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Any Possibility Of WN Increasing Service In N.E?  
User currently offlineKstateinALB From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 748 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 3234 times:

The title says it all really. Is there any possibility of an increase of WN presence in cities such as PVD, MHT, ALB, or ISP? They have done well in these cities before, and was wondering if they will increase in these cities in the future.


ALB, DTW, ORD, MDW, MCI, JFK, LGA, LHR, MAD, MSP, IAD, DCA, MCO, ATL, CVG, TUL, MHK, PHL, PIT, DFW, DAL, CLT, IND, AUS,
25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCOERJ145 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 3194 times:

I'm hoping they'll start MHT-PHX and PHX-LAS.

User currently offlineAtrude777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5692 posts, RR: 52
Reply 2, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 3175 times:

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 1):
PHX-LAS.

PHX-LAS?  Silly

There is a MHT-LAS..but no MHT-PHX.....

Alex



Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
User currently offlineDL777LAX From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 521 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 3159 times:

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 1):
PHX-LAS.

if you meant PVD-LAS, which I'm assuming you are, they already fly that one too.



Blindly following anything is bad, unless of course your blind and your following a guide dog.
User currently offlineCOERJ145 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 3102 times:

Quoting Atrude777 (Reply 2):
PHX-LAS?

whoops! typo. I meant PVD-LAS, but to my surprise they already fly this.


User currently offlineAtrude777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5692 posts, RR: 52
Reply 5, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 3098 times:

Quoting COERJ145 (Reply 4):
whoops! typo. I meant PVD-LAS, but to my surprise they already fly this.

Ya only 9 WN cities do not have this service non stop, RSW, HRL, CRP, FLL, JAX, JAN, DAL, DTW, and PBI.

Alex



Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
User currently offlineGeorgiabill From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 577 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 3083 times:
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Personally I would like to see WN add MHT service to PHX,DEN,RDU, FLL or RSW. But realistically I can see MHT PHX or MHT DEN being a viable new route for 2007

User currently offlineLV From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 1991 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 3043 times:

Quoting Atrude777 (Reply 5):
Ya only 9 WN cities do not have this service non stop, RSW,

I think WN could start RSW-LAS and make a fair amount off of it. There are a lot of people between Lee/ Collier/ Charlotte counties that make the trip to the desert. Do it once a day and it will fill with good yield.


User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4364 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 3030 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

FLL-LAS would work well also. Other than DAL it's the largest WN station without N/S service to LAS, and I wouldn't be surprised to see it by summer '08. LAS-MCO went non-stop last fall, so maybe FLL is next.


Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlinePVD757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3411 posts, RR: 17
Reply 9, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2969 times:

I'm hoping for PVD to STL, PBI, DEN, and/or RDU. I'd say there is a fair to good chance PVD gets 1 of those in 2007...

User currently offlineGeorgiabill From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 577 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2940 times:
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On a side note, I am surprised that WN has not chosen to connect IAD with ALB,BDL,PVD ,ISP or MHT. IN MHT case not sure how big the market would be but perhaps shifting one or 2 BWI to IAD might work.

User currently offlineDolphinflyer From Canada, joined May 2005, 199 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2858 times:

ALB-PHL and ALB-PHX would be great adds. Since WN is gaining a few gates at PHL, that might be a good possibility.

User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6707 posts, RR: 32
Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2824 times:

Quoting Georgiabill (Reply 10):
On a side note, I am surprised that WN has not chosen to connect IAD with ALB,BDL,PVD ,ISP or MHT. IN MHT case not sure how big the market would be but perhaps shifting one or 2 BWI to IAD might work.

I agree, but I don't see WN starting any of those markets to IAD (and throw in BUF for good measure) with fewer than four daily round-trips, given that they'd need to have at least four or five flights each way to be competitive in terms of frequency. Perhaps you'd see one or two flights moved from BWI, but then again, there's a reason WN goes 12x BWI-PVD and 11x BWI-MHT. If WN were to build up PIT more, I could certainly see PIT-MHT, PIT-PVD, and PIT-ISP happening.


User currently offlineChrisNH From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4083 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2821 times:

I'm encouraged that MHT will receive three new flights from Southwest: One each to MCO (5), PHL (6), and MDW (5). PHL/MCO start next month; MDW starts in May.

MHT-PHX is the one we've all been waiting for, and quite frankly I'd have expected that long before any of the ones we WILL get. But that's where we're at.

Since we were the only New England station to gain new flights in these last go-arounds, I'd expect us to now get no more for awhile. Southwest will probably drop one or two flights into PVD, although I'm not sure whether the bloom is off the rose at BDL. I would be absolutely SHOCKED if MHT got yet another new flight the next time Southwest unveils new flights/routes. To a huge degree, deliveries from Boeing serve as a catalyst for new routes & how many.

Chris


User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4645 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2817 times:

Cities that PVD could support n/s on WN:

STL
HOU
PIT
RDU
JAX
PBI
LAX
ORF
CMH
IND
IAD
DEN

Each of those average over 150 daily O&D pax, many of those have well over 200, and good connecting/through flight opportunities.

Seems like WN is PVD's only hope for growth these days, until someone else can come in and kick up some competition.

My primary fear is the "Islip Effect" Where the more marketshare WN gains, the more the other carriers shrink. Competing services have been obliterated at ISP, and also, since WN passed 50% at MHT, offerings from other airlines decreased as well.....



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4645 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2812 times:

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 13):
Southwest will probably drop one or two flights into PVD,

care to explain that reasoning, lets not forget MHT's gain of three, is a net increase of one flight since they dropped MHT-BNA 2x last year



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineChrisNH From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4083 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2777 times:

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 15):
care to explain that reasoning

Simply that MHT got three new flights and PVD got zero. I was suggesting that it was time for PVD to 'get something' from WN. Stands to reason, although in our case none were new routes...they were all additions to existing ones. So while your list of new cities looks appealing, it would be in keeping with recent Southwest strategy to add to existing markets rather than debut new ones. Like I said, the flow of planes from Boeing is key.

And the losses of MHT-BNA (2x) and PVD-ISP (at least 4x) are water over the dam, so to speak.

Chris


User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4645 posts, RR: 11
Reply 17, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2773 times:

Well your word "drop" probably isnt the best choice of word to use!

I agree, they will probably ADD 1-2 flights, which is what i assume you meant.

I also agree, that list of cities will be pretty much lost on WN. Best chances for a new city are IAD, STL, PIT or RDU



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlinePVD757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3411 posts, RR: 17
Reply 18, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2764 times:

by "drop...into," I think he means they will ADD...

some of the cities on the list have a bit less than the 150 O&D. I usually look at markets from PVD that average above 90 pax each way for (65% LF) locals and figure another 15-20% LF would connect onward. If a city won't offer any connecting opportunities, then I'd go with 85% LF or about 116 each way.

my list would be:

FLL (553)
RSW (336)
LAX (290 O&D)
SAN (277)
IAD (244)
PIT (243)
PBI (238)
DTW (214)
RDU (209)
JAX (197)

there are certain markets that have suppressed demand (due to lack of PVD nonstop and BOS nonstop available) that WN could grow enough with nonstop service:

ORF (163)
DEN (129)
IND (128)
CMH (126)
STL (125)


User currently offlineKstateinALB From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 748 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2737 times:

Well, I think ALB can have sufficient service to these airports and I think WN can make it work...

PHL- compete with US, and can probably make a good amount by dropping the price down
IAD- compte with UA, would work if theres the right price
PHX- 141 daily passengers makes this flight doable with either WN or US
DEN- Has over 160 daily passengers, maybe once a day would work
FLL-about 200 daily passengers, again once a day would be good



ALB, DTW, ORD, MDW, MCI, JFK, LGA, LHR, MAD, MSP, IAD, DCA, MCO, ATL, CVG, TUL, MHK, PHL, PIT, DFW, DAL, CLT, IND, AUS,
User currently offlineChrisNH From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4083 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2712 times:

Yes, sorry. Poor choice of words on my part! I simply should have said 'ADD.' But I think it's time for Southwest to ADD a few flights at PVD. I have a gut feeling that Southwest is more bullish on PVD/MHT than on BDL.

Chris


User currently offlineN200WN From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 784 posts, RR: 6
Reply 21, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 2660 times:

Quoting Dolphinflyer (Reply 11):
ALB-PHL and ALB-PHX would be great adds



Quoting KstateinALB (Reply 19):
Well, I think ALB can have sufficient service to these airports and I think WN can make it work...

PHL- compete with US, and can probably make a good amount by dropping the price down

I don't think ALB-PHL would be so successful, especially given that BDL-PHL was just dropped.


User currently offlineChrisNH From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4083 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2645 times:

Do people agree that BDL is the weak link in Southwest's New England operation? Is it the competition? Weaker-than-expected response from the public?

User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4364 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2638 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting PVD757 (Reply 18):
my list would be:

FLL (553)
RSW (336)
LAX (290 O&D)
SAN (277)
IAD (244)
PIT (243)
PBI (238)
DTW (214)
RDU (209)
JAX (197)

Not to be the bearer of bad news, but the only one that has a chance of happening on that list is FLL. All of those others are either transcon flights, or smaller WN stations with not enough O&D to PVD to bother with. There are several WN city pairs I can think of out there that dont have n/s service on WN that are over 400 pax per day.



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4645 posts, RR: 11
Reply 24, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2614 times:

I agree it is more of a "wish list" posted there, but i can see potentially places like STL, PIT, or IAD possible in the near term. LAS PHX and MDW could also get additional frequencies.

With transcons there needs to be a 110% chance of good yeilds and loads during mid weeks days to get them these days with the cost of fuel.



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineKstateinALB From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 748 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2510 times:

Quoting N200WN (Reply 21):
don't think ALB-PHL would be so successful

The one reason as to why it might be successful is the fact that they can lower prices on the route and take many passengers from US and bring them to WN. PHL is somewhat of a big market here, and by coming in, WN can make US have to fight for PHL.



ALB, DTW, ORD, MDW, MCI, JFK, LGA, LHR, MAD, MSP, IAD, DCA, MCO, ATL, CVG, TUL, MHK, PHL, PIT, DFW, DAL, CLT, IND, AUS,
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