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Delta And Air France In Talks With British Airways  
User currently offlineDeltaAir From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1094 posts, RR: 0
Posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 647 times:

British Airways Plc has begun talks on a possible alliance with Air France and Delta Air Lines of the United States that could lead to the breakup of the UK carrier's Oneworld alliance, the Sunday Times said.

Separately, the Mail on Sunday said BA had held talks with British Prime Minister Tony Blair seeking support to revive plans for a deeper alliance with American Airlines .

Speculation over BA's next move has swirled since the failure in September of its planned merger with Dutch airline KLM , but a BA spokeswoman would only say that the company talked to different airlines all the time and declined comment on the reports.

"People are always putting different airlines together because the industry has said consolidation and alliances are going to happen," the spokeswoman added.

The Sunday Times said unnamed BA executives had confirmed the talks with the other two possible partners, which it said could lead to it switching allegiances away from its Oneworld partner American Airlines.

The paper said it was too early to talk about the chances of a merger with Air France, but said that both sides recognised such a move was possible.

The Mail said a meeting between Blair and BA Chief Executive Rod Eddington had taken place two weeks ago, quoting an unnamed BA source as saying the company had unfinished business with American to which it was returning.

BA tried to form a strong alliance with American last year but was thwarted when U.S. regulators denied the two airlines the anti-trust immunity needed to better co-ordinate their services.

In its first quarter results in August, BA posted a pre-tax profit of just eight million pounds -- down from 23 million a year ago amid a continuing glut of capacity across the North Atlantic, high fuel prices and competition from low-cost carriers.

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
User currently offlineMr.BA From Singapore, joined Sep 2000, 3423 posts, RR: 20
Reply 1, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 574 times:


What's going to happen to OneWorld??? Hope that they won't break up. Do you all think that Qantas will join BA if the deal goes through with Air France and Delta???


Boeing747 万岁!
User currently offlineBlink182 From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 5500 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 560 times:

the US Government won't let this happen if they didn't let AA/BA go through, they won't let BA/AF/DL go through, if anything AA will leave Oneworld to join Qualiflyer and AA has already stated in the near future it will join Qualiflyer. QF might do what BA does, but I have a tremendous feeling that American Airlines might buy a bigger share than British Airways has in Qantas since QF is one of AA's most important partners.I think QF will leave, if anything, I want SR/SN to join Oneworld since it is my favorite alliance along with my favorite airline,American.

Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
User currently offlineMr.BA From Singapore, joined Sep 2000, 3423 posts, RR: 20
Reply 3, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 555 times:


Qantas has so many codeshare flights with AA and BA. Wonder what will happen to Qantas if BA and AA go at their on ways. Do you thing Qantas will follow AA or BA??? Not to mention that AA is your favourite and BA is mine. Just a thought...



Boeing747 万岁!
User currently offlineA350-200 From France, joined Oct 2000, 150 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 547 times:

As Blink said, the US gov might be quite reluctant to let this "BA/DL/AF" go.
Maybe it could be arranged thanks to slots redistribution or left routes but this is a costly way.

Any way don't you think financial links between US companies might evolve in the next few years ?

The anti-trust law is as stringent in the US as it is in Europe, which is a constraint for any alliance.
For instance Star enjoys a very strong position between Germany and Scandinavia, but now reaches full monopoly between Ger and Austria, with Austrian.
A BA/AF alliance might also be difficult to handle and slots/frequencies might have to be left to Star or low fare airlines (competing on French/UK market).
Another difficulty I think: LON is 50 min away from CDG.

I think that without working in an airline at a senior management level it is very difficult to forecast what future alliances will be made of in the short term!
Wait and see!

Anyway I like Skyteam philosophy that aims at being closer to customers: only customer oriented alliances, like any supply chains in other sectors of the economy, will be able to gain confidence.

Rgds, and GO SKYTEAM !!!!!!!

User currently offlineBrissie_lions From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 542 times:

It is impossible for AA to buy a slice in QF which is bigger than BA's because BA owns 25% and Australian foreign ownership laws prohibit more than 49% of QANTAS being in the hands of foreigners, and hell will freeze over before the Australian government allows this law to be lifted.

Ever thought that maybe one of these days that QF might turn around and buy a slice in AA? Not totally out of the question.

Anyway, on this alliance talk. All airlines will stay in Oneworld. As with the BA/KL merger, it will all fall into a heap when it gets down to the nitty-gritty.

User currently offlineA350-200 From France, joined Oct 2000, 150 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 533 times:

Blink and Mr BA,

Regarding QF, I think they could afford to maintain agreements with each of them (BA and AA), still reaping full benefits of codeshares and so on.

Given that transpacific frequencies are expected to grow fast in the next decade, QF might have an enjoyable position anyway.

The alliance model may not be fully settled yet I think.

Whatever may happen I'm not specially affraid of AA (and BA) future since they invest a lot in (rear+front) cabin comfort !
(Never travelled with AA nor BA so I make no comment on this)


User currently offlinePhilB From Ireland, joined May 1999, 2915 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 535 times:

The way BA is going, it's beginning to look like a wallflower at a dance, crying out for any partner whilst rapidly looking less and less attractive.

User currently offlineA350-200 From France, joined Oct 2000, 150 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 523 times:

Dear Phil,

Cynical remark but not very far from what it seems now:
next time I will upgrade you to "respected user" grade.
By the way I have no "respected user", (what a funny stuff !!) but it doesn't mean I respect no one !!
OK it's not a joke forum....

But more seriously, things change fast, and BA is likely to play a major role in the next decade. Regarding executive pax, I will be interested to see the impact of recent investments on traffic to come.


User currently offlineSeasonedflyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 514 times:

I would like to point out to all that BA/AF/DL is not the same as AA/BA.....and therefore has a much better chance of being approved.

Unlike AA, DL doesn't have Heathrow rights. That's the big problem with Oneworld....if AA/BA were to happen, they would own the U.S. to Heathrow service, probably the most lucrative routes in the world.

DL/BA doesn't have that problem. If BA/AF can find a way to work together, then BA/AF/DL actually has a pretty good chance of making it (after all, the EU is very interested in making sure that Lufthansa has some competition).

User currently offlineAFa340-300E From France, joined May 1999, 2084 posts, RR: 25
Reply 10, posted (15 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 469 times:


This would be the third time Air France and British Airways are in talks.

The first time was in 1997, when BA saw that Heathrow and Gatwick would face capacity limits. The airline was looking for an attractive airport in Europe, where there were expansion opportunities.
But Christian Blanc refused he feared what BA would do with Air France. At the time Air France had zero profit and BA made £600 million that year.

The second time was this year. The information was first published by the French economic newspaper 'Les Echos', well-known for the reliability of its information. And the airline were forced to admit that they have had some talks about a possible strategic alliance.

BA had even stated Delta Air Lines would be the best partner for them (because of the network specifications and hubs I would imagine).

Is this time the right one?

Best regards,
Alain Mengus