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AC To Close YXX  
User currently offlineYVR1968 From Australia, joined Feb 2004, 704 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 4485 times:

Effective 31 May, AC will discontinue service out of Abbotsford.

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/n...d9c-44ab-bf23-a14edf66513a&k=67016

12 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTheCol From Canada, joined Jan 2007, 2039 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 4417 times:

Yeah, just came down the pipeline. Not surprising though, I expected them to pull out much sooner. WS has had the upper hand at YXX for the longest time. It hasn't been too uncommon to see Jazz cancel their flights at the last minute, due to poor load factors. The AC mainline YXX-YYZ flights did particularly bad last year as well.


No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.
User currently offline9252fly From Canada, joined Sep 2005, 1392 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 4292 times:

WS has a market lock on YXX and it's probably well deserved as they have consistently served this market for many years. I'm sure they made it very difficult for AC considering the amount of additional capacity that has been added in the last year,especially to YEG. Yields for AC must have been dismal on this route as it's always been a low yield market with lots of price sensitive traffic. I'm sure AC will be much more successful deploying the aircraft on the YYC-YXS and YYC-SEA routes.

User currently offlineWestJetForLife From Canada, joined Jun 2005, 814 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 4155 times:

I was not surprised when I saw this.

AC has a bigger capacity at YVR than at YXX. YVR is AC's main base of operations for inter-BC and inter-Canadian travel. I think pulling out of Abbotsford (and away from the dominance of WS, which isn't bad at all for YXX) was a smart move made by AC.

Cheers,
Nik



I need a drink.
User currently offlineRobsawatsky From Canada, joined Dec 2003, 597 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3797 times:

I don't know how reflective of typical loads this is but last year my brother flew AC out of YXX and there were 9 passengers on the flight.

User currently offlineACDC8 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 7642 posts, RR: 35
Reply 5, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3774 times:

Quoting Robsawatsky (Reply 4):
I don't know how reflective of typical loads this is but last year my brother flew AC out of YXX and there were 9 passengers on the flight.

Does anyone know how WS's loads are out of YXX?



A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4997 posts, RR: 43
Reply 6, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3609 times:

Quoting Robsawatsky (Reply 4):
I don't know how reflective of typical loads this is but last year my brother flew AC out of YXX and there were 9 passengers on the flight.

I guess it depends on when one flies. I flew a few substitutions YYZ-YXX-YYZ last summer, and all were pretty close to capacity.

The only thing I can think of, is with the low yields dictated by that market, the base was not utilised enough to warrant its existence. While loads probably covered the cost of flights, maybe not the cost of the base itself. WestJet with more flights would have a better chance of breaking even, spreading around the cost.

I have always maintained that every airline has its areas of success. Westjet while successful in some areas, is definitely NOT successful in other areas.



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineTheCol From Canada, joined Jan 2007, 2039 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 3187 times:

Quoting Robsawatsky (Reply 4):
I don't know how reflective of typical loads this is but last year my brother flew AC out of YXX and there were 9 passengers on the flight.

It isn't uncommon to see that. I've seen a lot of Jazz flights come in and out with only a dozen people or less.

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 5):
Does anyone know how WS's loads are out of YXX?

WS is continuing to do well at YXX. The PVR charter has also been a success once again.



No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.
User currently offlineSpyderz From Canada, joined Apr 2001, 651 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2854 times:

While I suspect not, this could highlight a bigger problem for Air Canada. At the time of Air Canada's regional jet order announcement, Milton claimed that the regional jets could effectively compete against WestJet by providing a lower cost base. One of the specific destinations he highlighted was YXX, claiming that the RJ would be equal to WestJet's 737s. However based on Air Canada leaving, clearly the strategy did not work, at least at YXX. It just begs to wonder, how that strategy is paying off for other destinations?

User currently offlineFLYYUL From Italy, joined Jun 2000, 4980 posts, RR: 51
Reply 9, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2618 times:

Quoting Spyderz (Reply 8):
While I suspect not, this could highlight a bigger problem for Air Canada. At the time of Air Canada's regional jet order announcement, Milton claimed that the regional jets could effectively compete against WestJet by providing a lower cost base. One of the specific destinations he highlighted was YXX, claiming that the RJ would be equal to WestJet's 737s. However based on Air Canada leaving, clearly the strategy did not work, at least at YXX. It just begs to wonder, how that strategy is paying off for other destinations?

Dont let a simple YYC-YXX question a strategy.

Last I checked these are new RJ routes within the last 2-3 years out west
YWG-YXU
YEG-YLW
YEG-YYJ
YEG-YZF
YYC-YZF
YYC-YQQ
YEG-YQR
YEG-YXE


User currently offline9252fly From Canada, joined Sep 2005, 1392 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2588 times:

Quoting TheCol (Reply 7):
It isn't uncommon to see that. I've seen a lot of Jazz flights come in and out with only a dozen people or less.

Typically Jazz carried a lot of connection traffic inbound and outbound over YYC. The flights you mention were specifically the first inbound and last outbound that suffered from less connectivity in YYC. No matter if the loads were good the yield was still poor as the local market is very price sensitive and WS could spread it's cost better even with low yields utilizing a larger aircraft.

Quoting Spyderz (Reply 8):
One of the specific destinations he highlighted was YXX, claiming that the RJ would be equal to WestJet's 737s. However based on Air Canada leaving, clearly the strategy did not work, at least at YXX. It just begs to wonder, how that strategy is paying off for other destinations?

It seems this route was a one that the CEO at the time wanted as he is known as having a passion for scheduling and loved to micro-manage that aspect of the operation. I suspect the route analyst's and yield management folks must have thought better than question the CEO's reasoning.


User currently offlineA332 From Canada, joined Feb 2005, 1644 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (7 years 6 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2292 times:

Quoting 9252fly (Reply 2):
I'm sure AC will be much more successful deploying the aircraft on the YYC-YXS

I highly doubt it... WestJet could not make this route work when they did the YYJ-YXS-YYC route... CMA couldn't make it work with a tiny Beech 1900... so very unlikely AC will make it work.



Bad spellers of the world... UNTIE!
User currently offlineYEGinLeduc From Canada, joined Mar 2007, 37 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2073 times:

So I still cant think of a good reason to go 2 x daily YYC-SEA and battle it out with QX/AS with 4 x daily. Is QX/AS really doing that well on the route to make this happen?

I would have liked to see AC start YYC-PDX to really frustrate QX or even try YYC-GEG or YYC-SJC if they have the spare aircraft available. Those routes are not currently served and could be successful as there is a demand but for some reason, I dont see YYC-SEA 6x a day necessary and this will only create bad results for both carriers. The current schedule shows approx 400 seats a day in the summer each way in between the cities and with the many non-stop choices from YYC to the US, it seems AC may be finding themselves heavily discounting to fill seats. Any other thoughts?


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