Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Frontier Coming To FWA!?  
User currently offlineGeorgebush From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 679 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4583 times:

Does anyone know if Frontier will be coming to Fort Wayne?? I have heard so many rumors and now rumors of bids going around between the airlines here at FWA. I know my company has been asking us if we would be willing to ground handle the two 170's each day to DEN. I cant wait to see how this all turns out but F9 service to FWA would be a knockout!


Al Gore invented global warming.
80 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25698 posts, RR: 85
Reply 1, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4499 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Given the success of Frontier's new DEN-Louisville service, as with all their heartland routes, Fort Wayne might be a very good idea, so maybe they are looking around for more of the same?

I don't think FWA is on the list of airports with whom Frontier is negotiating, but that could have changed after SDF. But - I'm not sure they have anough aircraft to do it, at least by summer. The fleets - Airbus and Embraer - are going flat chat.

Could it be United? Although I'm not sure why they would need additional ground handling.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11154 posts, RR: 59
Reply 2, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4448 times:

There was a thread recently about UA possibly starting DEN-FWA.


"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineATAIndy From United States of America, joined May 2004, 615 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4438 times:

Here is the thread:

FWA-DEN On UA Express Coming Soon?



Boiler up! - Next flights: IND-DFW-AUS, AUS-DFW-IND
User currently offlineSkyrat From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 173 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 4324 times:

I have also heard that F9 is in talks with a few companies for the ground handling contract. I hear that the airport pretty much has it wrapped up and they are waiting for F9 to come out and annouce it. What I'm wondering is, will United respond to F9 coming to FWA if indeed they do come?


flown:146,a319,a320,717,722,733,735,738,744,752,763,772,crj2,crj7,crj9,dc9,dc10,e135,e145,e170,e175,frj,md80
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4277 times:

I couldn't see FWA-DEN supporting more than a 50 seat a/c, and IIRC Frontier's smallest is the CR7, correct? Not to mention F9's connectivity at DEN just isn't quite the same as UA's.

User currently offlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3833 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4259 times:

Gosh, I hope that this is true. We might go out to Seattle in August, and F9 would make it easy and cheap to get there. I don't care if it's an E170 operated by Republic... I just want more (and cheaper) options out West and to the Mexican resort destinations. When I see Dave Young this Tuesday, I'll be sure to ask.

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 4):
What I'm wondering is, will United respond to F9 coming to FWA if indeed they do come?

I wouldn't be surprised if UA does respond...



"Did he really need the triple bypass? Or was it the miles?"
User currently offlineSkyrat From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 173 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4255 times:

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 5):
I couldn't see FWA-DEN supporting more than a 50 seat a/c, and IIRC Frontier's smallest is the CR7, correct? Not to mention F9's connectivity at DEN just isn't quite the same as UA's.

You would be surprised just how many PAX travel to DEN from FWA. Not to mention all the western connections. G4 is doing so well in FWA, that they are adding a 3rd flight a week to LAS. Their SFB, PIE flights also go out full. Then you have to look at MQ and their DFW flights that go out full pretty much every day. Also many people are feud up with ORD, DTW, and ATL. FWA support DEN service without a doubt!



flown:146,a319,a320,717,722,733,735,738,744,752,763,772,crj2,crj7,crj9,dc9,dc10,e135,e145,e170,e175,frj,md80
User currently offlineSkyrat From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 173 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4247 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 6):
I don't care if it's an E170 operated by Republic

They sure beat the 50 seat RJs that we have now in FWA!! The E170 is a very PAX friendly aircraft.



flown:146,a319,a320,717,722,733,735,738,744,752,763,772,crj2,crj7,crj9,dc9,dc10,e135,e145,e170,e175,frj,md80
User currently offlineATAIndy From United States of America, joined May 2004, 615 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4188 times:

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 4):
What I'm wondering is, will United respond to F9 coming to FWA if indeed they do come?

That will surely over saturate the market and doom one of the carriers in FWA won't it?

-Feister



Boiler up! - Next flights: IND-DFW-AUS, AUS-DFW-IND
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2018 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days ago) and read 4141 times:

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 8):
They sure beat the 50 seat RJs that we have now in FWA!! The E170 is a very PAX friendly aircraft.

You can say that again! The E70 is a wonderful aircraft. Mainline comfort on a regional. I just hope that when the Horizon contract ends, they send the E70 to BIL. Right now, the schedule still doesn't list a date for the BIL service to transition, so I wonder it BIL will become a Lynx DH4 destination instead.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineEjmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4085 times:

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 7):
Also many people are feud up with ORD, DTW, and ATL.

I agree with you on ORD and ATL. Why would someone be fed up with DTW? It is one of the nicest facilities in the country, and has nowhere near the delays that ORD or ATL has.



"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23306 posts, RR: 20
Reply 12, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4065 times:

Quoting Georgebush (Thread starter):
I know my company has been asking us if we would be willing to ground handle the two 170's each day to DEN.

Wouldn't whoever is handling the YV flights now handle any UA DEN service? Heck, even if it's mainline, an express carrier can do it if it's just a few flights.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineGeorgebush From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 679 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4026 times:

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 7):
You would be surprised just how many PAX travel to DEN from FWA. Not to mention all the western connections. G4 is doing so well in FWA, that they are adding a 3rd flight a week to LAS. Their SFB, PIE flights also go out full. Then you have to look at MQ and their DFW flights that go out full pretty much every day. Also many people are feud up with ORD, DTW, and ATL. FWA support DEN service without a doubt!

Yes I know that if they come it will be two flights daily. They already asked us at work about our schedules for a morning and evening DEN flight.

I also doubt that United would respond with DEN service, because their passengers going there now are mostly west coast connections, and I doubt those folks would want to lose their 1k status with UA to start flying on F9. UA knows this and I think they have bigger things on their agenda then adding DEN flights out of FWA.

Quoting ATAIndy (Reply 9):
That will surely over saturate the market and doom one of the carriers in FWA won't it?

No it wont. It will finally stop so many Fort Wayners from driving to INDY! (no offense) to catch their cheaper flights on WN or F9

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 6):
When I see Dave Young this Tuesday, I'll be sure to ask.



Ask him about his meetings with Kristina Holmes (Community and Government Affairs Manager FWA) I know that she was out in DEN this week, on business, most likely negotiations lets hope!!

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 5):
couldn't see FWA-DEN supporting more than a 50 seat a/c, and IIRC Frontier's smallest is the CR7

"If you build it, they will come" I also believe that Frontier's smallest aircraft would be the E170 operated by Shuttle America. I'm not sure who operates their 700's if they indeed have them, which I dont think they do.



Al Gore invented global warming.
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11154 posts, RR: 59
Reply 14, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4004 times:

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 13):
I also doubt that United would respond with DEN service, because their passengers going there now are mostly west coast connections, and I doubt those folks would want to lose their 1k status with UA to start flying on F9. UA knows this and I think they have bigger things on their agenda then adding DEN flights out of FWA.

Actually, UA has been doing quite a bit of expansion east of Denver as of late.

They started Huntsville, AL in February and are starting Dayton, OH and Raleigh-Durham, NC this Tuesday.



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2018 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 4000 times:

Quoting Ejmmsu (Reply 11):
Why would someone be fed up with DTW? It is one of the nicest facilities in the country, and has nowhere near the delays that ORD or ATL has.

Absolutely agreed that Detroit is one of if not THE nicest facility in the country. However, I think people being fed up on that one is more that they are fed up with Northwest Airlines, not DTW itself.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineEjmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3974 times:

Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 15):
However, I think people being fed up on that one is more that they are fed up with Northwest Airlines

Why is that? NW has been near or at the top among the legacies in least customer compliants, on-time performance, and least baggage problems.



"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2018 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3952 times:

Quoting Ejmmsu (Reply 16):
Why is that? NW has been near or at the top among the legacies in least customer compliants, on-time performance, and least baggage problems.

I don't know. I've kind of wondered that myself. Both here in Florida and back in my home state of Montana, everyone seems to have a special sort of hatred for Northwest. But, that could also be because both of those states are generally Delta-dominated. I have only flown NW on one occasion, and I found them OK. Nothing special (no DL or CO), but not awful, either. Nothing to complain about, but also nothing to brag about. However, I must say, NW's telephone reservation people are BY FAR the best in the business. However, although they are top in DOT statistics, they also consistently rate low in other ratings (i.e. consumer product ratings), for example, they were second or third from the bottom in the JD Power and Associates airline ratings.

[Edited 2007-04-21 07:47:37]


Good goes around!
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3910 times:

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 13):

"If you build it, they will come" I also believe that Frontier's smallest aircraft would be the E170 operated by Shuttle America. I'm not sure who operates their 700's if they indeed have them, which I dont think they do.

They've had CRJ-700's for quite some time, alot longer than the newbie E-170's.


User currently offlineGeorgebush From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 679 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3835 times:

Who operates the 700's?


Al Gore invented global warming.
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2018 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 3831 times:

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 19):
Who operates the 700's?

Horizon Air operates the CRJ-700's.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineSkyrat From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 173 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 3768 times:

Quoting Ejmmsu (Reply 11):
Why would someone be fed up with DTW

9E is always late. I don't think the first two flights ever go out ontime.

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 13):
and I doubt those folks would want to lose their 1k status with UA to start flying on F9

Exactly the reason to add flights to compete against F9 and not lose any 1k's to them.



flown:146,a319,a320,717,722,733,735,738,744,752,763,772,crj2,crj7,crj9,dc9,dc10,e135,e145,e170,e175,frj,md80
User currently offlineEjmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3742 times:

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 21):
9E is always late. I don't think the first two flights ever go out ontime.

The first two FWA-DTW flights of today and yesterday were all early.



"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
User currently offlineGeorgebush From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 679 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3691 times:

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 21):
Exactly the reason to add flights to compete against F9 and not lose any 1k's to them.

Ok dude, I know how much you want OO DEN flights, but its not realistic. Besides the 1K's which thrown into the whole population of DEN goer's is very slim, who is going to pay 100 to 200 percent MORE to fly to DEN on UA when they can jump on a F9 DEN flight which is likely to be more reliable, more comfortable (E170), and less expensive. UA may be able to offer DEN service but not near the price of what F9 can...



Al Gore invented global warming.
User currently offlineNosedive From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3656 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 6):
I wouldn't be surprised if UA does respond...

Yup, just like UA did on LIT, BNA, MEM, SDF....

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 7):
Also many people are feud up with ORD, DTW, and ATL.

Profits before pity.

Quoting Skyrat (Reply 21):
Quoting Georgebush (Reply 13):and I doubt those folks would want to lose their 1k status with UA to start flying on F9
Exactly the reason to add flights to compete against F9 and not lose any 1k's to them.

You're joking right?


25 Skyrat : I'm pretty sure I know a little more about where UA Pax are going to than you do. DEN is one of our most popular destinations for UA out of FWA. Also
26 Tedex : How about a couple CRJ-200s to MKE?
27 Tornado82 : Your best hope there is probably whatever Midwest's smallest will be going onward, the Beech or whatever.
28 Georgebush : Yea, and a nonstop direct DEN flight on Frontier, a lot cheaper than a UAX flight, would be Christmas to those folks! My point... Why would UA add a
29 Georgebush : Right on! Are you joking!? DTW could freaking give pax free PlayStation Three's as they get off their flights, but thats not going to change their de
30 FWAERJ : That would still backfire, as most people want Nintendo Wiis, not PS3s... As much as I'd like to see Midwest come here, I think that FWA is rather lo
31 Skyrat : Since OO is now a Midwest Connect carrier, I can see them adding more OO stations to there route map.
32 Tornado82 : You act as if F9 is oh-so-cheap to fly on, but they're not in many instances, and they're costs will NOT be low running DEN-FWA. UA could compete wit
33 FWAERJ : I forgot to add one thing: FWA loses over 50% of potential pax to IND due to the huge LCC presence at IND, and I think that at one point recently, it
34 Ejmmsu : Please back yourself up with some statistics. If DTW was so delay prone, then NW wouldn't have been the top legacy in on-time performance. DTW's runw
35 Georgebush : Ok I bet you could ask ANYONE on this website and ask them if a FWA-DEN ticket would be cheaper on F9 or on UA and I know that YOU know which one of
36 TAN FLYR : Well..As a former Fort Wayner, To me it makes more sense for UA to put an Express flight or 2 into FWA than Frontier. But hey, our here are FAT we tho
37 Georgebush : So its normal for them to delay their flights almost two hours? And how can I give you facts to prove that they have delayed flights!? Id be copying
38 Nosedive : So... by your logic UA should pack up DEN entirely. Granted, DEN has lost UA flights in the past few yrs, but still. Companies adapt. Hehe, you and y
39 Floridaflyboy : Statistically, I believe Ejmmsu is absolutely correct, that ORD is much more delay prone than DTW. However, some of 9E's routes are INCREDIBLY delay
40 KingCavalier : This could simply siphon off UA's ORD traffic. UA has not added a SDF-DEN to compete with F9 there. I have to disagree with your statement. F9 took a
41 Georgebush : Lets see DTW handle as many flights as ORD does, and who can do it better... Sir, those would be UA MAINLINE flights. FWA (small little city in north
42 FATFlyer : Somehow, for whatever the reason, Frontier missed in this market. Jan 2007 was 38%LF for Frontier which is during the 2nd slowest month at FAT and wa
43 Ejmmsu : Luckily for passengers who chose to connect in DTW over ORD, DTW doesn't even try.
44 Nosedive : Well aware where FWA is, thanks. You stated: Nothing about mainline/express in there. So don't get all in a huff when people tell you things. Other e
45 Flyinryan99 : You may get traffic from the Western Ohio counties but you're not going to get passengers driving from TOL. I say that because Frontier is already of
46 Georgebush : FWA is in a great position geographically to become like DAY. Our facilities are state of the art, heck our runway is long enough for the space shutt
47 Mariner : At the risk of hijacking the thread, I don"t think Frontier did "miss the market". I think they got exactly the market that is there. While I was hop
48 Georgebush : Unless your a nerd like us, sorry me; I'll speak for myself on this one!
49 Mariner : Hmmm? I don't understand that, sorry. I was responding to FATFlyer. ??? mariner
50 Georgebush : I was just saying that I wouldnt mind flying FAT-DEN-SLC just to be in the air more!
51 Post contains images Mariner : I'm with you there, I'll always choose a route with a few stops over a non-stop. I once from from Melbourne, Australia, to LAX - stopping at Brisbane
52 TAN FLYR : I see my friend FAT flyer answered this remark. Yes, they do..MY point was that ,before you were born, there WAS a martket that supported mainline to
53 KingCavalier : Then I don't understand why you had to bring it up. ??? FAT fler brought up FAT in this FWA thread. My friend Mariner pointed out that UA only adding
54 Georgebush : This was probably due to the fact that their flights were constantly weight restricted on the 145's. Almost every DFW flight they would be looking fo
55 Floridaflyboy : That's not the point. To the passenger, they really could care less how many flights are going through an airport. They care that there's one going t
56 Georgebush : I wasn't saying that ORD was better than DTW at all... what I said was a reply to another earlier post claiming DTW never has delays. The fact is the
57 Post contains images FATFlyer : My post was directed as a rebuttal to KingCavalier who said the market only generated 20-30% loads for Frontier. Sorry no, Frontier saw good loads mu
58 Mariner : I don't think I do. Why would you think that? But the fact that United hasn't added (much) capacity on the route would suggest that the FAT-DEN marke
59 FWAERJ : I agree there wholeheartedly... I don't think that the FWA market, being the size that it is, could initially support both carriers, and especially i
60 Skyrat : All I'm saying is that it's possible. We have been told that it is possible that Midwest may add some of our OO ground handled cities. Never said FWA
61 Post contains images FATFlyer : UA maintains over-capacity on FAT routes to SFO and LAX. Fresno serves as 1 of Skywest's major maintenance bases in California. They prefer to use FA
62 Post contains images Mariner : Yes, I agree. Neither do I. I'm not sure where you're getting this idea from. That may be. But Frontier has access to a great deal more information t
63 Nosedive : What would you say the percentage of pax connecting to DEN is compared to all pax? No argument from me. Just in amazement like you are.
64 Skyrat : I did some research today on this. Three out of four random days I checked, DEN was top connection. The one day that it wasn't the top, it was tied f
65 FWAERJ : The 2 years free landing fees is only for new carriers starting new service from FWA. When an existing airline adds service to a new city, then it's
66 Tornado82 : 10-12% of a handful of CRJ-200's still isn't that many people. Basically, FWA could support *at most* 2x CRJ-200 using those numbers.
67 Post contains images FATFlyer : If I misunderstood you I apologize. I interpreted your comments as it should be considered a FAT-DEN only route. Sounds like you agree that the marke
68 Cubsrule : Now that the Avros have left the fleet, this should be even better. In days when everything else was running fine, it wasn't uncommon to have 4 or 5
69 Mariner : I think I may be wasting bandwidth, but it is a two-way street. The good people of Fresno can dump on Frontier all they want, but the basic fact rema
70 Georgebush : Cuz, I'm gonna have to say that FWAERJ is correct. The free landing fees are only for NEW airlines. Shoot the airport aint stupid, they arent gonna g
71 Skyrat : My bad, I was typing a little too fast and hit 2 instead of 1. So one year of reduced fees doesn't do anything? I still don't think the fares will be
72 Tornado82 : FWA-DEN wouldn't be long enough to restrict a Skywest CRJ-200 except in some really really crappy wx, not with your runway. It's only 890nm.
73 Skyrat : Well as long as we wouldn't have more than 45 bags. Just today on our ORD flight we had a normal fuel load with 60 bags and had to leave 3 behind. Th
74 Georgebush : Ok well anyways, I hate to inform you all, but the airport authority today said there will be NO flights on F9 out of FWA anytime soon. They are still
75 Post contains images FWAERJ : Who told you so? Still, I was taking this rumor with a hefty grain of sodium chloride anyway. However, there's always the possibility whoever said th
76 Post contains images Mariner : If they are actually negotiating with Frontier, that's more promising than I thought. The problem, I guess, would be aircraft availability, as noted
77 Post contains images Tornado82 : Like quite a few of us said for a long time... United flying FWA-DEN makes FAR more sense than Frontier opening that little city up. Now let's lay th
78 Georgebush : Thats what one would hope, but I think the airport might be keeping their options open... Besides its going to take the TSA forever to move out of th
79 FATFlyer : I never find your thoughts a waste of bandwidth, my online friend. I respect and enjoy your insights and hope that is mutual. But we may find we even
80 Mariner : You know it is. But there's really nothing more I can say. I'm not going to change anyone's opinion (which is what I mean by waste of bandwidth), bec
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Frontier Aims To Unveil Lynx's Markets Next Month posted Fri Apr 13 2007 01:45:16 by Laxintl
AC 777 Coming To YYZ Tonight. posted Wed Apr 4 2007 21:51:31 by SixtySeven
A380 Coming To HKG posted Sat Mar 24 2007 05:18:48 by Foilcat
A380 Coming To Toronto? posted Thu Mar 22 2007 17:24:28 by Arv79
IL-76 Coming To ENS Again. When Exactly? posted Sat Mar 10 2007 15:37:04 by Jush
L10's Coming To LAS! posted Tue Feb 20 2007 07:13:13 by Crownvic
Is The A380 Coming To JFK And IAD posted Tue Jan 30 2007 19:22:43 by NYC777
Guess The New Airline Coming To MSY posted Fri Jan 19 2007 22:01:24 by MSYtristar
Frontier Races To Kentucky posted Tue Jan 16 2007 15:49:30 by KingCavalier
South African Coming To Buenos Aires EZE posted Fri Jan 12 2007 22:40:32 by Incitatus