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What Happened To BA 747 Overstressed Airframe?  
User currently offlineChuchoteur From France, joined Sep 2006, 774 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 14666 times:

I was wondering what happened to the BA 747 that had a cockpit intrusion and rolled 98 degrees (I believe)?

The airframe was substantially overstressed, and possibly not capable of a ferry flight...
curious to know if there are any pics of it being dismantled.

27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineNA From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10817 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 14602 times:

When was that and what type of 747? Never heard anything about such incident.

User currently offlineAussiestu From Australia, joined Mar 2001, 780 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 14535 times:

I seem to remember that the 747-400 that was involved in the Nairobi incident was G-BNLM. (I think)! If it is then its still currently flying for British Airways. I don't actually remember any of BAs 747-400 being removed from service after this incident. Perhaps one of BAs engineers can confirm and explain any tests that would have needed to be done.

User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13252 posts, RR: 77
Reply 3, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 14354 times:

While the intruder event happened, I have never, in years of working in BA Engineering, heard of one of our 747's being retired for any reason, aside from the reason most others airliners are retired.
Except B747-136 G-AWND, stranded in Kuwait as Iraq invaded in 1990, later used as an Iraqi army field latrine, as well as general vandalism before they torched it.
Or any aircraft being 'overstressed', the staff maybe, but not an aircraft!


User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7737 posts, RR: 17
Reply 4, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 14049 times:

BA have purchased 57 744s, G-BNLA to 'LZ (excluding G-BNLQ), G-CIVA to 'CZ (excluding G-CIVQ) and G-BYGA to 'GG. All 57 are still in service.

User currently offlineAirfoilsguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 13968 times:

If you are referring to this one there was no damage.



Date: 29 DEC 2000
Type: Boeing 747-436
Operator: British Airways
Registration:
C/n / msn:
First flight:
Crew: Fatalities: 0 / Occupants: 19
Passengers: Fatalities: 0 / Occupants: 379
Total: Fatalities: 0 / Occupants: 398
Airplane damage: None
Location: Nairobi-Jomo Kenyatta International Airport (NBO) (Kenya)
Phase: En route
Nature: International Scheduled Passenger
Departure airport: London-Heathrow Airport (LHR/EGLL), United Kingdom
Destination airport: Nairobi-Jomo Kenyatta International Airport (NBO/HKNA), Kenya
Narrative:
During the flight, a 27-year old Kenyan man stormed the cockpit of the aircraft and tried to seize the controls of the aircraft. The autopilot was accidentally turned off as the crew struggled with the man and the aircraft lurched and made sudden manoeuvres. With the help of the passengers, the crew members overpowered the offender and regained control of the flight. Upon landing in Nairobi, six passengers were taken to hospital with injuries caused by the aircraft's violent movement.


http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=20001229-1


User currently online9MMPD From Australia, joined Oct 2005, 286 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 12761 times:

Quoting VV701 (Reply 4):
BA have purchased 57 744s, G-BNLA to 'LZ (excluding G-BNLQ), G-CIVA to 'CZ (excluding G-CIVQ) and G-BYGA to 'GG. All 57 are still in service.

I have always wondered what is the reason that there is no G-BNLQ and G-CIVQ?


User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7737 posts, RR: 17
Reply 7, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 12706 times:

Quoting 9MMPD (Reply 6):
I have always wondered what is the reason that there is no G-BNLQ and G-CIVQ?

No British aircraft registration includes the letter 'Q' because of potential confusion with the letter 'O'. However the rest of the world seems to manage all right. Perhaps we Brits are just a shortsighted nation?


User currently offlineJbernie From Australia, joined Jan 2007, 880 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 12323 times:

Quoting VV701 (Reply 7):
Perhaps we Brits are just a shortsighted nation?

or, more cautious and sensible?

Q O and 0 can cause problems...especially if they are not next to each other.


User currently offlineLHR777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 10871 times:

Quoting Chuchoteur (Thread starter):
The airframe was substantially overstressed, and possibly not capable of a ferry flight...
curious to know if there are any pics of it being dismantled.

Are you making a bit of an assumption there, or did you read that somewhere? Source, please?


User currently offlineSevenforeseven From France, joined Nov 2005, 164 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 10848 times:

There you have it GDB. Yes, you BA guys must be stressed not knowing whats going on.

User currently offlineQuetzal From Australia, joined Feb 2007, 141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 8599 times:

I seem to remember that the singer Bryan Ferry was onboard, seated in the upper deck, when this incident happened..... for what it's worth!


No matter how far you push the envelope, it will always remain Stationery.
User currently offlineBeechNut From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 731 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 8299 times:

Quoting VV701 (Reply 7):
No British aircraft registration includes the letter 'Q' because of potential confusion with the letter 'O'. However the rest of the world seems to manage all right. Perhaps we Brits are just a shortsighted nation?

Beats the heck out of me how one can confuse "Quebec" and "Oscar"...

Beech


User currently offlineRichardPrice From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 8273 times:

Quoting BeechNut (Reply 12):
Beats the heck out of me how one can confuse "Quebec" and "Oscar"...

Visually and from a distance, they could be.


User currently offlineBeechNut From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 731 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 7893 times:

LOO

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 13):
Visually and from a distance, they could be.

Yeah but on the radio, one goes by the phonetic alphabet (although airliners use the airline callsign and flight number). Seems to me that the odds of confusion are probably low, the odds of say a G-ABCQ being alongside a G-ABCO on the same field being fairly low especially of both being the same type. As was pointed out, other countries seem to manage OK. I rented a PA28-140 registered C-FAQM for a while before I had my own plane.

Beech


User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13252 posts, RR: 77
Reply 15, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 7122 times:

SevenFourSeven, that will teach me to be flippant I guess!
To the point, no-one I know involved in BA 747 maint, from the shop floor to development Engineers, have ever mentioned anything about airframe overstressing, in this incident or any other.
Even beyond this group, had it happened, it would be well known in the airline and the subject of numerous threads here before now.


User currently offlineAirfoilsguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 7080 times:

There was an incident where a 747 got into a situation where it broke the sound barrier but it wasn't BA.

User currently offlineDavid L From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 9543 posts, RR: 42
Reply 17, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 6853 times:

Quoting Chuchoteur (Thread starter):
possibly not capable of a ferry flight

Aparently it was...

Quoting Quetzal (Reply 11):
I seem to remember that the singer Bryan Ferry was onboard, seated in the upper deck, when this incident happened..... for what it's worth!

Sorry!  duck 


User currently offlineVC10DC10 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1037 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 6683 times:

Quoting Airfoilsguy (Reply 16):
There was an incident where a 747 got into a situation where it broke the sound barrier but it wasn't BA.

What incident was this? Source?

I had been under the impression that the only airliner that was NOT designed to be supersonic to ever fly supersonically in a controlled manner was a DC8-40 in a shallow dive during a test flight before delivery to Canadian Pacific. That was, of course, quite a while ago. Am I wrong?


User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7737 posts, RR: 17
Reply 19, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 6643 times:

Quoting BeechNut (Reply 14):
the odds of say a G-ABCQ being alongside a G-ABCO on the same field being fairly low especially of both being the same type

Not in this case. There is a G-BNLO and a G-CIVO and both are BA 747 436s. If there were a G-BNLQ and/or a G-CIVQ - see Reply 4 - they too would be BA 747 436s. As all 57 of Ba's 747 436s are based at LHR and as most of their fleet fly out from mid morning to early evening and, excepting those on flights to Southern Africa and Australia, mostly return to LHR between early morning and mid afternoon on the following day, the chances of G-BNLO being alongside G-BNLQ or G-CIVO being alongside G-CIVQ at LHR on any particular day are not fairly low but actually quite high.


User currently offlineBeechNut From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 731 posts, RR: 10
Reply 20, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 6608 times:

Yeah but airliners don't go by their civil registration in normal ops. They go by airline callsign and flight number.

Beech


User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6428 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 6565 times:

Quoting VV701 (Reply 7):
No British aircraft registration includes the letter 'Q' because of potential confusion with the letter 'O'. However the rest of the world seems to manage all right. Perhaps we Brits are just a shortsighted nation?

Just as no US civil registration has an "I" (India) or "O" (Oscar) in it (to avoid confusion with the numbers 1 and 0...)  Wink



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineDavid L From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 9543 posts, RR: 42
Reply 22, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 6511 times:

Quoting BeechNut (Reply 20):
Yeah but airliners don't go by their civil registration in normal ops.

But there is some possibility for confusion. It hardly throws UK civil aviation into complete disarray by omitting the letter "Q".  Smile


User currently offlineVV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7737 posts, RR: 17
Reply 23, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 6415 times:

Quoting David L (Reply 22):
But there is some possibility for confusion. It hardly throws UK civil aviation into complete disarray by omitting the letter "Q".

 checkmark 
I guess we could exclude half the alphabet and still survive.  Wink


User currently offlineCOIAHLGW From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 155 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (7 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 6273 times:

Quoting Airfoilsguy (Reply 16):
There was an incident where a 747 got into a situation where it broke the sound barrier but it wasn't BA.

Airfoilsguy - Are you talking about this incident described in this photograph?



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Photo © Andrew Hunt - AirTeamImages




Last aircraft flown, N78008, EI-CSR, EI-DHP, N77014, N78008, EI-CSH, N78002, N68155, N77012, N78017, N19117, N38403
25 Philb : Regarding the use of "Q", the British civil register has omitted it, post 1945, to avoid visual confusion with "O" . Whilst this is not an issue today
26 Post contains links BCAL : As previously stated this was Air China B747SP Registration N4522V flying from TPI-LAX on February 19, 1985 Source here
27 Post contains images David L : I think "Q" and "O" were both omitted from car registration numbers here - not that it changes the gist of your point.
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