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New Gates For Airtran In ATL  
User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2494 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6225 times:

It was mentioned on the earnings conference call that FL has recently taken possession of more gates on D. Does anyone know how many they have over there now and are they trying for more? My last FL flight, we waited 15 minutes for a gate to open.

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTLHFLA From United States of America, joined May 2003, 593 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 5948 times:

I remember someone mentioning them starting to use some gates on E. I am surprised they were able to get more D gates considering D is pretty full. Are these gates that Delta previously used?

Does anyone know how many gates Concourse F is going to have? I thought I remember hearing only about 12 gates would be added, but it seems like they should max out the number of gates with F, and open some more gates in E for domestic operations.

What would really be great is if when Concourse F and the new international building is complete, they could move half the D tenants to E and reconstruct each half of Concourse D as a newer wider concourse.



Bill in ATL
User currently offlineATLAaron From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1023 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 5872 times:
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Isn't everything international going to F? That would probably allow for additional gates at E as it could accomodate smaller aircraft.

User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8902 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 5868 times:

I saw about 7-8 AirTran 737s on D sometime over the past week (I've been in ATL 3 times in the last 6 days, so it's all blurring together now...). All were on the lower end of the concourse at the common use gates...I know a few new ones opened up though, so they might be using those.

User currently offlineOttoPylit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 5802 times:

Quoting TLHFLA (Reply 1):
Does anyone know how many gates Concourse F is going to have? I thought I remember hearing only about 12 gates would be added, but it seems like they should max out the number of gates with F, and open some more gates in E for domestic operations.

What would really be great is if when Concourse F and the new international building is complete, they could move half the D tenants to E and reconstruct each half of Concourse D as a newer wider concourse.

Not gonna happen. Concourse E is common-use gates, but all are owned by the airport and have to be paid for use, meaning that the airlines can't take charge of them and sit on them. You are charged as you use them, and don't rent them on a yearly basis, per the domestic gates.

When the new International Concourse is opened, it is planned for the international airlines in ATL(BA, KE, KL, LH, AF, and any new entrants) will move there, and Delta will continue to expand international operations on E. FL probably won't go for using any gates on E because they would actually have to pay for them as they use them, instead of renting them for a whole year, despite the usage.



OttoPylit


User currently offlineB757capt From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1379 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 5714 times:

Quoting OttoPylit (Reply 4):

We are deplaning on E and towing back to D or C after the aircraft has been cleaned. This is for the night terminators only.



The views written by this user are in no manner the views of my employer and should not be thought as such.
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 5638 times:

Quoting TLHFLA (Reply 1):
I am surprised they were able to get more D gates considering D is pretty full. Are these gates that Delta previously used?

No, these new gates become available because HAJIA is adding 3 jetways at D to fill the gaps, e.g. where CO routinely RONs of their planes. These gates allow for some gate reshuffling that gives FL these gates.

Quoting TLHFLA (Reply 1):
Does anyone know how many gates Concourse F is going to have? I thought I remember hearing only about 12 gates would be added,

Actually, it's only 10.

Quoting TLHFLA (Reply 1):
but it seems like they should max out the number of gates with F, and open some more gates in E for domestic operations.

That is maxed out, as that's the highest possible number on the limited area that there is for F.

Quoting TLHFLA (Reply 1):
What would really be great is if when Concourse F and the new international building is complete, they could move half the D tenants to E and reconstruct each half of Concourse D as a newer wider concourse.

Not gonna happen. Concourse D svcks, but the chance HAJIA will invest lots of money into redoing D are between slim and none.

Quoting ATLAaron (Reply 2):
Isn't everything international going to F?

No, only non-Delta flights.

Quoting ATLAaron (Reply 2):
That would probably allow for additional gates at E as it could accomodate smaller aircraft.

Having a row of 7 narrowbody gates instead of 6 widebody gates would indeed be a welcome addition, though I doubt it will happen.
That said, once F opens (sometime in the next decade), it will automatically mean that DL will also operate additional domestic flight from there as well. Currently, DL operates international departures from other concourses, either due to the lack of gate space at E during rush hour, as is the case with the 767s departing from Concourse T, or because the planes come off a domestic flight and depart from A/B, as is the case with the majority of 757/738 flights. All those flights could operate from E, and allow to ease traffic at A/B/T.


User currently offlineIndy From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 4562 posts, RR: 18
Reply 7, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 5632 times:

I know it is popular to jam everything possible into ATL. But this would be a bad move by FL. Why? Their on time record is really bad.

I was schedule to fly them IND-ATL-MCO . Guess what? IND-ATL severely late. They were nice enough to rebook me. That flight was also over an hour late.

My wife uses them twice. All flights late.

I recommended them to my neighbor who travels alot. She tries them a few times and refuses to ever use them again. Why? All of her flights were seriously late as well.

This is not a way to impress your customers. I don't care how friendly your people are if you can't get your customers where they want to go on time. Attempting to expand in ATL will only make matters worse. Think twice before you dig your own grave.



Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
User currently offlineRumorboy From United States of America, joined Aug 2002, 356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 5598 times:

Quoting Indy (Reply 7):
know it is popular to jam everything possible into ATL. But this would be a bad move by FL. Why? Their on time record is really bad.

I understand how you feel BUT there are other factors other than "popular". Airtran will probably do 1.7 to 1.8 Billion dollars in revenue this year. 70% of that is out of ATL. It is very easy to add cities and frequency in ATL without adding a whole lot of cost. Just ask Delta. Look how much they have added out ATL compared to rest of their system over the past three years. On time is important part of running an airline but somethings are beyond their control. Just before they closed 26L/8R(its almost 2 months now) on time for all three carriers in ATL were improving. That same logic UA and AMR should cut some flights out of ORD because relative to there other hubs it's on time is the lowest. Same goes for Usair in PHL. By far the worst performing hub as far as on time goes But is the crown jewel according to Parker.

There are trade offs but in a game of small operating margins that trumps everything else.


User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5509 times:

I believe after they are through resurfacing runways this month, the delays should drop off somewhat. I noticed that NW has several gates on D. Do they have that many flights?

User currently offlineGr8SlvrFlt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 1606 posts, RR: 10
Reply 10, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5463 times:

I believe AirTran is regularly using eleven gates on D in addition to the twenty-two on C. Some of the D gates are shared. Also, several late-evening terminators are off-loading at E before being towed to the hangar for overnight maintenance. There is talk of some carriers currently using D (AC, YX?) moving to E, opening up more space for FL.

BTW, the renovations on C & D, while still not finished are showing some nice results. AirTran is installing all-new gate podiums, flat panel info screens, new carpeting & wall coverings, more kiosks, laptop charging stations, etc. The marble central walkways (in the whole airport) make a huge difference in the look of the concourses.

The runway resurfacing, last I heard, is scheduled to be completed next week (11/7).


User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5458 times:

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 9):
I noticed that NW has several gates on D. Do they have that many flights?

6 to DTW, 3 to MEM and 5 to MSP, IIRC. Number-wise, 2 gates would easily be enough for NW, though I'm not sure of the flight times, so it might be that NW needs 3 gates at some point during the day.


User currently offlineTLHFLA From United States of America, joined May 2003, 593 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5450 times:

NW currenty has an all mainline schedule to/from ATL:

6x Daily to DTW
5x Daily to MSP
3x Daily to MEM

How many gates to do they have? They could survive with three, but I could see them needing four.



Bill in ATL
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 5412 times:

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 11):
6 to DTW, 3 to MEM and 5 to MSP, IIRC. Number-wise, 2 gates would easily be enough for NW, though I'm not sure of the flight times, so it might be that NW needs 3 gates at some point during the day.

NW's 4 gates are often used at the same time, its common to see 4 planes sitting there at the same time.

Quoting TLHFLA (Reply 12):
How many gates to do they have? They could survive with three, but I could see them needing four.

They use all four gates, and NW isn't going to give any up.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 5378 times:

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 13):
NW's 4 gates are often used at the same time, its common to see 4 planes sitting there at the same time.

4 gates for 12 flights? Talk about a waste of space.


User currently offlineIndy From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 4562 posts, RR: 18
Reply 15, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 5320 times:

Quoting Rumorboy (Reply 8):
I understand how you feel BUT there are other factors other than "popular". Airtran will probably do 1.7 to 1.8 Billion dollars in revenue this year. 70% of that is out of ATL.

Revenue does not equal profit.

http://www.ajc.com/business/content/...ies/2006/10/26/1027bizairtran.html

Revenue up 30% but they post a loss of over $4 million versus a profit for the same period last year. Perhaps since ATL is 70% of their business maybe we should look at ATL as the reason they aren't doing better financially.



Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (7 years 10 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 5277 times:

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 14):

4 gates for 12 flights? Talk about a waste of space.

How is it a waste of space when they have planes at four gates, during the summer when they have even more flights... one plane will leave and another will fill its space at the gate. Delta doesn't use all their gates at ATL all the time and so fourth, even worse is like HP and AC at ATL.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineGr8SlvrFlt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 1606 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (7 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 5052 times:

AirTran is pushing ATL to convert the old NW hangar into a 10-gate facility for non-hub airlines (CO, NW, YX) freeing up more space on D. AirTran has also committed to the entire new South Terminal but the city is dragging it's feet on any expansion. Look for AirTran to take its case public in the very near future.

User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 10 months 2 weeks ago) and read 5014 times:

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 16):
even worse is like HP and AC at ATL.

America West uses some of the same common use gates that AirTran uses. At one point in the 90s, America West did actually had it's own gate on D-North. AC's gate is also a common use gate, as in the past, I have seen AirTran and Hooters Air operating out of it. F9 and YX were sharing a gate, but since YX has increased their MKE-ATL service, F9 is using a different gate.

Quoting Gr8SlvrFlt (Reply 17):
AirTran is pushing ATL to convert the old NW hangar into a 10-gate facility for non-hub airlines (CO, NW, YX) freeing up more space on D. AirTran has also committed to the entire new South Terminal but the city is dragging it's feet on any expansion. Look for AirTran to take its case public in the very near future.

The only issue with creating a gate complex out of the old NW hangar is transferring pax between the terminal and the remote gates. The only option would be shuttle buses or eek! mobile lounges. DL codeshares on CO and NW and vice versa, so there would be pax that would need to transfer. Perhaps they could move UA and AA plus maybe F9, AC, YX and NK to such a complex and put NW and CO over on T-North.

[Edited 2006-11-10 01:21:47]

User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4749 posts, RR: 44
Reply 19, posted (7 years 10 months 2 weeks ago) and read 4974 times:

Quoting Gr8SlvrFlt (Reply 17):
AirTran is pushing ATL to convert the old NW hangar into a 10-gate facility for non-hub airlines (CO, NW, YX) freeing up more space on D. AirTran has also committed to the entire new South Terminal but the city is dragging it's feet on any expansion. Look for AirTran to take its case public in the very near future.

Let AirTran foot the bill....



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6763 posts, RR: 32
Reply 20, posted (7 years 10 months 2 weeks ago) and read 4951 times:

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 18):
Perhaps they could move UA and AA plus maybe F9, AC, YX and NK to such a complex and put NW and CO over on T-North.

I can't see either UA or AA being enthusiastic about giving up some of the best-located gates in the entire airport in order to be located in a converted hangar. Nor would CO or NW be interested given the codeshare with Delta.

Quoting Gr8SlvrFlt (Reply 17):
AirTran has also committed to the entire new South Terminal but the city is dragging it's feet on any expansion.

I was under the distinct impression that AirTran was actually uninterested in the South Terminal because the costs of operating from there were going to be significantly higher. One other consideration is that the new terminal would need to allow for expansion beyond what was proposed in 1999. The 1999 Master Plan had 31 gates at the new South Terminal, which would basically be a net loss in capacity for AirTran.


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