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Mesa Posts 2Q Loss! Whats Next?  
User currently offlineApodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4263 posts, RR: 6
Posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 3061 times:

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/070510/earns_mesa_air.html?.v=1

Of note, United express ops lost money, Go lost money, Air Midwest lost money, and Delta lost money, and as is mentioned in another thread, the Dash-8 ops is going away. Maintenance costs have skyrocketed.

What does this mean? This is not good news for Mesa. They are so desperate for help they are offering $10,000 signing bonuses to attract and keep people. And now it turns out that being cheap doesn't mean profits. And a lot of their partners are about fed up. Are they going to have to shrink to profitability? What does this mean for the China flying? Could they be on the way out at USAirways, or United? How do you lose money as a regional carrier?

One rumor that has started is that Mesa is having a hard time finding CRJ's to start the China flying. It has been rumored that a carrier like Air Wisconsin might allow Mesa to take the leases on some CRJ's in order to place CRJ-700's or 900's in service for USAirways.

24 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineCrjflyer35 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 668 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3007 times:

Whew, glad I got out when I did. Though not too sure if it's any better that I went to US here in PHX....lol
Morale in PHX @ YV among the ground crew is rock bottom...they just keep bringing in new people off the street, so they're losing experienced rampers, and in turn not having the man power to train the new hires.



Ok, wait for the RJ to pass, cleared to push tail south Mike, and you're cleared to spin #2 in the push.
User currently offlineGeorgebush From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 679 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2976 times:

I think there are more YV 200's with inop APU's than they have 200's with functional APU's.


Al Gore invented global warming.
User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6372 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2975 times:

Quoting Apodino (Thread starter):
Of note, United express ops lost money, Go lost money, Air Midwest lost money, and Delta lost money, and as is mentioned in another thread, the Dash-8 ops is going away.

By process of elimination, that means that US/HP made money  Wink And possibly the old New Mexico operation...

Quoting Apodino (Thread starter):
and as is mentioned in another thread, the Dash-8 ops is going away.

only the one @ JFK...

Quoting Apodino (Thread starter):
What does this mean? This is not good news for Mesa.

Maybe it'll be the ouster for el primo cheapskate...aka Orenstein  Wink Maybe they'll have to start bidding prices closer to other regionals...I wonder if this means the start of the RJ bust  scratchchin 

Quoting Apodino (Thread starter):
They are so desperate for help they are offering $10,000 signing bonuses to attract and keep people.

But one must wonder if they are still paying pilots and F/O's wages that make a minor league AA baseball player look like a king after that $10k signing bonus...



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6372 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2949 times:

Did anyone else notice that their stock is up 8 cents today despite the general market decline and the really bad loss that they reported?


Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineSkyyMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2946 times:

Wonder if this will have any affect on the China based startup? Also with UA's investment in Aloha, I think they and HA are going to go for the jugular of Go! Hawaii has never been able to support three inter-island jet carriers and Go! seems the likely candidate to Go! away.

User currently offlineGeorgebush From New Zealand, joined Jul 2006, 679 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2944 times:

Quoting SkyyMaster (Reply 5):
Go! away

lmao!



Al Gore invented global warming.
User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 17
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2926 times:

How does Mesa lose money when Nike sweatshop workers in Vietnam are saying "holy cow, how do those Mesa employees live on such low wages and endure such poor treatment?"


Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineSkyrat From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 173 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2926 times:

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 2):
I think there are more YV 200's with inop APU's than they have 200's with functional APU's.

That and the CRJ100's that are flying around with a half a cargo bin. Makes it fun trying to fit 60-70 bags in there. The crews on the other hand are great. Just too bad they have to put up with management that treats them like crap.



flown:146,a319,a320,717,722,733,735,738,744,752,763,772,crj2,crj7,crj9,dc9,dc10,e135,e145,e170,e175,frj,md80
User currently offlineVictorKilo From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 311 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2785 times:

Quoting Apodino (Thread starter):
Of note, United express ops lost money, Go lost money, Air Midwest lost money, and Delta lost money, and as is mentioned in another thread, the Dash-8 ops is going away.

The press release only talked about the Dash-8 ops losing money for Mesa. It did not say that the Delta Connection ERJ ops lost money.

I'm going to speculate that what's next for YV may be an agreement between YV and UA for a reduction in 50 seat CRJ flying by YV for UA. UA has had issues with YV's service, and YV isn't making money flying 50 seaters for UA. Sounds like a mutually beneficial arrangement to me.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25169 posts, RR: 85
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2775 times:
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Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 7):
How does Mesa lose money when Nike sweatshop workers in Vietnam are saying "holy cow, how do those Mesa employees live on such low wages and endure such poor treatment?"

Funny post.  Smile

Seriously though - how do they lose money when a lot of their flying for others is on a cost plus basis? Or has that changed?

???

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineATLAaron From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1023 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2762 times:
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Quoting Mariner (Reply 10):
Seriously though - how do they lose money when a lot of their flying for others is on a cost plus basis?

Ok I need someone to correct me if I am wrong. So a regional carrier bids on service right? So they come to someone like UA and say "we can flight these routes for x amount of money." If that is the case and they are loosing money then that is ridiculously poor managment/planning. Period.

However, if this is an "at risk" operation then that is a totally different story.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25169 posts, RR: 85
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2718 times:
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Quoting ATLAaron (Reply 11):
If that is the case and they are loosing money then that is ridiculously poor managment/planning. Period.

Agreed.

Quoting ATLAaron (Reply 11):
However, if this is an "at risk" operation then that is a totally different story.

I agree again.

My present puzzle is that the UAX routes (most of 'em) used to be cost plus. That's why Mesa gave up the Frontier Jet Express deal - they said they could make more money flying for United.

So either cost plus has been changed - or Mesa seriously under-bid everyone else.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineApodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4263 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2701 times:

Quoting VictorKilo (Reply 9):
I'm going to speculate that what's next for YV may be an agreement between YV and UA for a reduction in 50 seat CRJ flying by YV for UA. UA has had issues with YV's service, and YV isn't making money flying 50 seaters for UA. Sounds like a mutually beneficial arrangement to me.

Just a thought. Could this pave the way for Air Wisconsin and United to reunite (No pun intended)? Cause it was originally the United creditors that forced United to give Air Wisky the boot, now that UA is no longer in Bankruptcy they could go back to Air Wisky. And note that Air Wisconsin and United have maintained a good working relationship, given the ground handling and it seems like Air Wisconsin is awarded ground handling at every new station United starts service to, PMD and RSW being the most recent examples. This would be a huge moral boost to a number of ZW employees if this happens.


User currently offlineBluewave 707 From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3152 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 2648 times:

Since Mesa's entry into the Hawai‘i inter-island market and the extremely low airfares, how much of the US$24-million loss was attributed to the go! project?


"The best use of your life will be to so live your life, that the use of your life will outlive your life" -- D Severn
User currently offlineAloha73g From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2362 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 2629 times:

Quoting Bluewave 707 (Reply 14):
Since Mesa's entry into the Hawai‘i inter-island market and the extremely low airfares, how much of the US$24-million loss was attributed to the go! project?

They say it was about $700,000. But, I'm pretty sure they are doing everythign possible to make that number as low as possible by allocating a very small amount of fixed costs (overhead) or none at all.

-Aloha!



Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
User currently offlineOOer From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1466 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 2618 times:

Huh? How do you post a 2Q loss when the quarter is not over yet? This does not make any sense!

User currently onlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6018 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2560 times:

Quoting Apodino (Reply 13):
Air Wisconsin is awarded ground handling at every new station United starts service to, PMD and RSW being the most recent examples.

That's something I don't get, is how Air Whisky got that contract. But then again, an airline such as SkyWest does ground handling in places like College Station, PA, where they themselves do not fly.



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineFlyboy80 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 1878 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2513 times:

They posted it probably because they are certain...lol. Who knows. All I can tell you is I put my time in at that airline in the inflight division. I remember those days. 15.59/hr, 1.13per diem (or something absolutely absurd like that) and 8 days off a month...I still beat myself up for it everyday.

I found in interesting what someone said about ramp in PHX. This time of year, they all start dropping like flys because of the heat. Besides most of them realize they can go up to HP and get a job, however last I heard mesa was "tying" HP's starting wage just for that reason. Mesa doesn't bother training any of the ground staff. Supposedly the "hub" folks go to the three week HP ticketing training, but I've heard that about half of them make it there. On my last trip we were doing a PHX turn on a 900. We had a non rev F/A sitting 1C...and the young lady who was about my age (19) working the jetway was having some issues pulling it forward. The NR F/A agreed to stand in for me because this particular captain knows that I have a gate background as my first airline job...so I got off the plane and went and pulled the jetway up to our aircraft and was helping instruct her in the process. You should have seen all the passengers, they were already pleased with my "special" announcements I provided enroute, but even more impressed with my ability to perform a simple function! I would often help downstairs at the gate as well in places like CLT where the US agents tried making QIK into reading Chinese. Anyways those days are over and I'm on to better things now. I think once the US contract is up, Mesa will be purchased by another regional, and with it, will die a bad business plan!

Flyboy 80


User currently offlineMainland From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 309 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2485 times:

Quoting OOer (Reply 16):
Huh? How do you post a 2Q loss when the quarter is not over yet? This does not make any sense!

Mesa's fiscal year ends September 30. So a normal 4Q is their 1Q and the January - March period they just reported is their 2Q.

All the impairment charges have caused Mesa to notify the SEC they will be late in filing their financials, so a more detailed look into the quarter will have to wait.



You don't need a passport to know what state you're in...
User currently offlineRjwrench85 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2397 times:

Quoting VictorKilo (Reply 9):
I'm going to speculate that what's next for YV may be an agreement between YV and UA for a reduction in 50 seat CRJ flying by YV for UA

This already happened.They have already lease returned 2 200's and taken delivery of another 2 new 700's N521LR and N522LR. But until they get more 700's they have been moving 200's out of the HP system into the United system to fill in. Its a mess.


User currently offlineATLAaron From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1023 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 2269 times:
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Quoting Mariner (Reply 12):
or Mesa seriously under-bid everyone else.

Has my vote . .  checkmark 


User currently offlineWyorca From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 31 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2140 times:

OR

It could all be creative book keeping. Jonny O has been proven a low life scoundrel before and it would not be odd for him to have the books cooked to show a loss. Why?

Because labor is in high demand and Jonny O has made his sweatshop so bad, than he is having a hard time even finding 300 hour pilots that will go to work for him. His pilot group is ready to (possibly for the first time) truly lock shields and try to get a good contract. Jonny knows he can't pull a Freedom Air deal and baring another 911 (something I'm sure that evil bastard would welcome), he knew he had better find a way to keep his pilots from getting a real contract. But now, with Mesa loosing money, good old Jonny O will be able to say to the ALPA negotiators "I would love to give you a good contract, but we are loosing money and just can't afford to right now", as long as Mesa looks like it isn't making money, the pilots will get bent over again and raped, and then all of a sudden, Mesa will be making money again.

It may just sound like another conspiracy theory, but I'd put nothing past that slime-ball Ornstein.

The timeing is just too perfect.


User currently offlineLuvflng From Costa Rica, joined Nov 2000, 178 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2098 times:

Quoting ATLAaron (Reply 11):

Ok I need someone to correct me if I am wrong. So a regional carrier bids on service right? So they come to someone like SA)">UA and say "we can flight these routes for x amount of money." If that is the case and they are loosing money then that is ridiculously poor managment/planning. Period.

Well, the truth be told a regional carrier can loose money. How? Well, they are paid for a completed flight and when certain quality measures are met, such as departure, arrival and other metrics. February and April were really pathetic months for ORD ops and many UAX flights were canceled. Thus, SA)">UA did not pay MESA for these while they had to pay their crews whom they planned will fly these canceled flights according to the contract.
While there may have been other financial problems with MESA, the weather did most likely hurt them on the income statement.



Radar Contact Terminated, Squawk VFR
User currently offlineATLAaron From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1023 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 2015 times:
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Quoting Georgebush (Reply 2):
I think there are more YV 200's with inop APU's than they have 200's with functional APU's.

I was on an America West/US Mesa Express CRJ900 yesterday with a broken APU.


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