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Midwest Airlines (YX) Expansion  
User currently offlineWDBRR From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 612 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 4389 times:

Read today that Midwest Airlines is expanding flights out of MCI.

I suspect this is to show their own shareholders that they are
better off as a "stand alone" company than to merge with Airtran.

where are they getting these extra planes from for all these additional
flights?

27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJBo From Sweden, joined Jan 2005, 2361 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 4362 times:

I imagine some of it comes from the added lift as a result of the SkyWest CRJs coming online on the MKE-MSP and MKE-PHL runs displacing the 717s on those runs.


I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
User currently offlineTSRA From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 218 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 4300 times:

Quoting JBo (Reply 1):
imagine some of it comes from the added lift as a result of the SkyWest CRJs coming online on the MKE-MSP and MKE-PHL runs displacing the 717s on those runs

You are correct. I was a bit surprised to see 3 MCI-BOS flights a day and expected the rest. I still want to know when/where the new city will be announced.


User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5472 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 4292 times:

Oh good grief. Between YX and FL, I need to be active on A.net 24/7 just to keep up. At least so far, they seem to be taking turns jumping into new routes! Phew -- exhausting!

(I'm still hoping for SAN-MKE to finally get started but I know this thread is about KC.)

bb


User currently offlineLuketenley From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 419 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4284 times:

I know PIT will be seeing some CRJ's from YX very soon as well.


Pittsburgh International Airport lover
User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5472 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4272 times:

I finally read the PR here:
http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix....l-newsArticle&ID=969817&highlight=

In a nutshell, eff May 1, YX will increase (with Signature 717 service)
>MCI-BOS from 1 to 3 weekday flights;
>MCI-LAX from 2 to 3 daily flights;
>MCI-MCO from 1 to 2 daily flights; and, saving the best May 1 for last,
>MCI-SAN from 1 to 2 daily flights!
>MCI-SFO, eff. Jun 1, will double to 2 daily flights.

YX's MCI op's will now number 37 weekday flights to 15 destinations. Impressive.
The question has already been asked (and answered) about where all the a/c are coming from. Midwest vs AirTran is sure creating some great new service around this country. Very neat!

(I was still hoping SAN would see MKE this summer but I will now stop complaining.)

bb


User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5929 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 4232 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Midwest Express used to fly the MKE-LAX-SAN-MKE, or something like that, during their somewhat early days.

User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16885 posts, RR: 51
Reply 7, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 4222 times:

EWR-MCI would really open up more opportunities for flyers such as myself in the NY/NJ metro area to fly Midwest.


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineSkyexRamper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 4086 times:

Really the whole new expansion deal is just a crock. The only new city in the midwest network is SEA. All the other new routes are just current routes being beefed up or just connecting already current YX cities, ie: OMA-LAX, MCI-CMH.

User currently offlineJBo From Sweden, joined Jan 2005, 2361 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks ago) and read 4030 times:

Quoting SkyexRamper (Reply 8):
Really the whole new expansion deal is just a crock. The only new city in the midwest network is SEA. All the other new routes are just current routes being beefed up or just connecting already current YX cities, ie: OMA-LAX, MCI-CMH.

Apparently you haven't paid attention to N917ME's posts stating what other new cities are in the works, just not officially announced yet.

I'm also fairly certain that some of this existing expansion is done in part to fend off FL, whose been touting increased frequencies to existing routes if the takeover were to occur. YX is merely showing they can do the same.

If YX weren't fighting off FL, we might see that lift being used for more new cities rather than beefing up current ones. Just my two cents.



I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
User currently offlineMikey711MN From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1400 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (7 years 7 months 4 weeks ago) and read 3989 times:

Quoting SANFan (Reply 5):
In a nutshell, eff May 1, YX will increase (with Signature 717 service)
>MCI-BOS from 1 to 3 weekday flights;
>MCI-LAX from 2 to 3 daily flights;
>MCI-MCO from 1 to 2 daily flights; and, saving the best May 1 for last,
>MCI-SAN from 1 to 2 daily flights!
>MCI-SFO, eff. Jun 1, will double to 2 daily flights.

My initial reaction is that Plan A of MCI expansion, to begin new routes and new cities with SkyWest CRJ's, has been scrapped. That is, with XJet on the scene, beating YX to the punch on many of the speculated thin routes, e.g. RDU, JAX, etc. there just isn't room for two airlines providing RJ service. Thus, beefing up existing routes out of MCI shows expansion, just not with the CRJs.

While I've read N917ME's purported list of cities, it wouldn't surprise me if YX chose to rerun the numbers with competition on those routes. And that we may not see that service after all.

Furthermore, it's not like YX is receiving new aircraft to begin this service, thus they'll need to pull down Signature Service elsewhere in the network to make this work. Because the CRJ's are still coming, I see their primary function as supplanting what used to be YX Signature Service, not for expansion into new cities per se.

With that said, I really wonder what routes will be downgraded to CRJ service as a result of this MCI Signature Service build-up.

-Mike



I plan on living forever. So far, so good...
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6776 posts, RR: 17
Reply 11, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 3979 times:

Quoting Mikey711MN (Reply 10):
That is, with XJet on the scene, beating YX to the punch on many of the speculated thin routes, e.g. RDU, JAX, etc. there just isn't room for two airlines providing RJ service.

YX still has the ability to add flights to the XJet destinations from MKE. Only service from MCI has been populated. But we will see if they are entrenching themselves...



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineKnope2001 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2948 posts, RR: 30
Reply 12, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 3800 times:

Most or all of the expansion mentioned in yesterday's press release comes *without* any additional CRJ replacement. Where does it come from, then? Well a bunch of it comes from 717 lift unspoken for from changes previously announced. As the published May schedule sits right now (3/3/07) for example, the 717 that now does an overnight MCI-PIT / PIT-MCI just sits there. Same with the 717 lift that used to go to SAT. And the aircraft being used for MCI-SEA is as the moment scheduled to do nothing but that one daily trip.

Also look at Florida. The added 2nd MCI-MCO trip is really just the current second daily trip *not* being pulled this year as it was in the past. No new lift needed there. And with MCI-FLL going to 1x/day as it does in the offseason, that' aircraft goes to BOS. Throw in a red-eye or two and very likely covers this added flying without any additional CRJ displacement.

The new markets and changes announced in the past weeks did not show the full picture, and the schedule coming out now includes the full results of those changes.

Make no mistake, there are 12 more CRJ's unspoken for coming online this year, and with them there will almost certainly be some CRJ's in current 717 markets, either to add frequency or perhaps free up more 717 lift for other growth. But much of the new CRJ lift will bring new city pairs, bith new cities and connect-the-dots expansion between existing cities. While a market like MCI-CHM isn't as exciting as, say, MCI-RNO, it does increase efficiency to link existing cities rather than open new ones.

No, yesterday's press release doesn't tell us anything about the plan for the next 12 CRJ's. It's possible that ExpressJet's plans have led Midwest to change a bit of their original Kansas City plan, but probably not wildly.


User currently offlineJibblets From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 41 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3708 times:

Quoting JBo (Reply 1):
I imagine some of it comes from the added lift as a result of the SkyWest CRJs coming online on the MKE-MSP and MKE-PHL runs displacing the 717s on those runs.

Are these routes loaded in the schedule yet? It's been postulated that these are coming, but I'm not sure I've seen anything official about the routes being loaded with CRJs.


User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5472 posts, RR: 12
Reply 14, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3690 times:

Don't forget that in Dec of 2006, YX announced the acquisition of 2 MD-80s "to increase Saver Service from MKE". That takes care of the some of the increases there.

Quoting SkyexRamper (Reply 8):
Really the whole new expansion deal is just a crock.

Remember, Sky', the PR said "6 new cities this year" and DLH was announced on January 3 followed by SEA on January 23. That only leaves 4 to go and it is only March...

Also announced were "at least" 12 new routes in 2007. I count 5 already: MKE-DLH, SEA to KC and MKE, KC-CMH, and LA-OMA. And it's only March...

Plus they've done a pile of frequency and equipment upgrades (I've counted 16 "service improvements" so far.) Yes, and it's only March...

Considering their equipment situation, I think YX is doing a wonderful job of growing. I also feel they are kind of fighting for their life (with FL nipping at their heels) so that could be a darned effective incentive!

Go Midwest!

bb


User currently offlineKnope2001 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2948 posts, RR: 30
Reply 15, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3686 times:

The new schedule is apparently going to be loaded overnight and available for sale tomorrow (3/4).

User currently offlineAustinAirport From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 643 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3670 times:

What about Austin. Anybody Know.


Whoever said you can do anything you set your mind to has obviously never tried to slam a revolving door!!!
User currently offlineKnope2001 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2948 posts, RR: 30
Reply 17, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3633 times:

Personally I think MCI-AUS is very likely with CRJ in splite of ExpressJet in the next six months or so.

User currently offlineWDBRR From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 612 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 3474 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):
EWR-MCI would really open up more opportunities for flyers such as myself in the NY/NJ metro area to fly Midwest.

I totally agree, I am sure they can fit one or two EWR-MCI flights
a day to meet a bank going west. I wonder if their MCI hub is
almost as big as when Eastern or Braniff had a hub 20 years ago.
Strange how two airlines competed head on in MCI and now they
are both gone. hope it's not a sign of things yet to come.


User currently offlineSkyexramper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 3386 times:

Quoting SANFan (Reply 14):
and DLH was announced

Oh yeah...DLH...yippe...how could I forget DLH!?!??! Oh wait, because it's DLH.


User currently offlineKrsw757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 112 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3221 times:

I know RSW-MCI will remain year round this year instead of being seasonal.

User currently offlineAccess-Air From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 1939 posts, RR: 13
Reply 21, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2966 times:

Quoting WDBRR (Reply 18):
I wonder if their MCI hub is
almost as big as when Eastern or Braniff had a hub 20 years ago.
Strange how two airlines competed head on in MCI and now they
are both gone. hope it's not a sign of things yet to come.

This is probably why Midwest should NOT rely too heavily on Kansas City as a hub......Dont forget USair also tried it and failed.....As long as Midwest doesnt go crazy in Kansas City and they serve only the main cities they should be fine...However, should they try to turn it into a fortress hub then I think they will fail.....

Access-Air



Remember, Wherever you go, there you are!!!!
User currently offlineKnope2001 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2948 posts, RR: 30
Reply 22, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2928 times:

Looks like no red-eyes from the west coast, although a couple of the flights run pretty late into the PM. All three MKE-DEN flights are being upped to M80's, and MKE-MCO is also running 3x/day M80 with the new schedule. MKE-FLL goes to 717.

The added M80 trips are coming from the two M80's coming out of seasonal Milwaukee-Florida service. Neither are the two added M80 aircraft....those are still to come, the first of which will do MKE-SEA-MKE-LAX-MKE in summer.

No additional CRJ routes or substitutions yet with this schedule.


User currently offlineKnope2001 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2948 posts, RR: 30
Reply 23, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 2897 times:

Looks like no red-eyes from the west coast, although a couple of the flights run pretty late into the PM. All three MKE-DEN flights are being upped to M80's, and MKE-MCO is also running 3x/day M80 with the new schedule. MKE-FLL goes to 717.

The added M80 trips are coming from the two M80's coming out of seasonal Milwaukee-Florida service. Neither are the two added M80 aircraft....those are still to come, the first of which will do MKE-SEA-MKE-LAX-MKE in summer.

No additional CRJ routes or substitutions yet with this schedule.


User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5472 posts, RR: 12
Reply 24, posted (7 years 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting Skyexramper (Reply 19):
Oh yeah...DLH...yippe...how could I forget DLH!?!??! Oh wait, because it's DLH.

Sorry they haven't announced Heathrow or O'Hare, Sky', but Duluth IS in fact a new city for Midwest; I'm almost positive they didn't announce minimum population requirements for the 6 new cities!

Quoting Knope2001 (Reply 22):
Neither are the two added M80 aircraft....those are still to come, the first of which will do MKE-SEA-MKE-LAX-MKE in summer.

So, what, maybe SAN will still see a MKE flight added this summer? I'm sure we will continue to see more announcements from Midwest in the next few weeks. (And, I bet, from FL as well!)

May I also add that I like the way YX seems to "take care of their own", i.e., they seem to make efforts, unlike some carriers (e.g. that one back east with blue plaid tails), to grow existing cities by connecting the dots and increasing frequencies, rather than just adding new stations. For example, instead of adding SEA (new city) to MKE and some other new city like SLC, PDX or ABQ to MKE, they then add another SEA route (to KC). Another example, SAN service is doubled in the summer rather than spreading things very thin over more cities. (I know that it is easy for me to say this since my city has increased service while many other cities have no service at all. It's all about perspective...)

bb


25 TSRA : Those crazy kids in the cookie place can not make up their minds can they? The last May schedule I saw (a couple of weeks ago) showed the SEA flight
26 N917ME : Expansion is more than just new cities, expansion is also increased frequency, connecting MCI to the rest of the network. YX is doing a great job at
27 TSRA : You tease!!! haha
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