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US Airways Flyers Hoping Against The Merger?  
User currently offlineUSAirPlatinum From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2006, 244 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4393 times:

I've seen a ton of US Airways bashing from the Delta fans, and it seems to be the origin of most of the anti-merger sentiment. But as a frequent flyer on both US (and once Delta), I'm hoping the merger doesn't go through.

First of all, if it does go through, those of us who fly US regularly will get swamped with the angry Delta attitude against US Airways and its customers. It never fails, when I meet a Delta employee and mention US, that they fly into a tirade about how much US sucks and how they don't believe it's in business, etc., etc., etc. That ancient rivalry won't go away, and if US gets Delta, it will be facing legions of sullen, angry employees who almost shut down the airline (pilots) and who picketed ticket counters against mergers and reorganizations. Who wants that?

Second of all, contrary to all the Delta fanboy rhetoric, Delta's in bad shape. I live in the UK and in Philadelphia, and in Britain, Delta is notorious for being the carrier from America with the old, dirty planes and the cheap fares. US definitely has a better reputation.

A flight on Delta today is far from fun. Whether it's a jaunt on an old, dirty MD-80, or one of Delta's "domestic" 767s across the Atlantic, it's just a tick above RyanAir. SkyMiles is a joke compared to Dividend Miles -- redeeming miles is difficult, upgrade opportunities are well-nigh impossible, and the SkyTeam network is far less useful for business travelers like myself.

There's all this talk about Delta's "turnaround," but if the $88 million loss posted this month (going into a weak winter with high fuel prices) is a turnaround, I'd hate to see a downturn. Delta's "plan" appears increasingly desperate -- reviving Pan Am's old business model at JFK and hoping that it will work better than it did for Pan Am over the medium term. The RJ experience is part and parcel of flying Delta -- even moreso than US Airways. Connections through Atlanta are hellish when compared with Charlotte.

Meanwhile, Continental across town offers a vastly more convenient airport, better in-flight experience, and better overall product. And JetBlue is going to slaughter Delta's domestic feed from a brand new TWA terminal. Delta's NYC RJ and Domestic 767 "hub" will get slaughtered by both within two years. And calling Terminal 3 at JFK "awful" is an understatement. Rip on Philadelphia all you want, as a connecting facility, it's vastly superior with modern and efficient international facilities.

I could go on and on, but I won't. I think it's pretty clear why US should step back from its bid. Politicians' grandstanding and employee unrest notwithstanding, Delta is a dead man walking -- its employee and fan protestations remind me a bit of what the Pan Am people were saying about Delta in 1990. US Airways has an opportunity to improve its network, update its fleet, and continue its operational profitability improvements while Delta continues to circle the drain.

If Delta has assets that US wants, they should wait a year or so after Delta exits Chapter 11 in 2007 and ends up collapsing back into bankruptcy (and liquidation). They'll get assets on the cheap and hopefully more humble employees.

Meanwhile, I'll keep flying US, and thank US Airways employees for their great service (including through the dark days of 2004) and class act. I truly believe that US is setting the future of network carrier air travel.


"Hey guys, Delta is OUR Delta right now." -- Unpaid Creditors
65 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBucky707 From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1028 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4362 times:

you believe what you want to believe. As long as you are against a Delta-USAir merger, that's fine with me.

User currently offlineSonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4333 times:

It's all about Delta eh? Never mind the horrible conditions the industry is in. Since we need mergers, what makes DL so much better than everybody else.

-SOAC



Non Illegitimi Carborundum
User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4747 posts, RR: 45
Reply 3, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4318 times:

is there a point to this thread?


Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineUSAirPlatinum From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2006, 244 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4320 times:

Did you read my post?

I don't think, as a US Airways flyer, that glomming Delta's cold corpse onto a now-healthy US would add anything for me as a customer, especially with all the improvements US has made in the past 12 months -- financially, operationally, and in terms of customer service. I think US building its network organically and buying assets in a Delta liquidation in a couple of years would deliver much more value.

I think the chance is pretty high that Delta would be back in bankruptcy court within 24 months if they "go it alone" anyway -- especially since they'll have to almost match or beat Parker's offer in order to do so.



"Hey guys, Delta is OUR Delta right now." -- Unpaid Creditors
User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 17
Reply 5, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4293 times:

Quoting Bucky707 (Reply 1):
you believe what you want to believe. As long as you are against a Delta-USAir merger, that's fine with me.

That is such a contradictory statement. First, you're saying that he can believe whatever he wants, and then you say that he HAS to agree with you. How 1984-ish.

For what it's worth, I'd like to see the merger happen, however, I am not holding my breath waiting for the Department of Justice, if not everybody else, to approve of it, and were I in charge of the DoJ, I'd be suing for this merger to not happen under Sherman Antitrust.



Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineDL787932ER From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4273 times:

I recommended deletion. I'm sure you can find an "Av Polls & Prefs" thread to join if you feel the need to emotionally bash your non-preferred carrier with no basis in fact.


F L Y D E L T A J E T S
User currently offlineKstateinALB From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 749 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4272 times:

For me, I'd somewhat like to see the merger happen. It would be an airline which could, in fact, be ready to fight against other future merged airlines. But, it could bring down the service of the airline, or even raise fares in cities. It will be a very interesting few months to see if it happens.


ALB, DTW, ORD, MDW, MCI, JFK, LGA, LHR, MAD, MSP, IAD, DCA, MCO, ATL, CVG, TUL, MHK, PHL, PIT, DFW, DAL, CLT, IND, AUS,
User currently offlineBucky707 From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1028 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4263 times:

Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 5):
That is such a contradictory statement. First, you're saying that he can believe whatever he wants, and then you say that he HAS to agree with you. How 1984-ish.

where in my post did I say he has to agree with me?


User currently offlineUSAirPlatinum From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2006, 244 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4243 times:

I think US Airways is actually well positioned, and what it needs in terms of coverage (the midwest and Asia), Delta cannot deliver.

Another year or two of competing with a healthy US Airways with new planes in the east, and with a United-Continental entity (as is being discussed apparently) will put Delta under. If US plays its Star Alliance card well, it could end up as the "new Continental" -- a mid-sized carrier with improving service and expanding destinations across the continent and Europe, with some service to Asia.

Right now, all the merger candidates are not appealing. Why not just order some extra 330s (beyond the 20 or so on order) and keep international expansion going, including perhaps a PHL-NRT toehold into Asia?

US Airways is profitable, no need to ruin that (and lots of other things like Dividend Miles) by assuming all of Delta's problems.



"Hey guys, Delta is OUR Delta right now." -- Unpaid Creditors
User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4747 posts, RR: 45
Reply 10, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4221 times:

seems your deepest fear is that you'll lose your status or not be as upgraded as often as a result of DL's SkyMiles program being significantly larger, with a significantly larger population of "Medallion" members.

beyond that, your argument is about as tired and jaded as you are.

best of luck.



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineAirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4217 times:

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 2):
Since we need mergers

Again why do we need these mergers? Sure isn't going to benefit the flyers or employees. In my humble opinion the US/DL and the talk of UA/CO mergers just don't make any sense, overlapping markets, difference in equipment etc.


User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 17
Reply 12, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4207 times:

Quoting Bucky707 (Reply 8):
where in my post did I say he has to agree with me?



Quoting Bucky707 (Reply 1):
As long as you are against a Delta-USAir merger, that's fine with me.



Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineCOERJ145 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4191 times:

Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
SkyMiles is a joke compared to Dividend Miles -- redeeming miles is difficult, upgrade opportunities are well-nigh impossible, and the SkyTeam network is far less useful for business travelers like myself.

What US should do is bring back the short-haul 15,000 mile awards for flights under 750 miles like AA and UA have, and eliminate the blackout dates(Skymiles doesn't have any from what I know). Once they do this, I'll be more inclined to fly them.


User currently offlineEvan767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 2957 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4170 times:

Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
the angry Delta attitude



Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
Delta is notorious for being the carrier from America with the old, dirty planes and the cheap fares



Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
US definitely has a better reputation.



Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
old, dirty MD-80



Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
just a tick above RyanAir



Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
upgrade opportunities are well-nigh impossible



Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
Philadelphia is vastly superior with modern and efficient international facilities.



Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
Delta exits Chapter 11 in 2007 and ends up collapsing back into bankruptcy (and liquidation



Quoting USAirPlatinum (Thread starter):
US Airways employees for their great service

Except for MD-88's being old (how can you say they are dirty if DL has upgraded EVERY single interior to be spotless?), I don't see much truth in ANY of those statements. You're gonna get it. Prepare to be flamed and bashed and flamed some more. Just warnin' ya.

 duck   duck   flamed   flamed 



The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7534 posts, RR: 25
Reply 15, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4170 times:

I myself am a DL Medallion flyer and my godfather is a US pilot. Last night I called him in Pittsburgh to wish him a happy birthday. The one thing we agree on: WE DONT WANT THIS. He is worried about job security for the US employees, the route network remaining intact, etc. Im sure the DL employees worry about the same. I would. Mergers are a no win for the employees. For the sake of US and DL, I hope this merger doesnt happen.


Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineBucky707 From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1028 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4146 times:

so saying its fine with me that you are against the merger is the same as saying you HAVE to agree with me? Interesting.

User currently offlineEvan767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 2957 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4146 times:

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 15):
Im sure the DL employees worry about the same

They certainly do.



The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
User currently offlineUSAirPlatinum From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2006, 244 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4126 times:

your deepest fear is that you'll lose your status or not be as upgraded as often as a result of DL's SkyMiles program being significantly larger, with a significantly larger population of "Medallion" members

I'm actually not just thinking about that, since I usually fly internationally (where upgrades don't happen). I just don't relish needing 50,000 miles or more to get domestic coach seats, and I also don't fancy Delta levels of service.

Except for MD-88's being old (how can you say they are dirty if DL has upgraded EVERY single interior to be spotless?), I don't see much truth in ANY of those statements. You're gonna get it. Prepare to be flamed and bashed and flamed some more. Just warnin' ya.

My observations are based on my own experiences. I would think that given all the (unjustified) bashing US gets here on a daily basis, that Delta fans could engage reality with their eyes wide open.  Wink



"Hey guys, Delta is OUR Delta right now." -- Unpaid Creditors
User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 17
Reply 19, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4119 times:

Quoting Bucky707 (Reply 16):
so saying its fine with me that you are against the merger is the same as saying you HAVE to agree with me? Interesting.

No...you're saying that "As long as you are against a Delta-USAir merger, that's fine with me." is basically saying that it is NOT OK if you are FOR a Delta-US Airways merger. If that is not how you meant it, I apologize wholeheartedly.



Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9191 posts, RR: 18
Reply 20, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4115 times:

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 15):
I myself am a DL Medallion flyer and my godfather is a US pilot. Last night I called him in Pittsburgh to wish him a happy birthday. The one thing we agree on: WE DONT WANT THIS. He is worried about job security for the US employees, the route network remaining intact, etc. Im sure the DL employees worry about the same. I would. Mergers are a no win for the employees. For the sake of US and DL, I hope this merger doesnt happen.

I guess I am a bit neutral now with the US/DL merger, or a little towards neutral anyway. A good thing: possible PIT build-up, a few added destinations. The largest domestic airline, better 767/777 aircraft with the 787 on order(?). Some bad things... Suppose Parker isn't true to his word on PIT and actually cuts more mainline flights and puts them in PHL or CVG, leaving PIT more and more of a RJ base, B6 will be kept in check when considering PHL (yes, I would like to see B6 in PHL), the whole situation with employees and pax alike as posted above...

I am still against this merger somewhat because DL has done a LOT in trying to turn a profit again, and I don't want to see management disappear into US. I am happy for what both US and DL have done. US has improved its image considerably, and DL is trying to do the same. US already merged with HP and should complete that before taking on another big fish in the pond.



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineMCIGuy From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1936 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4103 times:

I'm of the opposite mindset. I have serious issue with USAirways (with good reason) and I actually like Delta.


Airliners.net Moderator Team
User currently offlineEvan767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 2957 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4103 times:

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 20):
aircraft with the 787 on order(?).

Nope. Try an Airbus (Yeah, I said AIRBUS) A350.



The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
User currently offlineSonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4096 times:

Quoting AirCop (Reply 11):
Again why do we need these mergers? Sure isn't going to benefit the flyers or employees. In my humble opinion the US/DL and the talk of UA/CO mergers just don't make any sense, overlapping markets, difference in equipment etc.

There is too much competition. The U.S. does not need 8 major players in this industry. We are NOT that big.

While it may hurt the flyers, it will greatly benefit the employees, especially in the long run. They will be working for stable airlines that are built for the future, not airlines that are built for the next year, like the current airlines.

-SOAC



Non Illegitimi Carborundum
User currently offlineUSAirPlatinum From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2006, 244 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4096 times:

DL has done a LOT in trying to turn a profit again

DL can only turn a meagre profit in the summer months in one of the strongest travel seasons in recent memory. Even NWA managed the same. I don't think it's a viable carrier -- it's as in danger as US Airways was when emerging from its first bankruptcy with high hopes.

US already merged with HP and should complete that before taking on another big fish in the pond.

I agree that US should focus on improving its own operation. It has a lot of opportunities to grow and thrive with its existing network -- for instance, some London flights to PHX and LAS.



"Hey guys, Delta is OUR Delta right now." -- Unpaid Creditors
25 ScottB : Have you been on a Delta MD-88 in the past two years? Every single MD-88 I've been on in the past year has had the new, refreshed interior which I fi
26 Post contains images LAXdude1023 : Unfortunately, this is what I would put my money on. Not in favor of CVG, because I think they would dissappear into the woodwork too, but PHL instea
27 Micstatic : Bucky, I agree with your posts on this subject. Further, I'll add that I came to this thread because it was somewhat unique. It is fairly hard to find
28 Post contains images USAirPlatinum : How are those upgrade opportunities going on the US East 757's with 8, count 'em 8 first class seats? I don't fly leisure markets like Las Vegas very
29 Micstatic : Didn't think I could, but I actually partially agree with you on this point. I think all the airlines here in the US think intl flying is their ticke
30 Post contains images LAXdude1023 : Really???? ATL is one of the most organized airports in the world for in-transit flying. Compared to the amount of traffic they get, ATL is an engine
31 USAirPlatinum : But I will add that this isn't just delta. Continental who you seemed to speak highly of is doing the same thing. But Continental has a loyal business
32 Panamair : Actually excellent. 26 seats in First! All ex-Song a/c have been refurbished and are now 2 cabin. Having trouble keeping up? We've established that D
33 SHUPirate1 : Take it from me...I'm a Silver, and I have NEVER had significant problems getting upgraded on flights on US Airways East-configuration 757's. Sure, I
34 USAirPlatinum : Operating Income matters as it gives a picture of how the airline is actually performing doing its main job - flying. Except that the interest payment
35 Micstatic : Doubtful considering NYC is perhaps the number 1 tourist destination in the world. Even if. Howdoes this point addresses the thread subject?
36 USAirPlatinum : Doubtful considering NYC is perhaps the number 1 tourist destination in the world. Even if. Howdoes this point addresses the thread subject? It's not
37 Evan767 : Beat me to it! Upgrade opportunities on a Song aircraft are outstanding! Many medallions are taking advantage of it. Hell, there's so many F class se
38 USAirPlatinum : I'm not a know-it-all, just a frequent flyer who doesn't want Delta's horrifying problems to drag down the good things happening at US Airways.
39 Post contains images Evan767 :
40 Micstatic : Delta has executed some very impressive cost cuts. I think they are doing much better now. I would be open to Delta merging with other carriers possi
41 USAirPlatinum : USAir brings nothing to the table for Delta. Absolutely nothing. Except the prospect of survival of the corporate name, and preservation of a majority
42 Micstatic : Yeah, and US sure has a lot that would. Cough Cough. The shuttle. That's about it there. More people fly DL Shuttle compared to US Shuttle anyway.
43 USAirPlatinum : US is profitable and paying its bills while generating positive cash flow, and is successfully hedging its fuel. Even if US went out of business in 20
44 Micstatic : We will see what happens when DL exits CH11. US Airways has been in dire straights more than any other carrier over the last 10 years if you look at
45 USAirPlatinum : I wouldn't call Delta fanboys hopping on the US Air fanguy as an "asswhipping" -- more just fanboys angry that they're getting a bit of the treatment
46 Micstatic : Considering you haven't made a point that hasn't been easily and rapidly defused, and you have no supporters on this subject, I will just chuckle and
47 ScottB : Good luck trying to find a 757 flying scheduled service with the Song interior -- you won't. But you'll still have the generous 8 F seats on the US 7
48 LAXdude1023 : Look, I think both airlines deserves some credit. US was in very dire straits, they have pulled themselves up from the rubble (even though they still
49 BillReid : I am a platinum on DL and fly on both airlines. Simply put there is little difference in quality. I'll take KLM or LH or BA. The cuts on CH11 airlines
50 Post contains images Jlbmedia : USAirPlatinum, I just want to say that you are a very brave man. Supporting both USAirways and PHL on this forum, and at the same time! You have earne
51 DeltaL1011man : USAirPlatinum In addition, I'll take a Republic E170 over a Delta Connection turboprop any day of the week! i hate to break it to you but DL has 24 pr
52 Bucky707 : Thanks. I think the 88s are pretty good too. Had a passenger on my last trip ask how old the plane was. He thought it was new and complimented the in
53 Micstatic : Honestly without bias, I love the MD-88's. Having a seat in the 2 seat side of the plane is really nice. Especially with the new interiors.
54 Malexander131 : Why is it that any time someone posts something pro-US, they immediately get slammed?
55 Post contains links DeltaL1011man : www.keepdeltamydelta.org
56 Alitalia744 : Bro - you're so great at spinning - you should be in pols. You fail to mention that USEx operates S340s, Dash-8s and WOAH! even B1900s! Pot, is that
57 DeltAirlines : Here are some of my thoughts, as someone who holds Silver-level status Delta, and has held Silver-level status recently on US Airways (technically, I'
58 Post contains images Steeler83 : I am kinda leaning towards that myself, because I lived in that city when US management (pre-HP) promised the city that it would keep its hub there.
59 Vega : From what source are you getting data that DLs trans-atlantic services from JFK are primarily NYC O&D, or even as much as 40% O&D? Of the top 13 airl
60 Jmc1975 : Awwww.....that's so sweet! I'm sure the airline is better off for it.
61 Jmc1975 : WHOA!!!!!! STOP THE PRESS!!!!! US AIRWAYS IS MERGING WITH ALASKA???? I MUST'VE BEEN SLEEPING UNDER A ROCK. I CANNOT WAIT TO SEE THE NEW US AIRWAYS LI
62 Captaink : I an with USAirPlatinum on the following points. 1. THe US Airways bashing on this forum is ridiculous and at times unfouned. US Airways have come a l
63 Jc2354 : Why?
64 Panamair : Taking a step back from all the heat that threads like this generate, (and these threads tend to focus on the Micro issues instead of the Macro), my m
65 Micstatic : hah, My bad. You all know what I meant.
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