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DHL Order 6 767-300ERF  
User currently offlineNavion From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1010 posts, RR: 1
Posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11715 times:

Here's the link to the story from Reuters. Was this expected? The 767 ball just keeps on rolling!!!

https://www.etrade.wallst.com/v1/stocks/news/news_story.asp?docKey=354-WEN5230-41G29TD5C6IFKOVBMTS2C2D5E9&DMSourceID=RTRIDS&Source=Reuters&docDate=2007-03-08%2013:21:00&headline=Boeing%20says%20DHL%20orders%20six%20freighter%20aircraft&refSymbols=|US;BA|&

[Edited 2007-03-08 16:00:33]

81 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 23
Reply 1, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11622 times:

That's a first for DHL, a nice amount of aircraft (again an order for 6 freighters) but given the size of DHL a rather small order. Orders appear to be accounted for on Boeing's website. I assume last weeks unidentified order for 6 767's

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070308/bs_nm/boeing_dhl_dc_1



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User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 961 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11565 times:

Well how about that?  eyebrow 

Crafty ole' Bassler surely had some idea this was coming before he published his latest blog about the recent momentum in the 767 family.


User currently offlineCV580Freak From Bahrain, joined Jul 2005, 1033 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11554 times:

New aircraft order, now that's a first for DHL .....


One day you are the pigeon, the next the statue ...
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11555 times:

I take it these will be for their european operation, eh?


Good goes around!
User currently offlineFlyorski From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 987 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11532 times:

Is the first time DHL has ordered new, rather than used?


"None are more hopelessly enslaved, than those who falsly believe they are free" -Goethe
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11518 times:

Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 4):
I take it these will be for their european operation, eh?

Oops, I guess I should read further. It says it's for the US operation. Do you suppose these will go to ABX Air, or do you think they will go to replace Astar's aging fleet of A300's? Interesting question, seeing as DHL doesn't own either.

Quoting Flyorski (Reply 5):
Is the first time DHL has ordered new, rather than used?

I think some of the DHL 757's in europe were new order aircraft. But I'm not 100% positive on that.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12128 posts, RR: 52
Reply 7, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11497 times:

Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 4):
I take it these will be for their european operation, eh?

I would guess transatlantic, between Europe ant the US, as well as between the middleeast and Europe.

Quoting Flyorski (Reply 5):
Is the first time DHL has ordered new, rather than used?

I believe it is. Hmmm, big yellow B-767-300ERFs.


User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2490 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11497 times:

Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 6):
It says it's for the US operation

I didn't think they were allowed under law to operate aircraft within the US.


User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 23
Reply 9, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11474 times:

Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 6):
I think some of the DHL 757's in europe were new order aircraft. But I'm not 100% positive on that.

Most (perhaps all) 757's DHL has in Europe are ex BA aircraft.

Quoting Flyorski (Reply 5):
Is the first time DHL has ordered new, rather than used?

I'm not 100% on this one, but I believe it is.



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User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11446 times:

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 8):
I didn't think they were allowed under law to operate aircraft within the US.

They can't. It would have to be operated by one of their two contract carriers here. Of course, they could always have their european carriers fly it on Trans-atlantic flights.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineOsiris30 From Barbados, joined Sep 2006, 3192 posts, RR: 26
Reply 11, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11425 times:

You know I was wondering... Are Boeing selling these freighters to keep the line open for the tanker, or have they already been told they pretty much have the tanker deal and are actively selling filler slots on the line?

Boeing has moved an impressive number of 767s in the last little while and I doubt all of them were needed to keep the line open for the tanker project. Personally I think they've already been told the deal is pretty much theirs. I'm sure Putin's posturing hasn't helped the 330 tanker bid.



I don't care what you think of my opinion. It's my opinion, so have a nice day :)
User currently offlineLifelinerOne From Netherlands, joined Nov 2003, 1916 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11353 times:

Quoting Osiris30 (Reply 11):
You know I was wondering... Are Boeing selling these freighters to keep the line open for the tanker, or have they already been told they pretty much have the tanker deal and are actively selling filler slots on the line?

If that's the case, it would eventually leak out and it would mean that the whole process will be restarted once again because Northrop Grumman would be kicking, screaming and probably deliver a law suit at Congress' doors.

I think Boeing has an advantage with the B767F because it's available on rather short notice and, because they need to keep the line open, probably offer good discounts for the potential customers involved.

Hamlet already said that this order would be a surprise and a surprise it is! I've never expected DHL to order new planes, as they were big fans of reconfiguring old passenger planes. Would be an awesome sight, those yellow planes!

Cheers!  wave 



Only Those Who Sleep Don't Make Mistakes
User currently offlineCV580Freak From Bahrain, joined Jul 2005, 1033 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11352 times:

I'm not too sure if these would operate within Europe as they have their B757's and A300's covering the major trunk routes and the transatlantic routes are operated by MD11's either jointly with LH or leased in from Gemini.

There are also plans to expand their Latin American operations so maybe they'll operate to/from there.

It really depends who actually purchased these aircraft, ie was it the DHL group direct or their contracted operators ABX or Astar ?.



One day you are the pigeon, the next the statue ...
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 961 posts, RR: 51
Reply 14, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11193 times:

Quoting Osiris30 (Reply 11):
You know I was wondering... Are Boeing selling these freighters to keep the line open for the tanker, or have they already been told they pretty much have the tanker deal and are actively selling filler slots on the line?

I think they are selling 767F because it is a very capable freighter and one of the only widebody aircraft in the world with near-term availability.

Quoting LifelinerOne (Reply 12):
I think Boeing has an advantage with the B767F because it's available on rather short notice and, because they need to keep the line open, probably offer good discounts for the potential customers involved.

Even with discounts, orders like these toward the end of the production life can be some of the most profitable....


User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 38
Reply 15, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11151 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 14):
I think they are selling 767F because it is a very capable freighter and one of the only widebody aircraft in the world with near-term availability.

I think early during its life as a jet it was more popular than the competition as a passenger jet, so Boeing demanded a premium that freight carriers less willing to pay, so those carriers went with the A300. Now with passenger airline orders significantly reduced, Boeing is willing to be more aggressive with pricing, and they can afford to given the 767 family is paid for. It also helps that Airbus no longer is advantaged by extremely weak European currencies and that the A300 line is be closed down.



ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21474 posts, RR: 60
Reply 16, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11099 times:

Also, Airbus closed down the A300F line, the competition. Companies may have been waiting to see what the A330F was like, and now they are making their choice between the two. Some are choosing the A330F, others the 767F, some will choose both...


Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineBrowntailWhale From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 11019 times:

All of you so called "experts" have conveniently left out the one US airline that DHL own 49% of ...... Polar.

User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 10921 times:

Quoting BrowntailWhale (Reply 17):
All of you so called "experts" have conveniently left out the one US airline that DHL own 49% of ...... Polar

I thought of it, but I wasn't sure if DHL had hashed out the actual flying agreement with Polar yet. I guess it's always possible that these will go to them. I think it's also possible that these may go to Astar to replace the A300 aircraft, seeing as Astar has six or seven A300 aircraft and this order is for 6 767 aircraft.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineERAUgrad02 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 1227 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 10764 times:

Well the new order is def. listed now as DHL...

http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/

I wonder who the other 3 will be for? Also would Boeing make a 767 BBJ? Based of the new model 767-200LR.



Desmond MacRae in ILM
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7057 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 10680 times:

Cool I recently heard rumors that DHL wants to expand and will place an order for 767 because of commonality with their 757s.


It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 10654 times:

Quoting Columba (Reply 20):
Cool I recently heard rumors that DHL wants to expand and will place an order for 767 because of commonality with their 757s.

Yeah, I remember hearing that on this forum a few months back that they were considering replacing some of the A300's in Europe with 767 aircraft for the commonality.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineERAUgrad02 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 1227 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 10526 times:

Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 21):
Yeah, I remember hearing that on this forum a few months back that they were considering replacing some of the A300's in Europe with 767 aircraft for the commonality.

You'd think they'd order more than 6. Maybe this is just a start. Did they say anything about further options? On another note, will Boeing start building more than 2 a month now that they have like 68 planes to build as of now?



Desmond MacRae in ILM
User currently offlineER757 From Cayman Islands, joined May 2005, 2495 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 10479 times:

Well, this is a surprise - there isn't even anything about this order on our intranet site! I'll keep watching to see if there's a blurb about whether these will go to Astar/ABX etc. I am sure they aren't for PO, our agreement with them is just that we get space on their aircraft between N America & Asia

User currently offlineLegoguy From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 3312 posts, RR: 40
Reply 24, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 10460 times:

How long has the 767-300ERF been offered for by Boeing? There seems to have been alot of orders for it recently!!  Smile


Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
25 Post contains links BoeingFever777 : http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2007/q1/070308a_nr.html Looking good! Congrats DHL and Boeing!
26 Post contains images FXramper : A small order for World Express. I guess they wanna keep the line clear for the FX order.
27 Ward86IND : It'll be pretty neat to see this plane being produced alongside the aircraft intended to replace it. Long live the 767!
28 CV580Freak : The Boeing site quotes 'DHL International' so I expect they will either operate in Europe or Asia. Seems a bit too much of an aircraft for the short E
29 Tayaramecanici : Container commonality with the B747 (the Long haul work horse) was one of the deciding factors for most airlines choosing the A300-600 over the B767
30 EA772LR : Congrats to the 767 family! Just a thought, but would it make any sense for Boeing to make a 767-400ERF?
31 Floridaflyboy : Well, they're definitely not going to ABX. I called my dad (who's a pilot for ABX) this morning and he was in a meeting with the system chief pilot an
32 Post contains images Glideslope : Congrats DHL!!! New frames "Holy Cow." Airbus better get that 332F in the air ASAP.
33 2wingtips : FedEx, UPS and now DHL have apparently rejected the A330F. I would have thought all 3 would have been major targets for Airbus and they failed on all
34 Floridaflyboy : This was announced by DHL's USA division head, and most of the articles about it specify that they are for the United States operation, not Europe or
35 EA772LR : When is the A332F supposed to enter service anyway? I would have thought with the extensive Airbus fleet in FedEx and UPS that they'd have waited for
36 Wjcandee : Here's my guess: DHL orders 763Fs for some part of its operation. Noting all the free publicity that the other Big Boys in the US got from their Boein
37 Post contains images LifelinerOne : Agreed, all your costs are already paid so probably every plane means $$. Cheers!
38 Post contains images Floridaflyboy : My sentiment exactly I think that's highly possible. Maybe with Polar. I agree. It's just that the number seems to fit Astar so well.
39 DfwRevolution : Launched - January 15, 1993 Entered service - October 16, 1995 Orders to date - 83 Deliveries to date - 46 If Airbus maintains their delivery schedul
40 EA772LR : Perhaps you're right DfwRevolution. I didn't even think of that. Maybe with the delays of the 380 (unfortunately) The 3 major players (FedEx, UPS, DHL
41 Legoguy : Why the sudden large amount of orders after 12 years, especially with newer cargo aircraft around? What is the price difference between the 763F and
42 727forever : Astar currently operates 6 A300B4-200s. The leases on these aircraft are up starting this year and the last one will be gone in 2009. DHL does not lik
43 Atmx2000 : While that was important for some passenger airlines, it isn't so important for cargo airlines, who use other types of containers and pallets. It's i
44 SpinalTap : My guess is that with so many 787 orders they expect a lot of cheap 767s to be floating around in a few years ripe for conversion to freighters. Orde
45 ERJ170 : Where are all the 737 orders? only 3 for the first 3 months? that's not a good sign is it?
46 Floridaflyboy : DHL doesn't get to bargain with either company's pilots. In fact, DHL could care less about the pilots' negotiations as long as it doesn't effect the
47 ER757 : Yes they could be used on flights TO the US, but no they won't be with Polar. DHL's agreement with Polar is simply confirmed space on Polar's flights
48 Post contains links Warszawa : http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2007/q1/070308a_nr.html " "Adding the wide-body 767 Freighter to our network allows us to grow our business consid
49 Wjcandee : This all makes sense, particularly since the headline has to do with "refleeting US operations". But I have to say that it would seem odd to put thes
50 Floridaflyboy : Yeah, I agree. However, Mullen said that DHL USA wouldn't rule out actually signing an ACMI agreement with Polar if demand necessitated it. I agree w
51 Wjcandee : That's not likely to happen, because the run isn't ILN-ANC. It's ILN-Asia, and, like all NW's Asia business, the 747s stop in ANC and swap cargo. So
52 Post contains images Hamlet69 : That's a very good question. One I have been pondering more and more lately. Here's another one I would love to have answered: After 40+ commitments
53 Lumberton : I would have thought at least one of these mega package carriers would have opted for the A332F as well? Which can also auger well for A330 conversio
54 Post contains images Hamlet69 : They were certainly rumored to be the launch customer last year at Farnborough. However, it never happened. I would expect that if AerCap now commits
55 Post contains images A388 : Indeed nice to see the B763F in DHL colors but why is it called the 767-300ERF? I never knew Boeing offered a "ERF" version of the 767 full freighter.
56 XT6Wagon : I think the issue may be that the 777F makes a better A330F than the A330F does... the only hold up is a fairly firm inital price and slots. So it ma
57 Manni : No. The 777F will be able to carry 50% more payload over a distance 50% further then the A330F, it also cost a massive US$70 million more at listpric
58 Post contains images Hamlet69 : I like how you are trying to prop one aircraft by bashing another, but oh well, because that's exactly what I have my doubts about. As I said, the A3
59 F14D4ever : I thought XT6 meant that, as the 787s replace other types, those obsolescent types will become a flood (or at least a stream) of frames for conversio
60 Manni : I'm not bashing the 767F. I'm providing facts, they're very easy to check if you like. As for propping up the Airbus aircraft, it's a refreshing chan
61 Lumberton : No doubt, but what about the package business? I tried to find some good data on the market share for these three, but all the reports out there seem
62 XT6Wagon : yes, exactly. If it starts shoving A300, old A330's, and 767s out of passenger service, then its clear it will murder the A330F market. Hmm, I think
63 Post contains links Manni : http://www.iata.org/pressroom/wats/wats_freight_flown.htm For 2005, ranging from more then 14 million tonnes for FedEx to 5 million tonnes for Cargol
64 Floridaflyboy : I don't believe there is right now, but there wasn't a 767 freighter conversion program in place until ABX started buying used 767's in the late 1990
65 ERAUgrad02 : I wonder if DHL would want the new -200LRF? That would be a great aircraft for them id think. What do you folks think? I wonder what the range would b
66 Post contains images Hamlet69 : Apologies. I misunderstood the point you were trying to make. I was blamed for bashing Airbus the other day for merely pointing out that the 767 now
67 MCOflyer : I think many will order a new 763ER for this purpose. I thought NW would be a very good customer as they have a big 330 fleet. Congrats to DHL and ma
68 Floridaflyboy : I don't believe this order includes any options.
69 XT6Wagon : Whats interesting to me is that on the Airbus website they list two payload/range combinations. 141,095lbs over 4000NM or 152,120lbs over 3200NM So f
70 Alexinwa : Working for DHL in SEA I can say that I am VERY excited about this........ Our 762 to ILN is packed everyday and the 763 will add (i think) another 4
71 AlexInWa : Then again I'm not 100% sure of the Asia routing. Does DHL go via HNL or ANC to Asia?
72 MCOflyer : Exactly my thoughts too. I bet we'll see at least another 6 plus 6 more options. MCOflyer
73 Atmx2000 : Are you sure about these numbers? I found numbers before that suggested that the payload volume of the A332F was proportionally greater than max payl
74 AlexInWa : It is rumor up here in the SEA area that the 767 tanker deal is all but done. That means that the 767 line will have a VERY long life in Everett there
75 XT6Wagon : I used only the documents found on Boeing's or Airbus's respective website to develop those numbers. I used the highest cubic foot arrangement shown
76 Post contains links Atmx2000 : Airbus has claimed that the A332F has 30% more volume than any aircraft in its class: http://news.taume.com/World-Business...s-Airbus-A330-Freighter-
77 ERAUgrad02 : the 767-300erf carries about 50tons
78 Post contains images Hamlet69 : That's not what they are displaying, however. According to Airbus's own figures found on their site, the maximum usable volume of the A330-200F's mai
79 Post contains links XT6Wagon : Nope, the 763F is 4150cu-ft Vs A332F at 4767cu-ft. Which is not much over 10% more. My only thought is that someone in marketing was on drugs and com
80 HAWK21M : Considering the Demand for B752SFs out here.What are the chances that B767s would be considered as Crew commonility exists. There are no B752s for sal
81 XT6Wagon : yes, the 767 and 757 share a type rating, both passenger and cargo. The 767-400 and 767-200F based on the KC-767 might not hold to this, but in the en
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