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F9 Announces Q4 And Full Year 2006 Losses  
User currently offlineLaxintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24785 posts, RR: 46
Posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4659 times:

(For those wondering F9's fiscal year does not conform to traditional calender reporting periods)


Frontier's 4Q Loss Widens
Thursday May 24, 8:28 pm ET


DENVER (AP) -- Frontier Airlines said Thursday its fourth-quarter net loss widened as operations were buffeted by winter storms that forced flight delays and cancellations from its Denver hub.

The airline also saw fewer travelers as it flew more miles from January to March and, like its competitors, paid higher fuel costs. "This quarter was one of the toughest that we have faced financially," Chief Executive Officer Jeff Potter said a statement.

Demand has picked up ahead of the summer travel season, but Potter said company officials are concerned that fuel costs "remain at uncomfortably high levels."

For the quarter ended March 31, Frontier Airlines Holdings Inc. reported a net loss of $10.4 million, or 29 cents a share, compared with a net loss of $7.9 million, or 22 cents a share, in the same period a year ago.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/070524/earns_frontier.html?.v=1


Frontier Airlines Reports Fiscal Year 2007 Results
Thursday May 24, 6:30 pm ET


DENVER, May 24 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Frontier Airlines Holdings, Inc. (Nasdaq: FRNT - News) today reported a net loss of $20.4 million, or $0.56 per diluted common share, for its fiscal year ended March 31, 2007. This compares to a net loss of $14.0 million, or $0.39 per diluted common share for the year ended March 31, 2006.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/070524/lath061.html?.v=97

[Edited 2007-05-25 20:37:08]


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
37 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24996 posts, RR: 85
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4634 times:
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Given that the winter storms accounted for $14 million to $15 million of that loss, and given that DEN fares are under siege - 5% lower than last summer - that ain't too bad.

I note from the conference call they are cautiously opimtistic about a profit this next quarter - unless oil goes crazy, of course.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineGraphic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4607 times:

They took 3 or 4 good heavy winter storms at DEN this last winter so its really not surprising something like this would happen. They really need to grow outside DEN and not just liesure down in mexico...MEM anyone?

User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24996 posts, RR: 85
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4607 times:
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Quoting Graphic (Reply 2):
They really need to grow outside DEN and not just liesure down in mexico...MEM anyone?

Funny you should say that. I see that MEM-MCO goes to 2 x daily in December.  Smile

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineDesertAir From Mexico, joined Jan 2006, 1457 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 4471 times:

F9 converted this year from 2 RJs a day to three airbus flghts to Tucson. I hope these flights are doing well to maintain the service.

User currently offlineGraphic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4439 times:

Quoting Mariner (Reply 3):

Have the MEM flights started yet? How are loads looking?


User currently offlineFuturecaptain From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4422 times:

Ouch, bleeding more red ink.

Well, I'm flying them in 3 weeks, hopefully my money can help them out. I always liked Frontier, great airline with great service IMHO.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24996 posts, RR: 85
Reply 7, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4399 times:
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Quoting Graphic (Reply 5):
Have the MEM flights started yet? How are loads looking?

The flights started earlier this month. I don't have access to proprietary load info, but from what I can tell, it's doing great.

This was confirmed by the CEO in the cc. He compared Memphs to Louisville - which was gangbusters out the gate. And, in addtion to the extra MEM-MCO, in November DEN-MEM goes to 3 x daily.

 Smile

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineFlyboy7974 From United States of America, joined Jan 2003, 1540 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4388 times:

Anybody been able to find a link or clip for a webpage for Lynx Aviation? I've trying to find something hopefully and have had no luck

User currently offlineKingCavalier From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 1302 posts, RR: 17
Reply 9, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4373 times:

Quoting Flyboy7974 (Reply 8):
Anybody been able to find a link or clip for a webpage for Lynx Aviation?

Don't think they'll have their own web site. It's just like most regionals do not have their own web site.

Currently, job postings for Lynx are on Career Builder, though.



Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness
User currently offlineGraphic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 4373 times:

Quoting Flyboy7974 (Reply 8):
Anybody been able to find a link or clip for a webpage for Lynx Aviation? I've trying to find something hopefully and have had no luck

Frontier Holdings seems to really be keeping the whole Lynx operation close to the vest, even after their AOC has been given...wonder what that's all about, you'd think they'd have at least announced destinations by now since they'll be flying in what, a month and a half?

...Speaking of which, where are the planes?


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24996 posts, RR: 85
Reply 11, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4346 times:
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Quoting Graphic (Reply 10):
.wonder what that's all about

Yes, they have the AOC from the DOT - but they do not have FAA approval, so they can't sell tickets, so there isn't much point in announcing the routes.

They have applied to the DOT for a waiver to be able to do so. It is thought that the routes will be announced within a week or two - depending on the DOT timetable.

http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/p101/470112.pdf

mariner

[Edited 2007-05-25 23:45:09]


aeternum nauta
User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4332 times:

keep in mind that F9's fiscal 4Q is calendar 1Q07. There were weather issues in DEN this winter but the worst of it was in December which was not in this reporting period.

DEN is a simmering bloodbath which could turn very nasty very quickly if WN decides to turn up the heat.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24996 posts, RR: 85
Reply 13, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4306 times:
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Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
There were weather issues in DEN this winter but the worst of it was in December which was not in this reporting period.

Yes, sir, they were.

The majority of the $14/$15 million cost was in the January period, due to the rebookings and the hangover effect of the storms.

There was also an addtional effect - booking away to avoid DEN - which affected all the major carriers at DEN and lasted up until at least the end of February.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 12):
DEN is a simmering bloodbath which could turn very nasty very quickly if WN decides to turn up the heat.

Southwest has already said (CEO Kelly) that DEN will only grow at a moderate pace. And the "heat" seems to be affecting United, which has seen DEN turn from its most profitable hub to its least - as per Mr. Tilton in their last quarterly report.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineLaxintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24785 posts, RR: 46
Reply 14, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4296 times:

One of the things with F9 is that while not posting huge losses, simply has not been able to get its head above the water line while many others in the industry have had the opportunity to report some rather improved earnings these last few years.


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6707 posts, RR: 32
Reply 15, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4253 times:

The one thing that concerns me a bit about the fiscal 4Q07 earnings is the way that the mark-to-market gains on hedges for future quarters are rolled into the 4Q operating numbers, rather than as non-operating gains. It's not that other airlines don't do the same -- US Airways, for example, does, though Southwest does not. Rather, they tend to distort the operating picture since the mark-to-market gains relate to business activities in future periods.

If you remove the mark-to-market gains on hedges maturing in the future, the operating loss for the quarter was closer to $21 million. (For what it's worth, this sort of accounting cuts both ways; if the price of crude/derivatives were to fall, you'd see mark-to-market losses for future periods in the operating numbers). But if you add back the unusual effects of the storms in Denver this weekend, they're probably level or slightly better than last year, which is very good news.

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 14):
One of the things with F9 is that while not posting huge losses, simply has not been able to get its head above the water line while many others in the industry have had the opportunity to report some rather improved earnings these last few years.

I think that's the big concern on Wall Street, and I think that's why FRNT is trading for only a small premium above book value. The company is holding its own and the losses aren't huge, but there aren't earnings to justify a better valuation, either. Frontier isn't really a good merger partner for anyone, either. Few if any of the legacies want a head-to-head hub competition with United at DEN, and the Airbus fleet isn't a match for LUV or AAI. I don't believe that Frontier's A318's & A319's are a match for JetBlue's strategy with the A320 & E190, while Spirit must get its own house in order (they're losing low-8-figures/quarter according to their financials filed with DOT).


User currently offlineGraphic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4229 times:

Quoting Mariner (Reply 13):
And the "heat" seems to be affecting United, which has seen DEN turn from its most profitable hub to its least - as per Mr. Tilton in their last quarterly report.

If Tilton thinks that WN is the only reason they're loosing money at DEN, he really needs his head screwed on straight.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24996 posts, RR: 85
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4173 times:
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Quoting Laxintl (Reply 14):
One of the things with F9 is that while not posting huge losses, simply has not been able to get its head above the water line while many others in the industry have had the opportunity to report some rather improved earnings these last few years.

There's a simple reason for that. It is the war at Denver.

The RMN reported last week that average air fares at DEN for this summer are 5% lower than last year - and last summer, DEN was one of the few major airports to see declining fares.

I think we know who might be the catalyst for that.  Smile

Still as CFO Tate said, Frontier has done what it can, and picked up some market share. In his words, if the others "enjoy" the situation at DEN, that's up to them.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineBicoastal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4141 times:

Quoting ScottB (Reply 15):
Few if any of the legacies want a head-to-head hub competition with United at DEN, and the Airbus fleet isn't a match for LUV or AAI

Hmmm....an Airbi fleet. United should buy Frontier. United could rid itself of some of its its maintenance needy older aircraft and incorporate Frontier's younger fleet of Airbi (with the exception of the useless 318). Southwest and United appeal to different travelers. The two could coexist peacefully at DEN as they will at SFO


User currently offlineGraphic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 4069 times:

Quoting Bicoastal (Reply 18):

That would result in a public flogging of Jeff Potter in Larimer Square at high noon on a busy saturday.


User currently offlineMkorpal From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 90 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3958 times:

This is not too good of news. I hope this next quarter is better.

As for Lynx, it was announced today that they will serve 4 mountain communities and 5 other cities. Not much there, but it's a start. Does anyone remember when the first Q400 is going to be delivered.
http://biz.yahoo.com/bizj/070525/1468659.html?.v=1


User currently offlineJetdeltamsy From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 2987 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3943 times:

Quoting Mariner (Reply 1):
Given that the winter storms accounted for $14 million to $15 million of that loss, and given that DEN fares are under siege - 5% lower than last summer - that ain't too bad.

I personally fell that the writing is on the wall, so to speak, that Frontier is no longer viable as it currently operates.

The entrance of Southwest into their Denver hub will continue to be more and more devastating as Southwest ramps up service there. United will slug it out on price as well. Frontier just doesn't have the deep pockets that it will need to survive in the long run...IMHO. (After United's extremely poor financial performance the past couple of quarters, they may not have the deep pockets necessary to comepte with Southwest at Denver either).



Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 24996 posts, RR: 85
Reply 22, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3890 times:
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Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 21):
The entrance of Southwest into their Denver hub will continue to be more and more devastating as Southwest ramps up service there.

I guess you haven't been following what has been happening with Southwest at Denver. Here's today's snippet - there are more:

http://cbs4denver.com/business/local_story_145135959.html

For the record, I just checked again and my statement about the Q4 storm costs is badly worded on my part. Of the $20 million annual loss, some $15 million is because of the storm. A further $3.5 million is attributable to Frontier Holdings and not to the airline.

Of the $10 million loss for the 4Q, it breaks up as nearly $4 million in additional storm (4Q) costs and $3.5 million in 4Q lost revenue - as in pax who didn't fly.

Meaning that without the storm, the 4Q loss would have been about $3 million, excluding any other special items.

Of the annual loss, over $3.5 million is attributable to Frontier Holdings, but not to Frontier Airlines - as capital costs for the start-up of Lynx.

Since the company is anticipating a positive Q1 - unless oil misbehaves - I am not sure what writing you are seeing on the wall.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineBicoastal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3793 times:

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 21):
After United's extremely poor financial performance the past couple of quarters, they may not have the deep pockets necessary to comepte with Southwest at Denver either).

Doesn't United have something like $3.0 Billion...yes with a B....cash on hand?


User currently offlineWorldTraveler From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (7 years 1 month 4 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 3710 times:

Quoting Mariner (Reply 13):
The majority of the $14/$15 million cost was in the January period, due to the rebookings and the hangover effect of the storms.

your logic doesn't fly. if anything, people postponed their trips into the first of the year... UA and F9 were both still carrying pax into Jan that should have been carried over Christmas.

and lots of people claim bookaway but no one ever proves it. I say F9 is simply using weather as an excuse for their poor performance..... how many routes has F9 cancelled since the first of the year..... and their poor performance in SFO-LAX has been well documented.

WN never comes into a competitive market and just lets all the fists fly because they don't want the reputation of killing off the dominant airline. But you just have to look at PHL to see they will relentlessly grow and then everyone wakes up one morning and finds that they are a very large force. It will be no different in DEN.


25 RJNUT : i think that Southwest beginning to participate in Galileio/Appollo will help their situation in DEN since most agencies use that system.. But sitll ,
26 Mariner : It isn't my logic, I took the numbers directly from Frontier: If you want to tell Frontier their logic doesn't fly, I'll happily supply you with the
27 F9Animal : Everybody always feels that WN is invading their turf, and that the "writing is on the wall". HP/US has managed fine against WN. HP/US has learned to
28 Floridaflyboy : As we all know, one of those cities is BIL. That is all but confirmed by the fact that Lynx is hiring for people here in BIL.
29 Lexy : F9 could do well with some point to point domestic service I would think outside of the west coast. Not everyone wants to fly into Denver everytime th
30 Post contains images TxAgKuwait : Let's see how this works. What I have done is take the Q3 2005 passenger figures from the DOT and compared them to the results from 2006. Some things
31 Bicoastal : Interesting all the comments of "if only fuel prices." All airlines are using the same commodity. High fuel prices can't be used as an excuse. Some ar
32 Dw9115 : When will F9 announce the Lynx cities I thought they said by months end of May but no word yet and it doesn't look like they are going to announce the
33 Graphic : Lack of aircraft and more importantly, lack of certification. ...And didn't F9 announce a CR7 order along with the DH4s?[Edited 2007-05-27 03:22:30]
34 WorldTraveler : If you're talking about WN in PHL, they are receiving 4 ex-DL gates this winter as part of DL's move. Let's see: BWI is a former hub, PIT is a former
35 Post contains links and images Mariner : That would probably be me. I think I'm the one who raised oil prices first. And it is not an "excuse" - but it may be a reason. Like Southwest, Front
36 Mariner : Why would I be talking about Southwest at PHL? We were discussing Southwest at Denver. I know nothing of PHL. Mr. Kelly has said they will not commit
37 Graphic : Ok, I was probably thinking of the announcement that they were looking for to fly up to 20 70 seaters that eventually became Republic.
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