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Rumor: EK To IAH And YYZ In 2007?  
User currently offlineTriley1057 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 1999, 462 posts, RR: 1
Posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 8206 times:

Don't know if this is true or not, but over in the EK section at Flyertalk.com there are a few posts stating that EK will start YYZ and IAH service in 2007. According to the posts, EK will begin YYZ service on October 28, 2007 and IAH will start on Dec 1, 2007 3 times weekly but will go to daily in February 2008. Is there anyone that can possibly confirm this here? The posts seem to be from EK employees.

42 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineUAEflyer From United Arab Emirates, joined Nov 2006, 1147 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 8172 times:

I am sick from these rumors, i will not believe until i see a press release from Emirates

They should add to their slogan Emirates Keep Discovering Rumors!!


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 2, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 8135 times:

Quoting Triley1057 (Thread starter):
Don't know if this is true or not, but over in the EK section at Flyertalk.com there are a few posts stating that EK will start YYZ and IAH service in 2007. According to the posts, EK will begin YYZ service on October 28, 2007 and IAH will start on Dec 1, 2007 3 times weekly but will go to daily in February 2008. Is there anyone that can possibly confirm this here? The posts seem to be from EK employees.

There are only 3x/weekly slots left from The Emirates to Canada (EY has the other three)..

EK should have gone with the 6 slots available...but they didn't (it was "daily or forget it"..and they got their answer).....

They will have to renegotiate if they want to serve Canada more than 3x/weekly.

IAH sounds interesting...possible...

ORD/LAX/SFO are three places also..but I see IAH before SFO..



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4825 posts, RR: 44
Reply 3, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 7852 times:

This is what is mentioned on that website by a member who is also a member on Airliners.net

New destinations :

-GRU will be 6x weekly 772LR

-IAH will initially be 3x weekly and move upto daily Feb 08

-VCE is correct

-NCL is correct with A 332 daily

-YYZ is not 100% confirmed...mentioned daily with B 773ER from Oct 28th 07


As for frequencies :

-PEK will go double-daily in 2007

-PVG will go double-daily in Feb 08

-BEY goes double-daily end of Mar 07

-DAC goes double-daily end of Mar 07

-MNL goes double-daily end of Mar 07

-KWI gets two more weekly flights on EK853/854 end of Mar 07

-DAM goes 9x weekly beginning of May 07

-BAH goes triple-daily in Feb 2008

-SAH goes 6x weekly in Feb 08


As for aircraft changes on routes :

-JFK - EK201/202 will upgrade to B777-300ER low density

-JFK - EK205/206 will move to A340-500 (but this doesnt sound logical)

-LHR - EK007/008 will operate 4x week with A340-500

-BHX - EK039/040 will upgrade to B777-300ER high density

-ATH - will upgrade to B777-200ER low density

-LCA/MLA - will upgrade to B777-200 but switch to high density

-CMN - will upgrade to A340-300

-ICN - will upgrade to B777-300ER low density

-HBE will upgrade to A330-200 high density (A6-EKL the lone A310 is being phased out)

-CMB/MLE flights will upgrade to B777-200 high density

-CGK nonstop flights upgraded to B777-300ER high density


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 4, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 7820 times:

Hi Behramjee.. Smile

Got a few questions...

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 3):
-YYZ is not 100% confirmed...mentioned daily with B 773ER from Oct 28th 07

Given the situation of the bilaterals right now, does EK have a shot at getting the 3 open slots left, or is EY going to try to get those too (I'm under the assumption they are going on the current bilaterals, and nothing new has come out)...

If they are going with the 6x/weekly bilaterals, I could see EY fighting hard for the other 3 frequencies...

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 3):
-LHR - EK007/008 will operate 4x week with A340-500

Will the other 3x/weekly flights remain with the A332?

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 3):

-JFK - EK205/206 will move to A340-500 (but this doesnt sound logical)

Maybe the A345 is the optimal value for both routes combined (i.e. it could be DXB-HAM is strong, but HAM-JFK a little bit weaker)....

Thanks..

Regards..



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offline777FlyGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 7803 times:

Yeah for real, why do people give so much talk to RUMORS? Some border on the ridiculous at times. I guess idle minds need something to do. For me, I'm awaiting that long rumored announcement that B6 is buying 50 A380's and 50 A350XXXWB's.

User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4825 posts, RR: 44
Reply 6, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 7750 times:

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 4):
Given the situation of the bilaterals right now, does EK have a shot at getting the 3 open slots left, or is EY going to try to get those too (I'm under the assumption they are going on the current bilaterals, and nothing new has come out)...

If they are going with the 6x/weekly bilaterals, I could see EY fighting hard for the other 3 frequencies...

Canada is looking to sign OPEN SKIES agreements with many nations in 2007...if UAE is one of them then its good for EK.

See this :

http://www.embassymag.ca/html/index....&full_path=/2006/november/8/skies/


User currently offlineAirbusfanYYZ From Canada, joined Oct 2002, 1436 posts, RR: 25
Reply 7, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 7737 times:

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 2):
There are only 3x/weekly slots left from The Emirates to Canada (EY has the other three)..

EK should have gone with the 6 slots available...but they didn't (it was "daily or forget it"..and they got their answer).....

They will have to renegotiate if they want to serve Canada more than 3x/weekly.



Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 4):
Given the situation of the bilaterals right now, does EK have a shot at getting the 3 open slots left, or is EY going to try to get those too (I'm under the assumption they are going on the current bilaterals, and nothing new has come out)...



Quoting Behramjee (Reply 3):
-YYZ is not 100% confirmed...mentioned daily with B 773ER from Oct 28th 07

This might be an early indication that the new "Open Skies Policy" to be announced by the Canadian Government next month will include a reworked Canada-UAE bilateral.

Strong indications are that EY is planning to upgauge to the A345 for AUH-YYZ non-stop and also increase frequency to 6x week for Summer 2007.

If a new bilateral does takes effect next year they are probably going to want to grab as much market share as possible before EK jumps in.

Cheers,
Kaz



t.dot photography
User currently offlineTokyoNarita From Palau, joined Aug 2003, 570 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 7726 times:

Where would rumored IAH service stop in Europe or is it rumored non-stop?

TokyoNarita.


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 9, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 7715 times:

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 6):
Canada is looking to sign OPEN SKIES agreements with many nations in 2007...if UAE is one of them then its good for EK.

See this :

http://www.embassymag.ca/html/index....&full_path=/2006/november/8/skies/



Quoting AirbusfanYYZ (Reply 7):

This might be an early indication that the new "Open Skies Policy" to be announced by the Canadian Government next month will include a reworked Canada-UAE bilateral.

Strong indications are that EY is planning to upgauge to the A345 for AUH-YYZ non-stop and also increase frequency to 6x week for Summer 2007.

If a new bilateral does takes effect next year they are probably going to want to grab as much market share as possible before EK jumps in.

Cheers,
Kaz

Got it..thanks Behramjee and Kaz.... Smile

I'm going to read the link Behramjee provided...



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4825 posts, RR: 44
Reply 10, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 7687 times:

Quoting AirbusfanYYZ (Reply 7):
Strong indications are that EY is planning to upgauge to the A345 for AUH-YYZ non-stop and also increase frequency to 6x week for Summer 2007.

yes July 2007 will see nonstops from AUH to YYZ by EYs A 345s...thats what the scoop is here in the local YYZ market.


User currently offlineAirbusfanYYZ From Canada, joined Oct 2002, 1436 posts, RR: 25
Reply 11, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 7658 times:

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 10):
yes July 2007 will see nonstops from AUH to YYZ by EYs A 345s...thats what the scoop is here in the local YYZ market.

Now the only question is will they arrive/depart in daylight hours for us photographers!  pray 

Cheers,
Kaz



t.dot photography
User currently offlineCarfield From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1943 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 7658 times:

Just want to seek clarification regarding these a/c types...

For Boeing 777-300ER Low Density, does it refer to the 77W with the new F suites, J flat seats, or the original 77W with flat seats in F, normal sleeper seats in J?

I wonder if ICN gets a nice boost in the premium products offered there...

Thanks,
Carfield


User currently offlineAirlinefreak1 From United Arab Emirates, joined Jul 2000, 260 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 7630 times:

thats excellent news for EK .

with regards to the UK , so is NCL confirmed for summer 07 ? when will it go online ?
how about the expansion to the US ? will it be non stop ? or via a stop in the UK ?
any more updates would be appreciated .

regards


User currently offlineSqno1 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2004, 687 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 7573 times:

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 3):
-CGK nonstop flights upgraded to B777-300ER high density

Is that EK344 DXB-CGK-SIN-DXB?

With Regards,
Alex.B


User currently offlineSebring From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 1666 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 7518 times:

Quoting AirbusfanYYZ (Reply 7):

If a new bilateral does takes effect next year they are probably going to want to grab as much market share as possible before EK jumps in.

Cheers,
Kaz

One would be well-advised to read the new policy out today. I call it "open skies if" or "open skies but if"

The playing field has to be level, opportunities have to be level, a particular country with an undeveloped or nonexistant market can't put in too much capacity or it's not a candidate country for such an agreement. Both sides have to agree to unlimited fifth freedoms, etc. There can be no airport access constraints. I can see SQ getting in on the basis of offering unlimited fifths and having no practical constraints. Not so certain about UAe with two carriers. That would appear to trigger the caveats in the new policy.

Look for a Canada-Australia deal to be among the first.


User currently offlineMEACEDAR From Lebanon, joined Oct 2006, 753 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 7488 times:

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 3):
BEY goes double-daily end of Mar 07

I though it already was a double....one with an A330 and the other with 777, no?


User currently offlineAirbusfanYYZ From Canada, joined Oct 2002, 1436 posts, RR: 25
Reply 17, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 7474 times:

Quoting Sebring (Reply 15):
One would be well-advised to read the new policy out today. I call it "open skies if" or "open skies but if"

I couldn't find it on the CTA site, do you have a link? Thanks in advance.

Cheers,
Kaz



t.dot photography
User currently offlineSebring From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 1666 posts, RR: 14
Reply 18, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 7434 times:

It's a policy matter, it's not on the CTA site, it's on the Transport Canada site


www.tc.gc.ca/bluesky


User currently offlineThreepoint From Canada, joined Oct 2005, 2165 posts, RR: 9
Reply 19, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 7321 times:

Quoting Sebring (Reply 15):
Both sides have to agree to unlimited fifth freedoms, etc.



Quoting Sebring (Reply 15):
I can see SQ getting in on the basis of offering unlimited fifths and having no practical constraints.

Forgive me if I sound simplistic, but I interpret this scenario as : SQ can take Canadian passengers from Canada and transport them anywhere they like via SIN and conversely AC can pick up Singaporean passengers at SIN and transport them anywhere they serve via a Canadian airport.
I believe if the domestic airport rents/fuel excise tax/security charges issues are addressed then that would serve as a 'reasonably level playing field' for AC or another Canadian carrier. What would you suggest are 'practical constraints' that may hamper SQ or another airline from gaining open skies status?

[Edited 2006-11-27 20:37:20]


The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
User currently offlineSebring From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 1666 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 7262 times:

Quoting Threepoint (Reply 19):
Forgive me if I sound simplistic, but I interpret this scenario as : SQ can take Canadian passengers from Canada and transport them anywhere they like via SIN and conversely AC can pick up Singaporean passengers at SIN and transport them anywhere they serve via a Canadian airport.
I believe if the domestic airport rents/fuel excise tax/security charges issues are addressed then that would serve as a 'reasonably level playing field' for AC or another Canadian carrier. What would you suggest are 'practical constraints' that may hamper SQ or another airline from gaining open skies status?

As I noted, I don't see practical restraints with SIN. Fifths can also be intermediate fifths. I doubt SQ is interesting in flying SIN-YVR or SIN-YYZ nonstop. Vancouver and Toronto are not Los Angeles or New York in terms of sheer volume of customers or the willingness of the markets to pay premium fares. SQ flies to YVR via SEL and is a player on SIN-SEL and SEL-YVR. That makes the route work. It could be argued that if one country has intermediate fifths and Canada can't negotiate those with relevant countries, then there isn't parity. Slot times could also be an issue if an airport were to grant Canadian carriers access at unfavorable times, particularly for fifth freedom follow-on flights. Let's say, strictly theoretically, Air Canada wants to fly Toronto-Dubai-Lahore (which would require fifths and access to Lahore from Pakistan). If Dubai was to say, sure, we'll give you slots at 8 p.m. (meaning AC would have to leave Toronto during the overnight curfew - impossible, and arrive in Lahore after midnight). The Canadian government would likely interpret that as a non-tariff barrier and refuse to do an open skies agreement.

As the policy reads, the government will consult the industry and airports before entering into any negotiations, and then will apply its other tests. it will then prioritize negotiations, chosing those that are in the best interests of Canada. As the policy states, that will include business travel and tourism potential. Its not just about generating activity for the airlines or airports. That's why I say that a deal with Australia (and New Zealand, for that matter) are the type that will go to the very top of the list. You then have to figure out that Canada does not negotiate a lot of air bilaterals in the year and doesn't have the infrastructure to spool up to a much higher rate. That, too, will tend to favor a particular type of deal, where there is broad support from all stakeholders. That's where the UAE may get frustrated. I suspect it will take 2-3 years before there are open skies agreements for all countries that want them and can offer the necessary reciprocity.


User currently offlineThomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 4013 posts, RR: 26
Reply 21, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7146 times:

I have to agree with the skeptics. EK has been dangling this carrot at IAH for close to 10 years now and we are no closer to seeing EK than we were in 1998. I seem to recall all sorts of rumours from "inside sources" of MS starting IAH services sometime in 05/06, only to find out they were unfounded. Frankly, I feel that AI is jerking us around as well.

My motto is, "I'll believe it when I see those tails lining up at D"

Thomas



"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7751 posts, RR: 25
Reply 22, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7131 times:

Quoting Thomasphoto60 (Reply 21):
I have to agree with the skeptics. EK has been dangling this carrot at IAH for close to 10 years now and we are no closer to seeing EK than we were in 1998. I seem to recall all sorts of rumours from "inside sources" of MS starting IAH services sometime in 05/06, only to find out they were unfounded. Frankly, I feel that AI is jerking us around as well.

My motto is, "I'll believe it when I see those tails lining up at D"

I have to agree 100%. EK has been doing the exactly same thing to us here at LAX for a long time as well. I happen to think that LAX and IAH are both worthy of service from EK. I have to admit that I would find it hard to believe that EK's next destination wouldnt be on the west coast, but I could be wrong.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineMk777 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1195 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 7045 times:

When will EK, EY or even QR decide to fly to IAD...please don't say never.  banghead 


come fly with me
User currently offlineThreepoint From Canada, joined Oct 2005, 2165 posts, RR: 9
Reply 24, posted (7 years 12 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6959 times:

Quoting Sebring (Reply 20):
That's why I say that a deal with Australia (and New Zealand, for that matter) are the type that will go to the very top of the list.

Agreed. Both countries fit into the 'why haven't we negotiated these agreements already?' category. With the imminent arrival of AC planes that can fly to these countries non-stop, I foresee huge response from the flying public and tourism stakeholders. And it also meshes with your stated non-stop YVR/YYZ-SYD service near the top of AC's prioritiy list for new routes, although AKL remains absent.

Quoting Sebring (Reply 20):
You then have to figure out that Canada does not negotiate a lot of air bilaterals in the year and doesn't have the infrastructure to spool up to a much higher rate.

To which infrastructure do you refer? Are you thinking physical structure (airport capacity/gate space/service facilities) or more along the lines of capability of TC and other stakeholder staff to negotiate and implement these agreements?



The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
25 Sebring : The latter.
26 Flying Belgian : What about CPH or BRU guys ?? Any plans for EK in those two cities ? FB.
27 Yellowtail : IAH-Dubai....talk about premium traffic...then again Gulf Air did fail in a similar route (albeit through IAD) IAH-KWI would definitely work though. H
28 Thomasphoto60 : Actually GF was routed through JFK and if memory serves via Nicosia (or perhaps Larnaca), I know there was a stop in Cyprus. Let's also not forget th
29 NateDAL : IAH-DXB is possible with an A345 of 772LR. I think it will be a huge success. Houston has very stong business ties to the Persian Gulf which will hel
30 Thomasphoto60 : So, this service success is solely predicated on high oil prices......wow! Prices are high now but what happens when (not if) prices drop or even col
31 102IAHexpress : I don’t know. This is a trend of yours, kill any good IAH buzz. But lets assume that the energy traffic will be lackluster, you still have to ackno
32 Triley1057 : Just to add some fuel to the rumor, new cabin crew recruits at the training college have been told of upcoming 20 routes which include IAH, GRU, YYZ,
33 FlyEmirates : Just a few comments regarding some of the new routes/frequencies, having looked at EKs intranet on the flight status page I put in the random date of
34 Thomasphoto60 : You could look at it that way but I don't. Actually I am cautiously optimistic in terms of new int'l service. Keep in mind that EK's management has n
35 LAXdude1023 : [quote=102IAHexpress,reply=31]I don?t know. This is a trend of yours, kill any good IAH buzz. [quote] I dont think he is, hes being realistic. IAH is
36 Jacobin777 : PK was terrible in advertising..I know so many Pakistani's who had no clue that PK even flew there..in fact, I even knew PK employees who's families
37 102IAHexpress : But that goes without saying. All of us who care about IAH or any airport for that matter are cautiously optimistic. I don’t take stock in every ru
38 Thomasphoto60 : PK is indeed still around, but not in H-Town. That is wonderful news but in what way does this effect their lackluster pax operation? I agree, but it
39 Behramjee : Hi Thomas, With regards to your above mentioned quote, I would like to give my opinion on the matter. PIA never had a realistic of making IAH succeed
40 NateDAL : You are far too pessimistic. CI has been in Houston for more than two years now. Currently, they are at 3x weekly pax flights. That is pretty good, e
41 LAXdude1023 : I have wonder: Is IAH really the next logical step for EK? But I guess it depends on the market targeted really. There has to be good business ties, b
42 Yellowtail : Their biggest problem is that IAH-TP is not non-stop......stopping is SEA is a real pain. Most Tiawanese comign up from Central America will go IAH-L
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