A388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9409 posts, RR: 11 Posted (7 years 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 6610 times:
As the Caribbean Aviation, part deux was getting too long, I decided to start this new thread. So let's here you're opinions about the Caribbean aviation in its entirety again and not only discuss the developments surrounding Caribbean Airlines. We have more airlines in our region, luckily
As I've said in another thread of Caribbean Star Airlines, they are starting flights to CUR next month. What surprises me is that I have not seen an add or commercial here in CUR to promote this new flight. How do they promote CUR in Trinidad? I see the famous view of our city (Punda) on their website frontpage and the press release about re-instating the route. Do they do more advertising for this new route?
What's the latest on JM's acquisition/lease of the two 757s and possibly switching to an all-Boeing fleet? I read in another thread they are/were looking at the 757 and 733s and even the 787 for longhaul flights or maybe the 767?
When is Caribbean Airlines's first aircraft (9Y-TAB) scheduled to be rolled out of the paint shop (in ATL?)?
LOL...that thing is still going on after all these years. Wow.
Since we're on the subject of advertising, I'd like to ask how much do you think Caribbean Airlines should spend in advertising since the airline will be in operation in about a month? My mind goes back to when Jetblue and Ted got started and what was the strategy in getting the word out to the markets. Granted, B6 and Ted had deep pockets to start with, but if we were to just look at the strategy alone, what could be copied (or even developed) to help the new airline and despell the worries of some of out colleagues here of the new airline possibly dying or being mistaken for another airline?
God did not create aircraft pilots to be on the ground
Captaink From Mexico, joined May 2001, 5108 posts, RR: 12 Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 6459 times:
Quoting WestIndian425 (Reply 3): I'd like to ask how much do you think Caribbean Airlines should spend in advertising since the airline will be in operation in about a month?
Money wise? Maybe Beewee15 might have a figure on hand, as he has more experience in that area. But here is what I think. Caribbean Airlines would need to bring the VFR traffic in keys routes such as MIA, and JFK up to speed, that they 'exist' and that they are a viable option for returning home. That wouldn't be too hard as many caribbean nationals prefer to fly on Caribbean metal, and how much options with that in view do they have? This is just with MIA and JFK in mind. Not sure what plans Caribbean Airlines has for US expansion. Advertising throughout the caribbean is not as expensive as in the US, but they need to put some attention there as well. Caribbean Airlines wants to become a serious force to reckon with throughout the region well it would need to sell its product well to those who live and travel in the caribbean.
Caribbean Airlines also needs to start attracting the tourists. Their name works well for this. You are flying to the caribbean your only choice should be on Caribbean Airlines. We need advertisements on popular TV channels, (not too far fetched as JM does it.) We need some billboards through out the NY area, if their pockets are really deep they can advertise via the MTA. Continental anyone? Then along the I95 in MIA needs to be tackled, again I have seen a JM ad there before, not sure if it is still around.
I think after these efforts Caribbean Airlines would be well on its way. But of course all this can only be realized if and only if, Caribbean Airlines builds and keeps a good reputation for inflight service, on time flights and a true warm caribbean experience.
Although some may disagree, there was a period in the 'new' BW's history, when they just go the 737NGs and new livery when that was feeling. you stepped on board and you felt as if you were already home. There was a point in the 'new' BW's history when things were 'superficially' on-track, I say superficially as I am not too knowledgeable on what was really happening in terms of their financial situation.
I think however that Caribbean Airlines can only achieve true success by hiring us all. What do you say?
CARIBBEAN AIRLINES "The Warmth of the Islands."
P.S. I still can't believe we saying goodbye to BWIA, it just hasn't set in as yet...
A388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9409 posts, RR: 11 Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 6438 times:
I just read that you are allowed to take a maximum of 15 kg of luggage on Caribbean Star Airlines from CUR to POS and that departure time is 12:45 with arrival in POS at 15:05. This would make the flying time 2 hours and 20 minutes on a Dash-8!!! Will this route be a success? Caribbean people are known to take a lot of baggage and now you are only allowed 15 kg max. I know when you're island hopping you wouldn't need a lot of baggage but flying from CUR to POS isn't exactly island hopping as the distance is longer. I think the smaller capacity of the Dash-8 will give the route only limited success. If Caribbean Airlines would start the POS-CUR-POS route they can become more succesful with their 747-800 because of the aircraft's cargo capacity? CUR was known to people who just came to the island for shopping and go back to Trinidad. A Das-8 won't give you the ability to really go shopping here.
Any opinions on this?
Either way, I wish both Caribbean Star and Caribbean Airlines success of course. Good luck
Beeweel15 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1699 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 6438 times:
Quoting Captaink (Reply 4): Maybe Beewee15 might have a figure on hand, as he has more experience in that area.
From what I know according to information I have on average airlines spend around 12.56 cents per CASM ( Cost per Available Seat Mile) of which .8% goes to promotions & advertising. Although it seems like a tiny amount is adds up.
Quoting Captaink (Reply 4): Caribbean Airlines would need to bring the VFR traffic in keys routes such as MIA, and JFK up to speed, that they 'exist' and that they are a viable option for returning home.
The current BW has that already and why I say that is because I have seen many many trinis yell hell and high water when there is a problem and swear they will never fly BWIA again only to see them a few weeks later on another BW flight and treating you like a friend. I have even experienced it on one of the charter flights worked to Trinidad. It was so funny I got the cursing out of my life but a few weeks later I went into a roti shop only to see the same person mopping to floor of the shop and when he saw me I was treated like i was his good friend.
Quoting Captaink (Reply 4): Caribbean Airlines also needs to start attracting the tourists. Their name works well for this. You are flying to the caribbean your only choice should be on Caribbean Airlines. We need advertisements on popular TV channels, (not too far fetched as JM does it.) We need some billboards through out the NY area, if their pockets are really deep they can advertise via the MTA. Continental anyone? Then along the I95 in MIA needs to be tackled, again I have seen a JM ad there before, not sure if it is still around.
This is where the current BW failed badly enabling JM to come into it markets and erode its share. So we will have to see what they do. I hope they will spend the money this time. And this time in the most unusual places where there are folks who want to soak up some sun during the winter and spring break periods.
Quoting Captaink (Reply 4): Although some may disagree, there was a period in the 'new' BW's history, when they just go the 737NGs and new livery when that was feeling. you stepped on board and you felt as if you were already home. There was a point in the 'new' BW's history when things were 'superficially' on-track, I say superficially as I am not too knowledgeable on what was really happening in terms of their financial situation.
Well I agree with you cause I saw the same at JFK and the NY area BW started off very good then started sliding down hill and alot had to to with some not all of the management.
Quoting Captaink (Reply 4): I think however that Caribbean Airlines can only achieve true success by hiring us all. What do you say?
Well lets do it anyone up to the challenge to start our own airline owned by and run by WEST INDIANS. Cause I know we are as good as the English.
A388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9409 posts, RR: 11 Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6401 times:
I just read that Caribbean Star has made a deal with DHL to carry the extra cargo for their passengers from CUR to POS via CCS. Even so, it is less convenient to passengers. So I really do hope Caribbean Star will order/lease the ERJ190 very soon as this aircraft is more ideal for the POS-CUR-POS route even though a 737 sized aircraft in my opinion is better due to a better cargo capacity.
Captaink From Mexico, joined May 2001, 5108 posts, RR: 12 Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6389 times:
Quoting A388 (Reply 8): I just read that Caribbean Star has made a deal with DHL to carry the extra cargo for their passengers from CUR to POS via CCS. Even so, it is less convenient to passengers. So I really do hope Caribbean Star will order/lease the ERJ190 very soon as this aircraft is more ideal for the POS-CUR-POS route even though a 737 sized aircraft in my opinion is better due to a better cargo capacity.
Is there that much cargo being transported between POS and CUR? What about passenger counts. Can the route support a 738? We are talking about 154 seats in Caribbean Airlines config. How many days a week are you suggesting?
A388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9409 posts, RR: 11 Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 6355 times:
Quoting Captaink (Reply 9): Is there that much cargo being transported between POS and CUR? What about passenger counts. Can the route support a 738? We are talking about 154 seats in Caribbean Airlines config. How many days a week are you suggesting?
I don't know about the demand but CUR was famous among people who just wanted to visit the island for shopping and go back, so the aircraft doesn't always have to be full as the cargo carried compensates it. So both the passenger and cargo demand between POS and CUR were healthy. After the demise of ALM/DCA it surpised a lot of people no other airline wanted to start the route. After a long while BW came in but stopped the flights in about 2 months or so, or even less due to the airline's financial state back than/now.
WestIndian425 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1012 posts, RR: 2 Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 6259 times:
What about the other airports in the ABC islands? Curacao does seem to get a lot of attention, but what about Aruba and Bonaire? How is the demand for travel to these other islands?
CaptainK and BeeweeL15, that was good on the advertising. I sincerely hope that Caribbean Airlines does put up a good advertising campaign, especially since they are officially starting on January 1st.
God did not create aircraft pilots to be on the ground
A388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9409 posts, RR: 11 Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 6249 times:
Quoting WestIndian425 (Reply 13): What about the other airports in the ABC islands? Curacao does seem to get a lot of attention, but what about Aruba and Bonaire? How is the demand for travel to these other islands?
Unfortunately I don't know how the demand from POS to BON and AUA is but from experience the demand to BON and AUA is mainly from tourist from the U.S. and Europe and in the case of AUA also from South America. AUA and BON to my knowledge aren't very popular among Caribbean islands. BON does receive flights from JM but it's only once a week IIRC. I could be wrong though. To give you an impression on the number of flights between the ABC islands and other Caribbean islands, here's an overview:
AUA-SDQ:7 x week with J31 equipment (Caribair)
AUA-SJU: 14 x week B752 equipment (AA)
BON-MBJ/KIN: 1 x week A320/321 equipment (JM)
BON-SJU: 7 x week ATR72 equipment (AA Eagle)
CUR-SDQ: 7 x week MD82 equipment (VH)
CUR-SJU: 5 x week ATR72 equipment (AA Eagle)
CUR-MBJ/KIN: 3 x week A320/321 equipment (JM)
CUR-SXM: 14 x week ATR42 equipment (9H)
BWIA 772 From Barbados, joined May 2002, 2200 posts, RR: 2 Reply 15, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6231 times:
Quoting WestIndian425 (Reply 13): I sincerely hope that Caribbean Airlines does put up a good advertising campaign, especially since they are officially starting on January 1st.
Well when the 9Y TAB arrives it is expected that Caribbean Airlines is going to be launched officially. So they may launch their marketing campaign then.
LI has really upped its marketing recently. I heard the ending part of their new jingle sounds nice. At the bottom there is a link to the press release about the airline going to the World Travel Market http://www.liatairline.com/
River747 From Netherlands, joined Aug 2005, 57 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 6220 times:
I flew this summer CUR-AUA-POS and POS-CUR on Surinam's MD.82 and I was surpised about he number of people boarding in AUA. Also, even though the flights was continued from POS to PBM a lot of people disembarked in POS.
On the way back a lot of people boarded in POS and indeed with a lot of luggage.
Also flown a Dash8 on Tobago Express'inter-islands flights and I was glad the flight on the Dash was only 20 mins, and not 2hrs and 20min, like planned Caribbean Star flights.
A388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9409 posts, RR: 11 Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 6169 times:
Quoting River747 (Reply 16): Also flown a Dash8 on Tobago Express'inter-islands flights and I was glad the flight on the Dash was only 20 mins, and not 2hrs and 20min, like planned Caribbean Star flights.
Agreed. I would also not use Caribbean Star for the CUR-POS flight, that's too long for me in a turboprop aircraft and the luggage allowed is also very limited (15 kg). Like I said the demand is there and a 737-sized aircraft can fill the flights pretty decently.
BWIA 772 From Barbados, joined May 2002, 2200 posts, RR: 2 Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 6151 times:
Quoting Beeweel15 (Reply 17): They should be doing that as we speak. Letting folks know of the up coming transition.
They may not be doing it with the intensity that some us think that it should be done but word is getting around about the transition. Many booking engines had article about caribbean airlines.
There was an article recently about the airline having strong bookings for Carnival. Carnival will be the first test for caribbean airlines and the carrier's performance through this period would be a pretty good indicator of if Caribbean Airlines is different to BWIA. In terms of how customers are treated and how delays are handled.
Beeweel15 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1699 posts, RR: 0 Reply 20, posted (7 years 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 6125 times:
Quoting BWIA 772 (Reply 19): There was an article recently about the airline having strong bookings for Carnival.
Booking are always strong for Carnival even the charter operators are at the max right now. Also remember most of those bookings were made already and were just transfered over to Caribbean.
Quoting BWIA 772 (Reply 19): In terms of how customers are treated and how delays are handled.
When it comes to inflight BW was good and lets hope it continues with Caribbean. On the ground is where needs a lot of improvement especially in Trinidad. I can tell you of several situations I experienced which even I myself could not believe the bad treatment I got and the dont care attitude I got from BW staff once again at Piarco. As for delays a lot of time when it is below three hours it is pretty much standard with all airlines. Once you go over that there needs to be improvement on how things are handled. However with a small fleet a major delay with one aircraft has a very bad ripple effect throughout the entire system.
Beeweel15 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1699 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (7 years 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 6121 times:
I got this artice and think it porvides a look at what I have said.
(From Travel Weekly UK, 06 November, 2006)
(Antigua) World Travel market: Caribbean air taxi service booming.
by Ian Taylor
The popularity of the Eastern Caribbean in the UK is fuelling the expansion of an island-hopping air taxi service as larger airlines in the region struggle. Three out of five passengers aboard the services of Carib Aviation and Grenadine Airways are from the UK, according to owner and managing director Bruce Kaufman.
Speaking at World Travel Market on Monday he said expects to carry more than 70,000 this year aboard a fleet of 22 aircraft, and is looking to buy more. The group includes the merged services of Trans Island Air, SVG Air and Mustique Airways, plus a Dominica Air Taxi service established four months ago between Antigua, Dominica and St Lucia.
The expansion comes as established names such as BWIA disappear from view. It is all the more remarkable because Kaufman, the former owner of an electronics business, had not worked in aviation before retiring to the Caribbean and buying the assets of the failing Barbados-based Trans Island Air in 2000.
He said: “The only experience I had of flying was sleeping on long-haul flights. I was living in Barbados and my wife requested I get out of the house. Trans Island Air was about to go broke and I bought the assets.”
Eight months later Kaufman set up Carib Aviation and in 2004 established the services of Grenadine Airways. “Now I’m out of the house all the time,” he said. The UK provides 60% of his business, the US 20% and inter-island traffic the remainder.
Dominica Air Taxi operates 44 flights a week, connecting with services into Antigua from the UK and US. Seats are bookable online, but Kaufman said 60% of sales still come through the trade.
A388 From Netherlands Antilles, joined May 2001, 9409 posts, RR: 11 Reply 22, posted (7 years 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 6097 times:
Interesting, Grenadines Airways flew from CUR for a few weeks when the single EMB110 of Insel Air was on the ground due to technical problems. Insel Air is a new airline here in CUR. If anything, Grenadines Airways should work on their livery as one side of their DHC-6 shows no name nor a tail logo. Only the other side had a tail logo. See my photos below:
Is Grenadines Airways planning on getting larger aircraft in the near future? How are they doing now, financially speaking? Unfortunately there are very few photos of this airline on the internet as I couldn't find any before I uploaded my photo. Nice to see yet another Caribbean airline and also nice to see the Twin Otter here again after so many years
Beeweel15 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1699 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (7 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 6030 times:
Quoting BWIA 772 (Reply 23): HI guys it just came over the news that BA will be operating the London Route for Caribbean Airlines using a 777. The route will be operated to LGW.
BA you are not serious I hope this is temporary situation. And if it is true Mr. Davies needs to be fired immediately. Do any of you realise how coverted those slots for LHR are and those were that most profitable for BWIA. And Yes with only two planes flying the route if there is a hic cup it does get magnified.
25 AA1818: Man oh man oh man oh man!!! What are you on about???? This is likely to be a very permanent move. LHR never made money for BWIA. The best it did was
26 Captaink: THe LHR slots are indeed coveted. I hope they were not sold, and that LGW is only a temporary situation. Anyone has details on this? You see bigger a
27 Captaink: Whats the situation with this BA flight. Is BW leasing the BA planes/crew for the flight? Does this mean that BW can use the airplane on other route,
28 Beeweel15: This is like dejavue when the Acker group handed BW to American Airlines Mr. Davies is doing the same with BA. BWIA has been handed to the sharks. I
29 WestIndian425: I did a search online and didn't find anything on this. I would love to read this to find out more info, especially the status of the LHR slot. So...
30 Trintocan: Yes, there is another thread about this development with BA. BA will be returning to POS after a 13 year absence. While the flights will be code-share
31 Captaink: Forget BWIA for a second, sadly a SVG Air Commander dissappeared of the radars yesterday. Link to the airplane in question. http://www.aviatorsale.com
32 BWIA 772: Since when sharks only eating bone? In the Barbados Nation there was an article in which Davies noted that BW market share was under 5% and that mark
33 Speedbird2155: This will be a BA service oeprated with full BA aircraft and crew, but with a BW codeshare. The flights will be three times weekly via BGI. I suspect
34 Captaink: Isn't that what they do on the LGW/ANU/GND run? In that the crew LGW/ANU stays over in ANU, whilst a seperate crew does ANU/GND/ANU? My concern is th
35 Beeweel15: Well if and when they do it will be out of Gatwick cause no one in their right mind will give up those LHR slots. As for competition it is there now
36 Captaink: I dunno guys, I am starting to have my doubts now. First we loose the name BWIA, but in some ways we justified it. But I am BW guy, I am proud of BW.
37 A388: Is there a link to a reliable source about Caribbean Airlines selling their LHR slots? Everybody is saying it is the worst decision, which I also agre
38 BWIA 772: Beeweel15 LIAT and Air Jamaica have also hired foreign experts to run their airlines so really what is your point. BTW assets are there to make money
39 Beeweel15: I am glad to see you are beginning to see things from a different light now. You are like me proud of BW and its symbol. I always put BW on a higher
40 A388: Now that you say this, it does makes sense yes. Even so, wouldn't leasing out those slots also generate money for Caribbean Airlines? How valuable we
41 AA1818: I think the piece that Beeweel15 is missing is that BWIA would be a bigger laughing stock had it tried to fight the loosing battle. And you know what
42 BWIA 772: A388 IMHO given the fact that LHR route is loosing alot of money and needing money I would rather lease them out than sell them. LHR is great because
43 A388: That's a lot of money indeed. So for an airline like Caribbean Airlines is doesn't matter whether they operate from LHR or LGW? I assume there are no
44 Beeweel15: No it is you AA. JM folks are laughing at us even more now than ever before. Well why we dont go back to having BA as our national airline seems like
45 A388: Are you sure about Caribbean Airlines only becoming a regional airline? Caribbean Airlines will keep almost everything BW leaves behind (physically s
46 AA1818: http://www.guardian.co.tt/business1.html just thought i'd post a local source on the London route. - the route cannot be run on 1 plane - 2 planes is
47 Beeweel15: In that article it says that LHR was the most profitable so why give it to your competition. That goes to show that several factors in BW did not kno
48 BWIA 772: Couple of things to remember POS only got back FAA Cat 1 in August 2005 so until then the A340 was restricted to the Canada and European routes. Also
49 Beeweel15: Both aircraft have their limitations on those routes but if you know how to maximise the capacity of the aircraft you can make money with either airc
50 Speedbird2155: LGW is a very good airport and although I work at LHR, I very much enjoy using LGW (North of course) when flying home to BGI. The entire feel of the
51 A388: I'm beginning to think that the A343 was too big for BW to operate yearround. The aircraft might be big enough during peak season but what about off-p
52 Trintocan: While it is sad that BW is dropping LHR - certainly for the forseeable future - there is a greater picture whch people need to appreciate. The airline
53 Flybyguy: Now I'm sure that perhaps I've missed the reasoning behind the change from BWIA to Caribbean Airlines. To me it sounds like putting a shiny new bow on
54 BWIA 772: Excellent post trintocan I think most of us have realised the fact that the time has come for BW to change. A388 I agree with you about the 767 would
55 A388: Very well said. All in all, a very well written post Trintocan Also well said. My thaughts exactly A388
56 BWIA 772: Flybyguy Thanx for another thrilling post. Your brilliance is displayed by your acute insight of the Caribbean.Your indepth understanding of the Carib
57 AA1818: many trinidadians havea US visa so it's really not a problem. well i do approximately 10-12 hops across the atlantic/ very long haul each year and no
58 Beeweel15: I agree and many airlines are still feeling the effects of 9/11 and the up and down swings of the fuel prices. Again I agree with you and I do keep t
59 Beeweel15: Well AA I can go along with you on this. Painfull but true on you posting. Good post I must say
60 Beeweel15: Lets get one I know where a few are lying around. Lets see how you all can manage it. Lets put the talk to reality.
61 AA1818: It really is a rare moment for us...hehehe!!! Fresh word out of Trinidad (not my usual reliable source, but a source nonetheless!) Caribbean Airlines
62 BWIA 772: Hopefully they would have applied for jobs at Caribbean Airlines the salaries that I am hearing are not bad and they were not even for managerial pos
63 Beeweel15: Well from that it seems BW/Caribbean is really going to be come a regional carrier. BA/AA are main members of One World so if we already gave away th
64 A388: Well, the first photo of Caribbean Airlines is out, finally!! It has been posted in another thread already but I thaught to keep it central and post t
65 BWIA 772: The winglets look nice along with the tail. But gosh the Caribbean Airlines titles are just UGLY. I wonder what the cabin looks like... As for Davies
66 Drewfly: THIS is the livery that is replacing BWIA? Good lord, you have got to be kidding me. *grabs gun* Who are the managers and where do they live?
67 A388: " target=_blank>http://europeanbusiness.eu.com/featu....html Very interesting article, thanks for the link BWIA 772. When I read the article I immedia
68 Beeweel15: Just change it to Air Jamaica and it will fit better, by the way you wanted the change. THE PAN LOGO MUST FLY AGAIN !!!!
69 BWIA 772: I never said I wanted the change (as in getting rid of the BWIA brand). However I understand why the change (something had to be done with the airlin