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Frontier Makes Offer To Cedar Rapids -CID  
User currently offlineAlphascan From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 937 posts, RR: 13
Posted (7 years 7 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 5371 times:

Frontier has responed to The Eastern Iowa Airport's (CID) proposal for service. Basically, if CID will guarantee first year revenues of $500,000, Frontier JetExpress will start 2x daily 70 seat RJ or E-170 service as early as this spring.

Here is a news story from a Waterloo, IA TV station:

http://www.kwwl.com/Global/story.asp?S=6110900&nav=2Ifu


Here is The Eastern Iowa Airport's Call to Action for area businesses:

http://www.crairport.org/news/releases/FrontierFinal.pdf


Oddly enough, I find the Waterloo (which has its own airport -ALO) TV station's report more compelling than the actual Call To Action.


"To he who only has a hammer in his toolbelt, every problem looks like a nail."
28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 7 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 5349 times:

Interesting.

Another option to go visit my daughter . . .

CID has the gate and counter space, and it's an underserved market to the West Coast.

Good move F9.


User currently offlineDSMflyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 402 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 7 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 5294 times:

This would be very good. I flew them out of Omaha in January and was really impressed. I'm glad they're making an effort to move into an Iowa market.

User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 7 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 5267 times:

I wish they would come to PIA..Though a EMB170 in PIA might be too large.

User currently offlineKingCavalier From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 1306 posts, RR: 17
Reply 4, posted (7 years 7 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4990 times:

http://us2.newsmemory.com/ee/cedarrapidsgazette/default_open.php

Article is on page A4



Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness
User currently offlineFlymli From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 53 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 7 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4904 times:

All I have to say is that you don't want to mess with United when they already offer good air service between CID and DEN. The market is only so big and MLI and DSM already have flights to DEN also. UA will want a revenue guarantee too!

User currently offlineKingCavalier From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 1306 posts, RR: 17
Reply 6, posted (7 years 7 months 1 day ago) and read 4647 times:

Quoting Flymli (Reply 5):
All I have to say is that you don't want to mess with United when they already offer good air service between CID and DEN.

Do you not know where Frontier's hub is? You say UA offers good air service. I say expensive. I just checked UA's web site for a RT fare from CID to DEN in June and it priced out at over $720. Now, has UA really been that good to the good folks of Eastern Iowa?

[Edited 2007-02-24 00:18:08]


Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness
User currently offlineTom in NO From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 7194 posts, RR: 32
Reply 7, posted (7 years 7 months 1 day ago) and read 4613 times:

Quoting Alphascan (Thread starter):
Basically, if CID will guarantee first year revenues of $500,000,

Airport operator revenue guarantees to an airline are illegal. Note the comment below from the linked kwwl.com article:

Mann says getting the business community to back the half million dollar revenue guarantee by March 6th will be a task... but it will pay off in the long run.

The revenue difference between what F9 makes on the route and the minimum revenue guarantee would have to be made up by the local business community. And those types of promises from local business is very tough to come by.

Tom at MSY



"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
User currently offlineCaptover From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 87 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 7 months 1 day ago) and read 4550 times:

If I was Frontier I wouldn't worry about competition from United on the CID-DEN route. They'll just send their pax to Cheyenne anyway! And leave them there too! Big grin

User currently offlineF9Animal From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 5054 posts, RR: 28
Reply 9, posted (7 years 7 months 23 hours ago) and read 4514 times:

Quoting Flymli (Reply 5):
All I have to say is that you don't want to mess with United when they already offer good air service between CID and DEN. The market is only so big and MLI and DSM already have flights to DEN also. UA will want a revenue guarantee too!

I guess F9 should have considered all of this when they started flying from DEN to any other UA airport serves from DEN. If there is a place that F9 could serve to continue success, then so be it. All F9 will bring to CID is lower fares, good service, and options for the community.



I Am A Different Animal!!
User currently offlineIPFreely From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 239 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 7 months 23 hours ago) and read 4444 times:

I wish it was DSM instead (since it's my home airport), but it's great news for CID. If it happens, it will be interesting to see what it does to fares -- UA typically has high fares to cities like DSM and CID, but also responds with aggressive pricing to drive new entrants out of these markets when needed. Frontier is doing the right thing in asking for a guarantee.

It would be nice to have F9 in DSM, but I'd actually prefer WN, so I'll keep hoping for that.


User currently offlineStirling From Italy, joined Jun 2004, 3943 posts, RR: 21
Reply 11, posted (7 years 7 months 18 hours ago) and read 4233 times:

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 1):
Another option to go visit my daughter . . .

Or an Ex.

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 3):
I wish they would come to PIA..Though a EMB170 in PIA might be too large.

Peoria would be big enough.
UA/X already has the CR7 to ORD....plus CRJs and ER3/ERJs to Atlanta, DFW, and more to ORD.
The big O/D market is LAS, but that is probably because it is the only market with good airfares. Allegiant being on the route. If Frontier were to bring a more sensible fare structure...the numbers to places like DEN, PHX, SEA, LAX are sure to increase.
Back pre-Texas Air, Meatball Continental ran a dedicated 1-stop to Peoria...a tag to another flight, twice daily. I will go out on a limb and say if the market was there in the 1970s/1980s....it still exists today.

Quoting F9Animal (Reply 9):
I guess F9 should have considered all of this when they started flying from DEN to any other UA airport serves from DEN.

Well, that would leave Ogdensburg, NY, Tyler TX, Tonopah, NV, and Marathon FL....and maybe Benton Harbor MI, I hear the competition is getting tough there tho'.
 Wink
Interesting that PIA generates more O/D to Las Vegas. About 239 to 177 each day, or about 119 and 89 each way.
Down the list, the ranking is; LAS, DFW, ATL, MSP, LAX, PHX, DEN, LGA, SAN.
Frontier can access half of those destinations.

Quoting KingCavalier (Reply 6):
I just checked UA's web site for a RT fare from CID to DEN in June and it priced out at over $720.

That is going to seriously go down. No wonder the community is so eager for Frontier to come in.
I'm sure, 2 to 3 flights a day will fill up nicely with DEN O/D and beyond traffic.



Delete this User
User currently offlineEvilForce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 7 months 17 hours ago) and read 4180 times:

Flying into Cedar Rapids is very expensive. I think Frontier will do quite well there. Lots of folks moved from Iowa to Denver during the farm recession of the 80's and early 90's.

User currently offlineCidflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2304 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (7 years 7 months 11 hours ago) and read 4095 times:

F9 at CID would be awesome. CID is serving over 1 million pax a year now, this will only help the numbers grow. I remember when ATA Express came in here and lowered airfares back in 02. We really need some lower fares here, we definitley have the market as seen by the pax numbers. 2 airlines on one route to DEN would be no differnt than FL and DL to ATL from MLI. On a side note, I see we are getting a 6th daily flight on AA to DFW and a 7th to ORD.

User currently offlineFlyPeoria From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 434 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (7 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3285 times:

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 3):
I wish they would come to PIA..Though a EMB170 in PIA might be too large

Not if the entire Central Illinois market is considered. How they might be accommodated might be the issue though.


User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4403 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3061 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

As I've said in the past couple years, this route could definitely work if it's priced correctly. Also, as said above, CID is ripe for an LCC carrier to come in, and something better than a CRJ-200 is most welcomed anyways.

I'm sure the airport is really trying to pull this off, as it would be a huge victory in drawing pax to the airport that are heading west (MLI steals a lot of eastbound due to FL).



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD.
User currently offlineSking11 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 44 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3013 times:

Quoting KingCavalier (Reply 6):
I just checked UA's web site for a RT fare from CID to DEN in June and it priced out at over $720.

I just checked UAL's site and the above quoted price has gone down to $436.80 and this price includes all taxes for June of this year. Price must of gone down big time.


User currently offlineCIDflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2304 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2877 times:

Quoting Iowaman (Reply 15):
As I've said in the past couple years, this route could definitely work if it's priced correctly. Also, as said above, CID is ripe for an LCC carrier to come in, and something better than a CRJ-200 is most welcomed anyways.

I'm sure the airport is really trying to pull this off, as it would be a huge victory in drawing pax to the airport that are heading west (MLI steals a lot of eastbound due to FL).

totally agree. It would be interesting to see what CID's numbers would be if they did get this service.They are already turning out record passenger numbers as it is. It looks like CID is primed for expansion, and they will need it if they do land F9. They were in talks to expand the B concourse. I would hope they would put jet bridges in there because we only have maybe a couple saabs now to MSP and that's it, everything else is jet aircraft. I flew out a couple weeks ago around 6am and the lineup through security gets backed up into the middle of the main terminal.


User currently offlineSpinkid From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 1113 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2827 times:

Quoting Stirling (Reply 11):
Interesting that PIA generates more O/D to Las Vegas. About 239 to 177 each day, or about 119 and 89 each way.
Down the list, the ranking is; LAS, DFW, ATL, MSP, LAX, PHX, DEN, LGA, SAN.
Frontier can access half of those destinations.

PIA generates that much O/D to LAS since Allegiant offers non-stop service on that route 6-7 times a week.


User currently offlineCIDflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2304 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (7 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2647 times:

Any updated news regarding this? I thought F9 was to have made up their minds about it this week.

Quoting Flymli (Reply 5):
All I have to say is that you don't want to mess with United when they already offer good air service between CID and DEN. The market is only so big and MLI and DSM already have flights to DEN also. UA will want a revenue guarantee too!

Don't forget that DEN is a large F9 hub, and that many pax will be connecting on to other destinations out to the west and Mexico. It would really be no different than AirTran and Delta serving ATL from MLI.


User currently offlineSTJ From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 195 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2637 times:

Quoting CIDflyer (Reply 17):
I would hope they would put jet bridges in there because we only have maybe a couple saabs now to MSP and that's it,

You can use a gate with a Saab and a CRJ so there would be no reason not to do put a gate in just because you have Saabs. Most all the gates (regional) on the A and B (even side) can take CRJ's and Saab's.


User currently offlineAvConsultant From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 1360 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (7 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2616 times:

Quoting Cidflyer (Reply 13):
CID is serving over 1 million pax a year now

According to their airport website in 2004 CID 477,218 pax. that's a hug increase in 2 years.
http://www.eiairport.org/about/statistics.shtml

I remember the same year DSM was celebrating there 1st 1 million-th enplanement with signage and prize for that pax. IIRC, the numbers came in less than 100 passengers short of 1 million. I think they determined the NW computer problem during the summer and the huge OH fiasco in CVG during Christmas affected the milestone.


User currently offlineWhatUsaid From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 664 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (7 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2608 times:

When F9 came into FAT, UA immediately dropped fares to the F9 level and has kept them there. Word on the street was that UA moved to depress yield to where F9 wouldn't be able to recover costs without very full aircraft. You might also recall, UA also raised hell with the DOT on the fact that Fed Funds were being used to help support the service when they already provided service on the route and thus, UA may be trying to prove a point through their madness. No doubt in my mind, if F9 leaves, the cost of flying through DEN will skyrocket.

Maybe other midwestern markets can learn from F9's adventures in FAT. F9 has struggled some in Fresno. Starting the service in the fall didn't help matters. But, they did come into their own last summer and had keep the loads at pretty close to their national average until the December snowstorms hit and all of DEN took a tumble. During this period, flights were running hours late or were subject to cancellation, and loads dropped into the 60's. Since arriving, F9 tinkered with the schedules several times, and has finally settled into one mainlain 319 a day to DEN (for now). I was hoping that UA would blink and realize that their CRJ 200 vs a F9 319 requires a second look at the market, but thus far, nothing from UA.

For Cedar Rapids and other mid-sized markets, F9's entry brings with it some responsibility for UA to stop the outragous fare structure that is so common when they're the only game in town to DEN.


User currently offlineCIDflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2304 posts, RR: 3
Reply 23, posted (7 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2600 times:

Quoting AvConsultant (Reply 21):
According to their airport website in 2004 CID 477,218 pax. that's a hug increase in 2 years.
http://www.eiairport.org/about/stati...shtml

yes it is, for the past two years the pax served has been over one million, and this year to date has seen increases over the previous year
http://www.eiairport.org/news/releases/1_23_06.shtml


User currently offlineAvConsultant From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 1360 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (7 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2587 times:

Quoting CIDflyer (Reply 23):
this year to date has seen increases over the previous year

Thanks for the update. 2004 is an odd abnormally to lose that many pax and regain in 2 years. That's great news for CID, plus it makes sense why F9 would look at that market, I remember the 2004 numbers and went off the 477k.

Do you guys still have the PBR brewery?


25 Rjnut : I would have thought this would have been one of their Q400 initial routes..wouldnt it be within the range and scope of what they want to do with that
26 Alphascan : The ball is in CID's court ...not Frontier's. CID or someone representing The Eastern Iowa Airport's interests must show Frontier the money. Then it
27 CIDflyer : I'm not sure if you are reffering to the airport restaurant, but it does contain a Sam Adams Brew Pub restaurant in the main terminal......now speaki
28 FATFlyer : UAX puts a CR7 on their first run right now, same departure time as Frontier's 319. Frontier did a double-miles promo out of FAT in January. But I'd
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