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New DL Service To Mumbai Starts Today  
User currently offlineB777ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 548 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 11710 times:

Delta's flight 16 starts today (Atlanta-JFK-Mumbai). First time in a while that I can remember that DL will have a 777 at JFK on regular runs. Flight 16 gets into JFK at 1920L and departs at 2120L for the 14h 25min flight. DL flt 17 clocks in at just under 16 hours on the return to JFK....that has to be DL's current longest segment. Anyone from a.net going to be at JFK, will be cool to get some inagural pics.
Also anyone from DL, how many seats will they be blocking out of ATL for through passengers to Mumbai? I imagine they will not want to sell too many for just the ATL-JKF segment.

72 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineGoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1779 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 11621 times:

Quoting B777ER (Thread starter):
First time in a while that I can remember that DL will have a 777 at JFK on regular runs

I'm not sure to understand your remark ? I think DL operated 777 regularly to CDG from JFK these last years ?


User currently offlineDAL767400ER From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 5721 posts, RR: 46
Reply 2, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11557 times:

Quoting Goldorak (Reply 1):
I'm not sure to understand your remark ? I think DL operated 777 regularly to CDG from JFK these last years ?

DL hasn't operated the 777 from JFK on scheduled flights in at least 2 years.


User currently offlineB777ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 548 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 11381 times:

Yea, the only airports in the US that have seen the DL 777 in these last couple years have been MCO (which currently does not see it) and LAX (which currently has one flight a day from ATL).

User currently offlineGoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1779 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 11365 times:

OK guys ! sorry and thank you to have corrected my mistake  smile 

User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 3993 posts, RR: 11
Reply 5, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 11316 times:

This flight will have all sorts of logistical nightmares for the tech-staff, ground crews as well as the pilots since weight and cargo will be big issues with a 772ER. JFK-BOM is certainly a flight that DL could use a 772LR on. But it is important for DL to get a customer base on this flight since this half way around the world flight is going to be their future as well as the future of additional service they want to add in the next few years.
Big version: Width: 481 Height: 241 File size: 6kb
JFK-BOM 7800miles



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User currently offlineB777ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 548 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 11283 times:

The logistical nightmares aside, the flight planners have also the routing and the daily NOTAMs from the US military in ref. to Afganistan to contend with. Should be an interesting night for the first cockpit crew on this route. I wonder this being the first flight if DL will have the return crew already in place via the 763 service via CDG that ended yesterday?

User currently offline9V-SPJ From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 748 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 11258 times:

This flight is severely weight restricted on the VABB-KJFK leg. I have heard that they will be literally be running on fumes! My lab has been asked to look into designing an optimum arrival procedure for them... lets see what happens!

9V-SPJ


User currently offlineCricket From India, joined Aug 2005, 2964 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 11212 times:

Quoting 9V-SPJ (Reply 7):
This flight is severely weight restricted on the VABB-KJFK leg.

The 777-200LR's would be really useful for them I guess on the sector. What are the arrival / departure times from VABB.



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User currently offlineKaran69 From India, joined Oct 2004, 2869 posts, RR: 18
Reply 9, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 11122 times:

Quoting Cricket (Reply 8):
-200LR's would be really useful for them I guess on the sector. What are the arrival / departure times from VABB.

Somewhere around 2200 arrival and a departure of around 0030 hrs---[not precise, but roughly these are the timings]

Karan


User currently offlineJbmitt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 544 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 11054 times:

Quoting B777ER (Reply 3):
Yea, the only airports in the US that have seen the DL 777 in these last couple years have been MCO (which currently does not see it) and LAX (which currently has one flight a day from ATL).

CVG has had the CDG flight on and off as a 777 for the last several years. It appears that yesterday was the last flight with it, and its now a 767. Can anybody guess where the plane to operate the Mumbai flight came from?

I ask this because the flight from CDG-CVG operates today as a 777 arriving at 2:55 pm ET, will Delta reposition the plane to JFK, or ATL to operate the India flight or will a seperate craft do that?

On a side note.. CVG also loses the AMS, and FCO non-stops. Any idea where these 767s position out to? Do they appear elsewhere in the schedule?

[Edited 2006-11-01 19:54:47]

User currently offlineHanginOut From Austria, joined May 2005, 550 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 11054 times:

What does VABB mean?


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User currently offlineJbmitt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 544 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 11035 times:

Quoting HanginOut (Reply 11):
What does VABB mean?

Its the local airport code for Mumbai, the airport name is listed as CHHATRAPATI SHIVAJI INTL and the IATA code is BOM

I'm using Mumbai and Bombay interchangably.. I believe that Mumbai is the proper name.


User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5225 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 10935 times:

Here's the link to DL's press release regarding the new service.

http://news.delta.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=10441



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User currently offlineHanginOut From Austria, joined May 2005, 550 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 10918 times:

Quoting Jbmitt (Reply 12):
Its the local airport code for Mumbai, the airport name is listed as CHHATRAPATI SHIVAJI INTL and the IATA code is BOM

I'm using Mumbai and Bombay interchangably.. I believe that Mumbai is the proper name.

Thanks for the info, much appreciated.

Also, you are correct. The official name for the city is Mumbai, but almost everyone I know refers to it as Bombay.



Dreaming of the day I can work for an airline
User currently offlineGokmengs From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1123 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 10798 times:

From what I heard over at flyertalk the loads were extremely good for the first month. I am glad about this service since I go to BOM at least twice a year and this will definetly save me time, hassle of changing planes and the probability of losing my bags at CDG Smile The real fun will be when DL gets the 777LR's with the flat-beds can't wait for that.(Hearing about the weight restrictions with the ER, I'm assuming they will use the LR for this route) I will try(as always fail) to do a trip report when I take the flight to BOM soon.


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User currently offlineGr8Circle From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 3072 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 10595 times:

Quoting HanginOut (Reply 14):
Also, you are correct. The official name for the city is Mumbai, but almost everyone I know refers to it as Bombay.

The name, official or otherwise, is Mumbai.....those who are reluctant to change continue to call it Bombay... smile 


User currently offlineNorthstarBoy From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1812 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 10124 times:
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Quoting Jbmitt (Reply 10):
Can anybody guess where the plane to operate the Mumbai flight came from?

actually the equipment originates in Atlanta and makes a stop at JFK before continuing on to BOM

the ship operating the flight is 7007 or N866DA



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User currently offlineDalb777 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2192 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9919 times:

If anybody is interested, here is the flight track for DL 16:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL16



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User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9827 times:

Quoting 9V-SPJ (Reply 7):
This flight is severely weight restricted on the VABB-KJFK leg.

what do you consider severely weight restricted? my sources tell me DL is reducing the capacity by less than 20 seats and only for the first couple months at most until they are familiar w/ the capabilities of the 777ER and how ATC will handle them. Sounds like prudence rather than an incapable aircraft.

DL has recently retimed the eastbound leg to just under 16 hrs which is similar to CO's EWRHKG flight.

Also, airlines don't block a certain number of seats for use from one gateway or the other. Airlines like DL use sophisticated revenue management systems that take the highest valued passenger for DL's network regardless of the origin. The most valued passenger may connect in ATL or may be a local passenger in NYC and the optimum mix for the JFKBOM flight will continue to change as bookings on other flights change.


User currently offlinePanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4794 posts, RR: 25
Reply 20, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9809 times:
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Quoting NorthstarBoy (Reply 17):
the ship operating the flight is 7007 or N866DA

Yep - it just came in from ATL to Gate 6 here at Terminal 3. I'm on the flight to BOM tonight (thank goodness in Business) - will try to write a Trip Report at some point. Flight leaves JFK tonight at 2120 and arrives BOM 2210 tomorrow evening local.


User currently offlineRyanAFAMSP From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 155 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9734 times:

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 19):
what do you consider severely weight restricted? my sources tell me DL is reducing the capacity by less than 20 seats and only for the first couple months at most until they are familiar w/ the capabilities of the 777ER and how ATC will handle them. Sounds like prudence rather than an incapable aircraft.

The cargo load must be non existant, though. Maybe someone familiar with technical operations at Delta would be able to comment, but my guess is that there will be no revenue cargo on the trip - which is why these long-hauls really have to be able to generate an airfare premium. If they ran this trip as a one stop via CDG, they would have a much greater economic pad via cargo revenue. This is why the LR will be so important - as you have a whole lot more payload to play with.

And no one says the airplane is incapable. It is simply at the very far edge of its own range and payload design.


User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4530 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 9669 times:

Does anyone know what kind of weight restrictions CO has on its EWR-HKG route (if any)? Seeing that these are similar-legnth flights, it'd be interesting to see how they compare.

User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 9632 times:

obviously DL believes that they will get better revenue than when they operated it one-stop. given that business class is full days in advance, they are obviously making money up there if they are doing any kind of revenue control at all.

and just because cargo won't be carried westbound doesn't mean it can't be carried eastbound. The eastbound flight is shorter than other DL 777 flights which are known to carry significant amounts of cargo.

When you are the only airline providing nonstop service, you will get premium revenues for both passengers and cargo. If your capacity is limited, you force the prices up to compensate for the reduced capacity. remember that we are about ready to enter the peak winter season for VFR travel to/from India.

and while the 777LR may make sense in time, it's still possible that DL will choose to operate an LR on ATLBOM nonstop since almost all of the other proposed routes the LR would be used on are to/from ATL. DL could easily make its JFKBOM route a passenger route while ATL exists for the cargo business and the abundance of connections that can be made in ATL. Even if other airlines add new nonstop service to BOM, no one is talking about anything from an interior gateway - and it might not even be possible to do so w/o an LR. Therefore, if DL started ATLBOM service to supplement JFKBOM they would undoubtedly pretty well wrap up the US-BOM market.


User currently offlineBuck3y3nut From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 876 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 9493 times:

I'm wondering, if they do good on this route, will they try to fly to Delhi? Currently, Delta doesn't fly to Delhi, only AF does. DEL is also a very good market from JFK; a reason why AI will be starting non-stop service on one of their new 777s.

anyone know why they can't fly to DEL? Similarly, NW flies to BOM; however KL flies to DEL. I don't understand this...


25 RwSEA : I could see them starting service to DEL in the future, once they got more 777's. They could have started it now, but they'd be competing with AA and
26 FlyDeltaJets : I got off the ATL-JFK leg. It seems that alot of buisness seats were blocked. Two pallet stacks rode. It looks like they are planning to send a lot o
27 RyanAFAMSP : What other DL 777 sectors block in the 14 hour neighborhood? As far as I understand even at the 656,000 pound MGTOW the -200ER is pretty stretched at
28 ARGinLON : As you said, the system will show availability only for the "best" passengers taking into account many factors but mainly the fare they pay. However,
29 Zone1 : What VIP's were on the flight?
30 Mk777 : Did flight 17 land in JFK already? I don't see it on flightview or flightstats.
31 DAL767400ER : Flight has not even departed BOM yet, though it should within the next half hour.
32 9V-SPJ : DL17 has left and shows an ETA of 0603 on Nov3. 9V-SPJ
33 WorldTraveler : my sources tell me that DL did in fact carry revenue cargo eastbound from JFK last night. all of DL's new 777 routes are longer than their existing AT
34 Post contains images OA412 : I think you meant to say that AA operates the same engine as DL on its 777's.
35 Post contains images WorldTraveler : yes, thank you. long day. although in a year it will be true that CO and DL and AA and DL will both operate the same types of engines on their 777s...
36 Post contains links Panamair : OK, too tired to post a detailed report but here are some key highlights from the inaugural DL 16 on Nov 1: Pax. load last night: 50J 177Y (capacity i
37 Post contains images Kevin777 : Very true, but still, does anyone have a guess on the approximate split? It looks a bit like the ATL-JFK leg is more of a positioning flight with som
38 OA412 : I can't wait to see them either. Those are going to be some sweet birds!!!
39 Karan69 : India and the USA have an open skies policy no question of bilatereal issues in this case. Karan
40 AI : Looks like DL flight 16 was late by about 2 hrs arriving into BOM on the 2nd day. does anyone know the reason for this ? BOM -JFK DL 17 hence left abo
41 Alitalia744 : Taxi time at JFK.
42 Mk777 : What was the pax load on DL 17 the first day from BOM-JFK??
43 Alitalia744 : Not sure, but she's going out tonight full in J!
44 Panamair : The Nov 2 DL 16 was late arriving into JFK from ATL thus messing up the rest of the schedule. The Nov 3 DL 16 had a fuel leak at JFK and so was delay
45 B777ER : Every flight so far on the JFK-BOM leg has been running late.
46 Post contains images AI : lets hope the punctuality improves. it must be frustating to travel for 14-15 hrs nonstop & be delayd as well by about 2-3 hrs. i am not sure if i co
47 Jaysit : Why wouldn't they make money? US business travellers by and large prefer taking American carriers because of FF miles, etc., as do US-based Indian Am
48 Post contains images WorldTraveler : another point of interest.... this new JFKBOM route started 15 years to the day after DL began service to India as part of the Pan Am asset acquistion
49 B4real : These have always been seasonal. They are not on next summer schedules, but look for them to return unless they've put them on more opportune routes.
50 Panamair : Except for the inaugural flight.... I've been hearing more and more noise that CVG-AMS will not return next summer...as you said, maybe they're looki
51 B4real : Possible for AMS. There are a lot of flights to AMS from the USA. Surprisingly, none on AA. With UA, DL, NW, CO, US, and KL offering a lot of capacit
52 B777ER : I believe it was 40 minutes late. And in keeping with the inaugural DL flight theme, next up is in 9 days and again at JFK to London-Gatwick. This is
53 WorldTraveler : ...and December holds ATL-DKR-JNB and JFK-ACC plus all those flights to Latin America from LAX. Then it will be about 6 months until the summer schedu
54 Panamair : I meant the inaugural DL 16 JFK-BOM; scheduled arrival BOM was 10:10pm - we landed at 10:14pm and were at the gate at 10:24pm. Not bad. Anyhow, last
55 SQ452 : Hopefully something returns on that route. With AF pulling out, again, we dont have any true international carrier at CVG saddly. Maybe KLM will pick
56 LAXdude1023 : Man I hope the ATL-DKR-JNB turns to a 777 or at least a 764. Its a long time to sit on a 763, especially since on DL the 777s and 764s have much newe
57 WorldTraveler : The 763 has better performance characteristics than the 764 which are needed from JNB. Once DL makes the route work w/ an 763 and once there is a larg
58 LAXdude1023 : No kidding, maybe even more. I hate so much to see the 777s come off the ATL-Europe routes, but there seems to be a lack of them. I dont think they w
59 Jacobin777 : I think it will also depend on the loads...if the loads from DKR-CPT are strong, then it won't be replaced with a 777...if the ATL-CPT loads are stro
60 WorldTraveler : CPT only has a 10K ft (roughly) runway so the LR probably won’t work from there. My reference was and my hope is that DKR-JNB will be replaced by DK
61 Manny : That does not sound so promising at all. Its a good thing i gave this flight a pass for my travel plans to BOM.
62 RwSEA : Not necessarily. CPT tends to be lower-yield than JNB, because there is a higher percentage of tourist traffic. Still a relatively-higher yielding de
63 Manny : That is a good excuse, but not a valid one. There are a ton of wide bodies that fly into & out of JFK at that hour with turnaround times that are sim
64 RwSEA : By and large, yes, many of the international flights go out late at that time of the day. That said, most airlines (DL included) build extra time int
65 DAL767400ER : Not just JFK, pretty much any larger hub airport around the globe. I can't count the times my flight has been delayed pretty bad on departure at ATL
66 WorldTraveler : Let’s keep the delays in perspective. DL just started the longest flight in its history and one of the longest by any US airlines. It is also taking
67 Post contains images Panamair : Even with a 2 hour delay, one would still be getting into BOM earlier than if one had taken a connecting flight through Europe ...ah, the beauty of a
68 Jacobin777 : AA's ORD-DEL is only a couple of hundred nm's less than DL's.......DEL conditions are just as hot as BOM's... CO's EWR-HKG is farther than DL's JFK-B
69 Bobnwa : They probably are on most nights.
70 WorldTraveler : and can you post the on-time percentages for AA and CO's first 5 days of flights? that is the issue here. But DEL has about 1000 more feet of runway
71 Post contains images B777ER : FWIW, I understand that DL uses a CI of 377 on the 763 when running behind sked or a strong headwind. Tailwinds and ontime is a CI of 113. A CI of 37
72 Manny : Not much of a difference. I live in Denver. I would have a 2 stop flight anyways routing DEN-ATL-JFK-BOM and back. To add to it a 14-16 hours in flig
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