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China Southern Gets $250mil Comp. For A380 Delays  
User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6484 posts, RR: 3
Posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4235 times:

Brief fair use excerpt:

Quote:
BEIJING (XFN-ASIA) - Airbus is likely to pay 250 mln usd in compensation to China Southern Airlines for the late delivery of its A380 superjumbo aircraft on order, the Beijing News reported.

Citing an unidentified source close to the deal, the newspaper said any such payout would be the biggest for any Airbus A380 customer.

[...]

Sounds like compensation for missing the Olympics.

http://www.forbes.com/business/feeds/afx/2006/10/11/afx3081916.html


When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30974 posts, RR: 86
Reply 1, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4191 times:
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At $50 million a plane, that is a factor of 10 to 20 of what we are hearing is being paid to other carriers.

Either China Southern paid list for these birds, or Airbus is deeply afraid that China may choose the 748I and 773ER for their domestic large aircraft needs to show their displeasure at not having the A380 along with the 787* at the Olympics and is willing to risk taking a loss on each frame to keep China a customer.

* - I seem to recall that at least one Chinese carrier will have at least one 787-8 in time for the Olympics, but I could be mistaken.


User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 2, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4049 times:

The title of the topic is incorrect. In the article you linked is written that Airbus and CZ declined to comment, there's also written 'China Southern is LIKELY...'.

What apparently has happened is that CZ has made a claim for US$250 million. That does absolutely not mean they will get such a ridiculously high compensation. They could claim US$500 million. Does that mean they'll get them?

BTW, This is already being discussed...

http://www.airliners.net/discussions...eneral_aviation/read.main/3035603/



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User currently offlineWarren747sp From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1162 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3995 times:

this is better than playing lotto. Should have started an airline a few years back and order a whole bunch of A380s.


747SP
User currently offlineCarpethead From Japan, joined Aug 2004, 2954 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3898 times:

Airbus better pay up or CZ will just cancel its order and go with 773ERs and/or 748s. Future orders for A330s & A320s could be in jeopardy, if things go sour.

User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 3739 times:

Apparently CZ has denied the report.



http://english.people.com.cn/200610/14/eng20061014_311661.html



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User currently offlineLeelaw From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 3735 times:

Quoting Manni (Reply 2):

Unfortunately, the moderators deleted my earlier thread you cited above as a double topic yesterday. Sad


User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 7, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 3732 times:

Quoting Leelaw (Reply 6):
Unfortunately, the moderators deleted my earlier thread you cited above as a double topic yesterday.

That's strange and a shame because this is the double topic. When I did a search, I couldn't find it any longer, that explains it.



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User currently offlineEbbUK From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 3631 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 1):
* - I seem to recall that at least one Chinese carrier will have at least one 787-8 in time for the Olympics, but I could be mistaken.

Well that should help them bring in a shed load of tourists

Quoting Warren747sp (Reply 3):
this is better than playing lotto. Should have started an airline a few years back and order a whole bunch of A380s.


Just think of the airlines that have missed out CX, BA, JL (The last two perhaps not, they wouldn't take them even if they were given them for nothing!)

Well good to know that yet another airline is sticking with Airbus, a testament to the high regard the industry has have for Airbus's engineering prowess, in spite of the delays to the 380.


User currently offlinePolymerPlane From United States of America, joined May 2006, 991 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 3605 times:

Quoting Manni (Reply 5):
Apparently CZ has denied the report.

Not to nitpick Manni, but CZ did not deny the report. What they denied was authorizing anybody to such story. I know it's not 100% certain, but just like when EADS/Airbus denied that its CEO submitted a letter of resignation, but It actually happened. Journalists have a lot of other sources beside corporate public release.

Quote:
The CSA published an announcement Friday saying it has never authorized the release of such information.

http://english.people.com.cn/200610/14/eng20061014_311661.html

It looks like standard report denial before the official release by a company.

Cheers,
PP



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User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30974 posts, RR: 86
Reply 10, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 3556 times:
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Quoting EbbUK (Reply 8):
Well that should help them bring in a shed load of tourists...

I imagine they want it more for "showcase" reasons then actual capacity at this time, same with the A380.


User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 11, posted (7 years 11 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 3439 times:

Quoting PolymerPlane (Reply 9):
Not to nitpick Manni, but CZ did not deny the report.

From the article,

China Southern Airlines (CSA) denied reports that it will receive 250 million U.S. dollars in compensation from Airbus for delayed delivery of it new A380s.



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User currently offlinePolymerPlane From United States of America, joined May 2006, 991 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (7 years 11 months 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 3372 times:

Quoting Manni (Reply 11):
From the article,

China Southern Airlines (CSA) denied reports that it will receive 250 million U.S. dollars in compensation from Airbus for delayed delivery of it new A380s.

That's what the journalist said not the CSA

What CSA said:

Quote:
The CSA published an announcement Friday saying it has never authorized the release of such information.

http://english.people.com.cn/200610/14/eng20061014_311661.html

Cheers,
PP



One day there will be 100% polymer plane
User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 13, posted (7 years 11 months 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 3341 times:

Quoting PolymerPlane (Reply 12):
What CSA said:

Quote:
The CSA published an announcement Friday saying it has never authorized the release of such information.

You can read into it that the information should not have been released and is correct, or that the information is incorrect and it was certainly not CZ who has spread this incorrect information and has not given the authority to spread any information regarding compensations whatsoever.

More from the article,

"We will actively deal with and evaluate the issue," said the announcement, stressing that the delayed delivery will not have a serious impact on the company's business operation and financial results.


No serious impact on financial results and operation... Claiming US$250 million would be a bit much.

The original topic has been deleted, so I'll repeat what I wrote there.

If CZ does indeed has the right to claim US$250 million it is probably because they payed a price well above the average price being payed for an A380. Perhaps as close as 85% to 90% of the listprice.

CZ only ordered their A380s in 2005 but was supposed to recieve them well before many other airlines who placed their orders well before CZ did. This might have resulted in getting a less than average discount.

US$50 million for each aircraft would result in an additional 15% on top of the initial 10 to 15% discount. CZ would nicely fit in with an industry average of around 30%.

Airbus would earn less on what could have been a very lucrative contract, but would still be able to make a nice sum of money (A380s are said to be produced at around 40% of the listprice, not sure if engines are included).



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User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6484 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (7 years 11 months 6 days ago) and read 3216 times:

Quoting Manni (Reply 13):
If CZ does indeed has the right to claim US$250 million it is probably because they payed a price well above the average price being payed for an A380. Perhaps as close as 85% to 90% of the listprice.

You could say that; However, CZ made it clear that they wanted A380s in time for the Olympics. With everybody else, it's a serious problem to have their A380s delayed, but because all A380 customers are delayed, it puts them at an equal disadvantage. With CZ, not having it in time for an entire nation's premier event of the decade causes serious prestige problems. Anyone familiar with Chinese diplomacy knows this is not something that makes them very happy.



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
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