Iahflyr From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 4723 posts, RR: 25 Reply 1, posted (6 years 2 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4769 times:
In the U.S. the shoulder belts are only required for ground movement, take-off and landings, otherwise they can be stowed as the Captain has done in the picture.
Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
MD88Captain From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1287 posts, RR: 22 Reply 3, posted (6 years 2 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4606 times:
I actually didn't know it was required for ground movements. I usually just put them on for takeoff and landing.
SirOmega From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 735 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 4465 times:
Quoting Iahflyr (Reply 1): In the U.S. the shoulder belts are only required for ground movement, take-off and landings, otherwise they can be stowed as the Captain has done in the picture.
Quoting From the Pic's Caption: Banking hard over the Mediterranean Sea after takeoff from runway 25L on our flight from BCN to SZG.
So how quickly after takeoff is it allowable? 1500 AGL? 10,000 ft?
CaptainTim From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2004, 431 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (6 years 2 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 4415 times:
The FAR Part 29 states only during taxi, take off and landing, this guy seems like he's just taken off..
he's set to climb to FL190 maybe he's already reached 10,000+ and he's climbing 1200FPM on the VSI so.. probably he is allowed to take off his seatbelt
hey we can complain about the cell phone at the bottom of the picture
Gulfstream Planeview Cockpit: "why have hundreds of buttons when a CCD does the same thing and more?"
MD88Captain From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1287 posts, RR: 22 Reply 10, posted (6 years 2 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 4365 times:
We do not even have shoulder harness on the checklist anymore. And it used to be on the Before Takeoff. I've been in violation for many, many years... and probably will be for many more.
Baron52ta From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 211 posts, RR: 0 Reply 12, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3902 times:
Quoting CaptainTim (Reply 8): The FAR Part 29 states only during taxi, take off and landing, this guy seems like he's just taken off..
The Federal Air Regs don't apply anyway as it is not an American company ,who ever is governing body makes their rules. The FAA license is all but useless outside the USA or US registered aircraft.
Zeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 7726 posts, RR: 73 Reply 14, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3767 times:
Quoting BA84 (Thread starter): Is this a safety violation, or is it allowed?
The airline would follow the rules of the Letové prevádzkové služby Slovenskej republiky (Slovakia CAA) which says that the seat belt shall be worn at all times by a pilot, with the addition of the shoulder harness during takeoff and landing phases.
To me it looks like the cabin seat belt sign is also in AUTO on the overhead panel.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
A330 From Belgium, joined May 1999, 649 posts, RR: 8 Reply 15, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3452 times:
The Captain is actually one of SkyEurope's finest and also the Head of Training. Top guy.
Why do these teen plane spotters always think bad things when seeing a flight-deck picture... sad and one of the reasons why a lot of my collegues don't allow you guys into our "office" anymore.
Thomas, if you read this, hope all is fine with you!!
Airbelgium From Belgium, joined Sep 2005, 9 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2953 times:
I totally agree with A330: It seems that every time a picture of a flightdeck appears on this forum it is put under the loop and somebody will come up with something bad or "safety" related. I guess it's a good thing we don't allow pictures at our workplace...
MCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8553 posts, RR: 14 Reply 17, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2618 times:
Quoting Airbelgium (Reply 16): I guess it's a good thing we don't allow pictures at our workplace...
Agreed. At least that captain knows what hes doing.
Bohlman From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 18, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1787 times:
I actually thought that BA84's question was phrased in a very polite way. He simply had a question. Rather than some people here, who will post questions as a scandalized accusation (look at this blatant safety violation, how can you get away with this?!?) he asked it in a civil way and immediately thanked the poster who answered him. Not everybody knows everything about flying.
TACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 19, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1729 times:
Quoting A330 (Reply 15): The Captain is actually one of SkyEurope's finest and also the Head of Training. Top guy.
No single doubt about that.
Quoting Airbelgium (Reply 16): I totally agree with A330: It seems that every time a picture of a flightdeck appears on this forum it is put under the loop and somebody will come up with something bad or "safety" related. I guess it's a good thing we don't allow pictures at our workplace...
This thread is about a valid question from a fellow A.netter.
Nyskymasters From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 20, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1675 times:
Quoting CaptainTim (Reply 8): The FAR Part 29 states only during taxi, take off and landing, this guy seems like he's just taken off..
United States FAR Part 29 only applies to airworthiness standards for rotorcraft, ie. helicopters.
US FAR Part 91 would apply, specifically CFR 91.105b which states "Each required flight crewmember of a U.S. registered civil aircraft shall, during takeoff and landing, keep the shoulder harness fastened while at his or her assigned duty station. This does not apply if- (1) The seat at the crewmember's station is not equipped with a shoulder harness; or (2) The crewmember would be unable to perform required duties with the shoulder harness fastened.
It was once explained to me by the FAA that takeoff is generally considered to extend to flap retraction (the end off fourth segment climb) at which time you would be considered to be into "climb." ( Too much technicality if you ask me.)
Just thought I would pass along what the FAR's actally say for US operations. If anybody knows where to find this "obscure regulation" please pass it along. I would be interested to read it.
TACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 21, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1343 times:
Quoting BA84 (Thread starter): Is this a safety violation, or is it allowed?
Since this is a picture of an European[not American] aircraft, flying over Spain what is the treatment given by the European authorities to this theme?
ChiGB1973 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1605 posts, RR: 1 Reply 22, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1343 times:
Quoting MD88Captain (Reply 10): We do not even have shoulder harness on the checklist anymore. And it used to be on the Before Takeoff. I've been in violation for many, many years... and probably will be for many more.
So, you don't wear the shoulder harness?
If not, shouldn't you be more concerned about passenger safety? If you do hit something and get knocked out from the first impact simply because you weren't wearing your shoulder harness, you endanger any number of people in the plane not being able to attempt to control the plane, in the event you could, to prevent hitting something else or steering away from water, other aircraft or any number of obstacles.
Again, maybe I took your comment out of context and you do wear your shoulder harness when you know you should.
As a paramedic, I see people who are dead or seriously injured just because they were not wearing their seat belt. It is subjective, because I don't know what would have happened. Through education and experience, I can make the assumption that someone getting thrown through a windshield or my most recent fatality, the driver through the passenger side window, would have fared better staying in the seat.
BA84 From Canada, joined Aug 2004, 381 posts, RR: 3 Reply 23, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1296 times:
Quoting A330 (Reply 15): Why do these teen plane spotters always think bad things when seeing a flight-deck picture... sad and one of the reasons why a lot of my collegues don't allow you guys into our "office" anymore.
It seems my topic has annoyed our Belgian pilots. I'm not a teen, but 61, flying for many years as a passenger.
I was recently invited into the cockpit of an Air Canada A-320 during the cruise segment. I noticed both pilots were wearing their shoulder belts. The topic didn't come up, as we were talking about other stuff.
The reason I posted this thread, was that I noticed in the photo, that the FO was wearing his belts, but the captain was not. From the angle of the cockpit, it's obvious the aircraft is not at cruise. Hence my question. I certainly didn't mean to tell you guys your job. I merely asked if it was allowed. As you know, there are many parts of the world where pilots cut corners, and omit procedures, usually for economic reasons, but also because of machismo, or in cultures where the captain does it his way, or else.
Quoting Bohlman (Reply 18): I actually thought that BA84's question was phrased in a very polite way. He simply had a question. Rather than some people here, who will post questions as a scandalized accusation (look at this blatant safety violation, how can you get away with this?!?) he asked it in a civil way and immediately thanked the poster who answered him. Not everybody knows everything about flying.
Thank you, Bohlman, and TACAA320, for your support.
A330 From Belgium, joined May 1999, 649 posts, RR: 8 Reply 24, posted (6 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1236 times:
BA84,
Normal procedure is that at 10.000ft., shoulder harnessess come off except when workload is too high or flight conditions require us to wear them.
However, in good weather, some crew undo the belts after cleanup of the aircraft (flaps & gear). This is not dangerous and has no safety implications.
I presume that in this case, the FO is a little late in undoing his belts rather than the Capt. was too early, as the captain in the picture is partly responsible for the SkyEurope SOP's.
I was a bit harsh to you earlier on, my apologies.
26 Legacy135: Absolutely agree with you guys! So sad to see ........... a kind and open minded crew allows an aviation enthusiast to the flight deck who posts then
27 BA84: Apology accepted. No offence taken. Regards, BA84
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I recall that is an FAR you learn while you're getting your private license, atleast in the last 10 years.
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