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Easyjet Stops Bristol Flights Due To Runway  
User currently offlineAndz From South Africa, joined Feb 2004, 8471 posts, RR: 10
Posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 12015 times:
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Easyjet has stopped all flights to Bristol this morning due to safety concerns about the resurfaced runway. CEO Toby Nicholls said on Sky News a few minutes ago that there were concerns about braking on the current surface in wet weather, and that they would review it at noon today.


After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
62 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSean377 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 1225 posts, RR: 40
Reply 1, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 11996 times:

Just read about that on the BBC website.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bristol/6233487.stm

Out of interest, what's a runway 'safety zone'?



Flying is the second greatest thrill known to man... Landing is the first!
User currently offlineZSOFN From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1413 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11761 times:

Apparently this has been going on for a while now - an anonymous pilot reported this to the BBC:

Quoting BBC News:
"I've landed in wet weather, put the brakes on and come to the bit that is being re-surfaced, and just skated across it - we actually speeded up. When it is wet, you have no grip."

They were resurfacing back in September when I took this shot so it's been going on quite a while...


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Photo © Tom Collins



User currently offlineTonforty From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 69 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11712 times:

Quoting ZSOFN (Reply 2):
Quoting BBC News:
"I've landed in wet weather, put the brakes on and come to the bit that is being re-surfaced, and just skated across it - we actually speeded up. When it is wet, you have no grip."

Even if there is very little grip, i don't see how they could actually speed up on it when braking! Maybe i'm wrong. Perhaps it feels like you are speeding up due to the braking force being less.


User currently offlinePelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2531 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11732 times:

Quoting Tonforty (Reply 3):

Even if there is very little grip, i don't see how they could actually speed up on it when braking! Maybe i'm wrong. Perhaps it feels like you are speeding up due to the braking force being less.

Probably because there was no force to counter act the idle thrust from the engines.

pelican


User currently offlineTonforty From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 69 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11671 times:

Quoting Pelican (Reply 4):
Probably because there was no force to counter act the idle thrust from the engines.

Possibly, must be very slippy tarmac if that's the case!


User currently offlineZSOFN From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1413 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11664 times:

Quoting Pelican (Reply 4):
Probably because there was no force to counter act the idle thrust from the engines.

I would have thought that idle reverse would be used on a wet runway. They certainly use it most of the time.


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User currently offlineSpeedbirdEGJJ From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 432 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11636 times:

There is a long and interesting thread on pprune about this.

About the problem relates to the lack of friction when wet in the middle of the runway.

GR had an Atr72 overshoot as did BA with an ERJ in the last few weeks.


User currently offlineScouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 3403 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11592 times:

Bristol is the scareport with the skijump for a runway isn't it - double scary now!

User currently offlineFlyingColours From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2315 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 11538 times:

Quoting Scouseflyer (Reply 8):
Bristol is the scareport with the skijump for a runway isn't it

Yup, you could say that. Still it was always fun to be in the flightdeck for landing there, although I've never been up there when it was wet.

Quoting SpeedbirdEGJJ (Reply 7):
GR had an Atr72 overshoot as did BA with an ERJ in the last few weeks

At BRS?

Phil
FlyingColours



Lifes a train racing towards you, now you can either run away or grab a chair & a beer and watch it come - Phil
User currently offlineCardiffairtaxi From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2006, 303 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 11515 times:

Quoting Andz (Thread starter):

BA have also cancelled flights to/from BRS.
My customer was due in from CDG-BRS with BA,but has just been informed they have now got to fly CDG-LHR,and bussed from LHR-BRS.
They are obviously not too happy!


User currently offlineBritannia191a From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2004, 262 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 11447 times:

Quoting Cardiffairtaxi (Reply 10):
BA have also cancelled flights to/from BRS.
My customer was due in from CDG-BRS with BA,but has just been informed they have now got to fly CDG-LHR,and bussed from LHR-BRS.
They are obviously not too happy!

I would rather be inconvienced then have mine and the rest of the people on board safety put at risk. I congratulate Easyjet on their decision. Not an easy one(hehehe) to make but they must be very concerned if they have decided to cancel their flights in wet conditions. Maybe the other airlines should do the same and force Bristol's hand. No planes, No Income for the airport. Unfortunately like all these things people dont stand up and do something until an incident has occured. Surely they have to now with Easyjet making a point. Good on Easyjet!


User currently offlineLHRjc From Netherlands, joined Apr 2006, 1964 posts, RR: 19
Reply 12, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 11368 times:

Quoting Britannia191a (Reply 11):
Not an easy one(hehehe)

 bigthumbsup  Very good  Wink

I have a friend flying BRS - ALC tomorrow and EZY have told him he'll have to wait til the morning to find out if his flight will depart. However the BBC forecast says heavy rain forecast at BRS tomorrow so unless they can fix the runway overnight I can't see things improving.

Fingers crossed tho.

JC



"Our 319's are very reliable. They get fixed very quickly."
User currently offlineZSOFN From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1413 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 11333 times:

You certainly don't want to go off the end of RWY27. The ground falls away rather fast and the huge approach lighting structure would be unavoidable.

User currently offlineDHHornet From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 252 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 11170 times:

XL,AMC & TOM now operating from CWL.

User currently offlineEWRCabincrew From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5527 posts, RR: 56
Reply 15, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 11077 times:

CO's flights (flights 76 and 77) are still going to BRS.


You can't cure stupid
User currently offlineMainMAN From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 2115 posts, RR: 5
Reply 16, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 11074 times:

This is quite shocking news.......respect to EZY for putting safety before income. Shouldn't it have been the CAA who advised on BRS runway issues, knowing about previous incidents, and not a carrier to make that very hard commercial decision?

User currently offlineCory6188 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2692 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 11060 times:

I'd be curious to know what CO is doing in this situation, as they don't have a ton of leeway for takeoff given the loaded 752 and the relatively short runway.

User currently offlineAsuflyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 136 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 11035 times:

I never knew Bristol was that small! Beats me how a Continental 757 can take off fully loaded to Newark.

User currently offlineDHHornet From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 252 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 11036 times:

Quoting DHHornet (Reply 14):
CO's flights (flights 76 and 77) are still going to BRS.

I am surprised as the CO 757 uses every inch of the runway. I wonder what FCA are thinking of doing?

The weathermen are saying rain over the weekend.  raincloud 

I think they will be working on the runway tonight - big time!


User currently offlineZSOFN From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1413 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 10994 times:

Quoting Asuflyer (Reply 18):
I never knew Bristol was that small! Beats me how a Continental 757 can take off fully loaded to Newark.

It always looks a little tight on takeoff from where I've watched...

Quoting DHHornet (Reply 19):
I think they will be working on the runway tonight - big time!

I doubt there's much they can do in such a short space of time, particularly if it involves cutting grooves along a long stretch of runway.


User currently offlineBongodog1964 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 3700 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 10978 times:

I saw a TV programme recently which featured runway resurfacing, it was either Luton or Stansted, on this one of the last processes carried out each night was testing the new surface with a friction meter mounted on a lorry, to see if the new tarmac had enough grip. Surely the new surface either meets the spec or doesn't; there shouldn't be the need for any disagreement between the airport and the airlines, or the need for the airlines to make the decision themselves. The airport should close the runway immediately if the tarmac isn't to spec.

User currently offlineDHHornet From United Kingdom, joined May 2006, 252 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 10897 times:

Quoting ZSOFN (Reply 20):
I doubt there's much they can do in such a short space of time, particularly if it involves cutting grooves along a long stretch of runway.

I bet they will do something if only a little! or...Cancel the rest of the flights today and do it now! wink 

It is not reflecting very well on BRS Airport. The media machine is giving it a lot of cover. I think Mr Skipp and his merry-men are very worried. EZY did a brave move by stopping. God help BRS if something does happen again with another aircraft today, or until the runway is sorted. I think this is why the rest of the operators are doing what EZY have done.
BRS and the CAA say it is safe. But you still can't get away from the incidents over the past week or so. This goes with a large number of reports regarding the braking action from pilots.


User currently offlineLHRjc From Netherlands, joined Apr 2006, 1964 posts, RR: 19
Reply 23, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 10866 times:

Looks like U2 are already preparing for tomorrow:

http://easyjet.com/EN/News/bristol_flight_cancellations_5_january.html

"As rain is forecast for Saturday 6 January, easyJet will operate a large proportion of its services in and out of Cardiff International Airport. Passengers will be required to check in at Bristol International Airport as normal and will be transferred across to Cardiff. A list of the flights the airline plans to operate tomorrow will be posted on the website later this afternoon."


JC



"Our 319's are very reliable. They get fixed very quickly."
User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11725 posts, RR: 60
Reply 24, posted (7 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 10614 times:

Quoting Tonforty (Reply 3):
Even if there is very little grip, i don't see how they could actually speed up on it when braking! Maybe i'm wrong. Perhaps it feels like you are speeding up due to the braking force being less.

This is probably due to the severe gradient of the runway, as the photograph below shows, there is basically a huge hill in the middle which when landing on 09 can prove tricky for braking.

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Photo © Adrian Thompson



Quoting Asuflyer (Reply 18):
I never knew Bristol was that small! Beats me how a Continental 757 can take off fully loaded to Newark.

It's fairly close to using the entire runway most days:

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Photo © P R D Jones



Basically what I have heard and is also written on Pprune, is that the current surface in the middle of the runway is not the final one, this has yet to be laid and because of this there are no groves which allow drainage and thus grip during wet weather. This would be why pilots are reporting aquaplaning occurring. I know EZY had reduced their crosswind landing limit to 20knots, it doesn't appear too windy, so perhaps they have now said no altogether to operating in wet weather.

Dan Smile



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
25 PictureThis : XL and BA have stopped flights for now aswell. PictureThis
26 Post contains images SQNo1 : The BA flight from TFS has been diverted to EXT. Ive just seen it land from my bedroom window. On a seperate note BA is reducing frequency on its BRS
27 Stirling : What are all those bits on the left side of the pic? Look like junked autos?
28 RichardPrice : Longstay carparking.
29 B707Stu : I landed in rain at BRS on a little WOW flight on 11/20 and we had a hard time stopping which I thought was really weird. I chalked it up to pilot cho
30 Post contains links LHRjc : Easyjet have cancelled or transferred to CWL all flights out of BRS tomorrow too: http://easyjet.com/EN/News/bristol_disruption_6_january.html "Update
31 ZSOFN : I've flown with U2 landing on 09 in a 73G before in strong crosswinds and it's quite surprising just how hard it is to stop. You add rain and a slippe
32 Post contains links and images LHRjc : Leeds Bradford is higher by 8m !! I know, very picky Airport Data: International, Bristol 8km (4miles), Position 51°22´57"N, 002°43´09"W, Elevati
33 Post contains images FlyingColours : Hmm I had BRS down at 652ft ASL on my chrarts, I think, still it is fairly high and very suseptible to fog or sea mist. I used to live about 600 feet
34 Kaneporta1 : That's what happens when you have FZO with planning permission since just after WW2, access to the M4 and M5, not significant weather issues, but the
35 Cardiffairtaxi : Thomas Cook Airlines have just announced they will not fly from BRS either.They are operating their BRS flights from BHX.
36 Lapper : To those talking about the CO 757's using all the runway for takeoff, the concerns being raised by the airlines here are for landing and slowing the a
37 PITrules : A high-speed rejected takeoff is more critical than a landing
38 ZSOFN : Very good point. I drive past FZO all the time and can't believe how unfortunate it is that it's not converted to commercial use. Plenty of land area
39 Jasond : Well shocking in that the airport managers proceeded with the resurfacing work in the first place seemingly oblivious to the problems it seems to be
40 ConcordeMach2 : I agree. I think also that Kemble might be a better choice for a Gloucestershire airport than the current one at Staverton. Ok, it may not be as clos
41 DHHornet : So CO does not land then? On take off it could still abort and slide? I wonder what all the passengers of XL/AMC/BA/TCX/EZY/EIN/FCA etc. are thinking
42 Post contains images PlymSpotter : More importantly the pilots are not happy and that makes the airlines listen up. I would assume that many will be seeking some form of compensation f
43 Post contains links Tjr16698 : Hmmm, looking at the Bristol Airport website they appear on the surface to be playing it pretty cool, not even mentioning why all these airlines are n
44 Trintocan : One wonders if any of the airlines might consider shifting permanently to CWL? The trouble is that BRS has a larger local catchment area that includes
45 Post contains images PlymSpotter : Well the owners of Bristol Airport are trying to buy Exeter Airport as well, to which there is much debate about their true intentions. I haven't bee
46 Post contains links DHHornet : Latest news: http://www.bristolairport.co.uk/news...BC276-20EB-477A-9712-2E4F4F5FC225}
47 Sean377 : While I'm not advocating that safety should be compromised in any way, if the runway was truly unsafe, then it would be closed, full-stop (no pun inte
48 David_itl : Go had a base at BRS when easyJet bought them.
49 Post contains images EMAlad : A few years ago I was on a Britannia flight from EMA to Dalaman when they cabin crew announced that it would be via Bristol. It has to be the worst la
50 Post contains links RichardPrice : Exeter Airport was recently purchased by Regional and City Airports after Bristol Airport owners pulled out due to competition concerns. A Bristol Ai
51 Post contains images PlymSpotter : Thanks! I have been away and offline for a bit and the last I had heard was they were still trying to buy EXT. Dan
52 BMIE70 : Does CWL have the same level of ILS as BRS? It certainly had more cancellations during the fog prior to Christmas (although admittedly there was less
53 EZYAirbus : Just been reported on BBC website that the runway will close today from 1430 GMT Glenn
54 Post contains links GSM763 : Sky news has some footage of an FR aircraft aquaplaning on the runway http://news.sky.com/skynews/video/vi...ayer/0,,31200-bristol_p299,00.html
55 Sean377 : Hardly aquaplaning tho was it? I don't even think it was on the affected part of the runway.
56 Andz : Sky was interviewing passengers off a Continental flight that had come in, they said the Captain had announced before landing that it may be "abrupt"
57 ExFATboy : The FR plane in the Sky clip did seem to be sliding around more than I'd consider normal, but I don't think it was actually aquaplaning - it was shedd
58 EMAlad : Wow I thought that FR jet skidded about quite a bit on the Sky report! Anyone know when the runway will be open again?
59 Post contains links DHHornet : From the BIA Website... Latest News Update On Air Services From Bristol International Airport (07/01/07) 07 January 2007, 14.00 hrs UPDATED INFORMATI
60 XXXX10 : Out of interest were there any warnings of the lack of braking action NOTAMed ?
61 ExFATboy : Here's some weirdness on the CO website - CO 76 (EWR-BRS) doesn't come up from tomorrow until January 24 on the timetable search - it shows up again f
62 EWRCabincrew : THe BRS isn't a daily flight till late February or sometime March. I pulled up the BRS flights (76/77) and they all show in Sonic (our res system). I
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