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Continental And The 747-8?  
User currently offlineCX747 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 4454 posts, RR: 5
Posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11513 times:

Over the past decade, Continental has expanded its international services dramatically. I know that they "maximize" the potential of their aircraft ala 757s across the pond. With that being said, what is the chances of CO ordering several 747-8s for their growing Pacific Rim operations? Surely they could use the increased lift to HKG?


"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePC12Fan From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 2457 posts, RR: 5
Reply 1, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11504 times:

Not gonna happen. As much as I'd love to see it, the closest to this they will get to this is the 777-300ER. Which I think is very probable under the right conditions.


Just when I think you've said the stupidest thing ever, you keep talkin'!
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11489 times:

Why add another fleet type. They got rid of the 747s they have to reduce the fleet. Why not add 777s. They already have them, and they have the legs.

CO will continue to play it smart in their fleet structure, I don't see any 747s in their future.


User currently onlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31250 posts, RR: 85
Reply 3, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11400 times:
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Agreed that it is not going to happen. They will stay with the 777-200ER and (eventually) 787-10 as their top end, putting frequency over raw capacity.

User currently offlineCOSPN From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Oct 2001, 1643 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10862 times:

no 747's for CO Been there done that...Only place CO could use them are EWR- India Asia/ TLV CO will never get a plane that cant be used system wide. EWR/IAH - Europe/ S. America

User currently offlineAcidradio From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 1874 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 10794 times:
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The problem is that the 748 could only be used on a handful of CO routes, which makes it rather inflexible. The 777 (and the 787 soon), while not 100% perfect for every mission, definately gets the job done and has lots of flexibility for CO.

Some airlines have very specialized fleets for specific markets - as an example, NW with their separate trans-Pacific and trans-Atlantic fleets. Nowadays, the 747s are all dedicated for flights to NRT, while all the AMS work is done with the 333 and 332. OK, there are the west coast-NRT flights on the 332 as well, but what I'm getting at is the fact that the 777, which CO uses regularly for both trans-Atlantic and trans-Pacific runs was deemed by NW to be too heavy for its trans-Atlantic runs. The 777 would have been a nice trans-Pacific machine for NW too, but NW was intent on buying it with PW engines, which did not offer the economics that they were looking for. Somewhere, CO decided that the flexibility of using the 777 for just about everything outweighed any additional weight penalty.

And for most US airlines, unless there is a real big Asian presence (ala NW and UA), the 748 is not real practical. 300-seat and less aircraft have proven to be the most practical options for most US operators doing international service, as US airlines tend to rely more on frequency of service than operators in other parts of the world. This is why NW and UA are the only US-based 747 operators left, and that nobody in the US has bought a pax version 380 yet.

CO is really placing a lot of it's future international expansion plans on the 787. No, not nearly as big as the 748, but it will offer the size and range that CO is looking for.



Ich haben zwei Platzspielen und ein Microphone
User currently offlineMX757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 628 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 10559 times:

Quoting PC12Fan (Reply 1):
Not gonna happen. As much as I'd love to see it, the closest to this they will get to this is the 777-300ER. Which I think is very probable under the right conditions.

 checkmark 



Is it broke...? Yeah I'll fix it.
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16892 posts, RR: 51
Reply 7, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 10558 times:

CO likes to add stretch models to existing lines rather than add new types.

737-500, 737-300, 737-700, 737-800, 737-900, 737-900ER

757-200, 757-300

767-200, 767-400

777-200ER, 777-300ER

The 777-300ER is a natural extension of their fleet plan, keep the commanality with existing aircraft while growing capacity.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineTristarfreak From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 125 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 10147 times:

I wouldn't expect to see the 747-8 with CO anytime soon more like he 773 like everyone said above

User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21562 posts, RR: 59
Reply 9, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days ago) and read 9570 times:

The closest CO will come to a 748 is when one of their jets taxies past an LH 748 parked at IAH Terminal D.


Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineLostmoon744 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 176 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 9140 times:

Anyone know when CO expects their first 787?
Thanks
Lostmoon744


User currently offlineMush From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 97 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 8200 times:

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 9):
The closest CO will come to a 748 is when one of their jets taxies past an LH 748 parked at IAH Terminal D.

Or when they taxi past a British Airways 748 at Heathrow  Wink

P.S. Before you say I don't know what I'm talking about please notice the wink.



Sprung from cages out on highway 9
User currently offlineMEACEDAR From Lebanon, joined Oct 2006, 753 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 8200 times:

What about the A350 for CO? I know they usually go with Boeing, but it would be nice to see CO livery on a Airbus.

Oh, by the way, the 748 and CO just don't work!!! Either stick with the 777 or go with the A350 or possibly the A330.


User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 8096 times:

Quoting MEACEDAR (Reply 12):
What about the A350 for CO? I

CO is as Boeing airline. They ordered the 787. Why would they buy a 350? Make no sense at all.


User currently offlineSkyyMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7672 times:

Quoting MEACEDAR (Reply 12):
What about the A350 for CO? I know they usually go with Boeing, but it would be nice to see CO livery on a Airbus.

Even less likely than the 747-8. CO and Boeing are joined at the hip and that's not likely to change.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16892 posts, RR: 51
Reply 15, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 7079 times:

Quoting Lostmoon744 (Reply 10):
Anyone know when CO expects their first 787?

2009.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineRampart From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 3152 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6915 times:

Quoting MEACEDAR (Reply 12):
What about the A350 for CO? I know they usually go with Boeing, but it would be nice to see CO livery on a Airbus.

Oh, by the way, the 748 and CO just don't work!!! Either stick with the 777 or go with the A350 or possibly the A330.

Do a search in the database to find pictures of CO A300s in the old ("red meatball") and new (blue globe graticule) colors. Also, if you are lucky, you can also locate some drawings of CO's A340 they ordered prior to their last bankruptcy but then cancelled before taking delivery when Bethune was CEO. I have a picture of a CO A340 in one of my books, and I think some of the scale die-cast manufacturers offered them for a time.

Other than that, no chance of Airbus in CO fleet in the foreseeable future, barring merger or acquisition of another airline. IMHO.

-Rampart

Edited: I corrected myself above. I didn't know the A300s also existed in the new color scheme.

[Edited 2007-03-05 21:03:00]

User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4531 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6773 times:

Quoting COSPN (Reply 4):
CO will never get a plane that cant be used system wide

 checkmark 

And this is why CO has the highest aircraft utilization rates out of all the legacy carriers. They don't operate niche aircraft, and they don't have 2-3 different sub-configurations for their fleet types. It's not terribly exciting, but it makes money.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 9):
The closest CO will come to a 748 is when one of their jets taxies past an LH 748 parked at IAH Terminal D.

Can't wait to see one of those new LH 747's parked at IAH... Maybe if KLM and BA order, we can see 3!

Quoting Lostmoon744 (Reply 10):
Anyone know when CO expects their first 787?

They get 3 in 2009. Not sure exactly when in 2009, but I'd guess in the 3rd or 4th quarter.

CO could only make the 748 work on these routes EWR to India, China, Hong Kong, Tel Aviv, and Heathrow (presuming the new EU-US open skies agreement goes through and CO buys LHR slots). IAH-LHR and IAH-NRT could work as well. HOWEVER, this isn't going to happen. If CO needs bigger aircraft, the 773ER is the logical step as it maintains commonality with the 772ER. I think however that even adding the 773 is unlikely for now. If the 787's tap into some new markets in Asia that are cash cows, then I could see CO logically operating a few 773's, but not any time soon.


User currently offlineLostmoon744 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 176 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 6528 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 15):
Quoting Lostmoon744 (Reply 10):
Anyone know when CO expects their first 787?

2009.

Thank you for the reply. Looking forward to flying in them in the coming years.
Lostmoon744


User currently offlineHighFlyer9790 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 1241 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5834 times:

Quoting PC12Fan (Reply 1):
Not gonna happen. As much as I'd love to see it, the closest to this they will get to this is the 777-300ER. Which I think is very probable under the right conditions.

 checkmark 



121
User currently offlineDampfnudel From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 93 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 5582 times:

Quoting Mush (Reply 11):
Or when they taxi past a British Airways 748 at Heathrow Wink

P.S. Before you say I don't know what I'm talking about please notice the wink.

That may actually happen. You never know.


User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9262 posts, RR: 21
Reply 21, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5447 times:

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 9):
The closest CO will come to a 748 is when one of their jets taxies past an LH 748 parked at IAH Terminal D.



Quoting Mush (Reply 11):
Or when they taxi past a British Airways 748 at Heathrow

D'OH! I was going to say that!

Still, good remarks though.

How about the closest they'll ever get to ANY 747s is when one of their aircraft passes by any 747s, whether they be BA, LH, VS, CX, what have you... Big grin



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineLemurs From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1439 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5179 times:

CO adds capacity to their routes by adding frequencies with smaller aircraft, and then as demand increases, increasing the size of that 2nd flight until it demands another 777...if the demand is still there, they'll add a 3rd frequency. Their target customer is the business traveler who values schedule convenience over anything, all other things being equal. The best way to appeal to that traveler is by having more flights, not bigger aircraft. The more scheduled flights they can offer to a popular city pair, the happier CO is. That's why you're unlikely to ever see anything bigger than a 772 or 787-10 in their fleet as long as their current (working) strategy is in place.

They'll keep growing, but with more medium sized airframes, not bigger airframes.



There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary, and those that don't.
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21562 posts, RR: 59
Reply 23, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4920 times:

Of course if they merge with UA or NW, all bets are off...  Wink


Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineSteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9262 posts, RR: 21
Reply 24, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4907 times:

Quoting Lemurs (Reply 22):
CO adds capacity to their routes by adding frequencies with smaller aircraft, and then as demand increases, increasing the size of that 2nd flight until it demands another 777...if the demand is still there, they'll add a 3rd frequency. Their target customer is the business traveler who values schedule convenience over anything, all other things being equal. The best way to appeal to that traveler is by having more flights, not bigger aircraft. The more scheduled flights they can offer to a popular city pair, the happier CO is. That's why you're unlikely to ever see anything bigger than a 772 or 787-10 in their fleet as long as their current (working) strategy is in place.

They'll keep growing, but with more medium sized airframes, not bigger airframes.

I think that's a rather smart way of growing internationally, as well as domestic, as opposed of buying large aircraft and throwing them onto routes you really don't know how they'll function/perform. Those larger aircraft typically mean higher costs/mx/etc... especially the 747. Granted the 748 is supposed to be less expensive than the 744, but I don't see it at all in CO's business approach...

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 23):
Of course if they merge with UA or NW, all bets are off...

oh good one...



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
25 Toxtethogrady : Yeah, but they take that philosophy to ridiculous lengths... using 8 RJ's a day between IAH and Nashville, for example. There's a limit to how many b
26 Post contains images N1120A : Sure, they got those from Eastern and it was way before a former Boeing executive saved the airline from what Frank Lorenzo did to it. Over 1300 buil
27 Lemurs : True...and they're scaling back on that quite a bit. They've been growing their 737 fleet and trimming the RJ fleet for a few years now, and that tre
28 Steeler83 : Isn't CO going to use those for CLE expansion?
29 Cba : I wasn't saying that the 747 is a niche aircraft. In Continental's fleet however, it would be a niche aircraft for only a select few routes that coul
30 DAYflyer : I would love to see a 747-8 in CO colors, but Gordon said it best: CO has no need for a plane bigger than the 777-200. He said this in an interview wh
31 CALMSP : would be nice a/c on our new route coming up this year!!!!
32 IAHFLYER : Any hints, or when we can expect an anouncement????????? My guess is to Europe somewhere from IAH, I hope!!!
33 N1120A : I tend to agree, though I do believe that CO could get a fair amount of value out of the aircraft. Markets like LGW could well be made more profitabl
34 Post contains images CALMSP : IAHFLYER............you and i could only dream............unfortunately our dreams are not going to happen
35 Glareskin : And this will be signed the day that US is taking over DL....
36 IAHFLYER : I hope CO's new route is from CLE to Europe!!![Edited 2007-03-07 02:33:47]
37 CALMSP : DAYflyer.......there are a number of routes that a 777-300 warrants......HNL/GUM/DEL to name a few.
38 Post contains images Ikramerica : Yep, it's going to be a 748 CLE-MUN...
39 FUN2FLY : What's the downside risk of a 6-8 aircraft subfleet of 777-300er's for CO? Certainly could sublease these easily if they don't work out. Surely could
40 Post contains images N1120A : Would be interesting to see a 748I get off the 6890' runway at MUN Well, cost is one thing. The 77W is currently the most expensive aircraft in activ
41 Toxtethogrady : It's also a matter of time before they end up with 70- and 90-seat aircraft. Er, jets. They've got a huge void between the seat capacity of the E145
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