RwSEA From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 3017 posts, RR: 2 Reply 3, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 9888 times:
Good to see UA trying out another transatlantic route, if true. Obviously it will be IAD since UA has pulled down all other international flying from JFK.
Cba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4530 posts, RR: 3 Reply 5, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 9805 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 1): Article is wrong. It will be Dulles-Dubai.
I was going to say, it seems strange that they'd be operating the flight from JFK as they don't have much presence there. IAD makes a lot more sense. UA has really done an excellent job utilizing IAD as a gateway to Europe.
AirlineFanatic From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 222 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 9681 times:
so as a business destination UA would propose starting this service IAD-KWI-DXB? Seems like not many biz travelers will be interested in a 2 stop flight when there are opportunities to make 1 connection on EK through JFK and soon IAH and ATL on DL
xxx-ATL-DXB or xxx-JFK-DXB vs
xxx-IAD-KWI-DXB
nonetheless it is good to see another US carrier expanding to a new international destination. Wish it were nonstop especially with as large a hub as IAD is for UA. Was ORD not an option - range maybe?
Also, isn't QR starting IAD-DOH service shortly... another 1 stop connection and option to DXB on an international carrier with reputable service.
KevinSmith From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 9, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 9661 times:
Quoting Cba (Reply 5): UA has really done an excellent job utilizing IAD as a gateway to Europe.
I can't imagine that it wouldn't be a cash cow for them. There's got to be a decent demand for non-stop Europe routes from DC, especially with the government types there.
Cba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4530 posts, RR: 3 Reply 10, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 9489 times:
Quoting KevinSmith (Reply 9): I can't imagine that it wouldn't be a cash cow for them. There's got to be a decent demand for non-stop Europe routes from DC, especially with the government types there.
They've also got good connecting opportunities for one-stop traffic to Europe. I'd connect through IAD any day over JFK, EWR, ORD, etc, it's a much less crowded and much more pleasant airport to use.
Behramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4447 posts, RR: 43 Reply 12, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 9285 times:
UAL have 1-2 B 772ERs freed up with the suspension of the daily HNL-KIX flight effective this Oct...so that aircraft might be used for the IAD-DXB flight.
I wouldnt recommend UAL to fly the route as an extension of their KWI service as the operating costs of such a route flown on a thrice weekly basis is higher than flying the route nonstop. Other important advantages of flying the route nonstop is that its more attractive to their F & J class clientele who would anyday prefer this option than having to stop in Europe or in KWI enroute, a dedicated DXB flight disables the flight's pax & cargo load to be shared with UA's KWI station and lastly, the nonstop option is more attractive to traders and cargo merchants for their goods to be transported in a quick & efficient manner from DXB to USA.
They should launch initially it as a 3 weekly IAD-DXB nonstop service and then upgrade after a year to daily service.
FreequentFlier From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 804 posts, RR: 6 Reply 14, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 9201 times:
Quoting Behramjee (Reply 12): UAL have 1-2 B 772ERs freed up with the suspension of the daily HNL-KIX flight effective this Oct...so that aircraft might be used for the IAD-DXB flight.
I thought this was utilization flying? Are you sure?
ORD Boy 2 From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 272 posts, RR: 1 Reply 15, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 9071 times:
I would agree that it would be IAD-DXB. UA is taking a long look at the Middle East. Maybe there is hope for the TLV route I have long advocated. The IAD-JFK RJ service is still operating by the way. It is bookable. I saw it when I was looking to book ORD-NYC and looked at one stop possibilities
Laxintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 22070 posts, RR: 51 Reply 16, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8981 times:
Quoting Behramjee (Reply 12): I wouldnt recommend UAL to fly the route as an extension of their KWI service as the operating costs of such a route flown on a thrice weekly basis is higher than flying the route nonstop.
How do you come up with such math?
The airplane sits on the ground in KWI for about 6.5hrs. The incremental operating cost of a 90 minute hop down to DXB and back is pennies on the dollar compared a nonstop IAD-DXB route.
The tag flight is simply an opportunistic move which adds another city to the network, very much how places such as GIG, MVD(until recently), SGN etc.. are operated by United. A low cost, and low risk solution.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
Amwest2united From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 378 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8971 times:
You are correct it is, but if they turn the aircraft in KIX differently, then it will provide 1 plane.
But currently, there are two trancsons that are 777 aircraft that could be pulled aswell, SFO-IAD-SFO and
LAX-IAD-LAX. If we were to tag KWI, I would guess it would be on 744 equipment to allow for the extra lift.
IAD-KWI is full down below now.
Life is what happens to you while you making plans to live it!
Laxintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 22070 posts, RR: 51 Reply 18, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8948 times:
Quoting Amwest2united (Reply 18): You are correct it is, but if they turn the aircraft in KIX differently, then it will provide 1 plane.
The KIX schedule changes in October to allow for sameday 2 hour SFO-KIX-SFO turn, the same way NGO is re-timed following the discontinuation of the NGO-TPE tag.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
Behramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4447 posts, RR: 43 Reply 20, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 8774 times:
Quoting Laxintl (Reply 17): The airplane sits on the ground in KWI for about 6.5hrs. The incremental operating cost of a 90 minute hop down to DXB and back is pennies on the dollar compared a nonstop IAD-DXB route.
that maybe so but then the flight's load in the pax & cargo cabin would have to be shared between DXB and KWI stations + for the 5th freedom intra-gulf route.
a dedicated IAD-DXB nonstop flight can easily holds its own ground and has a lot of revenue potential especially in the premium cabin.
EK & EY are bound to launch in the future nonstop flights to IAD from their respective hubs..QR is already starting from July 19th a nonstop DOH-IAD flight and they will target the DXB market to feed this flight...for UAL to be competitive effectively against these Arab carriers from day 1, its best to launch DXB with a nonstop flight rather than with a tag on from KWI.
Pellegrine From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1845 posts, RR: 8 Reply 21, posted (6 years 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 8667 times:
Quoting AirlineFanatic (Reply 8): so as a business destination UA would propose starting this service IAD-KWI-DXB? Seems like not many biz travelers will be interested in a 2 stop flight when there are opportunities to make 1 connection on EK through JFK and soon IAH and ATL on DL
xxx-ATL-DXB or xxx-JFK-DXB vs
xxx-IAD-KWI-DXB
I tend to agree. The article mentions the DIFC and "big US banks". Errr... Maybe UA will target traffic that does not originate in NYC. There's already (depending on your alliance) EK/EY/BA/LH/AF/... without taking a puddle jumper down to IAD and stopping in KWI.
It is possible they will have the flight number originate there, but it will be a "plane change." Like flight number (UA863) that used to go ORD-SYD-MEL with a stop in LAX, they obviously didn't fly the 747 from ORD to LAX.
I'm not sure about the range issue. I think ORD-DXB would fall within the 777 range since AA's ORD-DEL service does.
UA will definitely start the service from IAD as IAD seems to be the UA hub de jour. As an ORD based UA flyer, I would love to see UA start some new ORD international service. I stick with UA (I am a Premier), but from time to time defecting to AA is a thought b/c the great majority of their new international service (east and west-bound) originates in ORD (Central/South America is the only exception, and even that changed with their latest announcement). UA better keep it's homebase in mind before AA corners the international ORD market.
Fly the friendly skies of life!. Enjoy every minute.
25 Daron4000: I think that UA still has kept AA in check at ORD, especially regarding international destinations. The only transoceanic destinations that AA has wh
26 FlyMD: This is my point exactly. While UA is based in Chicago, they have Pacific and Atlantic gateways in other locations. AA on the other hand considers OR
27 MAH4546: Umm...not really. The flight does very well.
28 ORD Boy 2: If AA opens a new Atlantic or Pacific route, it will very likely be from ORD. I guarantee you that in the coming years as both airlines hopefully con
29 ConcordeBoy: While UA's 772ERs would indeed be capable of ORD-DXB nonstop, it's generally not a good idea to assume equivalent performance based on comparison to
30 FlyMD: Trust me, as a frequent UA flyer and an ORD resident, I hope that you are correct though I doubt it. If UA was concerned about their "home turf", the
31 CHI787ORD: All the rumors about AA not doing well at DEL are just rumors. There have no indications that AA is making losses... infact its probably the opposite
32 Daron4000: Actually, according to published reports, not just AA but other airlines are also finding the ULH services to India not as cash loaded as A.net makes
33 JRDC930: Good for them, but if theyre targeting the premium crowd, id think its prety hard to compete with the likes of EK and Etihad, whos service are about a
34 ConcordeBoy: Who doesn't fly to Washington, nor would have the "lock" on US government travel that UA typically enjoys
35 Jacobin777: .....Daron, a word of advice...when it comes to knowing facts/ops about AA, I wouldn't really want to contradict MAH4546 too much....for the most par
36 UA772IAD: SFO only gets a 777 (instead of the usual 763s) if there is a heavy load, or for aircraft repositioning. The 777s that serve LAX are 99% of the time
37 VC10er: why doesn't UA start p.s. service from LAX and SFO to IAD as well as JFK? flying into IAD in F or C class and then get on a regular UA domestic flight
38 RoseFlyer: I'm not sure that UA's 772ERs could easily fly DXB-IAD nonstop. I think that flight would be longer than UA's current longest 772ER flight (IAD-NRT i
39 Cba: Yes, but those transcons are operated by the 772A and not the 772ER, and thus have a range of around 5500nm. Not all of UA's 772's are ER models: a l
40 ConcordeBoy: If you want round figures, Trent892 birds (the majority of their 656K application) can do 7500nm and the Trent895 birds (e.g., BA, LY, some DL) can m
41 Amwest2United: As mentioned already above, we are turning the aircraft differently in KIX in order to free up one aircraft. It will be a SFO-KIX-SFO with a 2 hour t
43 B777ER: It's easy going North America-DXB. The trouble is the DXB-North America routing. Extreme heat in DXB and prevailing winds working against you. Heck,
44 UA772IAD: My mistake, I saw that in the bid package. That's a temporary assignment to recycle aircraft between the hubs. They did that last summer with the 744
45 Mcdu: Thank you very much. I just received an email that my post in this thread were pulled because they were pasted with text from a user that was having
46 RDUDDJI: I've heard rumors for months about KWI going daily. As much as I'd like to see the non-stop, "Testing the waters" with an add-on might be the way to g
47 UA772IAD: I think that this is probably how it will start out. They did the same thing with ICN (and to some extent with TPE), a tag on from the ORD-NRT flight
48 FreequentFlier: Not sure why focusing on improving the bad, rather than patting one's self on the back for doing something good is a bad thing necessarily. Of course
49 CirrusDriver: Hello, I was surprised to get the E-mail that my post was being deleted. Anyways, I did not get a chance to review your response (if any) because the
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