Also to note QF will add 6 additional flights to JNB during the southern summer on the following dates
- 8, 15 and 22 December 2007
- 5, 12 and 19 January 2008
Routing will be SYD-PER-JNB-PER-SYD which will be operated by the B743
Cornish From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 8187 posts, RR: 56 Reply 4, posted (6 years 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 4034 times:
Quoting SA744 (Thread starter): British airways to go 3 times daily
Virgin to go double daily
No chance - the bilateral doesn't allow it as far as I'm aware. They would like more flights but the bilaterals won't change until the SA government realise that slot allocation at LHR has nothing do to with the UK government and it cannot tie down extra slots at the times that SAA wants at LHR as part of any bilateral agreement.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
FLYACYYZ From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 1914 posts, RR: 12 Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 weeks ago) and read 3955 times:
Quoting SA744 (Thread starter): Air canada (but it is BIG maybe only if bilaterals agrrements are changed)
Is this a new rumour, or the same old rumour that's been circulating since the mid 80's??
The ongoing rumours have included:
YYZ/ZRH/JNB (Just because)
YYZ/FRA/JNB (Allegdly nixed by LH because of Star Alliance overlap/conflicts)
YYZ/MAD/JNB(Saving the on again/off again YYZ-MAD route)
YYZ/LIS/JNB (Inclusion of TAP with Star Alliance)
YYZ/MIA/JNB (Revised Canada/US Bilaterals foolowing in the footsteps of YYZ/LAX/SYD)
YYZ/JNB (With the once assumed increase of A345's)
YYZ/JNB (Resurrected with the 77L announcement)
There's ben some talk of CPT alright but little mention of JNB. If it's to happen at all it won't be soon - EI are about to receive 2 new 330s but they are already committed to 3 new US destinations. A long haul order is expected in the coming weeks (although we've been saying that for 6 months now) and there may be an announcement of new routes but they aren't going to start for at least 12 months I'd wager. There is significant Irish investment in Capetown property which would possibly make that route viable and if you're going that far, why not add a stop in JNB where there would be a chance of some business traffic (if that doesn't sound too flippant).
FlyDreamliner From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2759 posts, RR: 15 Reply 8, posted (6 years 2 weeks ago) and read 3886 times:
You left out TK, TK is planning to restart service from IST with the A330-200, per another thread on here. Here is a link confirming that TK will be back in Sept, continuing on to CPT.
I can't imagine either EI or AC flying to JNB. While a 77L might be able to make it to JNB from YYZ, who is going to be filling it? It seems to me that AC has much more profitable places to put their aircraft... and of course you'd need to revise the bilateral treaty. If AC were go 5th Freedom through MIA, that might make sense, but again, the treaty, so at this point, it sounds like pie in the sky to me.
As for EI, they are strapped for long-haul aircraft and are planning to use every one they can get their hands on for their ambitious North American expansion plans. I don't think JNB is on their radar at the moment.
Quoting FLYACYYZ (Reply 6):
YYZ/ZRH/JNB (Just because)
YYZ/FRA/JNB (Allegdly nixed by LH because of Star Alliance overlap/conflicts)
YYZ/MAD/JNB(Saving the on again/off again YYZ-MAD route)
YYZ/LIS/JNB (Inclusion of TAP with Star Alliance)
YYZ/MIA/JNB (Revised Canada/US Bilaterals foolowing in the footsteps of YYZ/LAX/SYD)
YYZ/JNB (With the once assumed increase of A345's)
YYZ/JNB (Resurrected with the 77L announcement)
I can't imagine why AC would put their aircraft on this route over others... plus, treaties...
"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
MainMAN From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 2064 posts, RR: 6 Reply 9, posted (6 years 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3688 times:
Flyglobespan will operate twice weekly MAN-JNB from 01/10/07 to 30/03/08, Thursday and Sunday with a 763.
It's great to see northern England linked to JNB again for the first time since SA's brief appearance at MAN in the early 90s. However, the fact that it's GSM hasn't aroused a lot of excitement.
Not a chance, CI tried JNB years ago and it was losing money badly, part of the problem was, SA was already flying this sector, twice weekly until South Africa broke ties with Taiwan (which was enough to cover this market). The biggest killer was CI couldn't get traffic right between SIN-JNB, had CI been allowed to fly between SIN and JNB, the route might have been saved.
Once KE provides daily service to JNB, this will pretty much cover all of Far East, ICN will take care of Japanses/Northern Chinese cities, along with SQ/TG/MH for SE Asia, CX/SA in between. The rest of Asian carriers will not be able to sustain this market.
Basically, it comes down to this: AA could print money on a MIA-JNB-CPT-MIA route, but (a) their 777's are not 180 minutes ETOP certified (necessary for CPT-MIA), (b) they don't have enough 777's as it is, and (c) they will probably wait until the 787 is available before trying this route.
However, of all major U.S. airlines, AA is the most likely to fly to South Africa - UA will continue the codeshare with S.A., DL is happy with ATL-DKR-JNB, and US, NW, and CO don't have the equipment, logistics, or O&D numbers to expand to Africa right now.
Okay, MAYBE Continental EWR-JNB, but I'd think they'd rather fly to LOS or LAD from either EWR or IAH for the oil business first.
Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
SA744 From South Africa, joined Nov 2005, 201 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 3205 times:
Quoting Vincewy (Reply 10): Once KE provides daily service to JNB, this will pretty much cover all of Far East, ICN will take care of Japanses/Northern Chinese cities, along with SQ/TG/MH for SE Asia, CX/SA in between. The rest of Asian carriers will not be able to sustain this market.
Do you have any idea what there initial frequencies are going to be at start up.
Lxlgu From South Africa, joined Sep 2000, 1085 posts, RR: 2 Reply 16, posted (6 years 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 3020 times:
Hi Cyba!
Emirates are triple daily from 1 July-we can sell the new flight and they have introduced special fares on the route
for connecting passengers to Europe
SAA have discontinued their 3x weekly service to Zurich and will start Munich 3x weekly on July 3
Another new route is JNB KILAMANJARO for SAA nonstop once a week from July
Zkojh From China, joined Sep 2004, 1500 posts, RR: 1 Reply 17, posted (6 years 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2961 times:
Another one to the list is a high from NZ - AKL to JNB via xxx possable add on to the Perth flight. rumer has its the 2008 route of choice for the airline. would either be 744 or T7 operations.
BD are also looking at the chance of jumping in if SAA pull out of the LHR market,
Quote: AA's 777 have a greater range than non-ER 747-400s. The only problem, as you said, is with ETOPS restrictions. There is a huge spot in the South Atlantic that is restricted for aircraft flying with ETOPS 138. Until American's 777s (unless they have already) are allowed to fly through that big spot, Miami-Cape Town is out the 777's normal (unrestricted) range.
From the previous thread on AA to South Africa (reply #24), this is what I am basing my comment on.
IF American's 777's are 180 ETOPS certified, then CPT-MIA is not a problem. If American's 777's are only 138 minutes certified, this would force a deviation in the flight plane out of a straight line to avoid an area between Namibia and South America where the direct route cuts through.
In looking at the Great Circle Mapper, California-Hawai'i does have a very small portion of the flight that is outside of the 138 ETOPS limitations, so it must be assumed that AA does have aircraft that are 180 ETOPS certified. But AA does not fly any 777's to Hawai'i, and the three longest distance routes - DFW/ORD - NRT, DFW/ORD - Europe, and ORD-DEL all fly far away from 180 ETOPS restrictions.
My point is this: AA 777 flying MIA-JNB-CPT-MIA is feasible; however, (a) range and payload restrictions must be carefully calculated with AA's current 777 fleet (it is over 6600 miles each way!), (b) ETOPS certification must be carefully calculated for maximum range (does anyone know what the ETOPS is for AA's 777's?), and (c) will the 787 be able to do this route more economically?
Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
KLM685 From Mexico, joined exactly 8 years ago today! , 1577 posts, RR: 21 Reply 21, posted (6 years 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2802 times:
Quoting SA744 (Thread starter): Rumours going around the aviation circle is that the following airlines are seriously considering JNB as a destination:
Quote:
AA's 777 have a greater range than non-ER 747-400s. The only problem, as you said, is with ETOPS restrictions. There is a huge spot in the South Atlantic that is restricted for aircraft flying with ETOPS 138. Until American's 777s (unless they have already) are allowed to fly through that big spot, Miami-Cape Town is out the 777's normal (unrestricted) range.
From the previous thread on AA to South Africa (reply #24), this is what I am basing my comment on.
and I don't think the info is correct but it's possible it is. I cannot for the life of me know why AA would choose not to certify the queen of its fleet to fly ETOPS 180 since the plane was designed and delivered to do just that.
If true, the irony is that AA maintains DL's RR Trents to 180 minute ETOPS standards while maintaining its aircraft to a lesser standard (of which engines are a part).
I still want to hear from someone at AA who knows whether this is true or not... I'm highly skeptical although GCI does show it is possible to fly to NRT from most of the US w/ ETOPS 138 as well as on most if not all of AA's other 777 routes .
ZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5020 posts, RR: 12 Reply 24, posted (6 years 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2608 times:
Quoting Zkojh (Reply 17): Another one to the list is a high from NZ - AKL to JNB via xxx possable add on to the Perth flight. rumer has its the 2008 route of choice for the airline. would either be 744 or T7 operations.
Is that still on is it, I thought it was another route for NZ in 2008. Not sure if a 772 can fly from PER-JNB or not.
25 RwSEA: I think the pilot issue needs to be resolved too. If the pilots refused to fly DFW-PEK, I can guarantee you they aren't going to be jumping up and do
26 PAHS200: is this because of the World Cup? I know its 3 years away. michael
27 SA744: This route has been a topic of many discussions so will believe it when i see NZ touch SA Runway. They were also thinking of flying it via Melbourne.
28 Omoo: What about CO flying from IAH to JNB using a 777 ? is that feasible ?
29 Horus: EgyptAir will increase CAI-JNB-CAI flights from 5x weekly to daily from W07/08. SA codeshare on the service. Horus
31 SA744: Hello All News thru the aviation circles Jet airways are wanting to start the JNB route in november. Aircraft and route frequencies as of yet unknown.
32 MAH4546: SAA and MIA officials have met lately, even though I don't think there will be something soon given SAA's situation: http://www.miamitodaynews.com/new
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