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Premium Economy Class On Canada  
User currently offline8herveg From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2006, 1127 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4585 times:

I have just been on the Air Canada website, and it says that the following flights are going to offer a Premium Economy Class on it's B767 aircraft.

Premium Economy Class routes:
Toronto-Rome: Starting October 1, 2006.
Toronto-Manchester: Until October 8, 2006.
Toronto-Amsterdam: Until September 23, 2006.
Toronto-Dublin, Shannon: Until September 30, 2006.

Will this class be in addition to the Executive First Class, or instead of?

I am quite suprised anyway that Air Canada only operates 2 classes on its International services. I would have thought a Premium Economy Class would sell really well?

8 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineJamincan From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 775 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 4541 times:

I understand that those situations will see a domestically configured 767. So, instead of their normal executive first configurations, it will feature the business class used on domestic routes, branded as premium economy.

User currently offlineTIMEAIR From Canada, joined May 2005, 436 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4451 times:

No Exec First on these routes....standard Domestic J cls seats.



...



You can't get there from here.
User currently offline8herveg From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2006, 1127 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 4330 times:

So why do they only operate the domestic business class seats? Do people pay less for these?

I cant see why operating the First Executive seats would be a problem?


User currently offlineJamincan From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 775 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 4266 times:

I can think of two possibilities off hand: aircraft availability and lower yields.

User currently offline8herveg From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2006, 1127 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 4137 times:

Quoting Jamincan (Reply 4):
lower yields

Sorry, do not mean to sound ignorant, but can you explain lower yields to me please....I am new to airliners.net and very young!!


User currently offlineJamincan From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 775 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 4092 times:

Quoting 8herveg (Reply 5):
Sorry, do not mean to sound ignorant, but can you explain lower yields to me please....I am new to airliners.net and very young!!

Well, there are several ways of measuring the profitability of a route. Load factor is the percentage of seats that are filled on a flight; however, that doesn't necessarily reflect the amount of money the airline is making on that flight. The seats might be full, but if the tickets were all very cheap, the airline would still lose money.

Yields reflects the actual money the airline makes. So for example, even if the economy cabin is empty, the flight may have a full business class, and so be high yielding. Yield can be measured by looking at two statistics: CASM (Cost per Available Seat Mile), and RASM (Revenue per Available Seat Mile). Airlines are far more tight lipped about yield then load factor though.

For destinations like FCO, AMS, MAN and DUB, which I understand are largely VFR (Visiting Friends and Relatives), the flight is likely quite low yielding since there would be few business travellers. Even if AC makes a fair amount on the route, it would be primarily from the economy fares (Y class) rather than business fares (J class). In this case, it makes a lot of sense for AC to market their domestic J class as premium economy on these routes, as a VFR traveller is far more likely to upgrade to premium economy than to business class. So, for AC, this makes sense on two fronts. First, they likely don't have any 767 available with executive first to operate the routes. Second, by marketing the domestic J class as premium economy on these routes, the front cabin is more likely to be filled up, and they are very likely increasing the yield of the flight.


User currently offline8herveg From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2006, 1127 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 4051 times:

Quoting Jamincan (Reply 6):
Well, there are several ways of measuring the profitability of a route. Load factor is the percentage of seats that are filled on a flight; however, that doesn't necessarily reflect the amount of money the airline is making on that flight. The seats might be full, but if the tickets were all very cheap, the airline would still lose money.

Yields reflects the actual money the airline makes. So for example, even if the economy cabin is empty, the flight may have a full business class, and so be high yielding. Yield can be measured by looking at two statistics: CASM (Cost per Available Seat Mile), and RASM (Revenue per Available Seat Mile). Airlines are far more tight lipped about yield then load factor though.

For destinations like FCO, AMS, MAN and DUB, which I understand are largely VFR (Visiting Friends and Relatives), the flight is likely quite low yielding since there would be few business travellers. Even if AC makes a fair amount on the route, it would be primarily from the economy fares (Y class) rather than business fares (J class). In this case, it makes a lot of sense for AC to market their domestic J class as premium economy on these routes, as a VFR traveller is far more likely to upgrade to premium economy than to business class. So, for AC, this makes sense on two fronts. First, they likely don't have any 767 available with executive first to operate the routes. Second, by marketing the domestic J class as premium economy on these routes, the front cabin is more likely to be filled up, and they are very likely increasing the yield of the flight.

Brilliant!! Thankyou very much for the explanation...very thorough indeed!


User currently offlineBa97 From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 377 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 3882 times:

I have always wondered why they do not offer a premium economy (similar to BA World Traveller Plus) on the LHR route or Frankfurt. I do not know the yields but know Business is full. I know BA fills the premium economy cabin with people like me who can't/won't pay business fares but will pay for premium economy when you get power in the seats and extra room so you can work comfortably for the flight. A bunch of us switched to BA for the premium economy from AC and with frequent flying status you get the lounge access so the best of all one needs.


there is economy class, business class, first class...then Concorde..pure class
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