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Air Canada Connoisseur Class/ Canadian Attache  
User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 3189 times:

Does anyone remember in say circa 1982 when Air Canada had connoisseur class on all its aircraft except the DC-9?

I seem to recall the layout was you'd get a special connoisseur class seat assignment, different meal, different headset and they would try to keep the seat next to you empty is possible.

Problem it seems was there was no separate cabin or even separate area of economy ala Economy Plus, the connoisseur class were spread out through the Y cabin with either aisle or window seats assigned.


I seem to also recall that in the circa 1985-86 period Canadian ( or was it CP Air) had a dedicated fleet of 733s in all C class called Attache Class. These flights flew between YYZ and YYC/YVR and YUL. I didnt last longer than say one year at most.


Can anyone add some further insight?

11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineThreepoint From Canada, joined Oct 2005, 2187 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 3185 times:

Quoting EXAAUADL (Thread starter):
I seem to also recall that in the circa 1985-86 period Canadian ( or was it CP Air) had a dedicated fleet of 733s in all C class called Attache Class.

I'm not sure they ever operated 733's, but it may have been in their 732's.



The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
User currently offlineConnies4ever From Canada, joined Feb 2006, 4066 posts, RR: 13
Reply 2, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 3149 times:

Oui. La service Connaisseur !

I think the main problem was as you pointed out - no separate C cabin (if that was the class designator back then).
I guess it would have bene hard to do on a 727 or DC8, but there was no real reason why it could not have been
done in the L-1011 or 747. Perhaps something like Club, Club World and World Traveller on BA (of course, I could be wrong here).

As for Attache, CP definitely had 733s, initially they were on mainline routes, as my then g.f. flew YWG-YVR on one painted in the Big Orange. But when Attache debuted in I think 1984, all the 733s (4?) were given a separate colour scheme, logo, it was an airline within an airline. All F seating, I think 84 or 88, and I agree that the a/c were dedicated YVR/YYC - YYZ. As you say, didn't last long.

I think the history of airlines within airlines isn't a happy one. AC had Tango, although now they Tango fares. I flew Tango twcie and it was OK. Also they had Zip. Flew them many times, again OK. Delta had Song, BA had Go!, United still has Ted. Problem could be you're sharing services with mainline and mainline are charging their costs to the low-fare unit, which really skews things.

Attache was a reverse take on this, making the airline within the airline the premium product. One thing Attache suffered from was lack of coverage -- only 3 citites, and I think only 2x daily on each route.

Mind you, PrivatAir seem to be doing very well DUS-EWR/MUC-EWR/DUS-ORD etc.



Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 5157 posts, RR: 43
Reply 3, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 3132 times:

Quoting Threepoint (Reply 1):
I'm not sure they ever operated 733's


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Photo © Trevor Ogle



btw, Attache was in both the B737-300 and the B737-200



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineThreepoint From Canada, joined Oct 2005, 2187 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 3127 times:

Quoting Connies4ever (Reply 2):
CP definitely had 733s

I stand corrected. Thank you very much.

Longhauler, I had the same photo to attach, but couldn't remember how to do it. Thanks.



The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 5157 posts, RR: 43
Reply 5, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 3105 times:

The Attache product was on most long haul CP Canadian routes.


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Photo © Trevor Ogle





The aircraft were configured with 8F, and the rest of the aircraft in J. There were no Y class seats. I dont recall the actual number of seats, but it did vary on the aircraft, ie -300 vs -200.

The routes were YYZ-YYC/YEG/YVR/YUL as well as YUL/YOW-YVR.

The B737-200s that were used were different from the rest in the fleet, as they had a fourth fuel tank in the forward part of the rear cargo hold. Also, the MTOW was 128,800 vs, 124,500 for the rest of the -200s equipped with -17 engines. This was necessary for the YUL/YOW/YYZ-YVR leg. Also they were the first of the -17s that were equipped with movie screens and headsets .. although eventually all the of the -200s with -17 engines were eventually so equipped.

And, to make matters more confusing, this is not to be confused with "The Company Jet" another project for YYZ-YOW/YUL routes in an all FJ configuration.


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[Edited 2007-03-31 17:58:36]


Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineConnies4ever From Canada, joined Feb 2006, 4066 posts, RR: 13
Reply 6, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 3073 times:

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 5):
The Attache product was on most long haul CP Canadian routes.

OK, but, photo caption says "one of two 737s that ooperated in the Attache scheme".
So if Attache was FJ, then it was 8F in 2x4 and ?? J in nx(3+2) ??. I had been under the
(wrong) impression that Attache was all F.

I knew that CP had retrefitted many 737s with extra belly fuel to do the YYZ/YOW/YUL-YVR
runs as this was really testing the a/c's range.

One side bar: this was about when both airlines started their loyalty programs. I was going
YWG-YYZ 6-8x yearly at that time. For a while in I think 1986, CP offered a promo that if you
_bought_ a ticket YWG-YYZ any class, you got 6x the normal mileage, and every other trip
you did that calendar year you got 3x. I paid for a ticket and said "Thank you". Going to visit
my parents near YVR, I cashed in on CP's ludicrous short-haul 15,000 points reward YWG-YVR
and flew J for several years.

Thank you, Rhys Eyton. What a guy !



Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
User currently offlineTCXDegsy From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2006, 518 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2941 times:

All that reminicing about AC in the '80's reminds me of my very first transatlantic flight... Wardair PIK-YYC!

What I remember most was the food - everything served on Royal Doulton china and the "Selection from the Sweet Trolley" listed on the menu was exactly that - a sweet trolley wheeled up and down the aisle for you view and choose from!!

Ah, them were the days... and all for £429 return... in 1987! I wonder what the equivalent fare would be now?



next flights: BA1441 0566 0581 1446 EDI-LHR-MXP-LHR-EDI
User currently offlineAceMcCool99 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2927 times:

I remember the Connaisseur Service very well. I flew from YYZ to YVR and enjoyed fantastic service. The steak they served was better than some I ate in a restaurant. The free booze part was fun too ... I hardly remember getting off the plane.

User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 5157 posts, RR: 43
Reply 9, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2796 times:

Quoting Connies4ever (Reply 6):
OK, but, photo caption says "one of two 737s that ooperated in the Attache scheme".
So if Attache was FJ, then it was 8F in 2x4 and ?? J in nx(3+2) ??. I had been under the
(wrong) impression that Attache was all F.

There were in fact some orange Attache B737s as well, they were just not branded as Attache on the outside.

The two aircraft types had 8F seats, 2X2 as you would imagine. The J seats were in fact convertible Y seats, where the armrests were lifted, and the centre seat back split. This gave a table, with armrests built into the table ... so J was 2X2 as well, just not as comfortable as the F seats. So the aircraft were FY when not on an Attache flight, and FJ when it was an Attache flight.

If you recall the CP/CAIL B737s in the late 80s to mid 90s, the J seats at the front, were the old convertible Attache seats. These B737-200s, (the -300s were gone by then) were variable J/Y seats, 2X2 or 3X3 varied by route, with a movable cabin divider. It was not until the mid 90s that the dedicated J seats 2X2 were fitted in the B737s giving the 12J 88Y configuration.



Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 26005 posts, RR: 22
Reply 10, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2739 times:

Quoting Connies4ever (Reply 2):
CP definitely had 733s

CP Air took delivery of 5 733s, 3 in April/May 1985 and 2 in April 1986. They were registered C-FCPG/I/J/K/L. I remember a few nonrev flights on them YVR-YYZ-YVR during the Attache period.

CP had plans to order more 733s to start replacing the 732s however the Pacific Western Airlines purchase of CP Air, resulting in the creation of Canadian Airlines, put an end to those plans. The PWA/CP Air deal was announced in early 1986 and the merger was completed in early 1987. The combined CP and PW fleets had so many 732s, including those CP had inherited from their earlier mergers with Eastern Provincial Airways and Nordair, they decided it didn''t make sense to further complicate the fleet and the 733s were sold after only a year or two of service. It wasn't long after that that CP, by now Canadian Airlines, announced their first A320 orders.

Two of the ex-CP Air 733s are currently with Southwest.


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Photo © Bruce Leibowitz



User currently offline747433 From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 57 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2652 times:

Quoting EXAAUADL (Thread starter):
on all its aircraft except the DC-9

AC did offer "Connaisseur service" on the DC-9

AC also had a 4 abreast "Chicago Class" DC-9 service between YYZ-ORD (middle seat in the triples was left open)

AC offered 3 class 767-200 service on all its major trunk routes from the mid 1980s-early 1990s
YYZ-YUL/YOW/YHZ/YWG/YEG/YYC/YVR/LAX/SFO


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