FlySSC From France, joined Aug 2003, 7313 posts, RR: 61 Posted (6 years 7 months 11 hours ago) and read 4405 times:
Everything started very well for Air France in Lebanon, for the first 6 months of this year 2006 :
While the global Lebanese market was showing a 13% growth during the first 3 months of 2006 and + 18% during the second trimester, Air France posted a turnover increased by 54% and 36% during the same periods.
AF market share increased by 12% during the first trimester and 14 % during the second one.
Then, following the Israeli agression in July, everything stopped.
AF resumed the flights to BEY after 56 days of interruption on September 8th, with 5 x Weekly flights. The program went back to normal starting October 1st with a Daily B773ER (in addition to the 2 MEA's daily flights, operated in codeshare). The AF Crew is even staying again in Beirut during the 24 hours layover.
Despite all the difficulties, and a Lebanese market drop of 24%, AF's load factor reached 77% in september, with a progression of 3%
the load factor for October should be even higher, despite a slower activity due to the Ramadan.
The reservations rate for November and Decembre is also very encouraging, and despite a drop of 24% of the annual turnover of the line CDG-BEY-CDG, AF plans to achieve its annual goal of benefits for the line.
Following the pull out of KLM from BEY, AF & MEA had planned to introduce a 4th Daily flight to CDG, operated by AF, and a new organization of the schedule.
This plan is, for the moment, suspended.
Jacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 61 Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 4 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 4150 times:
FlySSC....this is great to hear that things are returning to "normal"...I for one cannot wait to fly to BEY sometime in the near future (and support Lebanon)...I'm very excited..I hope AF/MEA do well..
CDG-JED-CDG..interesting..especially on an A319..bit long, but "do-able" I guess...transcon in the United States is quite far also, and there are mostly single-isle planes on those routes...
Airlinefreak1 From United Arab Emirates, joined Jul 2000, 259 posts, RR: 1 Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 3718 times:
thats excellent news .
another note , how is AF doing on the DXB route ? are they exceeding their expectations ? KL reduced the frequency of the second flight .
any news ?
F,J and Y cabins - r they usually full ?
GoMEA From France, joined Jan 2004, 202 posts, RR: 8 Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3645 times:
Great news FlySSC!
I presume ME should have similar figures on the BEY-CDG route.
I flew BEY-CDG-BEY on Sep 28-Oct 1 on both ME211 and ME 210 and flights were full. Lots of transiting pax from north America on ME 210 CDG-BEY and pilgrims to JED.
Let's hope they get the 4th frequency (with smaller airplanes, I acknowledge) as there are no late flights from CDG to BEY and no late flights from BEY to CDG
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11135 posts, RR: 61 Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 3535 times:
Thanks for the update FlySSC. I'm glad to see they are doing reasonably well.
Out of curiousity, what aircraft did they have planned for the 4th daily flight? How would it affect the 773ER on their existing daily?
Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
FlySSC From France, joined Aug 2003, 7313 posts, RR: 61 Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 3458 times:
Quoting BA (Reply 9): Out of curiousity, what aircraft did they have planned for the 4th daily flight? How would it affect the 773ER on their existing daily?
To face the increasing demand (before July 2006) the program was to add this 4th frequency with an A332, the other "regular" AF566/AF565 beeing changed for a B772ER.
The AF332 would have operated a late afternoon departure from CDG to arrive in BEY around 11:00PM and operate the "red eye" flight on the way back to CDG, replacing the MEA's A321.
This "red eye" flight is very popular, always full and the A321 is too small for it. I fly it regularly and 90% of the time on a jump-seat.
The MEA A321 would have operate a late departure from BEY (around 6:00PM) to arrive in CDG around 10:00PM (to connect with the late AF departure to GRU/GIG/HKG/LAD etc ...) and after an overnight at CDG, it would have operate, like today, the mid-morning flight at arount 11:00AM.
KL808 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1573 posts, RR: 2 Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 3299 times:
Question regarding MEA.
How are they doing? Is the airline back to normal operation?
How much of a hit did they take for the war?
Will we see any new plane orders to increase capacity?
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11135 posts, RR: 61 Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 3268 times:
Quoting KL808 (Reply 12): How are they doing? Is the airline back to normal operation?
Yes, the airline is back in normal operation and is operating its normal winter schedule.
Quoting KL808 (Reply 12): How much of a hit did they take for the war?
They suffered a loss of $45 million during the war, but will report a profit of $10 million for the year 2006.
It's not much, but it's better than a loss.
Quoting KL808 (Reply 12): Will we see any new plane orders to increase capacity?
Two days ago, the Lebanese newspaper Al-Balad ( http://www.albaladonline.com ) reported that MEA will soon announce an aircraft order for 8 aircraft to be delivered in 2008 and 2009 as well as 5 options for delivery in 2010 and 2011.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11135 posts, RR: 61 Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 3206 times:
Quoting FlySSC (Reply 16): But despite the restrictions at BEY, (due to the bombing of the fuel tanks of the airport ), AF signed a contract with a local Oil company that guarantees 20 tons of fuel for each flight if ever needed.
Interesting, thanks for the update.
Quoting FlySSC (Reply 16): This order should have been announced earlier this year.
Considering the situation in Lebanon, it was not sure wether these new aircraft would be effectively ordered or not.
This order was actually being finalized in July and was going to be formally announced at the 2006 Farnborough Air Show (July 17-23), but obviously had to be put off as a result of the war.
Last month (late September), they decided that they will go ahead with the order, but were going to decide whether to go ahead with the initially planned order or change it in some way.
The Al-Balad newspaper article two days ago stated that MEA will go ahead with the original order it had planned.
If anyone wants to read the article, I uploaded them to ImageShack, but they are in Arabic:
Quoting FlySSC (Reply 16): I heard the project of a regional airline, joint venture with Syria, long time expected has been suspended.
Any news, BA ?
I haven't heard anything about it in almost a year now. It certainly wouldn't surprise me if it was canceled. Lebanese-Syrian relations have continued to deteriorate and it is definitely not the right time to launch a joint Lebanese-Syrian airline.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
FlySSC From France, joined Aug 2003, 7313 posts, RR: 61 Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 3180 times:
Quoting BA (Reply 17): I haven't heard anything about it in almost a year now. It certainly wouldn't surprise me if it was canceled. Lebanese-Syrian relations have continued to deteriorate and it is definitely not the right time to launch a joint Lebanese-Syrian airline.
Right.
Actually I heard some rumors that MEA could finally launch this subsidiary, sort of "MEA Express" alone with the help of French investments, probably AF support, and a French and Lebanese Bank.
Cedars747 From Norway, joined Dec 2005, 2686 posts, RR: 23 Reply 17, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 3179 times:
Amazing news FlySSC
Where have you been before....I needed some doses of these updates from time to time. Air France is the best friend for Lebanon and MEA ,in good times and bad times
Good luck for Air France and here sister MEA
By the way what about MEA and Skyteam...........please some updates Pedro
Salut depuis la Norvége !
Alex!!!
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11135 posts, RR: 61 Reply 18, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 3167 times:
Quoting FlySSC (Reply 18): Actually I heard some rumors that MEA could finally launch this subsidiary, sort of "MEA Express" alone with the help of French investments, probably AF support, and a French and Lebanese Bank.
I guess this is possible. MEA was in negotiations with Embraer until recently as they were interested in their E-Jets, specifically the EMB-190/195, however, I think they ruled them out in favor of A319s as the upcoming order should include some A319s.
But I guess we'll see.
I think an "MEA Express" with Q400s would be ideal.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
KL808 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1573 posts, RR: 2 Reply 19, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3143 times:
Hey BA
What exactly would the 8 new aircrafts comprise of?
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11135 posts, RR: 61 Reply 20, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3125 times:
Quoting KL808 (Reply 21): What exactly would the 8 new aircrafts comprise of?
will there be any additional A330's?
Back in July shortly before the order was initially going to be placed, the Lebanese French newspaper, L'Orient-Le Jour ( http://www.lorientlejour.com ) had mentioneed that the order will be for 4 narrowbody aircraft and 4 widebody aircraft.
In the BeirutSpotters group, a few insiders mentioned that it will be for 4 A330-200s and 4 A319-100s OR a combination of 4 A319-100s and A320-200s, but this is not official information.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
BA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11135 posts, RR: 61 Reply 22, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3104 times:
Quoting FlySSC (Reply 23): I don't see MEA adding 4 A332 ... especially now.
I think 1 A332 and a mix of A320/A319 is more likely.
The original order was for 4 narrowbodies and 4 widebodies though, so if MEA is going ahead with its initial plans (which is what it sounds like), it can't be 1 A330-200 with the rest being A319/A320s.
I forgot to mention that the plan before the war was for 3 of the 4 A330-200s to replace the existing 3 ILFC-leased A330-200s.
The reasons why they want to do this is so that MEA can own its entire fleet since the existing 3 A330s are leased from ILFC. The other reason is so they can introduce a lower density higher quality interior that better fits MEA's strategy.
But again, these were the plans before the war. They may have changed them and they may have not...
Quoting FlySSC (Reply 23): I'd see a fleet of R.J such as CRJ100/700 or ERJ135/145 rather than turboprop.
Perhaps, and this would be more appealing from a passenger's perspective, but I think Q400s would make more sense for nearby routes like DAM, ALP, etc.
However, it all depends how important operating costs are for MEA. On short routes, the economics of turboprops are far superior to regional jets which is why small regional jets (less than 70 seats) are beginning to see a downturn while turboprops are starting to see a revival. Rising oil prices have given turboprops a new jumpstart.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
FlySSC From France, joined Aug 2003, 7313 posts, RR: 61 Reply 23, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 3087 times:
Quoting BA (Reply 24): Perhaps, and this would be more appealing from a passenger's perspective, but I think Q400s would make more sense for nearby routes like DAM, ALP
For flights to DAM, ALP, LCA, of course, Q400s or ATR42/72 would be pefect.
However, to extend the "Regional" notion to CAI, ALY, AMM, AYT, ADA, even BGW, a turboprop is definately inapropriate.
MEACEDAR From Lebanon, joined Oct 2006, 751 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (6 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 3064 times:
MEA should use the planes they are flying now to airports like AMM and LCA for extra flights between CDG and possibly open a route to AMS. I think it would be the best choice for MEA to open a "MEA Express" and use the ERJ135/145 for routes to airports like AMM, LCA, and possibly CAI.
25 BA: I agree with you here. I think this is why the upcoming order will supposidly include A319s. The A319 is of course much bigger than a regional jet, b
26 FlySSC: I just can't can't wait to see those littles busses with MEA ! Now, if only someone could convince M. El-Hout to change the boring colors and livery o
27 Goldorak: Good idea MEA should hire you as their "livery-designer" and corporate image VP !! But please do not accept. Otherwise who'll inform us of what's on-g
28 FlySSC: Goldorak, I didn't do it ! I am not so talented unfortunuately ... and if I would do it, I would change the MEA name also !
29 MEACEDAR: The EMB195 carries about 111 people on the average and the A319 carries 125 people on the average. Not that much of a differnce.
30 FlySSC: The Emb195 is a standard 108 seater. The A319 accomodates 124 PAX in a standard 2 Class, and up to 142 in a single Y Class (AF is using such a version
31 MEACEDAR: How much is the A319 and the EMB195? Is there much difference in price. Can MEA even afford it right now? I know they lease but can they AFFORD it?
32 BA: A319s are around $52 million. EMB-195s are cheaper, but I'm not sure exactly how much. If I had to take a guess, probably somewhere around $40 millio
33 MOE777: According to Wikipedia, German carrier Hapagfly is to commence flight's to Beirut airport as of today, any confirmation of this?
34 BA: No, it's been canceled as a result of the war.
35 WesternA318: LOL, I should have just kept reading... BA, I'd LOve to see MEA get more 332's...simply beautiful machines... I wouldnt seeing a modernized return of
36 Raffik: How are ME's load factors? They were quite high before the war, and I guess the war damaged the airport's plan to turn BEY into a West Med hub.
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