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When Will The US See The 777-300?  
User currently offlineUAL747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3499 times:

I was wondering when US airports will start to see this beautiful aircraft. I saw my first -300 in Hong Kong this summer. With the ER version on its way, do you expect the US to be getting some visits? Or possibly any US airlines buying the -300ER?

31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
User currently offlineJderden777 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 1763 posts, RR: 25
Reply 1, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 3419 times:

i don't know exactly when but i've heard rumors and talk on this forum about UAL and Delta buying 777-300s..i don't know whether this is true or not...but yes, the 773 is a beautiful aircraft, and it's HUGE!!!   i saw one 2 years ago (july 1999) at Boeing Field...it was in Boeing's house colors. no pictures though  , i just happened to be driving by...


"my soul is in the sky" - shakespeare
User currently offlineKaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 13265 posts, RR: 34
Reply 2, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 3405 times:

I'd say the most likely in the short term is Korean Air, which currently operates 773s to Sydney (i.e. it could make the transpacific trip) and it currently flies 772s to Toronto and SF.

In the long term, 2 European carriers - AF and AZ - will definitely bring there aircraft across the Atlantic; BA and KLM are likely 777 customers, so expect to see them too. JAL and ANA will more than likely get 773LRs as well, so expect to see them flying over here.

As for US carriers, I'd expect to see United at least go the full length and American and CO would probably follow suit, not sure about Delta - but wishful thinking hasn't ever been a problem for me!

User currently offlineMEL From Canada, joined Oct 1999, 1109 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3375 times:

Probably when airlines like ANA start using the 773ERs on routes from NRT to places like ORD or SFO. Also, we may see AF use their 773s on routes to JFK/EWR, when they arrive.

NO URLS in signature
User currently offlineSoku39 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 1797 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3351 times:

Im hoping to see AA UAL order a few of the -300 to add to there growing fleet of -200. Those are the two I would prabably guess and maybe Delta and CO

The Ohio Player
User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4534 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3334 times:

UAL will most likely order them. DL and AA will probably order the 777-300ER for their higher capacity asian routes. CO may eventually order it, but they don't need its capacity right now. They will most likely order -200LRs to expand into Asia from EWR and IAH.

User currently offlineBlink182 From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 5499 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 3321 times:

You can see it in the US this minute(go to boeing field where they are being built!)  I think AA and UA may be the first US operators to fly it, I think the first service will be AF or an asian airline.

Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
User currently offlineTEDSKI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3284 times:

With the exclusive engine deal with GE to have only the GE90 on the new 777-300ER model, I don't see current RR Trent and P&W 777 operators like United and American in the future purchasing this aircraft. Don't be surprised if they go to Airbus and select the A330-200/300 and A340-500/600 with P&W and RR Trent engines.

User currently offlineCactusa319 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 2918 posts, RR: 23
Reply 8, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3275 times:

My bet is that we'll see AF's 773's here first, probably at EWR or one of the Northeast destinations. Korean could also be a possability.

User currently offlineMr.BA From Singapore, joined Sep 2000, 3423 posts, RR: 20
Reply 9, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3263 times:

I think Korean Air will fly their B777-300s... to SFO/LAX in the future...


Boeing747 万岁!
User currently offlineAhlfors From Canada, joined Oct 2000, 1347 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3268 times:

Sorry, but AirTran has not announced any plans to buy a 777 and I highly doubt they will. They will fly the 717 to Grand Bahama Island.

User currently offlineUAL747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3252 times:

Tedski, I highly doubt either UA or AA will ever go for the A330, or A340. UA was the launch customer for the 777, and I highly doubt that they will be switching and entire aircraft type, merely for the engines.They have too much of a stake in the 777, owning the worlds largest fleet of them, to go adding a whole new type of aircraft. It would be more costly to switch aircraft than service different engines. You have to have different maintenance equipment, different maintenence training, different flight training, different facilities. It changes too many things to change aircraft.

Yes, AA did put up a fuss about the 777LR and its GE engines, but I will bet you money they will go for the 777LR. If I recal correctly, BA was an all RR airline, but they were the launch customer for the GE engines on the 777.

User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7906 posts, RR: 14
Reply 12, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3242 times:

I really believe it will be a long time before we see any US airline flying a 773 in their colors. They simply don't need the capacity. AA runs their 777s in the thinnest config of them all. If they needed the capacity they fit more than 240 seats in them. UA is the only airline that could use the capacity, but then they have 44 747-400s should they need 100 extra seats on a plane.

Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineN-156F From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3240 times:

I don't think any American airlines will go for the B777-300 for some time, as none of them are huge users of GE engines, and most seem very happy with the B777-200.
AF will likely start flying them to the U.S., as will Korean. They'll get here, it's just a matter of time.

User currently offlineTEDSKI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3230 times:

British Airways was indeed the launch customer for the GE90 on the 777, but on their last batch of 777-200ERs they ordered from Boeing, they went for the RR Trent 800 series. In another forum so time ago, someone said an engineer from BA stated that the GE90 was a poorly designed engine with many problems.

User currently offlineUAL747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3224 times:

That really is irrelevant to the topic. The point I was trying to make was that BA selected their 777 fleet at first with GE90s, not RR. Thus, it shows that the engine isn't the most important thing when choosing an aircraft. BA had a large fleet of Boeing widebodies; hence, it wanted to stay with Boeing for widebodies. They chose the aircraft with GE engines for some reason, showing that engine commonality may not be as important as you think it is and that similar aircraft type is important. This is why AA and UA might chose the 777-300ER with GE engines as well. Again, UA and especially AA will not go Airbus. I'll bet you money on it.

User currently offlineKiwi dave From New Zealand, joined Aug 2000, 895 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days ago) and read 3183 times:

If Air New Zealand were to get any from Singapore the west coast of the USA would see them as Air New Zealand would fly them thru the pacific island to the USA.

User currently offlineRed Panda From Hong Kong, joined Jun 2000, 1521 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 3 days ago) and read 3180 times:

I can see that there is market for 773 in N. America. Most trans-alantic routes now being flown by 742 can be run by 773 too since 742 and 773 has similar pax capacity and range. 773 is a good a/c to replace older 742 flying tans-alantic routes.

Best Regards  ,
R Panda

User currently offlineAFa340-300E From France, joined May 1999, 2084 posts, RR: 25
Reply 18, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3174 times:


Engines and commonalty

One precision first: BA chose to the Rolls-Royce Trent 895 as powerplant for its latest 777-200ERs not for the fun of switching from aircraft manufacturer.
The GE90 has had some troubles during its earliest operations, but that's not the reason why BA switched - and AZ, CO, AF, ... haven't reported any troble AFAIK.

- In fact BA switched orders from R.B211-powered 747-400s to 777s. The options selected was to convert the RB.211 order into a Trent 800 one. Otherwise the airline would have lost most of its funds already placed for the RR orders.

- Also, British Airways had been requiring an engine with a thrust over 92,000lb, what GE refused to do - but eventually did with the GE90-94B.

- In the 1990s, when BA ordered the GE90, this made a huge wave of protest in the UK. With Richard Branson pushing with his European Airbuses (he had first thought about ordering 8 Boeing 777s), BA found this as a good opportunity to move in the "good direction" ("good" according to the general opinion).

Even if the engine commonalty isn't as important as the airframe commonalty for many reasons (crew management, type rating, ...) it remains an important factor. But it also based on the performance achived by the engine for the particular mission.

So, to be clear, it's nonsense to say United Airlines' fleet plans will be affected as some people say because of the sole supplier deal with General Electric Aircraft Engines.

Best regards,
Alain Mengus

User currently offlineRaggi From Norway, joined Oct 2000, 1008 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 3165 times:

some said that AA was not a major customer of GE engines ..how about 35 A300s and 60-70 767s, all remaing MD11s and DC10s, all powered by the GE CF6..
Eventually AA ( and UA ) will by GE powered 777s. just wait and see..

Stick & Rudder
User currently offlineRayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 8360 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3152 times:

Here's the question: how long is the exclusive deal with Boeing for the GE90-115B engines on the 777LR's?

My guess is that once GE's deal runs out both AA and UA may start ordering the 777LR. That means we may eventually see 777-300ER's powered by 115,000 to 120,000 lb. versions of the PW4100 and Rolls-Royce Trent engines. Both airlines can use the capacity since AA's routes to South America and UA's routes to Asia tend to be extremely busy.

By the way, there may be a wildcard equation in all this: Northwest. If NW is willing to upgrade their maintainance procedures to ETOPS standards, they could end up buying the 777-300ER to replace their 747-200 fleet. That means NW may start flying the 773ER from SEA, SFO, MSP and DTW to Asian destinations. And there won't be worries about engines since NW already has the facilities to work on GE engines thanks to their DC-10 fleet.

User currently offlineNa From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 11584 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3138 times:

The 777-300 a beautiful aircraft? - I think that is really a matter of taste. Though I like the B777-200, the 773 looks ugly to me. Is there a more ugly widebody aircraft than the 773? Not one comes to my mind. Completely out of proportion. Imagine Naomi Campbell more than 7 feet tall.
Anyway, I don´t give thiy aircraft a big chance in the US.
Why? UA and NW seem to be the only airlines to need aircraft bigger than a 772. They both have rather big 747-400 fleets that don´t need to be replaced this decade. And when the first 744s get old by 2010, airlines will have the choice between different 747X-versions and the A3XX then, both likely to have even or even better seatmile-costs than the B773. Traffic will be far higher by the end of this decade so its also more likely that airlines that need 744s now will most likely upgrade to the new Superjumbos than downgrade to a 773 then.
AA, Delta and Continental could be candidates, but I also think that there´s hardly demand for them in the next years. And after that maybe the 747X is a better candidate if they need some flagship aircraft.

User currently offlineTEDSKI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3131 times:

The only thing that bothers me about the GE90 engine is that the fan blades are made with composites with titanium edges vs. all titanium on P&W and RR engines. Will these fan blades be durable enough to take any kind of ingestion of objects like metal, ice, or birds and the added thrust of close to 115,000lbs required for the new 777X models?

User currently offlineTupolev154B2 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1332 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 3117 times:

What about AA's Rolls-powered 757's? There isn't a GE version of the engine for that aircraft.

User currently offlineAFa340-300E From France, joined May 1999, 2084 posts, RR: 25
Reply 24, posted (15 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 3115 times:


RayChuang: There's one little detail you forgot to add in your analysis:

General Electric has no reason to scrap its sole supplier agreement with Boeing for powerplant of any 777 above 318 tonnes.
That would be a total nonsense for GE to invest in a product because they gained the contract and drop it in favor of their competitors.

So it is totally useless to speculate on RR and PW-powered 777LRs.

Best regards,
Alain Mengus

25 UAL747 : Na, The A310 has to be the ugliest widebody, second being the A300. But, like you said, it's a matter of taste. I think the 777-300 is beautiful!!!!!!
26 Louis : If anyone wants to see a real dog, check out the A346. Ewwwww! I'd be embarassed to be inside one of those things!
27 RayChuang : Alain Oh, that depends on what AA and UA wants. If AA and UA says they will buy 40 777-300ER's each but AA wants the Rolls-Royce Trent "8120" and UA w
28 UAL747 : If Boeing "decides to listen" won't that be in violation of the contract with GE? Or would the benefits outweigh the costs in this situation? Also, wh
29 Chiawei : With GE's exclusive status on the 777LR and ER. I doubted that there would a market for it for N.A customers. United operates nearly all PW engines. I
30 TEDSKI : All of Delta's 777-200ERs are powered by RR Trent 800 series engines. The only American carrier that might order the 777-300ER is Continental, who has
31 Post contains images Danny : I don't know, but think that the 773 would look good in UAL colors.
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