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BA&IB: Does BA Need To Merge?  
User currently offlineScotron11 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 1178 posts, RR: 3
Posted (7 years 5 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 3539 times:

Reports on the weekend are again saying because of O/S, BA will merge with IB. They also say LH and Texas Pacific are interested in IB as well.(Forbes,Reuters etc)

BA is playing down any reports that it is going to make any bid at all, although it does have a 10% stake in IB.

If, as has been widely reported, consolidation happens within EU airlines, would BA/IB be a good fit?

Cheers!

18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineJoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (7 years 5 months 6 days ago) and read 3500 times:

BA and IB are the perfect fit (networkwise from my point of view at least).

And yes I think BA has to come up with an offer for IB or they will loose them. There are strong indications that IB is looking for husband. So if BA is not interested somebody else will.


User currently offlineScotron11 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 1178 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (7 years 5 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 3464 times:

Quoting JoFMO (Reply 1):

So if BA is not interested somebody else will.

I tend to agree. Especially IB's network to Latin & South America.


User currently offlineANother From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 5 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 3438 times:

While it may be a good idea, we are still a long way away from the political situation which would allow cross-border mergers. For the time being Iberia needs to remain Spanish, British needs to remain British or they lose valuable route rights.

Perhaps a AF/KL or LH/LX fiddle but not a merger.


User currently offlineBA787 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 2596 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (7 years 5 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3249 times:

Quoting ANother (Reply 3):

I would imagine that is all that would be intended anyway, a full blown merger would lead to one or both of the airline's losing their brand individuality and recognition, which would be bad for BA (maybe not for IB Big grin)


User currently offlineFlyCaledonian From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2082 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (7 years 5 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 3182 times:

I wonder if a BA/IB deal would see moves to dispose of Clickair? BA is very firmly setting itself up as a premium, full service carrier, and whilst IB's operations at MAD would support this, a combined carrier might decide to get out of the low-cost operations.

A dark horse for a BA deal in my book would be AY. Finnair is slowly building HEL as good Asian gateway from Europe. Indeed, longterm a BA/AY/IB deal would produce carriers with good Asian (via HEL), North American, African and Middle Eastern (via LHR) and Latin American (via MAD) hubs.

LH, with LX, has key hubs in Central Europe, so a BA/AY/IB marriage would seek to counter that by having the hubs at the dge of Europe, drawing traffic outwards.



Let's Go British Caledonian!
User currently offlineAndaman From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 5 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 3035 times:

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 5):


A dark horse for a BA deal in my book would be AY. finnair is slowly building HEL as good Asian gateway from Europe. Indeed, longterm a BA/AY/IB deal would produce carriers with good Asian (via HEL), North American, African and Middle Eastern (via LHR) and Latin American (via MAD) hubs.

I have heard the same idea here in Finland, sounds good to me. The Finnish state hasn't been eager to give up the majority of Finnair, but things can change. It seems AY want to go on expanding in Asia and Europe, they might need some closer partnership in future.


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11552 posts, RR: 61
Reply 7, posted (7 years 5 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 3028 times:

I don't think BA "needs" to merge with Iberia, per se.

However, I do think that, plausibly, BA could be forced into some type of deepened alliance, if not full-out merger, with Iberia if Lufthansa and partners (possibly Texas Pacific, possibly others) make a move. BA needs Iberia more than they needed SWISS (i.e., not at all). I don't think BA will able to justify to its shareholders letting a strategic partner like Iberia slip into Lufthansa's hands as SWISS did.

Long-term, BA and Iberia have complimentary networks and generally complimentary fleets and operating structures. Ultimately, I personally do think there is potential for real value creation for both companies, for oneworld, and for their customers.


User currently offlineR2rho From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2611 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (7 years 5 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2951 times:

Quoting JoFMO (Reply 1):
BA and IB are the perfect fit (networkwise from my point of view at least).

And yes I think BA has to come up with an offer for IB or they will loose them. There are strong indications that IB is looking for husband. So if BA is not interested somebody else will.

 checkmark  I brought this up some time ago and was surprised that it didn't get much of a reaction from airliners.net. Iberia CEO Mentions Merger/acquisition Possibility
Specially now with the Almost-Open Skies agreement, mergers in Europe start to make more sense.

IB is a a peculiar position: it is the smallest among the big carriers, yet too big to be considered a medium carrier. I believe they truly want BA as a husband, but they are toying around with LH in order to get some attention from them as BA has not shown much interest in IB lately.

IB may also be looking to acquire a small to medium sized carrier (they have the cash to do it so why not). This would put them in a more advantageous position for a merger by increasing their critical mass. I hadn't thought of Finnair... would actually make sense. Very interesting.

Expect to hear a lot of BA, LH and IB rumors this year!


User currently offlineLite From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 5 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 2803 times:

The airline industry is consolidating into a few major groups, and whilst British Airways have so far been successful by placing all their eggs into the LHR basket with a few minor investments elsewhere, Open Skies will create a whole new environment in which the airlines will have to adapt to. BA already has an investment in Iberia, they are a member of BA's oneworld alliance and the two airlines already co-operate - particularly on UK/Spain and Spain/South America markets. Now that we have a strong Star Alliance (LH's investment in Swiss plus a minor holding in bmi with close co-operation with Austrian, SAS and LOT) Skyteam (AF/KLM) means that British Airways might want to play catch up, with Iberia being one of the remaining medium-to-large size airlines that is free for merging with. It simply gives BA better bargaining power with authorities, airports, handling agents, aircraft manufacturers etc. if they have more size to them, as the AF/KLM and Lufthansa/Swiss groupings do.

User currently offlineAcelanzarote From Spain, joined Nov 2005, 829 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 5 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2710 times:

If BA etc merge/buy IB, I wonder if Iberia will restart meals/drink etc on Europe flights.
At present you have to buy everything.....
Whoever gets Iberia will not find they an easy setup, the staff will not like change
even more so if forced on them by a Non Spanish Company....

cheers



from the Island with sun and great photo's.. Why not visit Lanzarote
User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 5 months 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2696 times:

Quoting ANother (Reply 3):
While it may be a good idea, we are still a long way away from the political situation which would allow cross-border mergers.

What about AF/KL?


User currently offlineScotron11 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 1178 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2650 times:

Quoting R2rho (Reply 8):

I believe they truly want BA as a husband, but they are toying around with LH in order to get some attention from them as BA has not shown much interest in IB lately.

BA bought the stake AA held in IB last year taking their holding to 10%. They also have first refusal rights to acquire an additional 26.5%, so I would say BA are interested.

Additionally, there are reports today that IB has hired Goldman Sacks to advise them on a possible sale of the company.

Interesting days indeed!!


User currently offlineSKY1 From Spain, joined Apr 2006, 879 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (7 years 5 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2630 times:

I agree with many posters on this thread.

Anyway, now in April I believe we see new news about this subject. The most logical, natural path will be see a BA-IB merge AF-KL style.



Time flies! Enjoy life!
User currently offlineTimboflier215 From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 1336 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2513 times:

I don't think that BA or IB necessarily NEED to mege yet, but it is definitely getting to that, what with such strong other airline groupings in Europe. I for one hope that they do!

User currently offlineANother From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2504 times:

Quoting EI321 (Reply 11):
What about AF/KL?

What about AF/KL? They have not merged. AF remains a French Company based in Paris and KL remains a Dutch company based in Amsterdam.


User currently offlineCOEI2007 From Vanuatu, joined Jan 2007, 1912 posts, RR: 5
Reply 16, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2450 times:

Quoting Timboflier215 (Reply 14):
don't think that BA or IB necessarily NEED to mege yet, but it is definitely getting to that, what with such strong other airline groupings in Europe. I for one hope that they do!

I agree 100%. BA is strong on USA flights and Asia, and IB is strong on Sout American routes. Its a good fit!!! Add in the synergies that could be achieved, particularly on UK to Spain routes, and we have a winner!!! I wonder would Click open more routes ex UK, ie UK regions MAN, GLA etc, that BA have abondoned, or would Click get shut???


User currently offlineRichardw From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 3749 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2385 times:

IB service on routes to S America has a poor reputation, BA only has its code on IB's MAD-LIM route, and hopefully LHR-EZE and LHR-RIO will be non hopping via GRU soon.

User currently offlineJfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8337 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2306 times:
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Iberia is a unique property in Europe given its access to Latin America. BA only flies to Sao Paulo and EZE, Iberia's portfolio would bring the whole continent. There may yet be 777 flying from MAD to South America.

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