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Virgin America Approved W/conditions-ruling Here  
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5804 posts, RR: 14
Posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11498 times:

The DOT just filed approval granting Virgin America's certificate with conditions:
http://dms.dot.gov/search/document.c...m?documentid=461049&docketid=23307

The conditions include:
"**Requiring that the disinterested directors on the Virgin America board (that is, U.S. citizens) separately approve of the appointment or replacement of the trustee of Virgin Group’s shareholdings.

**Amending the voting trust agreement to require that the Trustee vote its shares proportionally to the other shareholders as to any matter that, in the opinion of the U.S. investor directors, creates a conflict of interest between the interests of Virgin Group and that of U.S. shareholders.

**Modifying the Virgin Trademark License Agreement to remove certain geographic and operational restrictions on Virgin America and the requirement that it pay royalties to the Virgin Group should the applicant conduct operations independent of the Virgin name.

**Confirming that the current CEO has terminated employment with the applicant within 90 days of the certificate being issued and any follow-on consultancy within 180 days following termination of employment.

**Submitting copies of all executed and signed agreements prior to certification.

**Reporting to the Department in advance if any additional loans (or other debt funding) are to be provided to it from the Virgin Group."

http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/p89/461049.doc

[Edited 2007-03-20 18:46:34]


"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
69 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5758 posts, RR: 47
Reply 1, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11487 times:

Does that mean that Virgin America is cleared to fly? Are these conditions acceptable to SRB?


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineHawaijahaz From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 352 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11463 times:

Wow. Just when I had thought that Virgin America was all but dead. It'll be good to have options when travelling from SFO for me.

P


User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5804 posts, RR: 14
Reply 3, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11444 times:

Starting to hit the news media now:
Virgin America gets tentative approval to launch U.S. service
http://www.usatoday.com/travel/fligh...0-virgin-america-cleared-fly_N.htm



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 26977 posts, RR: 57
Reply 4, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11446 times:

Brilliant , good news at last , I really hope to fly F class on their AC as soon as they start.

User currently offlineIADLHR From Italy, joined Apr 2005, 735 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11384 times:

I am not too surprised. I always felt that if an openskies was reached and slots made available at LHR there was a 90% plus chance it would be approved.

I wonder if, for this to happen, that the UK signaled they would not veto the openskies at the EU meeting this week.


User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6762 posts, RR: 32
Reply 6, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11364 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
Confirming that the current CEO has terminated employment with the applicant within 90 days of the certificate being issued and any follow-on consultancy within 180 days following termination of employment.

Well, it looks like DOT is going to call Virgin America's bluff on terminating Fred Reid...very interesting.

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
Modifying the Virgin Trademark License Agreement to remove certain geographic and operational restrictions on Virgin America and the requirement that it pay royalties to the Virgin Group should the applicant conduct operations independent of the Virgin name.

This seems to be going farther than what Virgin America has said that Virgin Group was willing to do vis a vis the licensing agreement.


User currently offlineJayDub From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11284 times:

Good for them...looking forward to flying them.

Quoting FATFlyer (Thread starter):
**Confirming that the current CEO has terminated employment with the applicant within 90 days of the certificate being issued and any follow-on consultancy within 180 days following termination of employment

I'm a bit confused...does this mean Fred Reid is gone? While they're at it, maybe they should show Don Carty the door, too...

[Edited 2007-03-20 18:53:16]

User currently offlineAntonovman From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 720 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 11282 times:

Quoting IADLHR (Reply 5):
I always felt that if an openskies was reached and slots made available at LHR

And how are slots going to be made available when LHR is running at full capacity ?


User currently offlineIADLHR From Italy, joined Apr 2005, 735 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11115 times:

I thought Carty had become a US citizen years ago. Dont know what the status of Reid is, but think for sure Carty is now a US citizen.

User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3292 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11051 times:

Quoting OA260 (Reply 4):
Brilliant , good news at last , I really hope to fly F class on their AC as soon as they start.

I believe their business plan calls for an all coach cabin, similar to JetBlue. You may be waiting awhile for that F seat.


User currently offlineTimboflier215 From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 1336 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 11022 times:

Quoting IADLHR (Reply 5):
I wonder if, for this to happen, that the UK signaled they would not veto the openskies at the EU meeting this week

I doubt the UK Govt would base their decisions on something as big as open skies on whether or not SRB can have a carrier operating domestically in the States, especially as that carrier is mostly owned, anc controlled by, US interests.


User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5804 posts, RR: 14
Reply 12, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 10977 times:

Quoting IADLHR (Reply 9):
Dont know what the status of Reid is

Reid is US, the issue became that he was hired by Sir Richard and thus is considered to be too closely influenced by a non-US citizen.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6762 posts, RR: 32
Reply 13, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 10977 times:

Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 10):
I believe their business plan calls for an all coach cabin, similar to JetBlue.

Nope. Two rows of first class seating, if you look at their videos. I'm not big on the white leather seats.


User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3292 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 10906 times:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 13):
Nope. Two rows of first class seating, if you look at their videos. I'm not big on the white leather seats.

Just looked at the website, I stand corrected. Was hoping to get back here before someone caught my mistake! I could swear that the original model was coach only. That white leather won't last 6 months. It's going to be a nightmare to keep clean!


User currently offlineARGinLON From Vatican City, joined Jun 2005, 614 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 10823 times:

Quoting Timboflier215 (Reply 11):
I doubt the UK Govt would base their decisions on something as big as open skies on whether or not SRB can have a carrier operating domestically in the States, especially as that carrier is mostly owned, anc controlled by, US interests.

But VS's position may change after this approval...It's incredible BAs power over the British Gov.


User currently offlineOsiris30 From Barbados, joined Sep 2006, 3192 posts, RR: 25
Reply 16, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 10685 times:

I hope they agree to the terms and start flying, mostly to see if they can make a go of it. I was really bothered by how certain carriers hid behind laws to protect themselves rather than competing for the business. I don't blame them mind you, it's business, but I don't exactly respect that sort of running to mommy attitude.

Go Virgin America is about all I can say. Afterall what good is a free market that's not free :/



I don't care what you think of my opinion. It's my opinion, so have a nice day :)
User currently offlineSearpqx From Netherlands, joined Jun 2000, 4344 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 10554 times:

I still question their business plan and choice of markets, but I'm glad they've now got the opportunity to prove it out. I'd be more than happy to be shown wrong! Big grin


"The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity"
User currently offlineIflyKPDX From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 287 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 10539 times:

I really hope this ushers in a new standard of service. I've always been hoping for features in Y that VA is touting, and hopefully it will do something to pressure other carries to add them as well.


Airport Management - UND
User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6484 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 10378 times:

Quoting JayDub (Reply 7):
I'm a bit confused...does this mean Fred Reid is gone? While they're at it, maybe they should show Don Carty the door, too...

WSJ reported that one of the conditions was specifically that Fred Reid must be fired due to his buddy-buddy status with SRB.



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5804 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 10275 times:

Quoting N328KF (Reply 19):
WSJ reported that one of the conditions was specifically that Fred Reid must be fired due to his buddy-buddy status with SRB.

As I posted above in the thread starter, the DOT said,
**Confirming that the current CEO has terminated employment with the applicant within 90 days of the certificate being issued and any follow-on consultancy within 180 days following termination of employment.

In other words they want Reid gone 90 days after the actual certificate issuing, which will be in about a month, assuming no new arguments or protests occur. The DOT is then allowing him to be a consultant to the airine for another 6 months before cutting all ties.

The Docket is now in .pdf at
http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/pdf100/461049_web.pdf



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineS12PPL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 10260 times:

Crow anyone?

VA will fly after all!

Great to hear!!


User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 10247 times:

It is pretty certain that Virgin will accept the requirements and that Virgin America will launch. I’m sure they’re trying very hard to get in the air for at least part of the summer if they can at all do it.

This move also effectively leaves BA as the only “injured party” in the US – EU Open Skies plan. Virgin’s ability to develop new transatlantic flights to non-UK cities and feed them w/ intra-US flies is a huge advantage for them – and an advantage they want to develop before other carriers are able to match them.

United will be the most significantly impacted by Virgin America with AA a close second. Given that they are also going to be impacted by Open Skies, there are some significant changes coming in the US airline industry.


User currently offlineARGinLON From Vatican City, joined Jun 2005, 614 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 9986 times:

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 22):
This move also effectively leaves BA as the only “injured party” in the US – EU Open Skies plan. Virgin’s ability to develop new transatlantic flights to non-UK cities and feed them w/ intra-US flies is a huge advantage for them – and an advantage they want to develop before other carriers are able to match them.

I hardly believe any major European carrier will go and start operating from other European countries to the US (Say VS flying MAD-LAX)

VS statement (about starting operations from other European markets) in my opinion was to support the UK in its campaign to rule out Open skies. If VS really wanted to start Europe-US flights, they would have done it already by launching a VS subsidiary in other European countries.

I think VS will have other priorities with open skies like LHRIAH or LHRDFW


User currently offlineLono From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1335 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (7 years 6 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 9529 times:

Quoting S12PPL (Reply 21):
Crow anyone?

VA will fly after all!

Great to hear!!

Yes where are all the Nay-sayers...???
I can't wait to see what cities they will fly to... Hope SEA is one of them......



Wally Bird Ruled the Skys!
25 Steeler83 : A little while back, somebody posted a list of cities Virgin America hopes to serve within 5 years or so of start-up...
26 Post contains images S12PPL : I hope they start up PDX right away. I'd love to see UA, AS, and WN have to compete with VA....Airfares might actually get reasonable, too. My dad and
27 Planecrazy2 : It's about time! If they fail they fail, at least they'll get a chance to prove themselves.
28 Post contains links SeattleFlyer : This just posted to VA's website today... http://www.virginamerica.com/informa...news/story_template.php?article=36 Virgin America said it hoped to r
29 Post contains links SANFan : As a SANFan, I'm excited about this (and figured all along they should and would eventually get their certificate) and as SAN was announced as one of
30 Sparklehorse12 : Well it's about time! With DJ signing an order for 7 773's today to start their long haul services to North America it seems the Virgin name is having
31 Post contains images SANFan : OK, so I'll have to wait until the end of the year to see the RedBirds landing at Lindbergh -- I can do that! (I have to get going right now, otherwi
32 LASOctoberB6 : well about frickkin time!!
33 Lono : I was just reading their web page and noticed this....Kind of interesting the first city they mention is SEA.... Hmmmmm no wonder the boys at AS are
34 MrSTL : Which terminal will they operate out of at JFK??
35 Longhornmaniac : I thought this was really interesting. Taken from the .pdf file. I'm not entirely sure what it's saying in the context of the paragraph (I need to re
36 WorldTraveler : you will be surprised then. Many EU airlines will start services from other than their home countries.
37 SkyyMaster : Great news. This does rehash some questions brought up before, mainly - what gates will they use at SFO? It's my understanding they had not gotten to
38 Longhornmaniac : I forgot to add, that even as an AA fan, I'm really glad to see VA about to (hopefully) get off the ground. It seems like they've got a great product,
39 B6sFinest : It says on Usatoday.com that they are going to operate a leet of 34 aircraft. Does this mean in the future they wont go over 34 or are they happy with
40 Post contains images BMIFlyer : Excellent, and about time Good look VA, you'll need it Lee
41 Post contains images A380US : Ive been waiting such a long time for this. Why wouldn't set up a hub at JFK where virgin Atlantic flies 4 times a day. are they going to code share w
42 MEACEDAR : I wonder if they will fly to MCO. It would be nice for a SFO-MCO or possibly a LAX-MCO, instead of UA/DL/AA. MEACEDAR
43 Joemac547 : Their web site shows that the planes have an 8 person F Cabin that really looks impressive (55" pitch, PTV's, etc).[Edited 2007-03-21 01:39:40]
44 Ikramerica : No, it mean that should they choose to follow these conditions which would put them into compliance with the law, then they are cleared to fly. Right
45 Jerseyguy : Not exactly sure what gates exactly, But the AirTrain directory has them using International Terminal A. It also says Jetblue will be in Terminal 1.
46 PlanenutzTB : Congratulations to VA! Let VA fly!
47 FATFlyer : Actually it wasn't denied, the DOT found that they can be issued the certificate under the conditions. It will be up to Virgin to accept the conditio
48 DeltaGuy : Hah, Reid got what was coming to him. Good to see him go. DeltaGuy
49 ERJ170 : Well dang... Raleigh-Durham sent in a letter to the FAA/DOT expressing that VA should be allowed to start flying, and they we aren't even on the list
50 Post contains images Lightsaber : First of all, the conditions seem... fair. Good news for competition. Its... going to be an interesting market in 2007. Partially I'm talking about t
51 LawnDart : Hey, anyone want to guess how long it will take Southwest to announce their inaugural service out of SFO, and to where? My guess is sometime this summ
52 Jlbmedia : I understand that most people here do not like Fred Reid. But why is the DOT requiring that he step down as a condition of certification? Thanks John.
53 FATFlyer : He was hired by Sir Richard and the concern is that he would be too beholden to Branson to operate independently.
54 Jlbmedia : Thanks FATFlyer, I just did not see that one. John.
55 Atmx2000 : I think VA should not be allowed to carry any connecting VS customers. Otherwise it will smell like cabotage.
56 Mir : Geographically speaking, things should be pretty safe then, since SFO is pretty much as far away from London as you can get in the continental US. If
57 Atmx2000 : I think you are assuming that VA plans on basing its operations exclusively in SFO. I suspect they have their eye on NYC. And VS is planning on inund
58 BananaBoY : But if they are allowed to operate on the basis that they are truly independent from Virgin Atlantic, why shouldn't they have the right to co-operate
59 StarGoldLHR : Are you mad ? Are you saying that VS codesharing with CO is cabotage ? The only thing linking the two is the name. To apply your words, this would pr
60 StarGoldLHR : How about LHR-SFO-SAN with VS/VA ? Codeshare is not cabotage.. or are you suggesting if I fly LHR-SFO with VS I am not allowed to fly to SAN with any
61 Post contains images SANFan : Finally someone looking a bit outside the box (and, coincidentally, agreeing with me somewhat): Most posts I've seen since all this VX stuff started
62 Lightsaber : This is a huge change... Many of their initial target markets are already served. But if Virge America links up with Virgin Pacific (or whatever the
63 Pope : Correct me if I'm wrong but there's nothing in the agreement that prohibits the CEO from being terminated and then re-hired by the independent board.
64 Mir : Yeah, I suppose. I guess you could say that they can't codeshare, but you won't be able to stop people booking two seperate tickets. -Mir
65 EurostarVA : Congratulations to the VA team, who must feel exhausted after such a long tedious legal battle!
66 SkyexRamper : Sure, all they have to do is replace the entire company management and cut ties with Branson.
67 WhatUsaid : Looking at three 320's sitting on the ramp at SFO yesterday, I couldn't help but remember my Virgin Atlantic flights...my Virgin Blue flights....and h
68 Atmx2000 : But if they choose to cooperate with Virgin Atlantic preferentially, one has to wonder if they are truly independent. I said it smells like cabotage,
69 Post contains links FATFlyer : AA has now filed a letter saying they will not protest the granting of a certificate to Virgin America. http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/pdf100/461317_w
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