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MSY Still On AC Route Map...why?  
User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6560 posts, RR: 51
Posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 4577 times:

I was snooping around Air Canada's chunk of the web a few minutes ago and I noticed that our fair city is still listed on the interactive route map for the U.S. Of course, there's no line connecting it to YYZ anymore, but the city is still listed. And no, it's not because it's a code share city. You'd think that after a year and a half of not serving the market AC would at least have the decency to remove it from its route map. It took TA about six months to take MSY off of its route map, and we were quickly gone from F9's and YX's. So AC, I suggest this.

Please restore service to YYZ at some point this year, or if y'all have no intention to, please remove us from your route map and let the memories of the glory days down here fade into the past.

Thank you.

36 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6560 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 4520 times:

And for those of you who don't know, AC had nearly a 7-year stint here....10/98 to 8/05. A relatively short but sweet run.

AC service to New Orleans started in October 1998 to much fanfare. Initial service was a daily DC-9-30 to YYZ.


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Photo © Thomas Moore



After the AC/CP merger, AC decided to send CP to do the MSY turns. Daily 737-200 service replaced the AC DC-9. Double daily service ( 1x 732, 1x 319) was planned, but never flown. This hybrid aircraft was commonplace here for some time.


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Eventually, AC replaced the 732 with a 319. It stayed as such for several years, sometimes being upgraded to a 320 during peak seasons.


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Photo © Andy P. Jung



For the last year of its existence, give or take a couple of months, the service was flown with AC Jazz CRJ-200 aircraft. The flight was weight restricted quite often, usually only able to carry 35 passenger on the roughly 2.5 hour flight. In Summer '05 the route was seeing a mix of CRA's and CRJ's (and even a few 319's again), perhaps signifying a new upgrade in service which was sorely lacking in the market. Of course, that all changed on 8/29/05. And the rest, as they say, is history.


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User currently offlineC0ex From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 50 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 4502 times:

Could it be that it is servered by there partner United? Sometimes airlines will put the destinations that there partners only serve. I know CO does that.


theRightchoice
User currently offlineMattRB From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1624 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 4448 times:

It's odd. I'm just checking the map and there are a few places like that (GRR, RIC, CHS, DAY).

Perhaps service might be coming back in the short term as a seasonal deal (hopefully on a E75 instead of the CR2/CRA) and that's why they haven't yet removed it from the map.

Could always drop an email to Customer Service and see if they could find out why it's still there.

Don't know if this could play any part in it:

Some routes or destinations served by Air Canada may not appear on this map due to seasonal service. Routes are subject to change based on demand or seasonal requirements.



Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible.
User currently offlineC0ex From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 50 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 4444 times:

Quoting MattRB (Reply 3):
Some routes or destinations served by Air Canada may not appear on this map due to seasonal service. Routes are subject to change based on demand or seasonal requirements.

thats probally the reason. If the numbers start to pick up, there will probally be a daily flight with a crj-200



theRightchoice
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26444 posts, RR: 75
Reply 5, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 4411 times:

Quoting C0ex (Reply 2):
Could it be that it is servered by there partner United?

Not unless you connect.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 4312 times:

Quoting MSYtristar (Thread starter):
and let the memories of the glory days down here fade into the past.

....depressed sweetie? I feel ya.

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 1):
Double daily service ( 1x 732, 1x 319) was planned, but never flown.

Planned twice, made it into the schedules once-- and then came SARS.

Quoting MattRB (Reply 3):

Perhaps service might be coming back in the short term as a seasonal deal (hopefully on a E75 instead of the CR2/CRA) and that's why they haven't yet removed it from the map.

Some moron was on here a while back talking about YYZ EMBjet service, as well as YUL and YYC. Remember who that was Steve?


User currently offlineBmacleod From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 2262 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4209 times:

The E75 would be ideal for YYZ-MSY provided AC sees a sustainable market for it.


The engine is the heart of an airplane, but the pilot is its soul.
User currently offlineTom in NO From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 7194 posts, RR: 33
Reply 8, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4181 times:

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 1):
For the last year of its existence, give or take a couple of months, the service was flown with AC Jazz CRJ-200 aircraft.

They also graced us a few times with CRJ-700's.

We had an ERJ-175 IAH diversion in here a few months back, so at least we know they still exist  wink 

Tom at MSY



"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4174 times:

Quoting Tom in NO (Reply 8):
so at least we know they still exist

...or most likely, vice versa


User currently offlineWNCrew From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1457 posts, RR: 10
Reply 10, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4174 times:

Does MSY have the demand to fulfill everyone's dreams of all of these airlines returning to their pre-katrina levels? Seriously I read SOOOO much whining on this board about how airline X had abandoned MSY or how airline Y shafted the MSY market for this other market. It's business! New Orleans is NOT the end-all-be-all destination of the US where everyone should fly to. Stop the whining and accept things for what they are, reality.

And before someone goes OFF on me attacking their home, I am from Louisiana. Born in Jennings, went to elementary in N.O and Lake Charles, went to Middle school in Buras, graduated Highschool in Houma and my family still lives there.



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4153 times:

Quoting WNCrew (Reply 10):
And before someone goes OFF on me attacking their home, I am from Louisiana.

...and that abstains you from (regional/operational) ignorance how?


User currently offlineN353SK From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 821 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4146 times:

Quoting WNCrew (Reply 10):
I read SOOOO much whining on this board about how airline X had abandoned MSY or how airline Y shafted the MSY market for this other market.

And I've read SOOOO much more complaining from people saying the exact same things as you  Yeah sure


User currently offlineWNCrew From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1457 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4140 times:

I just don't get WHY people complain about the "emotional" side of air services and NOT remember the operational side. Airlines go where there is money....PERIOD. People ascribe this attitude to the airlines as if they're "neglecting" poor ole' MSY. But that's clearly not how it works. That's not to say it doesn't SUCK, or it doesn't make people mad that things arent the way they were but no sense in acting as if the airlines are abandoning some great GOLD pot! They're not, they're simply going where they can make money and reinstating service as they see fiscally and operationaly feasible.


ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineWNCrew From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1457 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4135 times:

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 11):

...and that abstains you from (regional/operational) ignorance how?

We're ALL ignorant. I never professed to be an airport manager. I'm just pointing out that people seem to have their emotions involved where emotions don't fit in.



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4089 times:

Quoting WNCrew (Reply 14):
I'm just pointing out that people seem to have their emotions involved where emotions don't fit in.

...apparently, yourself included.

In such a rush to criticize (or worse "analyze", or at least, poorly attempt thereto) that you base your argument nigh solely on the action of a single airline; while seeming to forget that every one of the carriers who've matched/exceeded their pre-Katrina status here are not only exceptionally adept at right-sizing market patronage, but also..................wait on it.................. PROFITABLE.


User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6560 posts, RR: 51
Reply 16, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4054 times:

Quoting WNCrew (Reply 10):
New Orleans is NOT the end-all-be-all destination of the US where everyone should fly to. Stop the whining and accept things for what they are, reality.

Dude, two things.

1) I certainly have never claimed MSY to be the end-all-be-all destination of the U.S. Neither has N1120A, Tom in NO, ConcordeBoy, or MSYguy. Where are you getting that one from?

2) Who the $%&# is whining? I was reminiscing, not whining. Besides, us still being on AC's route map interested me, no more, no less.


User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 4003 times:

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 16):
Neither has N1120A

...she's still around??


User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4930 posts, RR: 43
Reply 18, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 3926 times:

I was at a Flight Operations meeting a few weeks back, and a question was raised: "With 2 E190s a month being delivered, where exactly will they be going?"

There were many routes mentioned, some that stuck in my mind, and remember, they are just rumour at this point, were: YYZ-ONT, YYZ-AND CURRENT: Austin - Bergstrom International (AFB) (AUS / KBSM), USA - Texas">AUS and YYZ-MSY!

It was also mentioned though, that it may be that YYZ-SAN is on its last legs. It just doesn't have the numbers to support the A319, and while the passengers raved about the E190, it is just slightly beyond the capability of the aircraft to carry 93 passengers AND their bags to SAN ... oh well.

[Edited 2007-04-13 03:30:34]


Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineSan747 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4942 posts, RR: 12
Reply 19, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3907 times:

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 18):
There were many routes mentioned, some that stuck in my mind, and remember, they are just rumour at this point, were: YYZ-ONT, YYZ-AND CURRENT: Austin - Bergstrom International (AFB) (AUS / KBSM), USA - Texas">AUS and YYZ-MSY!

It was also mentioned though, that it may be that YYZ-SAN is on its last legs. It just doesn't have the numbers to support the A319, and while the passengers raved about the E190, it is just slightly beyond the capability of the aircraft to carry 93 passengers AND their bags to SAN ... oh well.

A restart of YYZ-ONT sounds compelling, I hope if that happens it can last longer than 3 months. The Inland Empire is a lot bigger now, and ONT is developing as a reasonable alternative airport for LA.

I must say though, that last paragraph about SAN is NOT what I like to hear... Can any other SAN person confirm or deny this? ...Anyway, YYZ-SAN is back on the A319, and if you look at the flight history-

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA779/history (YYZ-SAN)
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA780/history (SAN-YYZ)

They even subbed in an A320 last week.



Scotty doesn't know...
User currently offlineHockey55dude From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 213 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3864 times:

I don't know the numbers, But when I flew YYZ-SAN it was packed. It was an OK flight.

User currently offlineSan747 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4942 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3862 times:

Quoting Hockey55dude (Reply 20):

I don't know the numbers, But when I flew YYZ-SAN it was packed. It was an OK flight.

Was it the E-190 or an A319? I've heard the E-190s are great comfort and IFE-wise.



Scotty doesn't know...
User currently offlineLongHauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4930 posts, RR: 43
Reply 22, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 3799 times:

The A319 is now flying YYZ-SAN-YYZ for the summer. Not for increased passenger loads, but due to restrictions placed on the E190. Remember, full flights are not necessarily profitable flights. Apparently the decision is pending on whether YYZ-SAN-YYZ continues past the Autumn this year.


Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
User currently offlineFLYACYYZ From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 1914 posts, RR: 12
Reply 23, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3770 times:

YYZ-SAN-YYZ needs to adjust its departure/arrival times reminiscent of the original schedule & similar to the YYZ-SEA-YYZ schedule. Evening departure ex YYZ, and morning departure ex SAN to increase connection opportunities to Europe and Tel Aviv.

What is it with AC and Austin, TX?? On its original go-around loads were abysmal. I think on the heels of DFW & IAH, SAT would be the next logical destination in Texas--great tourist and convention destination.

There are still a large number of passengers who fly YYZ-LAX and drive to PSP. ONT would succeed if marketed properly, and promoted as an alternative gateway to PSP.

[Edited 2007-04-13 16:50:00]


Above and Beyond
User currently offlineMSYguy From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 113 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3770 times:

Quoting WNCrew (Reply 13):
I just don't get WHY people complain about the "emotional" side of air services and NOT remember the operational side. Airlines go where there is money....PERIOD. People ascribe this attitude to the airlines as if they're "neglecting" poor ole' MSY. But that's clearly not how it works. That's not to say it doesn't SUCK, or it doesn't make people mad that things arent the way they were but no sense in acting as if the airlines are abandoning some great GOLD pot! They're not, they're simply going where they can make money and reinstating service as they see fiscally and operationaly feasible.

I'm sick of this attitude. What you wrongly characterize as "whining" is, in reality, a discussion of the FACTS and a REASONED ARGUMENT. I won't rehash either here. Go look at them from my (and others') prior posts on the topic. If you have a reasoned rebuttal of these facts and arguments, please share it. I'm all for good faith discussion. But STOP accusing me and others falsely of whining and STOP mischaracterizing what we have said.


25 MSYtristar : If memory serves, his handle was "TIMEAIR".
26 ConcordeBoy : hmm, still a (somewhat) active member--- be interested to get a commentary on that "assessment"
27 PExDCA : There are a lot of people with powder rooms wallpapered in their worthless Braniff, Pan Am, Eastern, Air Florida, Midway, etc. stock certificates who
28 MainMAN : Is this site just about the sterile operational side of airliners and the airlines that operate them? I don't think so. It's also about connectivity
29 PExDCA : I agree... the MSY threads on here have always been based in fact and on first-hand observation. I will also add that given the post-Katrina environm
30 Threepoint : I'm not sure we can question his regional knowledge. No, he specifically mentioned 'airlines' (plural) at least a half-dozen times. Are these terms o
31 ConcordeBoy : Newsflash: just did ...regardless as to how he may view said "whining", such dialogue essentially only revolves around a single airline in question a
32 Post contains images PExDCA : I'm curious... what kind of bait do you use to catch a moniker? Perhaps a lure would be more effective?
33 SANFan : I've got a theory for you 'tristar: the person (in charge of the AC route map) who has left MSY ON the map is the same one who has NEVER put SAN on t
34 FLYACYYZ : The SAN connundrum never ceases to amaze me. Any flight I have ever operated whether it be A319 or E190 has been virtually 100% full. Yes, the loads d
35 San747 : I wonder that myself... Why doesn't AC move to either another part of Terminal 1, or even better, somewhere in Terminal 2, so that Canadians getting
36 AAflyguy : I think a nonstop YYZ-PSP during season would be successful, if marketed properly. I certainly hope that this marketing by certain carriers to use ONT
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