Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Southwest Needs To Rethink Their Route Strategy  
User currently offlineN471WN From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1531 posts, RR: 2
Posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 9947 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

WN had by any measurement a lousy March both in Load Factor and RPM.....I am a 35 year SWA flyer and huge fan (not an employee) but I must say to look at those numbers in comparison to Air Tran and Jet Blue and even Continental, ought to be to them alarming. What has happpened? Well there are a number of related factors but two come to mind:

1) SWA was always assumed to have the lowest fares in a market---in facts folks like me who take 100 flights a year never even looked at other airlines unless SWA did not fly there. Then one day I booked 2 months in advance a R/T from OAK to MSY and the ticket came to $480. I then looked on Orbitz and got the same one-stop service for less than $300. For the first time in my life, I cancelled a SWA flight for another carrier on the basis of price.

2) I would have to say that this "slow down" by SWA in adding cities has been a mistake. Look at Jet Blue and Air Tran who are adding destinations and growing much more and achieving higher load factors. It is simply amazing to me that SWA has not cut a deal with MSP to go into the Humphrey Terminal---that market is a field waiting to be harvested and other markets like it. SWA has now connected enough of their dots and needs more dots. Where is Herb when we need him?

70 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineInnocuousFox From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2805 posts, RR: 14
Reply 1, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9894 times:

The slowdown in adding "dots" may be a function of not enough equipment. You can only add new planes so fast and in order to serve a "dot" right, you have to have a decent number of initial flights to cover your set-up costs.


Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
User currently offlineJbmitt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 547 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9885 times:

Hello..

WN has always had the industry lowest load factor and RPM. Their model allows it, look at reports from previous years. As for price, it is well known that they aren't always the cheapest, however, their prices are predictable. People fly them wanting consistency, and for loyalty. There reward program is one of the easiest and quickest to accomplish.


User currently offlinePVD757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3412 posts, RR: 16
Reply 3, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9787 times:

yes, but I'd bet that $480.00 fare would be there 5 days in advance whereas the other carriers would be pricing out at about a grand...

WN has some things they need to watch out for, but I don't think rethinking thier route map is one of them. I also think they have lots of dots to connect. DEN, IAD, and PIT come to the top of my list of cities where WN has ample dots to add. What about STL & MCI to some east and west coast destinations to allow for more one-stop access to DAL? If WN wanted to, they could push NK aside and lay on a bunch of flights at DTW too. I will partially agree that WN needs to connect some dots that aren't served at all versus adding the umpteenth frequency between BUR and LAS or where-ever. MSY could probably use a few more flights as well. SFO is coming on-line this fall which should provide service to the obvious culprits: LAX, SEA, MDW, PHX, LAS just to start, then they can look at BWI, PHL, HOU, etc. The better they can connect thier system with each other the stronger the smaller stations (like PVD) will perform since there will be new options created by other markets' new flights.

As for MSP, I'm surprised they are not there yet either. The southeast is still a huge hole in thier map too, but where will they go - ATL would be tough, CLT has little room. NYC is the glaring hole - but again how do they get in? I'd like to see some more codeshare action from TZ - they seem to be dormant as of late...


User currently offlineAlphascan From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 937 posts, RR: 13
Reply 4, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9773 times:

Recently, WN has begun to change the strategy that has made it the leader in the domestic industry. At DEN, they are for the first time, adding flights and destinations faster than the marketplace is filling them. Hence, terrible load factors and very low yields vs. the competition. Mr. Kelly was quoted within the past month as saying WN "has not yet grown into the new flights added at DEN", but that does not explain load factors in the low 50s to low 60s for all of the inital DEN markets except HOU, a market with no direct competion.


"To he who only has a hammer in his toolbelt, every problem looks like a nail."
User currently offlineSkyexRamper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9758 times:

Were you booking the lowest possible fares figuring one way fares and some of their other discounted options? Or were you booking full refundable anytime fares?

User currently offlineN471WN From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1531 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9635 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

SkyexRamper asks:

Were you booking the lowest possible fares figuring one way fares and some of their other discounted options? Or were you booking full refundable anytime fares?

Great question and I ALWAYS book the lowest fare offered since I can always spend the "credit" money when I have to cancel as I fly them so much and I love their no penalty---it just amazes me that other carriers get people to cough up the $100 for a change and SWA charges not one dime!! No that was the lowest fare at the time and no sales were going on.


User currently offlineAADC10 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2088 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9620 times:

WN's edge over competitors is eroding and they are running out of profitable new destinations. However, as the legacies move away from bankruptcy, merge or vanish, fares will rise and WN will go back to its usual place as the cheapest flight.

Their load factors are always low, not just because of the new flight to DEN. They will operate even during off hours as long as the flight is still profitable. Fuel is starting to hurt that as the hedges unwind but the WN model depends the aircraft operating as many hours as possible.

The one thing that I think they should consider is overnight transcons. WN has traditionally only operated during the day-evening and performed maintenance overnight, but then again they did not traditionally fly transcons either. I would think that they have enough aircraft to rotate a few for overnight operations.


User currently offlineUnitedMSY From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9480 times:

They're doing just fine the way they are, I like their route network. I fly them once a week JAN-MDW-JAN because:

a.) I do not have to connect, I can actually fly n/s between small cities. It helps for non-rev, and its cheap as rev
b.) MDW is not the most dysfunctional airport in the world like ORD
c.) They're always on-time
d.) They're actually friendly
e.) Their boarding process is quick
f.) We get fed on the planes


User currently offlineAlphascan From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 937 posts, RR: 13
Reply 9, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9382 times:

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 7):
However, as the legacies move away from bankruptcy, merge or vanish, fares will rise and WN will go back to its usual place as the cheapest flight.

As the legacies emerge from Chapter 11 and/or renegotiate their contracts, their costs will be substantially lower than the old days. WNs wages will be amongst the highest in the industry. All the more pressure for WN as their (very astute) fuel hedges expire over the next 21 months.

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 7):
Their load factors are always low, not just because of the new flight to DEN.

Agreed. However, their DEN routes load factors are much, much lower than system average at an airport with some of the highest costs in the nation. Additionally, when initiating service to DEN 15 months ago, WN signed some insanely expensive, long term local market TV sports sponsorship contracts for a carrier that even today only has less than 5% of the market.



"To he who only has a hammer in his toolbelt, every problem looks like a nail."
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22932 posts, RR: 20
Reply 10, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9356 times:

Quoting N471WN (Thread starter):
Look at Jet Blue and Air Tran who are adding destinations and growing much more and achieving higher load factors

Is AirTran growing? They've added several cities, but they've also cut routes in many of their larger markets, such as MDW and DFW.

Quoting PVD757 (Reply 3):
If WN wanted to, they could push NK aside and lay on a bunch of flights at DTW too.

I'm not sure what the problem is, but WN has always been small in Detroit. Whether that's due to NW, NK, or some combination thereof I'm not sure. WN does seem to avoid clashing with NW for some reason, which may have something to with NW's propensity to respond to 'encroachment' with enormous capacity additions and price cuts. Having said that, though, the need to grow may force WN's hand at some point.

Quoting PVD757 (Reply 3):
The southeast is still a huge hole in their map too, but where will they go - ATL would be tough, CLT has little room.

CLT would make room, just as they did for B6. Jerry Orr tells the Observer at least 4 times a year that he badly wants WN. I don't think he's lying.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 11, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 9334 times:

Quoting N471WN (Thread starter):
SWA was always assumed to have the lowest fares in a market

As you learned, that is no longer a valid assumption. Even the big, bad legacy carriers offer some very attractive fares on many routes, even those that dont compete with LCCs, and Southwest is not necessarily the best deal. So much depends on inventory and the exact date that you book and will fly.....but all carriers are competiting head to head now. Also consider that many of the legacies have lowered their costs to the levels once reserved for the LCCs, so they too can offer sharp fares and make money.

Quoting N471WN (Thread starter):
2) I would have to say that this "slow down" by SWA in adding cities has been a mistake. Look at Jet Blue and Air Tran who are adding destinations and growing much more and achieving higher load factors

I am not sure that I agree here....JetBlue and AirTran are also having trouble with their respective expasnions. AirTran has come and gone from many of its new routes and seems to be having trouble on routes that bypass its ATL hub....AirTran has postponed some new aircraft deliveries as well. Some of JetBlue's newest routes out of JFK have not really taken off and at some point in the very near future, JetBlue must look beyond its NYC and BOS strongholds for route development purposes as they have a lot of new airplanes on order that must be put to work....JetBlue has also slowed down the its aircraft deleveries and sold a handful of airplanes to keep its growth under control.

The big issue facing all of the LCCs is the renew strength of the legacies......in the past, when Southwest or JetBlue would enter a route, the legacies would scramble, match fares, loose interest and then drop the route leaving it wide open for the LCC to dominate the market. Thats no longer the case, the legacies are fighting and protecting their markets. For example, when Southwest enetered the PHL market, many thought it was the beginning of the end of US's huge hub operation at that airport.....well US is alive and well and doing quite well at PHL.

Southwest is a little slower to enter new markets for several reasons - under their business plan, they generally like to open a city with atleast 12 to 16 flights per day to atleast 5 or 6 destinations, unlike Air Tran or JetBlue that will open a city with a single route and a single flight. Thus, new cities are added slower and more research is done, I dont think that Southwest is behind the curve, its just more difficult to find new markets where service can be added and profits can be make. MSP is a big market that WN has yet to enter.....as you point out.

Quoting N471WN (Thread starter):
WN had by any measurement a lousy March both in Load Factor and RPM.....I am a 35 year SWA flyer and huge fan (not an employee) but I must say to look at those numbers in comparison to Air Tran and Jet Blue and even Continental, ought to be to them alarming

I wound not be concerned with Southwest's low load factors, one of the interesting aspects of Southwest's operating model is that they generally produce mediocre load factors (lhigh 60s and low 70s is as good as it gets) but since so many of their segments are shorthaul and because they offer frequent service between most city pairs, low load factors are the result. Southwest usually comes up with good financial results even with lower load factors than some of their competitors. As for CO's results, they were outstanding (March....usually not a great month and Easter was NOT in March this year, was simply amazing) but CO runs a very different operation that Southwest, so its difficult to compare just one statistic.

In summary, Southwest will do just fine in the future, but your very astute points are proof that nothing is simple and even an established LCC such as Southwest has many issue to contend with, its not easy, especially with the legacy carriers rebounding.


User currently offlineLuvfa From United States of America, joined May 2005, 446 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 9183 times:

While our load factors are low our yields are high particularly on the short-haul routes. We are able to achieve this due to our convenient schedules. Example: customer in LAX has business trip to PHX. Rather than booking the $59 advanced ticket, he books the full-fare $99 because he knows if his meeting ends early, (or later), he has the flexibility to change flights. More than a few frequent flyers have told me this!

User currently offlineDesertAir From Mexico, joined Jan 2006, 1461 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 9143 times:

Southwest is a godsend here in Tucson, They have multiple flights for connecting and are usually on time. An additional flight to San Diego would be appreciated.

User currently offlineAirlineEcon From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 130 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 9051 times:

Its pretty darn tough for southwest to connect the dots and create new dots becuase many of those routes already have competition. (I'm just speculating on this point, maybe when they expanded more quickly there was lots of competition)

Southwest's competition can predict southwests behavior better than any of us. Whenever there is a threat of southwest entry, they slash fares long before southwest even announces service, and certainly before flights start. That makes it difficult to connect dots and create new ones.


User currently offlineTango-Bravo From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3805 posts, RR: 29
Reply 15, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 8903 times:

Quoting N471WN (Thread starter):
Look at Jet Blue and Air Tran who are adding destinations and growing much more and achieving higher load factors.

So what? Have their profits compared favorably with WN's? (not last time I checked) Moreover, it seems that FL, in particular, has a habit of dropping a city for every new one they add (or nearly so) while B6 has shown a similar tendency, albeit to a lesser degree.


User currently offlineBigJKU From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 880 posts, RR: 12
Reply 16, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 8811 times:

Knowing little about the business of Airlines and how they compete and merge I have a question.

Would any of the big legacy carriers ever try to merge with Southwest? Basically adopt Southwest model for the domestic market and use their current model for the international?

I am sure its a dumb idea but was just curious.


User currently offlineI15846375 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 9 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 8770 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

funny you should mention WN fares, just booked chicago to MCO, flying out on Air Tran and returning on American, beat the price that WN gave me by almost a hundred dollars, and that was for a late June flight. Even the flight out of GYY was cheaper, but the times were not good for me. Sometimes it pays to do your homework and look around, but WN still wins in most of the markets out of Chicago, I still miss ATA though, a lot!

User currently offlineLightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13040 posts, RR: 100
Reply 18, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day ago) and read 8755 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting InnocuousFox (Reply 1):
and in order to serve a "dot" right, you have to have a decent number of initial flights to cover your set-up costs.

 checkmark 
WN only opens "dots" with 10+ flights/day.

As to them needing to change strategy? Maybe. As others have noted WN is a business and thus profits are what really matter. I have no doubt they'll continue to do well.

Quoting Luvfa (Reply 12):
he books the full-fare $99 because he knows if his meeting ends early, (or later), he has the flexibility to change flights. More than a few frequent flyers have told me this!

In a heartbeat. WN's problem is lack of aircraft. That's a classy type of problem to have!  bigthumbsup  They need more cities and better connectivity through their hubs.

Let's put it this way... they'll be very tough to beat once they can hub in Dallas.  Wink


Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlineIloveboeing From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 796 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day ago) and read 8716 times:

Quoting Lightsaber (Reply 18):
Let's put it this way... they'll be very tough to beat once they can hub in Dallas.

Maybe WN could move to DFW and build a massive hub out of there to compete with AA. I'm not being anti-Love Field or anything, but there are some advantages that WN could get out of DFW. DFW's sheer size allows plenty of room for expansion, just like DEN, and they could draw on traffic from both Dallas and Fort Worth. DFW did say they would build WN their own terminal and free rent. Maybe they could take advantage of that.

I've been through DFW a few times on AA recently and it has drastically improved from how it used to be, especially with the Skylink. It could be an awesome base for WN.


User currently offlineLightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13040 posts, RR: 100
Reply 20, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day ago) and read 8691 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Iloveboeing (Reply 19):
I've been through DFW a few times on AA recently and it has drastically improved from how it used to be, especially with the Skylink. It could be an awesome base for WN.

Maybe... but AA would have a huge allergic reaction to WN entering "their turf." I'm not a fan of split opperations (no connectivity).

But WN does need a larger "mid-America" hub. Until the Northeast/midwest is filled out more, a hub up there doesn't make sense.

Its all good. Competition is an excellent thing.  Smile

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlineIloveboeing From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 796 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day ago) and read 8684 times:

Quoting Lightsaber (Reply 20):
Maybe... but AA would have a huge allergic reaction to WN entering "their turf." I'm not a fan of split opperations (no connectivity).

Yeah, there would definately be a huge fare war at DFW. The consumers would win, though. Here's a farfetched idea.......build an underground high-speed train link between DFW and DAL (all inside security). This could allow connections. It's only about 8 miles from DFW to DAL, right? That would be cool!


User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day ago) and read 8660 times:

Quoting N471WN (Thread starter):
SWA was always assumed to have the lowest fares in a marke



Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 11):
As you learned, that is no longer a valid assumption.

...nor was it ever.

Even in the 1999-2001 era, during record fatcat profits for the Legacies and my time as a po'-ass college student... I could always find better fares to the West Coast, New York, Florida, and Texas on the likes of DL and CO than I could on WN, given a few days prior research/booking. Always.


User currently offlineUSAir330 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 824 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day ago) and read 8656 times:

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 11):
. For example, when Southwest enetered the PHL market, many thought it was the beginning of the end of US's huge hub operation at that airport.....well US is alive and well and doing quite well at PHL.

You're right US is alive but WN still has a big effect in PHL. We don't loose as many bags as US and the people I work with actually enjoy there job and we take pride in what we do. We currently have 8 gates at PHL and we're not done yet.      

[Edited 2007-04-06 03:38:39]

User currently offlineMtnWest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2458 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (7 years 5 months 1 day ago) and read 8611 times:

Quoting I15846375 (Reply 17):
funny you should mention WN fares, just booked chicago to MCO, flying out on Air Tran and returning on American, beat the price that WN gave me by almost a hundred dollars, and that was for a late June flight. Even the flight out of GYY was cheaper, but the times were not good for me. Sometimes it pays to do your homework and look around, but WN still wins in most of the markets out of Chicago, I still miss ATA though, a lot!

But what is the penalty if you have to change, or not go at all?



"If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
25 Post contains images TSS : Terminal F, or maybe Terminal G? Exactly. Indeed it is, and that explains why there are no flights on WN headed West from BHM before 12:30 pm: Not la
26 Tango-Bravo : And who remained profitable during the years 2001-2005 while the legacies were posting annual losses in 9 figures (ie hundreds of million$) and billi
27 Post contains images SANFan : Not by me. Ever. It's not at all unusual to find cheaper (or equal) fares to WN; it's always been that way. As many have said, however, what do chang
28 Flyboy7974 : Correction about BHM, there's a 930am to DAL, a 1005am to HOU, a 735am to STL, and a 910am to BNA with connections westward. SWA wouldn't operate a st
29 EXMEMWIDGET : Huh? What do they feed you on SW?
30 TSS : My apologies; I didn't specify Saturday as my day of choice. According to the WN website, the first flight West out of BHM on Saturdays departs at 12
31 MSYtristar : Well, I can sort of explain this specific route. WN has far fewer connections in that market now than what they did a couple of years ago. They even
32 TWAmbassador : I have always wondered why WN moved into DEN. This totally goes against their business model of serving under-served airports and creating new markets
33 SANFan : I don't agree with you at all TWA'. I've mentioned before in the on-going DEN/WN discussion that Denver is not only an originating point but also a d
34 Swatpamike : Hello All Working in MCO for WN most flights are going to be booked way in advanced in the April-August time frame if you are talking about Thursday-S
35 Jetfuel : I am happy to pay more to fly Southwest. I feel like a customer and not a piece of cargo. I always feel they appreciate my custom and have never let m
36 Itsnotfinals : On flights over 3 hours you get a snack pack that other airlines sell for $3. typically you get peanuts, and a snack pack.
37 Drerx7 : I don't know how valid that is though, IAH is just across town so I would still consider it a market with heavy competition. There is just a large de
38 Richierich : I agree with your whole, well thought out post. Good job! While FL is cutting some cities and adding others, they are also growing. They are still ac
39 MasseyBrown : Yes. March year-over-year numbers RPM up 22.2%, capacity up 22.9%.
40 ConcordeBoy : Here's a better question: who'd care about any of that when searching for the lowest fare on any particular day? Chicago may disagree
41 Richierich : If that's accurate, then that is hardly "small" growth as I had indicated in a previous post!
42 Jetdeltamsy : Absolutely not true. Legacy carriers frequently undercut Southwest. I wil grant you that legacy carriers don't bring prices down to LCC levels until
43 ScottB : Well, first of all, I'm not entirely sure I agree that their March load factor was lousy. Yes, it was down 2.2 points year-over-year, but March 2006
44 Tango-Bravo : Certainly not airline customers to whom "all that matters is price." However, IIRC, the subject of this topic is the suggestion that the business pla
45 Post contains images Swatpamike : Hello All The lack of extra planes, I think. You are correct BUT how soon could WN acquire these extra 40 737's???? Time is money also. Consolidation
46 ConcordeBoy : Ever heard of anyone avoiding WN due to lack of premium classes and lounges? ...contrast that to the number of people who've vocally patronized them
47 JAAlbert : I agree that SWA is not always the cheapest. I recently flew to Nashville from San Diego and my airfare with AA was much cheaper than that offered by
48 MSYtristar : That is questionable at best considering UA's and F9's large presence at the airport. If the airport was underserved in some way, or if F9 was half a
49 TVNWZ : They are hedged for several years out at various percentages. They have continued hedging as prices remained volatile, but at a higher price. Those h
50 ScottB : Well, one would also need to take into account the potential impact on the corporate culture of taking on some number of AirTran employees who haven'
51 MSYtristar : I think Southwest will find some success in DEN, but due to the competitiveness of the market as it stands, I just don't see them making huge strides
52 Alphascan : Well that's half the point. The other half is forcing growth without profit is a departure from the way WN used to build up a new city.
53 Mcofreak : WN is adding gates in DEN, the amount of gates WN will have will give them the potential to go over 100 flts a day I think????? WN is smart and if the
54 Post contains images B52murph : Yes....but is there any real reason for them to move to DFW, when they can still expand @ DAL? I know the old BN rotunda was recently torn down, but
55 Post contains links DCA-ROCguy : As a (humorous) side note--in many ways WN is already on American's 'turf' at DAL; isn't the Green (West) Concourse the old AA concourse pre-DFW? Inde
56 Tsaord : You sound like a Tiger student from Chicago lol.....get it lol. If I attend school there I will max out credits on the MDW/Jan route for sure!!
57 Post contains links Mariner : Although DIA is building eight additonal gates on Concourse C, Southwest's CEO Kelly has not made a firm commitment to any of them. http://www.denver
58 AsstChiefMark : I distinctly remember the last time a WN aircraft landed at MSP. It was a charter. Well, it caused such a commotion that at least one Twin Cities tel
59 SkyexRamper : In a perfect world, yes they could without a problem. With standard 20min or less Southwest turns, thats 15 flights per hour, it would take just over
60 SW733 : I absolutely love Southwest, I fly them almost any chance I get...the key word being almost. The first place I look for plane tickets if I am going to
61 Cjpark : Southwest is paying for extras it does not use at airports all over the country. Why should DFW had been any different?
62 Mariner : Wow, that sounds very tight. I'd be interested to see them try 20 flights per gate per day at DEN in winter I had read - here on a.net - that they ru
63 Post contains images Ikramerica : I'll take that bet...
64 SANFan : You're right Mariner, 5 gates will never handle 100 flights -- optimally, 50, pushing it to maybe 60-65-ish. I'm not sure if you, 'Ramper, are seriou
65 InnocuousFox : Yeah... turn time for an aircraft is different than the turn time for the gate itself. Everything has to be positioned - like the departing luggage,
66 Post contains images SANFan : One other thing I didn't mention before that effectively reduces WN's workable optimum from 15 flights/day down to about 10 is the gate "down time" o
67 Tsaord : I have traveled with them on the Mdw-LAS route four times and I must say I just feel right at home with them. The staff and crews just seem more casu
68 SkyexRamper : 5 Jetways all feed be a generic boarding area instead of 5 seperate gates.
69 JAAlbert : DFW's Terminal D is a white elephant? My understanding is that the term refers to a large, often expensive, structure that has no use. The last time
70 Brons2 : There is slack capacity elsewhere at the airport. The extra expansion gates provided by Terminal D were not necessary, especially considering the dep
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Jetblue: Time To ReThink Route Strategy posted Wed Jun 1 2005 16:55:13 by Padcrasher
What Route Is PIA Going To Use Their 777's? posted Fri Nov 21 2003 19:07:22 by PIA777
Somebody Needs To Tell This Citiation Driver posted Thu Mar 8 2007 07:51:19 by L-188
Virgin Atlantic Might Want To Rethink Its Slogan posted Wed Jan 10 2007 13:46:26 by Leelaw
Why Southwest Needs Assigned Seating posted Fri Jan 5 2007 08:00:23 by Osubuckeyes
MacArthur Airport (ISP) Tower Needs To Be Replaced posted Wed Dec 13 2006 22:27:14 by Dragon-wings
IB To Start New Route To Algiers posted Fri Nov 24 2006 00:39:06 by Bullpitt
When Is Airbus Going To Update Their Website? posted Sun Nov 12 2006 05:40:44 by Dougloid
Air NZ Makes Changes To Unprofitable Pacific Route posted Wed Oct 25 2006 05:26:28 by NZ748
China Eastern To Continue Dhaka Route posted Thu Oct 5 2006 20:09:29 by 777way