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Possible OSL Intercontinental Flights.  
User currently offlineCXfirst From Norway, joined Jan 2007, 2927 posts, RR: 1
Posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2943 times:

Is there any chance that OSL gets any intercontinental flights in the early future other than CO to EWR?
EK to DXB with A332?
SK to EWR, PEK, etc. with A330,A340?

Personally I hope that EK starts flights to DXB, because then I only have to fly one stop to Norway from my home in PER Big grin

OSL has more passengers than Stockholm, Arlanda and they get flights to PEK and (i believe EWR with CO and SK). Not to mention CPH...

-CXfirst

[Edited 2007-02-01 10:29:17]


From Norway, live in Australia
36 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZRHnerd From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2935 times:

I think SK's current hub system works out well. Instead of flying two half-full A340 to ie. BKK, they rather feed OSL passengers through CPH and fly a full A340 to BKK. A North American route might work, but SK doen't have the metal to run it. They would need something in the 757/767 size. Their current A330s and A340s are simply too big to run a say OSL-EWR flight profitably.

User currently offlineEGBJ From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2007, 498 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 2912 times:

Agree with ZRHnerd....OSL simply doesn't have the passenger base to justify direct flights to these destinations.

Maybe the 787 could be a consideration for SK as I think this craft would be perfect for the routes you mention. However SK isn't really in the financial position to place a new order or a new type in an already very diverse fleet.

 Smile


User currently offlineSolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 847 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 2900 times:

Don´t see 752 in SK c/s, there´s no 752 to buy, even second hand.

CO doing a great job flying Scand. - EWR w their 752´s

Micke//  twocents 



Airbus SAS - Love them both
User currently offlineJlb From Denmark, joined Nov 1999, 68 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 2897 times:

Quoting CXfirst (Thread starter):
OSL has more passengers than Stockholm, Arlanda and they get flights to PEK and (i believe EWR with CO and SK). Not to mention CPH...

I have said it before, but I'll be happy to ask again: If OSL is so much more of a market than ARN and CPH why then did we see US open PHL-ARN and DL on ATL-CPH, while OSL only has the CO flight to EWR which CPH and ARN also have? Maybe the lack of intercontinental flights at OSL is just because the market isn't there?


User currently offlineFBU 4EVER! From Norway, joined Jan 2001, 998 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2873 times:

Many rumours abound re. SAS Intercont. these days.Fact is that SAS has been in Canada and looked at two AC A340's for fleet expansion.However,the change of CEO means that a decision to acquire these planes will not be taken until late March at the earliest.Expansion on the CPH-PEK and ARN-PEK routes will follow later this year as PEK becomes the only destination in China for SAS,PVG being cancelled due to low yields.
SAS is actively looking on CPH-HKG and CPH-SIN non-stop as future destinations.Also mentioned in the corridors of HQ is the possibility of OSL-EWR summertime and OSL-BKK wintertime.Some 300,000 Norwegians travel to Thailand on vacation every year,so there should be a market.



"Luck and superstition wins all the time"!
User currently offlineKevin777 From Denmark, joined Sep 2006, 1165 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2865 times:

Quoting Jlb (Reply 4):
If OSL is so much more of a market than ARN and CPH why then did we see US open PHL-ARN and DL on ATL-CPH, while OSL only has the CO flight to EWR which CPH and ARN also have? Maybe the lack of intercontinental flights at OSL is just because the market isn't there?

Spot on, jlb...

Sorry to break anyone's heart here, but as other noted more intercon from OSL is unlikely... The only thing I could see happening a few years down the line is a nonstop to BKK with TG 3-4 times a week with a 330 or so; I wouldn't say it's completely unlikely but don't bet your pocket money on it either..

Quoting CXfirst (Thread starter):
OSL has more passengers than Stockholm, Arlanda and they get flights to PEK and (i believe EWR with CO and SK). Not to mention CPH...

Again-again and again...: Subtract domestic pax and get the real picture

Quoting CXfirst (Thread starter):
Is there any chance that OSL gets any intercontinental flights in the early future other than CO to EWR?

To be fair, you still have a few weekly PK310-300's that you share with CPH...

Kevin777  Smile



"I was waiting for you at DFW, but you must have been in LUV" CPH-HAM-CPH CR9
User currently offlineZRHnerd From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2861 times:

What puzzles me is: Why on earth does SK serve EWR? EWR is a major skyteam hub and thus means they get less connecting traffic. Why dont they start a route to IAD? Why don't they fly to JFK? By flying to JFK, even though it aint a major UA hub, they would still get a lot more connecting traffic feeded by UA and wouldnt have to rely simply on O&D. Competing with CO on the EWR run must be pretty tough as CO gets a lot more connecting traffic through their hub at EWR. IAD might not be a bad option as it is a mjor UA hub and would enable feed from all over the US east coast.

User currently onlineCRJ900 From Norway, joined Jun 2004, 2152 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2812 times:
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Quoting Jlb (Reply 4):
If OSL is so much more of a market than ARN and CPH why then did we see US open PHL-ARN and DL on ATL-CPH, while OSL only has the CO flight to EWR which CPH and ARN also have? Maybe the lack of intercontinental flights at OSL is just because the market isn't there?

Bingo! We Oslo-people are quite set in our travel patterns, really. We fly to London to down Lager and watch musicals, we fly to Nice to down nice wines and eat expensive morsel-sized French food and we fly to Spain and Thailand to fry our flab in the scorching sun and dive into the ocean to cool off.  Wink

Scheduled longhaul flights will mostly be low-yield vacation flights from Oslo. That's why MyTravel Airways are so successful in filling their 360-410-seat A330s. Perhaps MyTravel should start OSL-NYC thrice-weekly, catering for all those who wish to shop at Bloomingdales and watch a Broadway musical. I'm sure they would do well with that.

SAS didn't cancel OSL-EWR just to be bastards, but because the yields were too low, the revenue didn't cover the costs, apparently. Biz travellers get great deals going through CPH, AMS, LHR, CDG, FRA already, so no guarantee that they will be raving about a new route from OSL as it may not cover their need anyway...



Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
User currently offlineScooter01 From Norway, joined Nov 2006, 1186 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2789 times:
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Looks like we have to keep on transiting trough CPH, ARN, AMS, FRA and LHR.
(Have to help getting their passenger count up   )

And for the spotters out there, you will have a variety of twins to chose from!

S

[Edited 2007-02-01 13:47:27]


"We all have a girl and her name is nostalgia" - Hemingway
User currently offlineJlb From Denmark, joined Nov 1999, 68 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2790 times:

Quoting ZRHnerd (Reply 7):
What puzzles me is: Why on earth does SK serve EWR? EWR is a major skyteam hub and thus means they get less connecting traffic. Why dont they start a route to IAD? Why don't they fly to JFK? By flying to JFK, even though it aint a major UA hub, they would still get a lot more connecting traffic feeded by UA and wouldnt have to rely simply on O&D.

SK already operates a CPH-IAD flight. I think SK's fights to EWR is mainly O/D to the New York area. They sometimes interline on Continental out of EWR, but mostly SK itenerarys will route you through IAD or ORD on United if you are going somewhere else in the US.


User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12163 posts, RR: 36
Reply 11, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2727 times:
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I wish SK would just be cheaper. If I wanna fly home to Norway, NW/KL is ALWAYS cheapest (sometimes beat by FI), but SK is always a couple hundred dollars more expensive. Would be nice to support the home team, but not when it's that more expensive.


911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlineKevin777 From Denmark, joined Sep 2006, 1165 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 2613 times:

Quoting ZRHnerd (Reply 7):
What puzzles me is: Why on earth does SK serve EWR?

SK served JFK until around what, 1990 or so, and then they moved to EWR because of their hook-up with CO (a deal that cost them a fortune, thanx Jan Carlzon!). When the two divorced SK just stuck to EWR then. I guess EWR is all right; it has been dicussed many times here on a.net, and even though it's in another state it still seems very popular with New Yorkers.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 8):
OSL-NYC thrice-weekly, catering for all those who wish to shop at Bloomingdales and watch a Broadway musical

You know what, that actually might be a good idea. In the summertime the DK 330s are often a bit oversized for many Med destinations, NYC could definitely be a hit, also with the yields on NYC in the summer.

Quoting Scooter01 (Reply 9):
Looks like we have to keep on transiting trough CPH, ARN, AMS, FRA and LHR.
(Have to help getting their passenger count up

And we are greatful at CPH!  Smile

Quoting Jlb (Reply 10):
they sometimes interline on Continental out of EWR, but mostly SK itenerarys will route you through IAD or ORD on United if you are going somewhere else in the US.

I think a major reason for this is that SK gets so good yields on EWR origin/dest pax; they'd rather not block any of them out because of low-yield transfer pax.

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 11):
I wish SK would just be cheaper. If I wanna fly home to Norway, NW/KL is ALWAYS cheapest (sometimes beat by FI), but SK is always a couple hundred dollars more expensive. Would be nice to support the home team, but not when it's that more expensive.

Well, that's economics and national preferences working for you there! Go to AMS and see what an AMS-JFK ticket sets you back, and then see what a AMS-CPH-EWR tix sets you back - probably the opposite picture. Just like VW's are relatively cheaper in France than in Germany, and Peugeot's are relatively cheaper in Germany than in France.

Kevin777  Smile



"I was waiting for you at DFW, but you must have been in LUV" CPH-HAM-CPH CR9
User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2179 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 2590 times:

Quoting CXfirst (Thread starter):
EK to DXB with A332?

In my opinion, this is a question of when and not if.

Quoting CXfirst (Thread starter):
SK to EWR, PEK, etc. with A330,A340?

Not very likely, IMO.

Quoting ZRHnerd (Reply 1):
Instead of flying two half-full A340 to ie. BKK, they rather feed OSL passengers through CPH and fly a full A340 to BKK.

They could actually have flown three full A340s to BKK from both CPH, ARN and OSL. The market is definitely there. They would've gotten much better yields that way.

Quoting Jlb (Reply 4):
I have said it before, but I'll be happy to ask again: If OSL is so much more of a market than ARN and CPH why then did we see US open PHL-ARN and DL on ATL-CPH, while OSL only has the CO flight to EWR which CPH and ARN also have?

It's not more of a market than ARN and CPH, but it's a more under-served market than the two others.

Quoting FBU 4EVER! (Reply 5):
Expansion on the CPH-PEK and ARN-PEK routes will follow later this year

Actually, CPH-PEK will be reduced from daily to 6 weekly.

Quoting Kevin777 (Reply 6):
The only thing I could see happening a few years down the line is a nonstop to BKK with TG 3-4 times a week with a 330 or so;

Thai's A330s don't have the range. A more likely option would be a 744 either nonstop or via some other city, e.g. HEL. The passengers on OSL-BKK would be mostly low yield, so they would need to use a plane with low CASM, while frequency is not that important.

Quoting Kevin777 (Reply 6):
Again-again and again...: Subtract domestic pax and get the real picture

Also, subtract the Norwegian and Swedish passengers transiting through CPH and you will get a much lower number there too.

Quoting ZRHnerd (Reply 7):
Why dont they start a route to IAD? Why don't they fly to JFK? By flying to JFK, even though it aint a major UA hub, they would still get a lot more connecting traffic feeded by UA and wouldnt have to rely simply on O&D.

They're already flying to two UA hubs, IAD and ORD. New York is such a big O&D market in itself that they don't need to compete with their own hub flights to ORD and IAD. That said, I believe that if SK should start a flight from OSL to the US, they should choose IAD or ORD rather than any NYC airport.



Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently onlineCRJ900 From Norway, joined Jun 2004, 2152 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 2545 times:
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Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 11):
I wish SK would just be cheaper.

Well, as long as SAS FAs are to earn NOK400,000-500,000 a year, SAS airfares will have to be somewhat expensive. The cost of living is very high in Norway. Source for the pay figure: a friend of a friend, who is an ex-SAS FA (he lost his job after 9-11).



Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12163 posts, RR: 36
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 2495 times:
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Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 14):
The cost of living is very high in Norway

I know, I'm from there.  Smile



911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlineZRHnerd From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 2490 times:

Quoting RedChili (Reply 13):
They could actually have flown three full A340s to BKK from both CPH, ARN and OSL. The market is definitely there. They would've gotten much better yields that way.

I highly doubt that, at least not for a daily service out of the three. it would probably work for a twice weekly each, but then again, this will cause toubles like aircraft positioning. Hubbing pax through CPH is definately a lot easier for them and it seems to work, as they have been doing so for a substantional amount of time now.


User currently offlineZRHnerd From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 2478 times:

What just crossed my mind is, if they could get their hands on an additional A340 or A330, they could probably shuttle it between OSL, ARN and BKK, ie: ARN-BKK-ARN-BKK-OSL-BKK-OSL-BKK-ARN etc. That might work and they wouldnt have to cope with the forementioned problems. But then again, that might just be a bit narrow-minded of me.

User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2179 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2433 times:

Quoting ZRHnerd (Reply 16):
I highly doubt that, at least not for a daily service out of the three.

Not for a daily service, but the BKK market is mostly leisure so they don't really need a daily service. They could've had e.g.:

5 weekly CPH
5 weekly ARN
4 weekly OSL

and the planes could turn around in BKK as you suggested.

But they would also have to change the configuration compared to today's. Today they're using the same amount of C-class seats on BKK and on NRT, which are two totally different destinations. BKK needs a small amount of C-class and a high amount of Y seats to be profitable.



Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently onlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7320 posts, RR: 24
Reply 19, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2392 times:

I would love to haveLAX-OSL because I try to go to Oslo once a year, but since that will never happen ill keep dreaming.


Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlinePavlovsDog From Norway, joined Sep 2005, 656 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 2391 times:

With a small enough aircraft I could see IAH, DXB and SIN all doing well. There is certainly enough business class traffic to 20-25 seats a day to those destinations and plenty of cargo. The issue would be finding the right size plane. I imagine a premium configure 752 might have the legs to manage both IAH and SIN.. I imagine a 762 would be better though if the cargo demand is high enough.



[Edited 2007-02-02 17:19:41]

User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2179 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 2337 times:

Quoting PavlovsDog (Reply 20):
I imagine a premium configure 752 might have the legs to manage both IAH and SIN.

Possibly long enough range for IAH, but never SIN! It's a loooong way between OSL-SIN. The smallest aircraft which would be able to do OSL-SIN without a restricted payload would probably be the A343 or B772ER, and the market does not justify putting such a big airplane on those routes.

I'm quite sure, though, that EK would be able to fill an A332 between OSL-DXB.



Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlinePavlovsDog From Norway, joined Sep 2005, 656 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 2306 times:

A 762 could do Osl-Sin though. You're right though that EK would make a killing on OSL-DXB.

User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2179 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 2281 times:

Quoting PavlovsDog (Reply 22):
A 762 could do Osl-Sin though.

It could, but I believe that it would be payload restricted on the way back, i.e. SIN-OSL. Maybe you would even see a few diversions.

I've heard that the 763ER used on the BKK-CPH route a few years ago often had to leave behind freight. OSL-SIN is 800 nm longer while the 762ER only has 500 nm better range.



Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlineSukhoi From Sweden, joined May 2006, 373 posts, RR: 8
Reply 24, posted (7 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 2257 times:

I think a QR 319LR to DOH would be perfect!

25 Post contains images Kevin777 : Don't take this the wrong way! But sadly, I think you're right. Now, let there be no doubt (come on, be realistic here!) that DXB-CPH would make much
26 Sukhoi : I read that SAS are looking for a possible seasonal OSL-BKK during the winter period and OSL-EWR summer seems very logical and SK will go daily ARN-PE
27 CEO@AFG : The major growth factor for OSL has been DY. With the advent of Norwegian, the flying public has been given lots of new European destinations direct f
28 FlyDreamliner : it surprises me that there has never been some kind of summer MSP-OSL service offered, maybe they will now on 752... I know more people here in MN who
29 RedChili : I beg to differ. EK is the superhub carrier which, more than any other airline, is basing its growth on connecting flights via its superhub in DXB. E
30 MAH4546 : Minnesota/Norway is probably the most over-hyped, over-used example of "ethnic traffic should support this route" when the truth is: it can't. Norwei
31 CXfirst : Thanks for all the replies However there are no norwegian carriers flying with a 762 or singaporean airline flying a 762. I believe that CPH-DXB will
32 Post contains images Kevin777 : No way! Hmm... don't really see any proof of this here... You said it, MAH4546, the nail on the head! Sorry, I wasn't making myself clear I guess: Wh
33 Someone83 : If you look at the statsitics from CPH, ARN and OSL and then look at their number of international and domestic pax which they also report and then d
34 Post contains images LN-MOW : Show me some numbers to support this ....
35 Post contains links and images KaiGywer : View Large View MediumPhoto © Thomas Lorentzen They did, but as MAH4546 said, there wasn't enough market. You can take FI fast, cheap, and easy.
36 Someone83 : And KLM also prefered to route pax via AMS instead of NW having a direct flight into OSL
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