LordHowe From Finland, joined Jan 2003, 728 posts, RR: 3 Posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2766 times:
I just came across Qf timetable SYD-NRT-SYD and realized that QF21/22 aircraft seems to stay in NRT the whole long day - as a matter of fact almost 14 hours.
How can QF afford to have this aircraft staying in one place so long? They could almost fly to Cairns and back in that time - not really but anyway, why are they keeping it there for so long.
Ikramerica From United States, joined May 2005, 18390 posts, RR: 59 Reply 1, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2761 times:
curfews and red-eyes. they do the same thing in LAX.
it's one reason Boeing was pushing the Sonic Cruiser way back when. If you could cut your flight time by 20%, you could sometimes get "there and back" in one day rather than needing to RON...
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
QFATWA From Australia, joined Jun 1999, 217 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2660 times:
The reason is cultural - the Japanese traveller (holiday maker) has limited time away from work, and wants to fly at night to maximise time uasge. They often finish work and head straight to the airport. On morning arrival, they join their coach tour immediately and are sightseeing after leaving the airport. It is often interesting to see tour coaches in the afternoon with many passengers asleep. Flights had operated at daytime, but the night flight is the right one for the market.
Swissgabe From Switzerland, joined Jan 2000, 5187 posts, RR: 44 Reply 6, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2353 times:
Quoting LordHowe (Thread starter): I just came across Qf timetable SYD-NRT-SYD and realized that QF21/22 aircraft seems to stay in NRT the whole long day - as a matter of fact almost 14 hours.
How can QF afford to have this aircraft staying in one place so long? They could almost fly to Cairns and back in that time - not really but anyway, why are they keeping it there for so long.
Regards,
LordHowe
Nothing unusual while travel longhaul on similar time zones (eg Europe to Southern Africa and North America to South America). Not all but most European carriers park their aircraft the entire day at JNB (exeption would be KL). Same goes for SAA in Europe (ex. the CPT flight which arrived in FRA in the evening and leaves back to JNB the same night).
Smooth as silk - Royal Orchid Service /// Suid-Afrikaanse Lugdiens - Springbok
ClassicLover From Ireland, joined Mar 2004, 3805 posts, RR: 22 Reply 8, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2231 times:
Quoting LordHowe (Reply 5): True - you can see several of them at the same time in LAX. And actually also the ones lying all day long in QFs European destinations.
The aircraft are used for charters to European destinations from LHR you know, to save them sitting about all day. Also, I believe QF opened a maint centre at LAX to efficiently use that down time.
I choose to fly oneworld, as a member of Qantas Frequent Flyer.
VHVXB From Australia, joined Apr 2006, 5507 posts, RR: 32 Reply 10, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 2197 times:
Quoting LordHowe (Reply 5): True - you can see several of them at the same time in LAX. And actually also the ones lying all day long in QFs European destinations.
Only one flight leaves LAX during the for a night time arrival in SYD. All other flights are early morning arrivals at SYD.
Quoting LordHowe (Reply 5): What a waste of capacity - the planes are made for staying in the air, not on the ground.
Well it probably costs more to keep them in the air than having them sit around all day
VHXLR8 From Australia, joined Feb 2005, 500 posts, RR: 4 Reply 11, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 2110 times:
Quoting Flying Belgian (Reply 7): Would you mean that QF's crews are only doing a day-stop in LAX ?
No, QF crews don't just do a day stop in LAX; depending on the actual pattern thay are operating, they will arrive in the morning, then leave in the evening of the following day (eg. arrive monday morning, leave tuesday evening) or the day after (eg. arrive monday morning, leave wednesday evening).
Crews operating the LAX-JFK-LAX sector will of course always have a longer stay in LAX before operating that.
Gemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 3038 posts, RR: 5 Reply 12, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2024 times:
What this whole thread proves is that airline economics is MUCH more complicated than most people on this site allow.
QF have had aircraft spending the day at LAX & NRT & LHR & FRA, for many years now, so there must be very valid reasons to do so and during that period QF has made pretty good profits, so it's a good call to have them do so.
QFATWA in reply 2 has hit on a specific reason for the NRT layover, although perhaps weakened a bit by the fact that JL's aircraft return to Japan immediately, so their northbound flight is daylight.
LAX is pretty much explained by time differentials. The maintance base was a responce to this. The latest you can leave LAX for SYD is about 1300, after that you run into problems with the SYD curfew. If you left LAX at say 1000 you would be OK with the curfew, but connection possiabilities are limited. There is also an argument that most people dont like the all daylight flight that a 1300 departure gives. Personally I love it!
LHR & FRA are a bit more complex being a mix of slots, curfews and connection times.
Given the hugh captial cost of aircraft I am suprised that it is cost effective for QF to have about a third(11) of their 36 B747s sitting idel most of the day, but they obviously do!
Carpethead From Japan, joined Aug 2004, 2299 posts, RR: 3 Reply 13, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 1804 times:
Many airlines thoroughout the world have aircraft sitting at foreign airport because it makes better sense to park it and then fly it back at a better time.
Avion346 From United States, joined Nov 2003, 184 posts, RR: 1 Reply 14, posted (2 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 1709 times:
Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 4): Look at GRU in the daytime. AA, CO, DL, UA all sitting there waiting for their trips back to the US.
Not to hijack this thread, but I've always found this stupid. The time differential would easily support a mid-morning return to the U.S. that would arrive in the mid afternoon, ready for a Europe-bound departure bank. Crews arrive in the early AM and then spend the day, and night, and depart the next morning. Seems like it would be a MUCH better use of the A/C without compromising connection opportunities.
Jcavinato From United States, joined Jan 2005, 461 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (2 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 685 times:
I remember when props were being replaced by jets in the trans-Atlantic market. There was some debate within the American airline managements as to what would be the best departures from both shores. Many travel agencies and frequent customers wanted to try eastbound day flights. The evening eastbound pattern won out, because of the lucrative mail contracts that were available to PanAm and TWA. Those that left earliest would get the most mail. A day flight leaving in the morning would get none or just any overflow from the night before. So, the pattern evolved of eastbounds leaving early evening, arriving Europe early morning with turn arounds starting anywhere from 10:00 am to about 1:00 pm thus allowing a decent eastbound again that same day.
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