Xpfg From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 628 posts, RR: 7 Posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8337 times:
The second aircraft to SFO for Virgin America has just arrived. Last one was N625VA, this one is N624VA...another name unveiling maybe? It comes pretty much around the same exact time of the week as the last one did, so I wonder if something will happen on Wed./Thur. yet again?
Walter747 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1440 posts, RR: 5 Reply 1, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8286 times:
JetBlueAUS From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1145 posts, RR: 8 Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8236 times:
Quoting Walter747 (Reply 1): when is the DOT actually going to approve them?
This question is just as repetitive as, "When is NW going to retire their DC-9's?"
Not all of us can be heroes, some of us can only stand on the sidewalk and clap as they go by.
Ghost77 From Mexico, joined Mar 2000, 5126 posts, RR: 53 Reply 3, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7899 times:
Sadly to see they're blocking MR Branson on this venture! As we speak N621VA and N623VA, 2 NEW A320s will be leased to TAM soon as PR-MHE and PR-MHF respectively.
g77 APM
Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
COEWR From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 273 posts, RR: 2 Reply 5, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 7573 times:
Quoting FutureFO (Reply 4): Way toooo much capacity in the US skies. I think this and Skybus should be blocked.
Since this is a free market economy, a carrier can NOT be blocked due to "too much competition". The government has no right to tell investors they can not start a business. It is up to the investors to invest their capital wisely and make their product stand out from the other products being offered. Remember, competition and survival of the fittest is the best option for consumers because it brings on competition, better prices, and better products among other things.
ChrisNH From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 3804 posts, RR: 2 Reply 6, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 7417 times:
Quoting COEWR (Reply 5): Since this is a free market economy, a carrier can NOT be blocked due to "too much competition".
Well, this is a topic for another thread, really, but the Wright Ammendment is essentially that: a mechanism to 'block' flights at DAL because there is 'too much competition' over at DFW. The Ammendment is being phased out (albeit gradually), but it was clearly an attempt by AA to wield political power to minimize nearby competition...just as Virgin America is being held hostage by 'political power.'
I do agree that there might be too much metal flying around, but these legacy carriers show their true colors when they have to use our government as their bully pulpit. In the end, it all comes down to votes: the legacy carriers represent tons of voter constituents in the states they operate in while Virgin America doesn't.
Jacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 61 Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 7409 times:
Where is the plane parked at? Maybe if I have some time today, I'll take a drive to SFO and take a few photos..
Hiflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2118 posts, RR: 4 Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 7367 times:
Quoting Ghost77 (Reply 3): N621VA and N623VA, 2 NEW A320s will be leased to TAM soon as PR-MHE and PR-MHF respectively.
If that is the case then even VA does not expect startup in the near term...name a couple aircraft to keep public relations alive but startup looks to be farther away.
Xpfg From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 628 posts, RR: 7 Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7255 times:
Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 7): Where is the plane parked at? Maybe if I have some time today, I'll take a drive to SFO and take a few photos..
Hey, Jacob. It's at Signature, but it's really not in a good spot, especially for light. If you have airside access, it's another story. Looks beautiful from the correct angle.
Jacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 61 Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7180 times:
Quoting Xpfg (Reply 9): Hey, Jacob. It's at Signature, but it's really not in a good spot, especially for light. If you have airside access, it's another story. Looks beautiful from the correct angle.
Thanks Xpfg...
Sux...I don't have access to airside, looks like I'm s.o.l....
Laxintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 22023 posts, RR: 51 Reply 11, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7129 times:
Decision on Virgin America's application is likely due in a short period of time.
DOT had set early August deadline for submissions of comments by 3rd parties, with VX given two add'l weeks for rebuttal submissions.
A 90 day time frame to make its final rulling on the carriers fitness is about the average which the DOT has taken the last decade for carrier certification.
This could see the decision as early as mid/late November. As a worst case I'd expect a ruling by New Years timeframe.
[Edited 2006-11-07 16:21:57]
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
MotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 2747 posts, RR: 10 Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7118 times:
Quoting Ghost77 (Reply 3): Sadly to see they're blocking MR Branson on this venture!
Not Branson they're blocking, but an idea of Sir Richard's which is being funded by American investors. This is an American airline based on the successful Virgin LCC model backed by the equity in the global Virgin brand.
The US majors are doing their best to make it appear like a foreign airline when it is not; a deliberate tactic to slow its entry to market. Qantas used a similar strategy in Australia with Virgin Blue, now the second largest domestic carrier in Oz.
Bring on the Virgin (Pacific?) flights between the two continents' hubs! BNE-SFO direct.
VgnAtl747 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 1492 posts, RR: 2 Reply 13, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7057 times:
Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 12): Not Branson they're blocking, but an idea of Sir Richard's which is being funded by American investors. This is an American airline based on the successful Virgin LCC model backed by the equity in the global Virgin brand.
The US majors are doing their best to make it appear like a foreign airline when it is not; a deliberate tactic to slow its entry to market. Qantas used a similar strategy in Australia with Virgin Blue, now the second largest domestic carrier in Oz.
Exactly! I'm so fed up of people saying this is a foreign airline. The model may be Branson's, but he only holds a minority stake (in line with US laws).
ChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1605 posts, RR: 1 Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 6378 times:
Quoting Ghost77 (Reply 3): 2 NEW A320s will be leased to TAM soon as PR-MHE and PR-MHF respectively
Maybe they should just change it to a leasing company? Less competition?
Baw716 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1994 posts, RR: 31 Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 6126 times:
I'm a little surprised to hear that two of Virgin's A320s are being leased out to TAM. I would think that the airline would want its fleet around if the DOT grants their certificate.
We'll know after today what happens in our government (if there is a change in control in Congress...likely in the House of Representatives, less likely in the Senate), but I would imagine that Virgin will have trouble getting anything approved before the new year.
Even then, if they are leasing their aircraft out to other carriers, maybe it isas I have said before: Virgin is waiting until things settle down a bit in the industry before they start operations. It is still a bad time to start new; there is a lot of capacity in the US right now. However, it isn't the capacity that is the problem. It is the fact that there are too many airlines that have cost structures that will make profitability problematic that is driving the current mess in the US airline industry.
If Virgin starts in 2007, they will have a tough go. Then again, if they don't start in 2007, will they ever start?
baw716
David L. Lamb, fmr Area Mgr Alitalia SFO 1998-2002, fmr Regional Analyst SFO-UAL 1992-1998
ASMVPGOLD From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 45 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 5985 times:
SFO seems like an odd place to park aircraft for a few weeks. I thought the ramp space there was rather limited.
Jacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 61 Reply 17, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 5944 times:
Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 12): Not Branson they're blocking, but an idea of Sir Richard's which is being funded by American investors. This is an American airline based on the successful Virgin LCC model backed by the equity in the global Virgin brand.
The US majors are doing their best to make it appear like a foreign airline when it is not; a deliberate tactic to slow its entry to market. Qantas used a similar strategy in Australia with Virgin Blue, now the second largest domestic carrier in Oz.
Bring on the Virgin (Pacific?) flights between the two continents' hubs! BNE-SFO direct.
Quoting VgnAtl747 (Reply 13): Exactly! I'm so fed up of people saying this is a foreign airline. The model may be Branson's, but he only holds a minority stake (in line with US laws).
If you guys ran UA/AA/CO, etc...what would you do? Stall as much as possible or say.."come on in and take some of our profits..we want the competition"?...If you guys were the CEO of such a company, no disrespect, but I would petition the various board of directors to have you fired...
These other carriers are trying to protect their turf in anywhich way possible...
Crosscountry From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 127 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 5754 times:
Land of the free?
The major carriers in the US are affraid of competition, particularly competition which will force them to improve their domestic product.
American, Continental et al have no business in preventing a new carrier starting up.
Typical US protectionist economics at work.
It shouldn't matter a jot whether US markets are already crowded.
A true free market ecomony would welcome the competition and the benefits it would bring for passengers.
VX is US owned, Branson has a minor stake.
Why the hold up?
Yeap I'm totally aware of this, and of course, its just SRB idea behind and American investors, but its REALLY SAD to see VA start-up blocked by either DOT or other american carriers... shame on them!
g77 APM
Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
DC10extender From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 617 posts, RR: 0 Reply 22, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3958 times:
Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 7): Where is the plane parked at? Maybe if I have some time today, I'll take a drive to SFO and take a few photos
Great, we would love to see some photos of the plane.
Did you ever read on your birth certificate that life is fair? Thats cause its not there.
Jacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 61 Reply 23, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 3606 times:
Quoting DC10extender (Reply 23): Great, we would love to see some photos of the plane.
Unfortunately, its not going to happen...
Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 10): Quoting Xpfg (Reply 9):
Hey, Jacob. It's at Signature, but it's really not in a good spot, especially for light. If you have airside access, it's another story. Looks beautiful from the correct angle.
Thanks Xpfg...
Sux...I don't have access to airside, looks like I'm s.o.l....
AS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 5818 posts, RR: 23 Reply 24, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 3396 times:
ASMVPGOLD: I think it more marketing ploy. Let the locals see that new airline is in fact real. Come see the planes sitting at the airport kind of thing. There is still some room over in the area. But thats the reason its at Signature FBO, not plot 41 where UA will say they need the room to park their planes.
ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
Charliejag1 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 238 posts, RR: 0 Reply 25, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 3038 times:
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