Cubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 21290 posts, RR: 19 Reply 3, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 9137 times:
9E has elevators installed on a lot of their jetways that lift a cart with the gate-checked bags from the ramp to the level of the jetway, typically right by the door that goes down to the ramp but sometimes up by the terminal. Still, it would be very difficult to get caught in one of those (provided the employee wasn't doing something extremely stupid, which isn't out of the question).
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SkyexRamper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 4, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 9116 times:
Quoting DAYflyer (Thread starter): How does a baggage claim person get caught in an elevator??
I'm assuming they've got the same RJ bridges in DAY that they have at MSP where their is a lift that you slide a 2 tier cart into to bring the planeside checked bags up into the jet bridge.
Northwestair From Poland, joined Jul 2001, 636 posts, RR: 5 Reply 5, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 9108 times:
I've been telling everyone that this kind of thing was going to happen. I left 9E in OKC 3 weeks as a manager cause I was afraid something bad was going to happen in that station. When I left there were 11 employees on payroll and flights were being worked with just 3-4 employees in the entire station. That's 3-4 to work the ramp/tkt ctr/gate/bagroom. Now I work at CO for less money but I work in a safer environment
DAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 4 Reply 6, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 8506 times:
Quoting SkyexRamper (Reply 5): I'm assuming they've got the same RJ bridges in DAY that they have at MSP where their is a lift that you slide a 2 tier cart into to bring the planeside checked bags up into the jet bridge.
This appears to be the case. The latest radio report on the incident indicated it involved a cart and elevator.
DAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 4 Reply 7, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 8412 times:
More details just released:
"We have some initial reports that apparently an object became lodged in (the elevator lift) and the employee in question was attempting to dislodge it," said Phil Reed, spokesperson for Pinnacle. "We are so deeply saddened by this event. It's just shocking and upsetting to us, and we want to make sure we fully understand what occurred."
Burnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7421 posts, RR: 9 Reply 9, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 8161 times:
Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 3): 9E has elevators installed on a lot of their jetways that lift a cart with the gate-checked bags from the ramp to the level of the jetway, typically right by the door that goes down to the ramp but sometimes up by the terminal. Still, it would be very difficult to get caught in one of those (provided the employee wasn't doing something extremely stupid, which isn't out of the question).
The ones that they have in MSP are very easy to get under. Also very heavy.. if something was caught this could easily happen.
Quoting DAYflyer (Thread starter): How does a baggage claim person get caught in an elevator??
She wasn't in baggage claim.
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F9Animal From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4745 posts, RR: 29 Reply 10, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8076 times:
"We have some initial reports that apparently an object became lodged in (the elevator lift) and the employee in question was attempting to dislodge it," said Phil Reed, spokesperson for Pinnacle. "We are so deeply saddened by this event. It's just shocking and upsetting to us, and we want to make sure we fully understand what occurred."
Oh man, that is just awful. Can anyone provide a pic of this type of elevator? I am trying to imagine what it looks like, but I am not getting it in the head. Does it have a safety shutoff, or do they require a lockout/tagout on these elevators during troubles? What a tragedy, and hopefully something will be learned from it to prevent another tragic event like this from occuring again. My prayers are with the families and the employees of Pinnacle.
Nlink From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 313 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8028 times:
This is not the first time this kind of accident has happened at Pinnacle. They generally run a very dangerous operation with 3 or 4 people total for the flight. Always push push and in you get in trouble when the aircraft are late leaving. We had a FA once fall off the carry on part at the top of the jetbridge to the ramp. She hit head first and was out of work for months, when she fell we saw here hanging there upside down we thought she was dead, and of course while pinnacle management wanted all pictures of the accident sent to HDQ ASAP and they had someone out fixing the broke part on the jetbridge within hours and told us to keep quite about it.
The idea of gate checking a carryon on a RJ while using a jetbridge is crazy in the first place. There should either be more room in the airplane or require the max size bag of something that will fit. There has been numerous other injuries associated with jetbridges, RJ and "gate checked" bags" (which is the stupidest idea ever invented imho)
Kuna From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 279 posts, RR: 3 Reply 13, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 7980 times:
Quoting Nlink (Reply 11): This is not the first time this kind of accident has happened at Pinnacle. They generally run a very dangerous operation with 3 or 4 people total for the flight. Always push push and in you get in trouble when the aircraft are late leaving. We had a FA once fall off the carry on part at the top of the jetbridge to the ramp. She hit head first and was out of work for months, when she fell we saw here hanging there upside down we thought she was dead, and of course while pinnacle management wanted all pictures of the accident sent to HDQ ASAP and they had someone out fixing the broke part on the jetbridge within hours and told us to keep quite about it.
The idea of gate checking a carryon on a RJ while using a jetbridge is crazy in the first place. There should either be more room in the airplane or require the max size bag of something that will fit. There has been numerous other injuries associated with jetbridges, RJ and "gate checked" bags" (which is the stupidest idea ever invented imho)
First of all I suggest this post for deletion for being distasteful in the light of what happened.
CuriousFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 662 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 7921 times:
Quoting Kuna (Reply 13): Quoting Nlink (Reply 11):
This is not the first time this kind of accident has happened at Pinnacle. They generally run a very dangerous operation with 3 or 4 people total for the flight. Always push push and in you get in trouble when the aircraft are late leaving. We had a FA once fall off the carry on part at the top of the jetbridge to the ramp. She hit head first and was out of work for months, when she fell we saw here hanging there upside down we thought she was dead, and of course while pinnacle management wanted all pictures of the accident sent to HDQ ASAP and they had someone out fixing the broke part on the jetbridge within hours and told us to keep quite about it.
The idea of gate checking a carryon on a RJ while using a jetbridge is crazy in the first place. There should either be more room in the airplane or require the max size bag of something that will fit. There has been numerous other injuries associated with jetbridges, RJ and "gate checked" bags" (which is the stupidest idea ever invented imho)
First of all I suggest this post for deletion for being distasteful in the light of what happened.
I don't see what should be deleted. This guy suggests Pinnacle is dangerous, maybe if they get their act together this won't happen again.
Kuna From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 279 posts, RR: 3 Reply 17, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 7898 times:
Well first I work for 9E, second I work at a station that is well established and been so for a long time. It is not uncommon to only have 4 agents working a turn flight. If you get much more than 2 or 3 on the ramp, its too congested and you end up tripping over each other. I work the morning shift, we have to kickoff flights, we work with 5 people for two flights. Thats all that is needed. Pinnacle flies RJ's and not DC-9's or larger aircraft.
Quoting CuriousFlyer (Reply 16): I don't see what should be deleted. This guy suggests Pinnacle is dangerous, maybe if they get their act together this won't happen again.
The airline industry in general is dangerous, no matter how you cut it. Any job could be considered dangerous, I see by your profile your a banker. At first glance, yeah it might not be considered a dangerous job. But robberies happen, and by the recent shootings at a bank proves it. A job can be only as safe as the workers make it. It won't eliminate the dangers, but it can minimize them.
Kuna From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 279 posts, RR: 3 Reply 19, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7853 times:
Quoting Skyway1 (Reply 18): Quoting Kuna (Reply 15):
Yes sir, Pinnacle took over I believe in October.
Well when I was there NWA had a small staff on shifts as well....just some food for thought...
Understood, Just tying to figure out why everyone assumes that the reason for the accident is because of it being short staffed. Can't it just be a freak accident?
Skyway1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 20, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7836 times:
Let me clarify....I worked for C8 and not NWA. We worked Saab 340's so we usually only had 3-4 on shift...sometimes only 2. It is a freak accident but also appears to be an abusrd one....
ROACSM9E From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 7 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7760 times:
I think that everyone is losing sight of what really happened here... we have had a huge tragedy in our airline. We need not point fingers at the management and the way things are done. We need to remember the young life that has been lost and the remaining employees that need to go on in that station.
Kuna From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 279 posts, RR: 3 Reply 22, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7754 times:
Quoting ROACSM9E (Reply 21): I think that everyone is losing sight of what really happened here... we have had a huge tragedy in our airline. We need not point fingers at the management and the way things are done. We need to remember the young life that has been lost and the remaining employees that need to go on in that station.
Afrikaskyes From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 141 posts, RR: 0 Reply 23, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7460 times:
I use this system on a regular basis. On occasion, bags will shift out of place as the lift brings the carryons up to the jet bridge for passenger retrieval. Sometimes, a bag strap will fall loose as the lift is in operation. You can TRY and stop the lift as it is in operation, but the manufacturers (Jet Bridge) system for starting/stopping/resetting the lift is very problematic and generally useless. Basically, once you send the cart up, there is no way to stop it. You can do two things at this point. First, you can allow the lift to continue with the bag or strap dangling from the cart, but this most often will jam the lift and destroy the bag. It will also halt the lift and it will take several minutes to 'un jam' it. Imagine the passengers having to wait for this. They get mad as hell that they weren't allow to take their bottled water thru checkpoint. Just think how angry they would get having to wait 15 mintues for their carryons That leaves your last and really only logical option. You as quick and as safe as possible, shove the bag or the offending strap back into the cart as the lift is in operation. Dangerous? You bet. Which is why it should never be done.
In my opinion, the lift is a joke. It is very quirky to use. There are 4 of these lifts available at our airport and we are the only airline to utilize it. The alternative to the elevator lift, is to lift 20+ carryons over your head up onto the jet bridge. It would be nice if passengers took fewer carryons, but then again, we would lose them if checked.
Toltommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3224 posts, RR: 4 Reply 24, posted (6 years 1 month 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7040 times:
Quoting Northwestair (Reply 5): I've been telling everyone that this kind of thing was going to happen. I left 9E in OKC 3 weeks as a manager cause I was afraid something bad was going to happen in that station. When I left there were 11 employees on payroll and flights were being worked with just 3-4 employees in the entire station. That's 3-4 to work the ramp/tkt ctr/gate/bagroom. Now I work at CO for less money but I work in a safer environment
Playing devils advocate, let me ask you a few questions.....
1. You were a 9E mgr in OKC. Because of your screen name, I have to ask, were you NWA before the changeover? If so, what was the NWA staffing for a CRJ?
2. How did your leaving the station do anything to prevent an accident in the future? Or did you just leave to protect yourself, rather than bring the problems you saw to the appropriate state or federal agency?
3. How many CO employees work a E145 flight? Whats the difference that makes it that much safer? At least share the info, so that others can learn from it, rather than make unsubstantiated statements.
9E isn't the only airline to work a CRJ with a staffing level of 3-4 total agents. 99% of these flights are worked without incident. A complete investigation should be completed to find out why before anyone screams that staffing levels are the only reason it happened. The facts don't support that finding.
Condolences to friends and family of the agent. May they find peace.
25 Bruce: Why not do it the old fashioned way - no jet bridges, walk the pax out to the plane stairs. i seem to remember not too long ago, maybe '98 - 2000, mos
26 SHUPirate1: In the near-term, completely right. However, as time goes on (and I'll be the first to admit that right now is not the right time for it), somebody n
27 Afrikaskyes: Why not do it the old fashioned way - no jet bridges, walk the pax out to the plane stairs. i seem to remember not too long ago, maybe '98 - 2000, mos
28 OGGFBORefueler: My deepest condolences to the friends and the family... Aloha! Keone
29 Irobertson: I don't doubt the truth of your statements and I'm sure the stairs aren't great, but frankly, people will sue over anything these days, especially if
30 Cubsrule: I fail to see how enforcement of carryon rules have anything to do with this. There are plenty of legal carryons that do not fit in the cabin, and ca
31 727forever: I disagree. This is his opinion. I am also quite suspect of 9E as an organization as a result of their hiring practices and abnormally high rate of i
32 DAYflyer: Well said. I have seen a slide for bags on the side of jet bridges; the elevators, if they really are this dangerous, should be replaced by the slide
33 DAYflyer: The latest update indicates an OSHA investigation is underway. The emergency safety cut-off on the elevator may have been defective. Apparently she wa
34 Cubsrule: DH used to really like to raise a belt loader up to the level of the little landing on the outside of the jetway, load bags on that, and drive them a
35 Kuna: We do that from time to time (not very often) here in SGF. Problem is if you get more than 10 carry-ons the belt is overloaded and the situation is t
36 ROACSM9E: I know that the family and staff in DAY would appreciate everyone's kind words. I will be sure to pass this along to the Station Manager and employees
37 JayDub: Sounds like just about any U.S. airline these days.
38 NLINK: This is including the whole operation with the checkin counter, ramp and gate etc.
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