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Possible CRJ900X Launch Customers...  
User currently offlineCRJ900 From Norway, joined Jun 2004, 2205 posts, RR: 1
Posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3163 times:
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The CRJ900 isn't dead yet, with 55 orders coming in over the last weeks, and the CRJ900X is now featured in its own article at www.bombardier.com - click on Regional Update, September 2006, "CRJ900X: a progress report.

With 98 seats @ 31-32" pitch, and MTOW of 90,000lbs (std) and 91,800lbs (ER) the -900X ought to be a suitable aircraft for many airlines, I'd say.

Lufthansa: huge CRJ operator, happy with the CRJ900 - Flight International report that they might get 10 more. A 9X with a 94-96-seat C/Y-cabin might replace some Avros and up capacity on busy CityLine routes...?

MyWay Airlines: publicly stated interest in 15 x CRJ900X.

AtlasJet: official interest in converting CR9 options to 9X. Still the case...?

Air One: will they order the 9X if LH and MyWay order it...?

Mesa Airlines: agreement with HP/US allow 90-seat jets to be flown IIRC, current CR9 only has 86 seats in Y-config. A CR9X with 6F + 84Y or 12F + 78Y might entice more premium pax...?

NWA: took 96 options when ordering 36 x CR9. With scope clauses allowing more than 76 seats as time goes by, a CR9X with 12-18F and 58-68Y might come in handy...? Or a 76-seat CR9X with 18F + 58Y for near-transcons...?

ASA, Horizon, SkyWest, Comair: bigger F-cabins (12-21 seats) for growing premium markets...?

Central and Eastern European airlines looking for new airplanes.

Other suggestions?  Smile


Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineA342 From Germany, joined Jul 2005, 4689 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 3120 times:

Quoting CRJ900 (Thread starter):
Lufthansa: huge CRJ operator, happy with the CRJ900 - Flight International report that they might get 10 more. A 9X with a 94-96-seat C/Y-cabin might replace some Avros and up capacity on busy CityLine routes...?

Certainly they're interested. Even their B735 have only 103 seats, so maybe...

They should also be interested in the Q400X, is that one progressing ?

Quoting CRJ900 (Thread starter):
and the CRJ900X is now featured in its own article at www.bombardier.com - click on Regional Update, September 2006, "CRJ900X: a progress report.

Can't find it, could you post the direct link ?



Exceptions confirm the rule.
User currently offlineTWA902fly From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 3128 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 3105 times:

Quoting CRJ900 (Thread starter):
Or a 76-seat CR9X with 18F + 58Y for near-transcons...?

Thats a lot of premium seats dont you think so? They will have to find a lot of thinner premium-traffic routes, of which there arent that many out of minneapolis, detroit, and memphis.

'902



life wasn't worth the balance, or the crumpled paper it was written on
User currently offlineCRJ900 From Norway, joined Jun 2004, 2205 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 3057 times:
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Quoting A342 (Reply 1):
Can't find it, could you post the direct link ?

I was unable to do that. Here's what you do: go to www.bombardier.com, click on the picture of the CRJ900 (with the Q400 in the background), then click on the grey "reports/publications" box above the picture and there you are...  Smile



Quoting TWA902fly (Reply 2):
Thats a lot of premium seats dont you think so?

Well, isn't "travelling in style" on the way back now that people are getting fed up with tight eco seats?  Smile



Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
User currently offlineRainmaker From Brazil, joined Jan 2006, 115 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 2843 times:

Quoting CRJ900 (Thread starter):
The CRJ900 isn't dead yet, with 55 orders coming in over the last weeks, and the CRJ900X is now featured in its own article at www.bombardier.com - click on Regional Update, September 2006, "CRJ900X: a progress report.

With 98 seats @ 31-32" pitch, and MTOW of 90,000lbs (std) and 91,800lbs (ER) the -900X ought to be a suitable aircraft for many airlines, I'd say.

Nobody in the business really believes that the CRJ production line will stop entirely. However a max. 50 units production rate per year of all models - 900X included - can't be favorably compared to the CRJ peak of 200+ a few years ago. In this sense, descending from a 60% market share to 25% with no clear plan to raise it again is very unfortunate.


User currently offlineMauriceB From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 2490 posts, RR: 25
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 2828 times:

Another possible customer is KLM, Embraer visited AMS this weekend for 2 demo flights, but from what iv heard Canadiar will also demonstrate its new product.

User currently offlineCRJ900 From Norway, joined Jun 2004, 2205 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 2795 times:
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Quoting MauriceB (Reply 5):
Another possible customer is KLM, Embraer visited AMS this weekend for 2 demo flights, but from what iv heard Canadiar will also demonstrate its new product.

Yes, definetly. KLM's partner AF has regional affiliate Brit Air flying quite a few CRJs, Brit Air also looked at the CRJ900 back in 2001 but didn't order any. Perhaps Brit Air will replace their F100 with the CRJ900X, prompting KLM to get the 9X too...?



Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
User currently offlinePlanemaker From Tuvalu, joined Aug 2003, 6240 posts, RR: 34
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2755 times:

Quoting CRJ900 (Thread starter):
With 98 seats @ 31-32" pitch, and MTOW of 90,000lbs (std) and 91,800lbs (ER) the -900X ought to be a suitable aircraft for many airlines, I'd say.

Yes, I agree but is there actually enough sales potential to launch the aircraft? With so many variables that are out of BBD's control, I think that it would be a marginal investment. If BBD really believed in the 900X's appeal and market potential, BBD would have already launched the 900X instead of dragging it out. Even if it is launched now you are looking at a 2009 EIS.

However, as has already been mention in previous threads, BBD is really in a quandry. If BBD does go ahead with the 900X, BBD will essentially be telling the industry that at somepoint in the future they won't be around in the Commercial Aircraft sector. While the 900X would be a "relatively" cheap stretch, BBD will nevertheless have a hard time to also fund a new airliner program.



Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
User currently offlineBahadir From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 1803 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2721 times:

You can kiss AtlasJet order good-bye. They went through some tough shake up and they are not doing that well..


Earthbound misfit I
User currently offlineKSUpilot From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 656 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2709 times:

Quoting Planemaker (Reply 7):
However, as has already been mention in previous threads, BBD is really in a quandry. If BBD does go ahead with the 900X, BBD will essentially be telling the industry that at somepoint in the future they won't be around in the Commercial Aircraft sector. While the 900X would be a "relatively" cheap stretch, BBD will nevertheless have a hard time to also fund a new airliner program.

While I like the sounds of a further stretch, you are right. I am assuming they are really looking at this from every angle.

If it really comes down to this being the last commercial model from Bombardier, I would rather see them invest in a new family. Base it off of the CRJ series, just a winder fuselage diameter, go to 5 abreast seating. They could start at 95-100 seats for a base model and stretch up to 120. Just take on the Embraer E-Jets by staying with the T-Tail, rear mounted engine design that they are used to building.

I'm assuming a new engine would be needed to handle the extra weight from the larger fuselage. They really could make something more economical than the E-Jets and a nice alternative to the Boeing 717.

Let's face it, Embraer has them beat, however this is a better than just stretching an existing model. A new family of aircraft could bring about a breath of fresh air for them. Everyone likes a comeback story.


User currently offlinePlanemaker From Tuvalu, joined Aug 2003, 6240 posts, RR: 34
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2703 times:

Quoting KSUpilot (Reply 9):
Let's face it, Embraer has them beat, however this is a better than just stretching an existing model. A new family of aircraft could bring about a breath of fresh air for them. Everyone likes a comeback story.

While I understand your reasoning, the market is just not big enough to justify an investment along the lines that you are suggesting.



Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
User currently offlineKSUpilot From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 656 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2668 times:

Quoting Planemaker (Reply 10):
While I understand your reasoning, the market is just not big enough to justify an investment along the lines that you are suggesting.

It would seem so. Really seems when Bombardier missed the mark with the C-Jets that marked the beginning of the end. As you said in the Embraer thread, the CRJ series cannot compare to the E-Jets. While the CRJ-900X will sell, it won't be enough to save Bombardier.
To me the -900X is a "Going Out of Business Sale".


User currently offlinePlanemaker From Tuvalu, joined Aug 2003, 6240 posts, RR: 34
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2649 times:

Quoting KSUpilot (Reply 11):
Really seems when Bombardier missed the mark with the C-Jets that marked the beginning of the end

It would seem so, but if you look at it from the point of view that the CSeries would not have been successful, as I do, then BBD did the right thing for their shareholders in not launching the CSeries.



Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
User currently offlineBoston92 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3390 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2649 times:

If the CR9 could make it, Skywest could use one for a SBA-ORD flight. I doubt it would make it though. Bout 1950 miles.


"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6072 posts, RR: 14
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2629 times:

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 13):
If the CR9 could make it, Skywest could use one for a SBA-ORD flight. I doubt it would make it though. Bout 1950 miles.

SBA-ORD is 1500 nautical miles point-to-point, and easily done by the CRJ-900; however, due to the scope clause with UA, and the wording in that scope, it would either a) be limited to 70 seats, with possible increased capacity in the future or b) certificated as a 705 and permanantly limited to 70 seats.



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineCRJ900 From Norway, joined Jun 2004, 2205 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2622 times:
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Quoting Boston92 (Reply 13):
If the CR9 could make it, Skywest could use one for a SBA-ORD flight. I doubt it would make it though. Bout 1950 miles.

Does SkyWest have the Longer Range-version? I think the LR has about 2,100 nautical miles range with only 70 seats...?



Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
User currently offlineBoston92 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3390 posts, RR: 7
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2622 times:

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 14):
SBA-ORD is 1500 nautical miles point-to-point, and easily done by the CRJ-900; however, due to the scope clause with UA, and the wording in that scope, it would either a) be limited to 70 seats, with possible increased capacity in the future or b) certificated as a 705 and permanantly limited to 70 seats.

Are we talking UA or UAX/SKYWEST? Is the clasue with UA or all UA and UAX partners?



"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6072 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2607 times:

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 16):
Are we talking UA or UAX/SKYWEST? Is the clasue with UA or all UA and UAX partners?

UA's pilots have a contract with UA management for the number and size of aircraft that may be flown by regional carriers.



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineBoston92 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3390 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2599 times:

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 17):
UA's pilots have a contract with UA management for the number and size of aircraft that may be flown by regional carriers.

In that case, could the CR7 make it???!!!



"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6072 posts, RR: 14
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2591 times:

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 18):
In that case, could the CR7 make it???!!!

It certainly could, but it would be weight restricted (carry less passengers) to a certain degree, depending on the situation surrounding the flight in question.



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineBoston92 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3390 posts, RR: 7
Reply 20, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2581 times:

Yeah, you know connecting in LAX or SFO is much better than being stuck in a CR7 for 4.5 hours!


"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6072 posts, RR: 14
Reply 21, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2561 times:

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 20):
Yeah, you know connecting in LAX or SFO is much better than being stuck in a CR7 for 4.5 hours!

But what's better: Sitting on a plane with 65 other people for 3.5 hours, or connecting to a larger aircraft that has the same amenities, seat pitch, less chance of a window seat, plus an additional hour sitting on the ground to transfer in that connection?



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineBoston92 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3390 posts, RR: 7
Reply 22, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2548 times:

Well I am 6'4" and 220 lb. I like a/c that I can actually stand up in and have a jetway to board or deplane.


"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6072 posts, RR: 14
Reply 23, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2539 times:

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 22):
Well I am 6'4" and 220 lb. I like a/c that I can actually stand up in and have a jetway to board or deplane.

Good luck getting a jet bridge in Santa Barbara!  Wink



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineEmSeeEye From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 508 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2483 times:

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 22):
Well I am 6'4" and 220 lb. I like a/c that I can actually stand up in and have a jetway to board or deplane.

No jetbridge?? Really?

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1013091/M/


25 Post contains images 747400sp : Let's just hope it can get off the ground, you know those CRJ's use a lot of runway, then they go stretch them come on now.
26 Johnnybgoode : i wouldn't hold my breath for LH ordering any turboprop aircraft ever again. I'm quite a fan of the DH4, especially considering the price of fuel, bu
27 Goldenshield : When you load up other types of aircraft at, or near its max takeoff weight (757 excluded, since no other commercial airliner can seem to compare to
28 A342 : I bet 20€ they will order turboprops again, or at least new turboprops will fly in their livery. Stretching the Q400 was (is ?) actually studied by
29 CRJ900 : That's the reason BBD came up with the rear-cabin service door on the CRJ900, so that pax could leave front-left while ground crews entered aft-right
30 Boston92 : This will never happen! No I live near 5 small regional airports and none of them use jetways. I did not mean that no airports use them on CRJ's, jus
31 Planemaker : Ah, but at the expense of pax seats... airlines have much rather stuff seats into the 900 than have a smaller rear door that doesn't really add much
32 Post contains images CRJ900 : True. But maybe that will be less of an issue with the 900X which has a little extra space and if airlines are willing to have 96-98 seats instead of
33 Aeronut : I beleive the aft service door is classified as an emergency exit and is therefore required for certification. Is this correct?
34 Johnnybgoode : i didn't know there was such an option! thanks for the input! but as someone else stated, it comes with a disadvantage just somewhere else, be it les
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