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Two Customers May Buy Private A380 Superjumbos  
User currently offlineLeelaw From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 15645 times:

Quote:
Airbus, maker of the delayed A380 superjumbo, is in talks with two potential buyers of private versions of the $300 million plane that the company calls the "flying palace."

"They are not customers until they sign, but there are two very interested parties," Richard Gaona, vice president of Airbus' executive and private aviation unit, said in an interview Monday in Dubai, United Arab Emirates. "It's going to be a private jet," Gaona said, adding that one of the customers was in the Middle East...

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/301644_airbus30.html

[Edited 2007-01-30 15:02:11]

68 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFlying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4166 posts, RR: 36
Reply 1, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 15576 times:

Quote:
"Airbus could sell 400 Flying Palaces and it won't save the program," said Doug McVitie, managing director of Arran Aerospace, a Dinan, France-based consulting company. "Airbus won't make a lot of money on sales like this because these guys want everything done their own way, so with highly customized planes, you reduce by a large percentage the number of components Airbus could provide."

That guy is an "aviation analyst"?? These will likely be the most lucrative sales of all... a small order, little chance to get a large discount, little need to customize the cabin/plane as it will be delivered green to Jet Aviation, Lufthansa Technik etc. A pricey green airframe on a single order... should be a very nice profit.

He makes it sound as if Airbus would be doing the whole customizing and cabin fit out - on which planet is he living? Both Airbus and Boeing don´t want to have this non-standart business as it is way too expensive for them.



Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
User currently offlineMptpa From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15500 times:

So if one customer is in the Middle East, where would the other be? Could it be from Russia with the new Oligarchs!! Perhaps Roman Abromovich??

User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 3, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15432 times:

Quoting Flying-Tiger (Reply 1):

That guy is an "aviation analyst"?? These will likely be the most lucrative sales of all... a small order, little chance to get a large discount, little need to customize the cabin/plane as it will be delivered green to Jet Aviation, Lufthansa Technik etc. A pricey green airframe on a single order... should be a very nice profit.

What some of those 'analysts' write makes me wonder how much research they put in their work.

Here's an article posted today regarding a sale of an A340VIP to a private Arab client.

"it (Airbus) recently sold an Airbus A340 to a private Arab client for $180m"

http://www.ameinfo.com/109115.html

I also came across an article that claimed that the VIP aircraft (2 A32S) for the Czech Republik were purchased for about US$135 million.

Looks like there isn't a lot, but a huge amount of money to be made with the sales of VIP aircraft.



SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
User currently offlineHeavierthanair From Switzerland, joined Oct 2000, 825 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15414 times:

G'day

Is the Sultanate of Brunei considered Middle East or Far East?

HRH the Sultan badly needs some new transport, the present metal is getting kind of dated.  stirthepot 

Cheers

Peter



"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." (Albert Einstein, 1879
User currently offlineThorben From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15389 times:

I read somewhere that there are actually three people very interested in an A380 VVVIP.

Quoting Mptpa (Reply 2):
So if one customer is in the Middle East, where would the other be? Could it be from Russia with the new Oligarchs!! Perhaps Roman Abromovich??

Abramovich? Maybe, he went from 737 to 767, maybe that one has become too small now. I read that he wants to have the world's longest yacht, currently build in secret at Hamburg. Maybe he feels that he needs to have the biggest private jet, too. He sure has the money for that.

Quoting Manni (Reply 3):
it (Airbus) recently sold an Airbus A340 to a private Arab client for $180m"

http://www.ameinfo.com/109115.html

I also came across an article that claimed that the VIP aircraft (2 A32S) for the Czech Republik were purchased for about US$135 million.

That looks like list prices. Maybe those ordering only small amounts really have no good negotiation power.


User currently offlineFlying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4166 posts, RR: 36
Reply 6, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15385 times:

Quoting Manni (Reply 3):
Looks like there isn't a lot, but a huge amount of money to be made with the sales of VIP aircraft.

That´s correct - and that´s the reason why both Airbus and Boeing have heavily ventured into the Corporate Shuttle / Private Jet market. The number of frames sold is comparably (selling 20 A319s a year for private use is by any means a small airline´s fleet) small, but the average price tag per unit is far higher. As these frames - and that goes for basically all the large private jets - are build on an airliner production line there is little extra cost compared to an airliner. Means: low costs due to "being fitted into the line" but high margin due to high price.

Quoting Manni (Reply 3):
"it (Airbus) recently sold an Airbus A340 to a private Arab client for $180m"

There was recently an article that Virgin Atlantic sold one of their newly delivered A340-600 to a fond management company for 106 million USD (think it was USD; and I don´t know if including engines or not). It gives a good bench mark how high the margins in the VVIP market could be.



Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
User currently offlineGr8Circle From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 3132 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15367 times:

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 4):
G'day

Is the Sultanate of Brunei considered Middle East or Far East?

Obviously Far East....one look at the map solves that question.... smile 


User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9756 posts, RR: 31
Reply 8, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15349 times:

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 4):

Is the Sultanate of Brunei considered Middle East or Far East?

Far East. And since HRH The Sultan does not fly what everybody else flies, it is highly likely that he is one of the two. Good for LH Technik, his 744 is a -430 as well.



Es saugt und blaest der Heinzelmann wo Mutti sonst nur blasen kann. Frueher war mehr Lametta.
User currently offlinePope From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15280 times:

I've never understood why any private party would want an A380 because of the practical limitations of where it can fly to. While it's certainly one hell of an aircraft in terms of size and what you could put in it, wouldn't it be severely limited on where it could go. What's the last count of the total number of airports around the world that could handle an aircraft of this size?

User currently offlineGr8Circle From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 3132 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15264 times:

Quoting Pope (Reply 9):
I've never understood why any private party would want an A380 because of the practical limitations of where it can fly to. While it's certainly one hell of an aircraft in terms of size and what you could put in it, wouldn't it be severely limited on where it could go. What's the last count of the total number of airports around the world that could handle an aircraft of this size?

You're absolutely right on that...but remember, anyone who can afford a private 380 will probably have their own private gulfstream / 767 / 330 / 787 or whatever, to connect from the nearest 380 capable airport, to wherever they ultimately want to reach...  Big grin


User currently offlineMptpa From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15235 times:

Quoting Pope (Reply 9):
I've never understood why any private party would want an A380 because of the practical limitations of where it can fly to. While it's certainly one hell of an aircraft in terms of size and what you could put in it, wouldn't it be severely limited on where it could go. What's the last count of the total number of airports around the world that could handle an aircraft of this size?

Why the limitation? It can land anywhere B747 can land which is a lot of fields. You part at a FBO or a remote spot and deplane!! Of course a smaller jet can land at many more places but these guys are not going to tiny locales ....


User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15209 times:

Quoting Flying-Tiger (Reply 1):
That guy is an "aviation analyst"?? These will likely be the most lucrative sales of all... a small order, little chance to get a large discount, little need to customize the cabin/plane as it will be delivered green to Jet Aviation, Lufthansa Technik etc. A pricey green airframe on a single order... should be a very nice profit.

True...but it's entirely possible that it could be delivered to a completion center in the states as well, due to our status as a third world country.


User currently offlinePope From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15209 times:

Quoting Mptpa (Reply 11):
Why the limitation? It can land anywhere B747 can land which is a lot of fields.

Is that true. I was under the impression that airports had to meet special requirements (i.e. taxiway width and building clearances) for the A380. Are you telling me that's incorrect and that an A380 can fit anywhere a 747 can?


User currently offlineThorben From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15187 times:

Quoting Pope (Reply 9):
I've never understood why any private party would want an A380 because of the practical limitations of where it can fly to. While it's certainly one hell of an aircraft in terms of size and what you could put in it, wouldn't it be severely limited on where it could go. What's the last count of the total number of airports around the world that could handle an aircraft of this size?

I guess the limitations are not smaller than those with a 747. Many of the changes that airports are doing for the A380 have to do with getting people out of the upper deck directly and handling those large numbers of pax. One wouldn't have those problems with the VIP version. It can just sit somewhere and the pax are picked up by cars and leave through one lower deck door. Not really a problem. The final location is probably reached by car or helicopter anyway.


User currently offlineNaritaflyer From Japan, joined Apr 2006, 549 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 15129 times:

Quoting Flying-Tiger (Reply 1):
That guy is an "aviation analyst"?? These will likely be the most lucrative sales of all... a small order, little chance to get a large discount, little need to customize the cabin/plane as it will be delivered green to Jet Aviation, Lufthansa Technik etc. A pricey green airframe on a single order... should be a very nice profit.

He makes it sound as if Airbus would be doing the whole customizing and cabin fit out - on which planet is he living? Both Airbus and Boeing don´t want to have this non-standart business as it is way too expensive for them.

I think what he is saying is that private customers will get the aircraft bare-bones, very green, and have it customized elsewhere. In that case, Airbus is basically selling the shell of the airplane so will not make a profit margin on the elaborate wiring, individual oxigen masks, lighting, seats, galleys and everythig else that airliners would want.


User currently offlineUpperDeck79 From Finland, joined Feb 2005, 1139 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 15000 times:

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 4):
Is the Sultanate of Brunei considered Middle East or Far East?

Are you serious? Big grin Check the map a bit...



AY and ANA rock!
User currently offlineFlying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4166 posts, RR: 36
Reply 17, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 14946 times:

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 12):
True...but it's entirely possible that it could be delivered to a completion center in the states as well, due to our status as a third world country.

Since when has Algeria a completion center  Wink ?? Seriously, per my understanding so far only LH Technik and Jet Aviation have developed something looking like an A380 VVIP cabin outfit. Anyway, if you read what you have quoted I clearly pointed out that there might be others => ETC.



Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
User currently offlineCV580Freak From Bahrain, joined Jul 2005, 1033 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 14889 times:

http://www.gulf-news.com/business/Aviation/10100459.html

Quoting 'two middle east clients' for A380VVIP  bouncy 



One day you are the pigeon, the next the statue ...
User currently offlineCV580Freak From Bahrain, joined Jul 2005, 1033 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 14855 times:

Quoting Mptpa (Reply 11):
Why the limitation? It can land anywhere B747 can land which is a lot of fields.

I remember many moons ago when the Saudi Royal family landed at LGW on a state visit they came in 3 x B747 and 2 x 707 with the luggage, 2 x A380 could take the lot, direct to LHR, including all the cars  Smile



One day you are the pigeon, the next the statue ...
User currently offlineJAAlbert From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1626 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 14840 times:

Sounds like great fun to have an enormous plane like that all to yourself, but jeez the cost to the environment to haul around one guy's ego. Rather disheartening I think

User currently offlineChrisH From Sweden, joined Jul 2004, 1136 posts, RR: 16
Reply 21, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 14828 times:

you could just pack in a nice helicopter into the back of the a380 aswell, for final positioning  Smile


what seems to be the officer, problem?
User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 14800 times:

I should think one could find something better to do with the enourmous amount of money that will be sunk into this...like help starving kids somewhere or something.


One Nation Under God
User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 14584 times:

Quoting Flying-Tiger (Reply 17):
Since when has Algeria a completion center ?? Seriously, per my understanding so far only LH Technik and Jet Aviation have developed something looking like an A380 VVIP cabin outfit. Anyway, if you read what you have quoted I clearly pointed out that there might be others => ETC.

That, my friend, is a flag of convenience, since a.net doesn't let me fly the Jolly Roger and it is also very useful for annoying Frenchmen, which happens to be a hobby of mine. Although we DO fly the tricolor here in Iowa.




 Wink  Wink

There are more than a few places here that can do a pretty good interior. Fact is, I worked on a few myself.


User currently offlineJfr From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 227 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (7 years 11 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 14336 times:

Quoting Heavierthanair (Reply 4):
G'day

Is the Sultanate of Brunei considered Middle East or Far East?

HRH the Sultan badly needs some new transport, the present metal is getting kind of dated.

Located on Borneo, between the Malaysian states of Sabah and Sarawak.

He's my bet, too. The royal household has a substantial fleet, including almost every widebody type in commercial service today. He got his 744 fairly early in the program's life. A 380 purchase about now would be holding true-to-form.

When the entire household travels to London, it takes a substantial portion of the fleet to get them there. Word in Bandar Seri Begawan is that it takes several extras to bring them and their purchases back!


25 Columba : I don´t get it why must an article that has positive news start with a negative comment.[Edited 2007-01-30 20:16:23]
26 Prebennorholm : Yeah, seems like a high price. But it is hard for us to judge since we don't know the details in the contract. For an operator like the Czech Air For
27 Post contains images FRAspotter : Just yesterday I was reading a thread in non-av about why many people (mainly men here in America) need such over sized SUVs and trucks when they wou
28 Prebennorholm : Sorry Chris, but for that purpose the A380 is one of the worst planes you can buy. The 380 fuselage is a triple bubble design. It means that it is to
29 Joni : I don't think there are that many limitations, at least in VVIP configuration. I think the wheel loading and runway requirements are less than for a
30 Post contains images Rheinbote : If you google around abit, you'll find that Doug McVitie is a former Airbus sales director
31 DEVILFISH : IMO major cities with modern facilities are the most probable destinations for such an ostentatious aircraft - save for those occasions when the owne
32 F22KA : The order must come from one of the countries oppressed by the West. Hey, that's what happens when your oil is being stolen... you can barely afford t
33 Flybyguy : Oh boy... now I know why they turn the spigot off from time to time... so that their spoiled, drug-using kids can get another Maserati or three. The
34 Post contains images Ncelhr : Not LHR apart from official visits. The British Airports Authority has banned private flights from LHR. It is just way too busy an airport... and we
35 Vega9000 : In any case, 300 million is probably what they earn extra in one month when the oil barrel goes up a few cents...
36 Post contains images Zippyjet : From a reliable source, the two private buyers of the 380 are: It'll be called of course either the Bodda Bing or the Stugatz of the skies! Buyer 2 is
37 Post contains images YVRFlyer : Hehehe... that would be fun, to see how low it would need to go to get enough runway. Maybe they could dub it the true "Clipper of The Fence"! Or it
38 Newagebird : my guess is its the Qatar Emiri flight, I got an uncle whos a chief engineer in there. I guess the emir needs it for his 50 something kids. my 2 cents
39 Baron52ta : One thing, an A380 would make the ultimate in airbourne conference centre, which is why you might want one since it is impossible to gate crash and ve
40 WingedMigrator : I'm curious to hear which helicopter would fit through the nose door of a 747. (hint: it's 2.49 meters from floor to ceiling)
41 UAEflyer : Sure he is Far Eastern, he is somewhere beside Singapore, Malaysia & Indonesia First of all, they call him His Majesty not H.R.H, second thing if he
42 Post contains images Baroque : So I do need to post, but perhaps I should not continue my theory from the A340 VIP thread that being secret, these must be low quality customers! Ah
43 Post contains images DEVILFISH : That would certainly jeopardize your five grand. Speaking of which, maybe I too am entitled, for urging everyone in the UFO 748I thread to look farth
44 Post contains images Plunaaircanada : Im one of the customers! and im going to make a party for a.netters! on the flying palace puac
45 Post contains images Baroque : As opposed to seize and insist?? Probably!
46 Joni : I agree that since they appear to be considering the purchase, prudence doesn't seem to be a big factor. That may turn out to be a mistake, however,
47 Thorben : Yes, a lot of people use their cars as a compensation for something. I have seen it often over here, a Mercedes M or a BMW X5 or some car like that -
48 Pyrex : Suddenly Freud comes to mind...
49 PanHAM : ask women and they will tell you that size doesn't matter, skill is everything. You know what really counts? The checque book and the Bank account be
50 TinkerBelle : A little out of topic but I met this guy in Manila a little over a month ago. A very nice guy and I even shook his hand. He was in town for a billiar
51 Revelation : Sure, it can land anywhere a 747 can land, but it can't necessarily taxi. Most taxiways need to be widened for A380. If they are not widened, the out
52 Scouseflyer : To be honest it seems that our "glorious" leader Mr Blair sometimes is trying not to annoy Mr Abramovich!!!!
53 RichardPrice : Dont use the outer engines then, the A380 can taxi well enough on just the two inner engines and it wouldnt be that much of an inconvenience for a VV
54 TinkerBelle : In some cases, it's not necessarily a matter sucking up anything but actually hitting something. Remember the beast's wingspan is out of this world.
55 Post contains images PanHAM : I didn't know Blair is a Chelsea fan Indeed, it is amazing where they operate the A124, I saw on flight tracking they recently went into a small airf
56 Post contains images TinkerBelle : He's a ManU fan, that's why he tries to annoy Abramovich. I saw an An-124 takeoff from Fresno airport, didn't think it'd clear the fence. Most amazin
57 Post contains images Jbguller : I know I'm a bit late, but I doubt one of those would be Mr Travolta - he'd wait until there was a used one for sale from Qantas before purchasing one
58 Rheinbote : The problems with taxiways are not due to pavement load, but due to to MLG track. A380 is much wider than the An-124 in track. Requires TWY shoulders
59 DEVILFISH : Is there any truth to the rumor that he bought the villa built at NAVMAG in Subic in which Clinton stayed for the summit? They could have flown the 7
60 Chuchoteur : dinan is in britanny... bit far removed from the aviation world...
61 Flying-Tiger : Some more info about the potential A380 customer(s):
62 A350 : What I don't get is what one single person wants to do with two decks. Hey, it's damn difficult to be on both simultanously. Cheers A350
63 Post contains images DEVILFISH : Let his significant other entertain on the first deck while he sequesters himself on the top deck with another partner? Less chance of the two bumpin
64 Post contains images TinkerBelle : Never heard of that rmor. Eitehr way, I don't blame him for staying in Manila instead of Subic. Apparently, he likes some action and there's a lot of
65 Manni : Unless he's mis quoted, it sounds like a done deal then. The exhibition is closing today, perhaps an announcement is imminent...
66 Post contains images UAEflyer : let us know stop thinking who why where and whom will buy the flying palace i doubt if you have money and you are living in a studio, you wouldn't thi
67 A350 : Where are many rich people in the world not wasting their money with "mine is bigger"-games like that. Cheers A350
68 Post contains links and images Leelaw : "Pictures: Airbus reveals letter of intent for VIP A380 'Flying Palace'" http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...of-intent-for-vip-a380-flying.html [Ed
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