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Rep Duncan Says DL/US Merger Likely To Go Through  
User currently offlineLowecur From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 585 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3738 times:

Although he is against the merger, Rep Duncan says if it makes it to Congress it will be tough to stop. Since he is a member of Oberstar's committee, my guess is he is voicing some opinions from within. Interesting observation.

http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/business...cle/0,1406,KNS_376_5281950,00.html

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBigGSFO From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2887 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3718 times:

He also claims the US needs more airlines. Interesting.

User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 3993 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3553 times:

Like others in Congress he is opposed to this idea. I don't see DL agreeing to be bought out, nor the creditors pushing them that direction either. If the creditors want DL to merge with someone, it is looking more and more as if it will be NW as predicted a year or two ago.


DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineGift4tbone From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 612 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3407 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 2):
If the creditors want DL to merge with someone, it is looking more and more as if it will be NW as predicted a year or two ago.

Not that I want a US/DL merger to occur, but I think this whole deal with NW is a sad attempt to shake Doug. Not sure if it's going to work...We shall see very shortly however.

-Tony@PVD



Top 3 airports: PVD 26.0%(115 flights), PHL 15.6%(69 flights), PHX 12.0%(53 flights)
User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 7871 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 3360 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 2):
Like others in Congress he is opposed to this idea. I don't see DL agreeing to be bought out, nor the creditors pushing them that direction either. If the creditors want DL to merge with someone, it is looking more and more as if it will be NW as predicted a year or two ago.

It's not a merger, it's a takeover. I don't think DL has any say in it. It's DL's creditors who will decide, not DL, and somehow I don't think they would agree to a merger with NW, and organization that's it total financial chaos, any more than US.


User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 3296 times:

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 4):
It's not a merger, it's a takeover. I don't think DL has any say in it. It's DL's creditors who will decide, not DL, and somehow I don't think they would agree to a merger with NW, and organization that's it total financial chaos, any more than US.

That is your opnion, but I think you are wrong.

I think a DL/NW merger is much more likely than a US takeover of DL for several reasons:

1. Commonality of shareholders post Chapter 11 in both companies (the current unsecured creditors).

2. Reported meetings and co-operation between DALPA and NWALPA.

3. Complementary route structures.

4. Reported friendly meetings between the managements of the companies.

5. Current levels of flight integration from code share agreements (seem to be more integrated together than HP/US).

6. No risk of additional pension liabilities being shed (very important to PBGC, a major unsecured creditor).


User currently offlineNW748i From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 361 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 3230 times:

Quoting Gift4tbone (Reply 3):
NW is a sad attempt to shake Doug. Not sure if it's going to work...We shall see very shortly however.

I think you're probably correct. All this about these meetings that have been taking place could be simply to project the image to the creditors that DL management is in firm control. If that's the intent, Doug has been undetered and is showing remarkable patience and reserve.

I'm curious to know if NW has also been having such meetings with other airlines... for their own sake I sure hope so.

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 4):
I don't think they would agree to a merger with NW

Perhaps they would, but BK notwithstanding, would two airlines in such bad shape be a good combo? Seems to be that the safer bet would be for NW to just tango with AA and let DL do what floats their boat.



Hail! to the victors valiant, Hail! to the conqu'ring heroes, Hail! Hail! to Michigan the leaders and best! Go Blue!
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16690 posts, RR: 51
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3196 times:

While DL and it's Unions are meeting with NWA Gordon Bethune acting on behalf of DL's creditors is in meetings in Manhattan with Parker, Citigroup and Morgan Stanely figuring out how to iron out the details of US Airways takeover of DL.

Gordon Bethune acting at the behest of DL's creditors got US Airways to raise it's bid, DL's creditors hired Gordon Bethune to iron out any possible hurdles to the sale and to get them the highest value.

The outcome of all this will be decided in Manhattan between Gordon Bethune, Parker, DL's Creditors and US Airways backers Citigroup and Morgan Stanely.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineDL787932ER From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3162 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):
Gordon Bethune acting on behalf of DL's creditors is in meetings in Manhattan with Parker, Citigroup and Morgan Stanely figuring out how to iron out the details of US Airways takeover of DL.

Gordon Bethune acting at the behest of DL's creditors got US Airways to raise it's bid, DL's creditors hired Gordon Bethune to iron out any possible hurdles to the sale and to get them the highest value.

You're accusing a highly respected figure in the commercial aviation industry of some pretty serious civil wrongdoing here. Do you have any evidence to back it up?



F L Y D E L T A J E T S
User currently offlineLowecur From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 585 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3151 times:

I think this complimentary route structure is overblown. The FAA budget this year is down from $14.31B to $13.75B. It's no secret they are unhappy with the efficiency of the system with the possible tinkering of a/c size at LGA. Even in that instance they are running into headwinds, but will mandate it if a better solution isn't reached. They have a ton of controllers that are retiring and few in the pipeline. The system is stretched beyond capacity with all these little RJ's/turboprops choking most of the major airports to protect slots and gates. It has become a logistical nightmare due to safety issues. It's only a matter of time before we have another midair or runway incursion catastrophe.

They will undoubtedly be called to testify before the Senate/House hearing to voice their opinion if it gets that far. It's my take that they would welcome a DL/USAIR merger above the others, just for the reason of overlap and contraction.


User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9105 posts, RR: 18
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3103 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 2):
it is looking more and more as if it will be NW as predicted a year or two ago.

 checkmark 

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 5):
Current levels of flight integration from code share agreements (seem to be more integrated together than HP/US).

Duh... both DL and NW are members of Skyteam. Naturally they'd have good flight integration and code share agreements...

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 5):
Reported meetings and co-operation between DALPA and NWALPA.

Both are willing to merge. DL just does not want to be bought out by Parker annd company. NW will merge if it's absolutely necessary to avoid CH7. DL does want to try and go it alone, but are willing to pursue a possible deal with NW. Sure, there is conflict among the aircraft, as DL flies Boeing and NW has a lot of Airbuses.

DL is mostly on the East Coast with some Midwest, and of course the growing SLC hub. This may be presumptuous, but I believe the new hubs would look like JFK, ATL, DTW, MSP, SLC, with MEM, CVG, and IND being focus cities



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16690 posts, RR: 51
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3103 times:

Quoting DL787932ER (Reply 8):
You're accusing a highly respected figure in the commercial aviation industry of some pretty serious civil wrongdoing here. Do you have any evidence to back it up?

Please no one loves Gordon more than I do, he is not doing anything wrong.

Bethune meeting with Parker = larger bid. What's so hard to comprehend?

Quote:
"We would note that following Bethune's meeting with US Airways this week, US Airways immediately raised its offer," Baker wrote in a report to investors Wednesday.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/headline/biz/4462434.html



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineEvilForce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3103 times:

Quoting Lowecur (Thread starter):
Although he is against the merger, Rep Duncan says if it makes it to Congress it will be tough to stop. Since he is a member of Oberstar's committee, my guess is he is voicing some opinions from within. Interesting observation.

http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/business....html

This thread is going to erupt into a "he's wrong no way in hades is DOT/DOJ going to allow it"!

I guess the voice of reason on why a merger will pass the feds is beyond some. Emotionally they don't want to concede that Delta's future will be shaped by outsiders, whether it's USAir or NWA or someone else.


User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4731 posts, RR: 45
Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3102 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):
While DL and it's Unions are meeting with NWA Gordon Bethune acting on behalf of DL's creditors is in meetings in Manhattan with Parker, Citigroup and Morgan Stanely figuring out how to iron out the details of US Airways takeover of DL.

Gordon Bethune acting at the behest of DL's creditors got US Airways to raise it's bid, DL's creditors hired Gordon Bethune to iron out any possible hurdles to the sale and to get them the highest value.

Yes and Bethune is meeting with the DL management team.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 11):
Bethune meeting with Parker = larger bid. What's so hard to comprehend?

And shortly you'll see Bethune meeting with Grinstein = revised POR.

So whats your point?



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3102 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 11):
Please no one loves Gordon more than I do, he is not doing anything wrong.

According to you, his is doing some very large things wrong.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):
While DL and it's Unions are meeting with NWA Gordon Bethune acting on behalf of DL's creditors is in meetings in Manhattan with Parker, Citigroup and Morgan Stanely figuring out how to iron out the details of US Airways takeover of DL.

Gordon Bethune acting at the behest of DL's creditors got US Airways to raise it's bid, DL's creditors hired Gordon Bethune to iron out any possible hurdles to the sale and to get them the highest value.

The outcome of all this will be decided in Manhattan between Gordon Bethune, Parker, DL's Creditors and US Airways backers Citigroup and Morgan Stanely.

All of this would expose Mr. Bethune to huge civil damage awards as it would be a huge breech of fiduciary responsibility.

1. Where do you get information that there was more than 1 meeting between Mr. Bethune and Mr. Parker and the LCC representatives? I have seen no such reports.

2. Where did you get information that Mr. Bethune was authorized to negotiate the sale of DL on behalf of the Creditors Committee? I have seen no such reports. Mr. Bethune was hired by the Creditor's Committee to evaluate alternatives, not propose or negotiate alternatives.

As far as Mr. Parker raising his offer during or after his meeting (singular meeting from all reports I have seen), this was his chance to put his best foot forward directly to the Creditors Committee's representative, and should be seen as nothing more than that.


User currently offlineJayDub From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3102 times:

Bethune is just doing what he's being paid to do. His job right now is to help DL's creditors to take the best course of action for THEM. Not necessarily what is best for DL or the industry.

No civil wrongdoing...just doing his job.


User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6344 posts, RR: 9
Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3102 times:

Quoting NW748i (Reply 6):
Perhaps they would, but BK notwithstanding, would two airlines in such bad shape be a good combo? Seems to be that the safer bet would be for NW to just tango with AA and let DL do what floats their boat.

Are you under the opinion that DL and NW are CURRENTLY in bad shape financially? What financial reports are you looking at?


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16690 posts, RR: 51
Reply 17, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3102 times:

As mentioned by people in other threads it's facinating how much the Delta folks hate (despise) US Airways and their takeover, but would jump at the chance to merge with NWA.


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineDL787932ER From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 3091 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 11):
Please no one loves Gordon more than I do, he is not doing anything wrong.



Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 14):
All of this would expose Mr. Bethune to huge civil damage awards as it would be a huge breech of fiduciary responsibility.

 checkmark 

Quoting JayDub (Reply 15):

No civil wrongdoing...just doing his job.



Quoting STT757 (Reply 11):
Bethune meeting with Parker = larger bid. What's so hard to comprehend?

That's not what he was hired to do - in fact, it's a conflict of interest with what he's hired to do. That's what is meant by a "breach of fiduciary duty". His job is to work on behalf of the DL creditors to analyze their available options and advise them on their best choice, not to negotiate or advocate for a specific choice.

In simpler terms, let's say I hired you to advise my new startup airline on whether the 737 or A320 was the best aircraft for my business. Instead, you went straight to Boeing, worked out a deal with them for 737s, and advised me to take it. That would be a breach of your duty to me and open you up to me suing you for damages.

I don't see Gordon Bethune opening himself up to losing his substantial reputation, career, and finances for the sake of Doug Parker (or anyone else). I believe he will advise the creditors' committee as an expert third party, as he was hired to do, not unethically negotiate with Parker and his buyout team. If you have evidence to the contrary, you should post it (and send it to the DL creditors so they can prepare their lawsuit); otherwise, you should edit your previous posts to retract your claim.



F L Y D E L T A J E T S
User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 3058 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 17):
As mentioned by people in other threads it's fascinating how much the Delta folks hate (despise) US Airways and their takeover, but would jump at the chance to merge with NWA.

A non-sequtir instead of answering honest questions?

You have made assertions as to events that have allegedly happened (such as multiple meetings and negotiations with Mr. Bethune and that:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):
While DL and it's Unions are meeting with NWA Gordon Bethune acting on behalf of DL's creditors is in meetings in Manhattan with Parker, Citigroup and Morgan Stanely figuring out how to iron out the details of US Airways takeover of DL.

Please admit that this was unfounded or provide some sort of factual back-up.

I actually hope you can find some back-up, as it would be very interesting to see the results reverberate throughout the industry and press.


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