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Is USAirways A "True" International Airline?  
User currently offlineJlbmedia From United States of America, joined Jun 2002, 622 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 8625 times:
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I was Wondering what you guys thought. PHL is my home airport and USAirways continues to grow with international destinations. But some how I don't see them equal to the United's or NW's etc. What do you think it would take to get them to the "elite" international status? Is it more European destinations, Asia, etc? Maybe a better "1st" and "Business" class service? Or a bigger Long haul fleet?. Or do you already consider them a major international carrier. Your thoughts either way. John.

[Edited 2006-10-30 17:23:09]


JLB54061
77 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31136 posts, RR: 85
Reply 1, posted (8 years 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 8627 times:
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Is US an international airline? Of course.

Asian operations would help, to be sure, to get them to "Tier One" carrier status. They don't need a First Class but a lie-flat Business Class and improved catering and service (in the air and on the ground) will be required.


User currently offlineHPRamper From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4078 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (8 years 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 8436 times:

More destinations...and to get that, more aircraft. US has a very, very small transatlantic fleet compared to much larger players like NW, AA, UA.

User currently offlineWalter747 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1440 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (8 years 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 8435 times:

they need a larger fleet and they should fly to aisa, but that goes with the whole plane thing.

need to redesign envoy class.



Hussel, Hussel, Husel, Grind, Grind, Grind
User currently offlineMEACEDAR From Lebanon, joined Oct 2006, 753 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 8399 times:

They need a larger fleet and they need to put in new interiors on there current fleet. I see US Airways in about 5-7 years like this.

2-4 A340s
2-4 B787
1-2 B748 (doubt it, but I like to dream)
3-5 B764


User currently offlineUA777300ER From Belgium, joined Jun 2006, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 8357 times:

Do they really have suitable hubs to fly to Asia? I mean, CLT, LAS, PHL and PHX are not the most popular destinations for European flights, so how could they make flights to Asia work.

I think that as long as they're part of Star Alliance, they can get enough traffic from Asia. Just my thoughts...

Greetz
Tom


User currently offlineAirScoot From United States of America, joined May 2005, 688 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (8 years 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 8355 times:

I don't know that a specific fleet type growth would put them into the "top tier". I think that an overhaul of their image is definately a necessity. They'll also have to get their customer service act together.

With the current attempt to position themselves as a low cost-low fares carrier they have other larger fish to fry first.

I also don't think that having an asian destination or two would raise them up either. Look at DL or AA. Neither has a large asian presence.. yet they are considered to be "top tier".


User currently offlineKjet12 From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 976 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8275 times:

Quoting MEACEDAR (Reply 4):
They need a larger fleet and they need to put in new interiors on there current fleet. I see US Airways in about 5-7 years like this.

2-4 A340s
2-4 B787
1-2 B748 (doubt it, but I like to dream)
3-5 B764

How can you see US Airways like that? They already have A330-200s and A350s on order. US will not be seeing any Boeing products in the near or distant future.



AA - Doing what we do best.
User currently offlineUA777300ER From Belgium, joined Jun 2006, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8254 times:

Quoting Kjet12 (Reply 7):
How can you see US Airways like that? They already have A330-200s and A350s on order. US will not be seeing any Boeing products in the near or distant future.

I don't think that's 100% certain. If Airbus can't deliver the A350 in a decent timeframe, US Airways will be faced with a capacity problem and they might go for the 787. I don't know how the loan-deal works with Airbus and if they can easily get out of the A350 commitment, but since the A350 EIS is now 2013 or so compared to 2010 when US Airways ordered them, this doesn't seem so difficult.

[Edited 2006-10-30 19:37:32]

User currently offlineAirScoot From United States of America, joined May 2005, 688 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8253 times:

What does what type of airframe they fly have anything to do with their perception as an international carrier?!

User currently offlineUAL777UK From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8222 times:

Quoting UA777300ER (Reply 5):
Do they really have suitable hubs to fly to Asia? I mean, CLT, LAS, PHL and PHX are not the most popular destinations for European flights, so how could they make flights to Asia work.

Agreed. They have a comprehensive code share agreement with UA, so Asia is covered, with a one stop service via UA's hubs.


User currently offlineUA777300ER From Belgium, joined Jun 2006, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8209 times:

Quoting AirScoot (Reply 9):
What does what type of airframe they fly have anything to do with their perception as an international carrier?!

Well, the future of their long haul fleet will partly determine the future of their long haul operations. However, this is off course pure speculation and I don't really see US Airways flying the B747 (too big) or the A340 (not competitive enough in it's current form).

I also have my doubts about the A350. It seems like it's to big for US Airways. What version did they order (-800?) and how will it compare to US Airways' currently biggest plane (the A330-300 IIRC)?

Greetz


User currently offlineUA777300ER From Belgium, joined Jun 2006, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8208 times:

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 10):
Agreed. They have a comprehensive code share agreement with UA, so Asia is covered, with a one stop service via UA's hubs.

Does US Airways have any other Code Shares to Asia other than with UA? I'm thinking Singapore Airlines, Thai, Air New Zealand, ANA, ...

Greetz
Tom


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31136 posts, RR: 85
Reply 13, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8194 times:
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Quoting MEACEDAR (Reply 4):
I see US Airways in about 5-7 years like this...

The A340 is most likely not going to happen, unless US gets a super-sweet lease deal. A332s would probably be better choices for initial trans-Pacific service and trans-Atlantic service from PHX.

The B764ER is definitely not going to happen. Their A332s offer equal capacity and better range.

The B748I is also definitely not going to happen. It's far too big.

The A350XWB will have the edge over the 787. Natural traffic growth should support the A350-800 and perhaps even the A350-900. The only way they go 787 is if the A350XWB is not available or Boeing pulls a rabbit out of their hat with the next set of 787's (787LR/787-10).

Quoting UA777300ER (Reply 5):
Do they really have suitable hubs to fly to Asia? I mean, CLT, LAS, PHL and PHX are not the most popular destinations for European flights, so how could they make flights to Asia work.

PHX could work. One advantage US has over UA is that UA flies TED to many southwestern cities (like LAS and PHX) which honk-off premium cabin fliers. Being able to be in domestic First on your connection to the hub and then Envoy on the long-haul could score sales.


User currently offlineCgnnrw From Germany, joined May 2005, 1165 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8149 times:

Is US an international airline? Yes. They have a good mix of North American, European, Carribbean and Mexican destinations. They offer trans-Atlantic passengers a wide range of connections, they are part of Star Alliance which gives them access to markets they can't/don't serve.

Is US a global airline? No, and I don't think they should try be play ball with the likes of BA, LH, AA, UA, etc.



A330 man.
User currently offlineWhappeh From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1563 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8110 times:

I'd say US Airways is what it is, and let it be that. They seem to have very little desire to be a global major international airline, and fit their market well.


-Travel now, journey infinitely.
User currently offlineOphila From St. Kitts and Nevis, joined May 2006, 110 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 8104 times:

Quoting Cgnnrw (Reply 14):
Is US a global airline? No

Once this company sorts through mess that has been neglected and overvauled for years....they need to get some real planes...... less than 30 itnl birds make sit hard to be a real player..........
I know that they will shy awat from Boeing eqp, but some 762ers could be the perfect stp gap while airbus gets its act together w/ the a350....

then look for cities like svo,kbp,waw,eze,lim,scl to be on the radar soon


User currently offlineUA777300ER From Belgium, joined Jun 2006, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (8 years 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 8055 times:

Quoting Whappeh (Reply 15):
I'd say US Airways is what it is, and let it be that. They seem to have very little desire to be a global major international airline, and fit their market well.

With the public statement by the CEO that US Airways is looking for a partner to merge, I don't believe they don't have global ambitions. They're just too small at the moment to rapidly build a global network and an established partner would be a big help.


User currently offlineWhappeh From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1563 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (8 years 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 8006 times:

Quoting UA777300ER (Reply 17):
Quoting Whappeh (Reply 15):
I'd say US Airways is what it is, and let it be that. They seem to have very little desire to be a global major international airline, and fit their market well.

With the public statement by the CEO that US Airways is looking for a partner to merge, I don't believe they don't have global ambitions. They're just too small at the moment to rapidly build a global network and an established partner would be a big help.

When did he ever say that? I am not doubting he said it, I just never heard him publicly claim that they were in fact looking for another merge partner. I'm not saying either that its not with out of reason for them too look to become a major global player in the market, I just think a lot of statements made to the contrary are done out of spite towards the airline. It's always seemed like US Airways is the airline everyone loves to hate. I hope they do get more global routes, its more places for me to Nonrev to.



-Travel now, journey infinitely.
User currently offlineAirScoot From United States of America, joined May 2005, 688 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (8 years 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 7960 times:

Quoting Whappeh (Reply 18):
I'm not saying either that its not with out of reason for them too look to become a major global player in the market, I just think a lot of statements made to the contrary are done out of spite towards the airline. It's always seemed like US Airways is the airline everyone loves to hate.

I don't know that I'd go that far. US earned the reputation it got over several rather large blunders over the last few years (think Philly over Christmas). US isn't the only carrier to face such a challenge. Look at UA and the summer of Hell. It wasn't until memories of how the company handled it's customers in such an aggrivated time of stress subside that the image can be rebuilt. I wish US well and I hope their service improves enough that they become trustworthy enough for me to fly on regularly again. Given that US is a very large player in my home airport of DCA I am forced to fly them out of necessity for business from time to time. I go out of my way to avoid them if the trip is on an overnight simply because I know that it's been my experience that something will go wrong - especially in the baggage arena.

My personal feelings on the carrier aside, I say that it has nothing to do with WHAT they fly. I say it has everything to do with HOW they fly. I think until the image of them being amateurish is overcome and they are able to provide a consistant product they won't be considered a "true" international airline.

I don't think it will never happen. I think they need to finish this transition and figure out what they want to grow up to be before they can actually be it.


User currently offlineMah584jr From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 512 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 7852 times:

IMHO, no airline in the U.S. is close to being a "top tier" international carrier. Their service just is not as good as BA, SQ, LH and other foreign carriers. CO comes the closest but there is still a noticeable gap. But US does have a good network of European destinations with a lower class of service. For some, that's fine given that US has lower international fares than do foreign carriers. Basically, you get what you pay for. US has made progress, but they need aircraft in order to expand in the long term.

User currently offlineUA777300ER From Belgium, joined Jun 2006, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 years 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7695 times:

Quoting Whappeh (Reply 18):
When did he ever say that? I am not doubting he said it, I just never heard him publicly claim that they were in fact looking for another merge partner. I'm not saying either that its not with out of reason for them too look to become a major global player in the market, I just think a lot of statements made to the contrary are done out of spite towards the airline. It's always seemed like US Airways is the airline everyone loves to hate. I hope they do get more global routes, its more places for me to Nonrev to.

Here's an article I found about it on google.

I admit, he doesn't literally say he's looking for a merger, but he is talking about merger talks with Delta and Northwest when the time comes. To me, this sounds like they're very interested in another merger, and Delta and Northwest are airlines that I would describe as global.

Greetz
Tom


User currently offlineUsair320 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 991 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (8 years 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7592 times:

I consider them to be as they are the 3RD biggest US airline in EU behind CO and DL and 2ND in the Carribean behind AA.

User currently offlineFCYTravis From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 1191 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (8 years 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7571 times:

US management is interested in finding another merger partner if and only if a non-US airline merger happens.

US Airways was formed by the merger of two marginal and generally regional players, forming a truly national airline with much greater reach. That said, US is still the smallest of the "Big Six" legacies (AA, CO, DL, NW, UA, US) and a merger between any of those two (CO-UA, for example) would put US right back in the position of being easily marginalized - and that would not be healthy for the airline. So if another carrier touches off a "mega-merger," US would start looking for a dancing partner.



USAir A321 service now departing for SFO with fuel stops in CAK, COS and RNO. Enjoy your flight.
User currently offlineTravelin man From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3534 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7454 times:

Q: "Is USAirways A "True" International Airline?"

A: No. Not at all. US Airways is fine as a East Coast/Caribbean/European carrier.

I think the better question is: "Do they need to be a 'true' international airline?"

I think their Star Alliance association helps immensely. US Airways does not need to be a "global" airlines, it just needs to be good at what it does.


25 Malexander131 : Europe, depending on destination, thrives in Philadelphia. PHL is often viewed as an alternative to JFK/EWR, and the O&D to many destinations is good
26 Steeler83 : Right, US travelers can hop on a UA flight out of ORD, SFO, or LAX, (and IAD I believe) to Asia... It doesn't even have to be with UA, they could swi
27 Tpaewr : The fact that you question it, is the answer! US is a smaller player. Their recent European push is impressive, all the more so given few thought they
28 FCYTravis : Hello, 2005 is calling, you might want to pick it up. They're not an "East Coast" carrier anymore.
29 Post contains images QXatFAT : US Airways is a big Europe Carrier but nothing really more. They need to put themselfs in Asia as well as South America. That is my opinion. They have
30 Post contains images FCYTravis : No, you misunderstand me, and I was too vague. I meant a "non-US airline" - that is, an airline that is not US Airways. Not a foreign carrier.
31 Steeler83 : Um... how about PIT-ANYWHERE outside North America for that matter?!! Agreed here. I don't see a merger on the horizon just yet either and that they
32 FCYTravis : A US focus at OAK would be going head-on against a very-entrenched and established major WN base. Not likely. However, it would almost be coming full
33 NWADC9 : It ain't happening. The A340 isn't necessary, because they have A330's and soon A350's. 787's aren't necessary because of the same reason. The 747-8'
34 FCYTravis : Uhhh, yeah it does - the 764 has the same type rating as any other 767. That notwithstanding, there aren't any 764ERs up for sale right now, and if t
35 QXatFAT : Why not? I dont think it would really matter if WN was there or not. WN is everywhere already anyways. UA is doing fine at DEN with WN there, NW is d
36 SkyHigh777 : For some reason I never really saw US Airways as an international airline like UA, AA, or Delta. However, I do consider them on the same "tier" as UA,
37 HZ747300 : The A350 for US is most likely dead. Airbus cannot meet the time standard, but that does not mean that US will just remain with the A330. No need to s
38 Jfk777 : Usair needs to snag some good used 763 like the KLM one that mostly went to Aeroflot. This would provide a bridge of 5 -7 years for the A350 or 787. A
39 JamesJimlb : my uncle flew from sweeden to phili on u.s airways
40 Post contains images Walter747 : well see some people think htey might choose the 787 because of the delays.
41 Steeler83 : Oh, my bad. This is what I see US using for international flights... More A330s and A332s forr more European flights out of PHL, PHX, and CLT. Regard
42 Vega : To suggest that Philadelphia is not big enough to support Global air travel is not really an accurate statement. Philadelphia is the 4th largest MSA
43 Walter747 : thats what i was thinking
44 Gigneil : Wait, what? US Airways offers one of the best business class products in the US. It is superior to every other one offered except, potentially, NW's
45 Steeler83 : Not to mention, aren't the 762s supposed to be getting an interior makeover soon if not already? Then you can bet that their FC/Envoy/Economy product
46 Walter747 : i mean they need to be updated
47 Post contains links Tpaewr : I am not sure how you can say this. I have flown US, in both F and J. Years ago there was a time when US offered good service. But this past years ag
48 FCYTravis : What are you smoking? Envoy isn't anywhere near competitive with AA or UA, let alone CO's flawless BusinessFirst.
49 Flybyguy : Certainly it's wonderful to read about US Airways' Y product in the latest issue of Attache or on their website... but have you experienced domestic
50 Post contains links Jetdeltamsy : You wonder if USAir is a "true" international carrier..look at the following links and that will tell you.. http://www.airlineroutemaps.com/USA/US_Air
51 Vega : Seems you have the best direct reply to the thread question - unemotional and virtually impossible to refute. Only thing that would look better is a
52 Captaink : And to think we haven't factored in HP ops out of PHX and LAS. US is a true international airline. As some have mentioned there is a difference betwe
53 Post contains images Steeler83 : Yes this count of international destinations may be limited, but so is their widebody aircraft fleet capable of doing such routes. Actually, as many
54 Gigneil : You cannot seriously be considering comparing the A330 J seat with either AA or UA's seats. It can't even be done. The seat is miles ahead. Maybe you
55 Supa7E7 : I thought they were getting new J class for 767/757 this winter. Is this correct? Anyone?
56 Walter747 : well AA and UA both offer F class international US, CO, NW, and DL only have J and Y. Envoy needs to be redesigned. They should have the envoy sleepe
57 Gigneil : When the rest of the US airline industry does that, then sure. Delta alone does not a trend make, and the current J seat is superior to what others a
58 COERJ145 : NW will soon have some 752s with 33-34'' of pitch in Y(to be operated on trans-atlantic routes).
59 Post contains images Boston92 : What? US has 80 routes to international destinations. Not 80 flights, but 80 different A to B routings. Over 1/4 are outside North America. YES, they
60 WorldTraveler : Wrong. US is the smallest of the 6 US network carriers to Europe based on 2006 year to date traffic statistics. US is smaller than both CO and DL in
61 Tommy767 : I'll bet US could make an A340 PHX-NRT flight work a few times a week. There has to be enough of a customer base in Phoenix to start that up. Not as
62 Walter747 : he means destination wise 1. need aircraft if they wanted it. might be to big. 2. they would need to get slots at NRT. not gonna happen anytime soon.
63 Steeler83 : Isn't their pax capacity on the same levels as the 777?
64 FCYTravis : Next winter.
65 Post contains links Walter747 : like a said need a makeover. they don't need anything as a big a 777 i understand from the last thread about flying to asia. heres the old thread US
66 FCYTravis : Kiss that nice pitch goodbye next year. The Sandcastle is ripping out a row of Envoy to put 30 more coach seats in. Pitch will go back to industry st
67 Walter747 : if someone high up in US corporate is reading this. You need a NEW envoy. Why would they rip out envoy?
68 HZ747300 : The A340 is dead for nearly everyone--why would US want to order it? A much better option would be more A332 or just jump aboard the 787. I don't kno
69 Gigneil : You keep saying that over and over. Stop it. Unless you're going to supply some reasons or logic or even a second sentence in your posts. The rest of
70 Burnsie28 : 764 not available from anywhere. and only 2-4 787's??? On order, but still yet to be seen for delivery. Once the A350 gets axed, hello 787. When not
71 Jano : I have never been on a US A330. But I've been on plenty of NW's A330. There are Y seats in the front part of the coach section where the seat pitch i
72 Walter747 : which were hoping they can get from OS if they could get the slots. They will probably start with KIX or maybe if they get the 332's (if they get the
73 Burnsie28 : They don't stand a chance of getting a Chinese route for atleast 10-12 years. KIX, AA couldn't make it work, I doubt US could. That would be quite a
74 Steeler83 : Yeah, if I recall, isn't the A350 supposed to be a bit heavier than the 787? Let's see, if a plane is heavier, doesn't that mean that the engines wil
75 MiCorazonAzul : Connections maybe? I really do see US growing drastically in the international biz but not just yet. They are still trying to figure out some things
76 Airzim : That's not true at CO. CO's 757's, 767-200's, and 767-400 are flown interchangeably.
77 Post contains links Jimyvr : http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimyvrroutemap/296165972/ US Airways' 2006/07 Winter International route map. Not really a true international carrier, pr
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