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Amazing Video! Short Field Takeoff Onboard A 727  
User currently offlineB737-112 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 883 posts, RR: 7
Posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 18077 times:

This dirt runway has hills like a rollercoaster and the 727 experiences a stickshaker on takeoff. Truly awesome!




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ghFuWv_gFE

37 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCX747 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 4445 posts, RR: 5
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 17964 times:

I tip my cap to the 727. I highly doubt we will see 737NGs or A320s operating from dirt runways at any point during their careers.


"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
User currently offlinePHKLM From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Dec 2005, 1198 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 17909 times:

Wow, 300 flying hours per month, 3 days without leaving the cockpit, in those conditions...
Like the guy says: "being a pilot there at that time was distinctive, mythical almost".


User currently offlineHAJFlyer From Switzerland, joined Sep 2005, 1472 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 17564 times:

Wow ! That is absolutely terriffic.

They sure do not make them like that any more. I do not want to image what shape an A320 would be in after operating in such an environment for even a week.


User currently offlineRyan h From Australia, joined Aug 2001, 1499 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 17307 times:

Interesting video.

The runway did not look that level.



South Australian Spotter
User currently offlineJetJeanes From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1429 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 17071 times:

I had head about them landing on dirt runways before and seen them with ski,s on the nose gear, i just wonder about fod>> can you imagine what those engines are ingesting... that runway looked almost like it was going down hill


i can see for 80 miles
User currently offlineOsiris30 From Barbados, joined Sep 2006, 3186 posts, RR: 26
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 16954 times:

Quoting CX747 (Reply 1):
I highly doubt we will see 737NGs or A320s operating from dirt runways at any point during their careers.

Not with the low slung engines.. They would be toast before you ever reached rotation. Those engines sitting high on the tail are great for two things, water ditching, and crap runways  Smile



I don't care what you think of my opinion. It's my opinion, so have a nice day :)
User currently offlineGearup From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 578 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 16743 times:

Quoting HAJFlyer (Reply 3):
They sure do not make them like that any more. I do not want to image what shape an A320 would be in after operating in such an environment for even a week.

Why? because it's an Airbus? Make no mistake, this kind of operation will cause a problem for any aircraft (except for a DC-3!). The 27 only succeeds because of it's high lift devices, high mounted engines and large wheels and as the video shows, it was right on the margin of total disaster. Completley dumb to use an aircraft designed for paved ICAO runways instead of a more appropriate C130.



I have no memory of this place.
User currently offlineFlyf15 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 16687 times:

Quoting Gearup (Reply 7):
it was right on the margin of total disaster. Completley dumb to use an aircraft designed for paved ICAO runways instead of a more appropriate C130.

Actually, if you'll notice, they're getting the shaker while on the ground. They got the nose off the ground as soon as possible instead of at Vr... soft field technique. Uses up more runway due to the drag but you're getting the weight off the mains as soon as possible... and you lift off the ground at the slowest possible speed. Once off, slowly lower the nose and accelerate in ground effect until you're at normal climb speed.


User currently offlineCrownvic From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1798 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 16522 times:

Flyf15...Are you sure that is the stick shaker? As you know, the 727 normally "ground hugs" just before rotation. This same noise is heard from from free spinning nose gear tires that have left the ground as well, but you could be right.

I actually saw this video about two years ago and it was more complete. This version cut off sooner than the original, but cannot remember where I saw it.


User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8626 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 16455 times:

Quoting Crownvic (Reply 9):
I actually saw this video about two years ago and it was more complete. This version cut off sooner than the original, but cannot remember where I saw it.

If you find it, please post it.

MCOflyer



Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineKPDX From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2693 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 16414 times:

Can someone embed the vid for me? Cause the vids dont work for me on the site, but when people embed them they do. Yes, I know its weird. Big grin

KPDX  Smile



View my aviation videos on Youtube by searching for zildjiandrummr12
User currently offlineQF772 From Australia, joined Aug 2006, 102 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 15607 times:

Quoting CX747 (Reply 1):
I highly doubt we will see 737NGs or A320s operating from dirt runways at any point during their careers.

Make you wonder what they will do when the current crop reach the end of their usefull life?



Eagles may soar but weasles don't get sucked into jet engines
User currently offlineMighluss From Spain, joined Oct 2001, 936 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 15418 times:

Quoting KPDX (Reply 11):
Can someone embed the vid for me?

Of course!





I thought that soft field technique was done only with light STOL planes!! Big grin



Miquel.
User currently offlinePHKLM From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Dec 2005, 1198 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 15248 times:

Quoting Crownvic (Reply 9):
I actually saw this video about two years ago and it was more complete. This version cut off sooner than the original, but cannot remember where I saw it.

It's on YouTube as well http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BIJqb90S-8


User currently offlinePanAmOldDC8 From Barbados, joined Dec 2006, 960 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 15148 times:

Quoting Gearup (Reply 7):
Why? because it's an Airbus? Make no mistake, this kind of operation will cause a problem for any aircraft (except for a DC-3!).

That is what the 727 was designed for. Originally it was designed for the short hops in Germany, but it was also designed to take off on short runways that were rough



Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait
User currently offlinePanAmOldDC8 From Barbados, joined Dec 2006, 960 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 13516 times:

Quoting B737-112 (Thread starter):
This dirt runway has hills like a rollercoaster and the 727 experiences a stickshaker on takeoff. Truly awesome!

Amazing aircraft, loved the 727. This will be my last post as I have found that this site does not meet my needs as well s I mar have said some things which were uncalled for . Good luck to you all and enjoy your discussions
PanAmoldDC8



Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait
User currently offlineRichm From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2004, 796 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 13067 times:

When you guys refer to it a "dirt runway", is that simply all it is? Or is it asphalt covered in dirt?

- Rich


User currently offlineKPDX From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2693 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 11827 times:

Quoting Mighluss (Reply 13):

Thank you!  bigthumbsup 

KPDX  Smile



View my aviation videos on Youtube by searching for zildjiandrummr12
User currently offlineAS907 From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 11373 times:

Quoting Richm (Reply 17):
When you guys refer to it a "dirt runway", is that simply all it is? Or is it asphalt covered in dirt?

Dirt Runway. It's amazing at what some airplanes are able to operate on. I always enjoy landing on a gravel strip. I bet it would be even better in a 727.


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 20, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 11075 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD DATABASE EDITOR




Quoting Osiris30 (Reply 6):
Quoting CX747 (Reply 1):
I highly doubt we will see 737NGs or A320s operating from dirt runways at any point during their careers.

Not with the low slung engines.. They would be toast before you ever reached rotation.



Quoting Gearup (Reply 7):
Make no mistake, this kind of operation will cause a problem for any aircraft (except for a DC-3!). The 27 only succeeds because of it's high lift devices, high mounted engines and large wheels and as the video shows, it was right on the margin of total disaster. Completley dumb to use an aircraft designed for paved ICAO runways instead of a more appropriate C130.

737-200s have routinely operated into and out of dirt and gravel strips for decades....using their low-slung engines, even:



Nothing "dumb" about operating an aircraft within it's certified limitations...  Wink


2H4





Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineAero145 From Iceland, joined Jan 2005, 3071 posts, RR: 21
Reply 21, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 10973 times:

As this thread is about the 727 flying to and from gravel strips, how is for example the An-124 or An-225? I saw somewhere that they're made for landing on all runways, that's gravel, dirt and grass... is it something that the aircraft could do or can do?

Nice video btw.


User currently offlineMd80fanatic From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 2659 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 10481 times:

Why would it be unusual to get a stick shaker during a short field takeoff like this? Once the nose wheel is off the ground, and until the mains leave the ground, the wings are "stalling". There is not yet enough airspeed to support the airfoil AOA.

BTW, that dirt field is child's play for an MD.  Wink


User currently offlineSanjet From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 180 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 10034 times:

They stated that dirt runway was 1800 meters. That's only 3300 feet!!! They must land heavy and take off nearly empty with that kind of runway I would imagine. Specially when you are doing soft field procedure.



By the way First Air regularly operates 737-200's on soft/gravel strips.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Peter Nickerson



You can clearly see the gravel kit installed on the nost gear and the blowers in front of both engine that blows bleed air to blow away dirt/gravel on take/landing.



Will Fly For Food!
User currently offlineLXLucien From Switzerland, joined Mar 2005, 250 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 9850 times:

Thank you guys for those links! Just awesome Big grin
That's Africa as it's best! The Pilot himself says: Only here, you can make something like that.
I guess there are no charts for those Airports Big grin

BTW: The CEO of Transafrik was former Executive member @ Crossair, so he know's how to lead an airline with strange opperations  Smile



Quote "Syriana": "Beirut, it's like Paris in the Mid-East"
25 Miamiair : Dumb statement maybe. As shown in the pictures above, the 737 can and does operate from unimproved airstrips. I have flown into places with shitter p
26 Clickhappy : dirt field operations to support the mines in Africa. Top shelf stuff, thanks for sharing!
27 Gearup : 737-200s have routinely operated into and out of dirt and gravel strips for decades....using their low-slung engines, even: Indeed, however the 732 is
28 2H4 : Granted, but it disproves your previous statement that the 727 "only succeeds because of it's high lift devices, high mounted engines, and large whee
29 Post contains images Solnabo : Tu-134 n 154 can t/o from dirt/gravel strip hence the wide gap between landing gears Micke// [Edited 2007-01-05 19:17:17]
30 DL021 : Really cool video...thanks for finding and posting it. Africa is one of the last places where wildcat outfits can push their equipment to the limits.
31 Cubastar : Awwww.....Hey, don't give up. Almost EVERYBODY on here has said something that he or she would probably like to retract. You have a lot of experience
32 Post contains links and images Noelg : The original thread is here: Interesting 727 Video Here (by Qb001 Apr 23 2004 in Civil Aviation) But it looks like the video is taken down
33 Cubastar : Just for info, I think that Boeing actually designed a package for the 72 to operate on unimproved fields.
34 Post contains images Jamesbaldwyn : And Easyjet are complaining about Bristols runway!
35 Cedarjet : You know what, it was one of these 727s that the CIA thought had been stolen by Al Qaeda. Remember, after 9/11? The missing seven-two? And the fear wa
36 Chris133 : I guess yo have never seen the cargo 73s operating in Alaska to unpaved gravel and dirt runways.
37 Siren : I found a 10 minute version of this if anybody is interested...
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