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Skybus Pay Rates  
User currently offlineNuggetsyl From United States of America, joined May 2006, 213 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 3 months 1 week ago) and read 6753 times:

I heard that skybus pays there fas $9.00 an hour and pilots 75,000 a year. For a fa this seems ungodly low. Is this true? And if so is it just starting first year pay or is $9.00 an hour just it?

73 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMichman From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 504 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week ago) and read 6731 times:

Don't know if there is a seniority based pay-scale, but I do know they receive a commission on the items they sell onboard.

User currently offlineNuggetsyl From United States of America, joined May 2006, 213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week ago) and read 6707 times:

Quoting Michman (Reply 1):
Don't know if there is a seniority based pay-scale, but I do know they receive a commission on the items they sell onboard

What selling coke and pillows???????


User currently offlineAa757first From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3347 posts, RR: 8
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week ago) and read 6701 times:

$9.00 an hour, if Skybus pays doors closed to doors opened, is about $8,100 a year. That's assuming they fly 75 hours a month, which is probably about the average.

User currently offlineCrogalski From United States of America, joined May 2005, 514 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6576 times:

On APC, they show a pathetic starting salary for FOs at $30,000 and CAPTs at $65,000...


A319 A320 B717 B727 B737 B747 B757 B767 C152 C172 DC9 E145 E190 MD88 PA28 | B6 CO DL FL NK NW LO TW
User currently offlineJayDub From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6506 times:

Yet another reason why SkyBus needs to go away.

Those payscales are setting a precedent that is just plain scary...and why it bothers me that everyone here is on board with the SkyBus idea.

So many here complain about the lack of service, how FA's, how customer service personnel are idiots, and how the golden age of air travel is over...then they fall all over themselves at the thought of $10 fares. When airlines like SkyBus succeed, other airlines follow suit, and they become the reason air travel sucks.

[Edited 2007-05-28 03:32:37]

User currently offlineNuggetsyl From United States of America, joined May 2006, 213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 6466 times:

Why the hell would would anyone work for 8000 a year? That is the dumbest thing i have ever heard.

User currently offlineSuperfreak From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 18 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 6433 times:

I seem to recall this discussion on previous threads. There must be something else to the compensation package that draws people in since they've obviously hired pilots and flight attendants. They wouldn't be flying if they couldn't get these folks hired and trained. From what I understand, the requirements for either position were more stringent than expected, so they clearly got more for their money on the salary piece. Hence, the reason why it would appear there is something else in the package that attracts the right kind of candidate. I don't know what it could be, but I think it would be safe to say that with all the other information they've managed to keep to themselves, there is a good chance it includes benefits information. These guys seem to be holding on to a lot of secrets very, very well. "Keep 'em guessing" isn't exactly a fool's strategy, either. If I were you, I wouldn't jump to any conclusions. IMHO

User currently offlinePGNCS From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 2821 posts, RR: 45
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 6376 times:

Quoting Superfreak (Reply 7):
There must be something else to the compensation package that draws people in since they've obviously hired pilots and flight attendants.

Or not. There are pilots who will fly for Skybus to get large airplane time and an A-320 type rating; they will move along to greener pastures by and large when they can. There are Flight Attendants who think this will be a glamorous life, and will think they can do OK financially from commissions off the cokes and pillows they sell. They will be wrong. In both cases, the problem isn't recruitment, the problem is retention. I highly doubt there is some amazing fringe benefit that has not been ferreted out here in their compensation package.


User currently offlineSuperfreak From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 18 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 5954 times:

Quoting PGNCS (Reply 8):
I highly doubt there is some amazing fringe benefit that has not been ferreted out here in their compensation package.

I never said amazing, and just because it's not on A.net doesn't mean it fails to exist.


User currently offlineAtomother From United States of America, joined May 1999, 440 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 5947 times:

So if people are willing to take jobs flying for these low salaries in hopes of getting some A320 time and then moving on, where are they moving on to?

Some may say to major airlines like United, American and Delta but they won't be offering reasonable salaries either if they are competing against skybus types where labor is nearly free.

Anyone who works for these companies for that low of pay is doing nothing more than hurting this industry and themselves. Hopefully they are blacklisted by anyone who conducts interviews in the future.


User currently offlineJoffie From Australia, joined Mar 2006, 806 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 5878 times:

Yes, according to several articles I have read, the Flight Attendants only get $9 per hour, and 10% commission of each item sold.

Try wikipedia or several news sites to obtain more information.


User currently offlineSuperfreak From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 18 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 5836 times:

Quoting Atomother (Reply 10):
So if people are willing to take jobs flying for these low salaries in hopes of getting some A320 time and then moving on, where are they moving on to?

Some may say to major airlines like United, American and Delta but they won't be offering reasonable salaries either if they are competing against skybus types where labor is nearly free.

Anyone who works for these companies for that low of pay is doing nothing more than hurting this industry and themselves. Hopefully they are blacklisted by anyone who conducts interviews in the future.

Yawn...so it begins with the salary mud-slinging. It's funny that you mention "hurting this industry" by the way. It seems to me, as an aviation consumer, that the previously well-paid legacy carrier employees did far more to hurt this industry than a low-frills/no-frills carrier ever has. From another perspective, you could make your same argument against all those who demanded higher salaries for less work via The Railway Labor Act. That's great for them, but it certainly didn't help the industry in any way. Even more interesting is the potential payoff that everyone seems to ignore. Let's say Skybus does very well and makes even half the money RyanAir pulls in. Wouldn't that enable them to elevate their pilot compensation above what any other airlines can afford? Would you call that hurting the industry? Let's say, with that nifty little 10%, the flight attendants rake in $35,000 per year starting out. They'd only need to sell about $4 per passenger given their current load factor (that appears to be about 1/3 of the plane buying a meal and a drink at listed prices). Would you call that hurting the industry? Seriously, what if they sold $6 per passenger?

By the way, I found a news tidbit with their CEO, and he mentioned stock options (regarding employee ownership). Not stocks. Stock options. I do believe stock options are locked at a strike price based on market value (and right now it's not much, say, $160 million), which makes them better than stocks. So, perhaps this is the missing piece of the compensation puzzle? Time will tell what those will be worth, but if Skybus does do well, these employees will wind up being compensated far more than the industry standard. Would you call that hurting the industry?

Interesting indeed...


User currently offlineIFly4UAL From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 5760 times:

Quoting JayDub (Reply 5):
Yet another reason why SkyBus needs to go away.

Those payscales are setting a precedent that is just plain scary...and why it bothers me that everyone here is on board with the SkyBus idea.

So many here complain about the lack of service, how FA's, how customer service personnel are idiots, and how the golden age of air travel is over...then they fall all over themselves at the thought of $10 fares. When airlines like SkyBus succeed, other airlines follow suit, and they become the reason air travel sucks.

AMEN to that JayDub. I couldn't have said it better myself. Here in the US it seems as if the entire industry has become a race to the bottom. Rather than seeing what MORE we can offer customers, airlines are spending time figuring out what we can take AWAY from customers...and yet we just can't get enough of the low-fare carriers, while at the same time whining about how "airline travel isn't what it used to be." I say the sooner we can get rid of SkyBus the better.



BGR--Vacation Spot for All the Flying Crazies
User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3289 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5562 times:

Quoting Superfreak (Reply 12):
Yawn...so it begins with the salary mud-slinging.

So very true.... yet I suspect the same people who claim that Skybus is hurting the industry have no problem looking for the best price when spending their own money. Nobody overpays for anything these days, including labor. Skybus is copying the Ryanair model, and Ryanair has some of the highest profit margins in the industry. There are quarters when Ryanair turns close to a 20% return. The majors would be ecstatic with 10%! Heck, United came out of Ch11 with a biz plan that projected a 6% return.

Yep, Skybus FA's make $9/flt hour, and 10% commission on sales. But they also get to be home every night (no overnighting), flight benefits, and I believe that if the company eventually goes public, all employees will have stock options. No matter what, it works for the people who are flying for them now.


User currently offlineUAL777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 1550 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 5533 times:

Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 14):

So very true.... yet I suspect the same people who claim that Skybus is hurting the industry have no problem looking for the best price when spending their own money. Nobody overpays for anything these days, including labor. Skybus is copying the Ryanair model, and Ryanair has some of the highest profit margins in the industry. There are quarters when Ryanair turns close to a 20% return. The majors would be ecstatic with 10%! Heck, United came out of Ch11 with a biz plan that projected a 6% return.

Yep, Skybus FA's make $9/flt hour, and 10% commission on sales. But they also get to be home every night (no overnighting), flight benefits, and I believe that if the company eventually goes public, all employees will have stock options. No matter what, it works for the people who are flying for them now.

The difference is that Ryanair pilots are paid very well. There is a pilot shortage in the US for a reason: salaries are TOO LOW!



It is always darkest before the sun comes up.
User currently offlineATLTraveler From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 44 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 5468 times:

For Coach Class passengers, its not like service is any better on Legacy Carriers. Same low end service and that staff gets paid twice as much as the LCC's. So the only difference is a coke and a snack. If they can make a good cup of coffee, I don't mind paying a few dollars. Someone needs to start low cost International Service where you can buy some nice meals and a cup of Starbucks or how about a nice bar  Smile That would be good for passengers and the Airline.

User currently offlineSansVGs From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 190 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 5413 times:

Quoting UAL777 (Reply 15):

The difference is that Ryanair pilots are paid very well. There is a pilot shortage in the US for a reason: salaries are TOO LOW!

Yep. Pinnacle is paying $1000 referral bonuses for referring pilots who make it through IOE. PSA has dropped their flight time requirements altogether. They will hire a pilot with a still-wet / fresh commercial, multi, inst. ticket.

Why couldn't times have been like this when I was a 19 year old "punkie" selling plasma to buy flight hours? Smile



Winglets on a Falcon are "over-painting" a great work of art.
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7539 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 5275 times:

Quoting Crogalski (Reply 4):
On APC, they show a pathetic starting salary for FOs at $30,000

Thats pretty high for a first year FO compared to most of the nation.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineItsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 5263 times:

Quoting UAL777 (Reply 15):
The difference is that Ryanair pilots are paid very well. There is a pilot shortage in the US for a reason: salaries are TOO LOW!

You have that backwards, the airlines can pay so low because there are people willing to take the jobs. Blame the 19 year old FO fresh out of Comair academy, not the airlines.

If the supply of pilots diminished, then the airlines would have to raise salaries to attract labor. Simple supply and demand economics, nothing more.


User currently offlineUAL777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 1550 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 5220 times:

Quoting Itsnotfinals (Reply 19):

You have that backwards, the airlines can pay so low because there are people willing to take the jobs. Blame the 19 year old FO fresh out of Comair academy, not the airlines.

If the supply of pilots diminished, then the airlines would have to raise salaries to attract labor. Simple supply and demand economics, nothing more.

I am a 21 year old instrument student myself. I ALMOST went to the Regional Airline Academy until I got wise. Commercial Pilot certificate issuance is was down 63% in 2006 compared to 2004. Flight instructors are leaving in droves and there are no replacements because minimums are so low. Most regionals are offering sign-on bonuses now, and are offering bonuses to FOs at other airlines to switch over.

I urge every flight student (or potential flight student) to avoid pilot mills like RAA, Delta Connection Academy, and Jet University. You will save ALOT of money and will receive better training.

Further, fight your case of SJS (Shiny Jet Syndrome) and instruct, banner-tow, fly traffic watch, or drop sky divers for a few months and apply to one of the top tier regionals.

Avoid Mesa, GoJet, Trans-States, and PSA.

The senior pilots will respect you for it, you will get paid more, and you will help force wages up and "improve the profession."

My wish list is: American Eagle, ASA, and Skywest in that order.



It is always darkest before the sun comes up.
User currently offlineUAL777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 1550 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 5208 times:

Quoting ATLTraveler (Reply 16):
Someone needs to start low cost International Service where you can buy some nice meals and a cup of Starbucks or how about a nice bar Smile That would be good for passengers and the Airline.

UA serves Starbucks.



It is always darkest before the sun comes up.
User currently offlineFlybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1801 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days ago) and read 5186 times:

Quoting Atomother (Reply 10):
Some may say to major airlines like United, American and Delta but they won't be offering reasonable salaries either if they are competing against skybus types where labor is nearly free.

The problem with this idea is that the higher paying legacies are HEAVILY unionized... and because of that they will never be low cost. As history shows, unionized employees rather run the company into the ground than take a lower paycheck for the long term.

Skybus is probably a great stepping stone for most people who want to fly in the airlines, but the problem that arises is that these "stepping stones" are becoming a dime a dozen while the number of legacy airlines and jobs remain small. I have a feeling that some day soon you'll need 8,000+ hours to be considered by legacies as a new first-officer. This prophecy will especially come true considering that every Tom, Dick and Harry with lapels on his shoulders, "shiny plane syndrome", and a degree from a Florida pilot mill, wants to be a career airline pilot... whatever the cost.



"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
User currently offlineItsnotfinals From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days ago) and read 5155 times:

Quoting UAL777 (Reply 20):
I urge every flight student (or potential flight student) to avoid pilot mills like RAA, Delta Connection Academy, and Jet University. You will save ALOT of money and will receive better training.

Further, fight your case of SJS (Shiny Jet Syndrome) and instruct, banner-tow, fly traffic watch, or drop sky divers for a few months and apply to one of the top tier regionals.

Avoid Mesa, GoJet, Trans-States, and PSA.

You are one of the smart ones and I applaud you. I was in your place in 1991 when you had to have 4000 hours to get on with a major and no one was hiring, times have changed, and they will again.

Unfortunately SJS is hard to stop and lots of people will still jump to get to be a "Jet piliot"


User currently offlineAa757first From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3347 posts, RR: 8
Reply 24, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days ago) and read 5116 times:

Quoting Superfreak (Reply 12):
Let's say, with that nifty little 10%, the flight attendants rake in $35,000 per year starting out. They'd only need to sell about $4 per passenger given their current load factor

A 90% load factor on their A319 is 140 people. If 80% buy a soda, 20% alcohol and 50% buy something like a snack platter, that's a total of about $18 a flight per flight attendant. There's no way you're going to get to $35,000 a year to start out.


25 F9Animal : I can't believe nobody on a.net has gotten on with Skybus. Or is there an employee or two, but just being cautious. Spill the beans!!
26 Itsnotfinals : They sell other iems as well like pillow and blankets. Their F/A's have been told to expect 9.40 in purchases per passenger (that is the target)
27 Travatl : $9/hr? Holy crap - even ValuJet started at $11.76/hr FOURTEEN years ago, and we got doublepay after 80 hours, profit sharing, and stock options. South
28 Ikramerica : Dude, this is exactly how the free market is supposed to work. Salaries are too low, so people avoid the profession. If there is a shortage of pilots
29 Post contains images DCrawley : Probably one of the better choices you have made in your life! I bailed on them after my private because it was such a scam of an operation. They are
30 Luvfa : Its not limited to FA's other professions use their union/political clout to help their standards of living. Half the legal advice and filing could b
31 Post contains images GMUAirbusA320 : HOLY CRAP, you guys make me miss the Economics classes at George Mason University. Seriously, people don't get that the "free market" we live in isn'
32 Post contains images Shenzhen : Guess we need to start tipping the FA when they show us to our seat Cheers
33 Ewmahle : I would agree with that. If you have ever taken an Econ course with a decent teacher, the downside and negative impact on labor markets as whole with
34 Post contains images GMUAirbusA320 : Yep, I did. George Mason University has 2 Nobel Prize Winning Economists and 1 Renowed (Dr. Walter Williams). I was fortunate to take a 100-level cou
35 UnknownUser : Haha, you think you get better training out of a Part 61 environment as opposed to a FAA controlled/regulated Part 141 environment? I wasn't doing we
36 UAL777 : I never said that. There are pt. 141 schools that don't charge you 70k to get your ratings. The ONLY difference between pt. 61. and pt. 141 is that 1
37 QQflyboy : Great book... loved every page. With $9/hr it won't stay this way. Look at B6... all roses in the beginning and now there is an effort by the FAs to
38 Post contains links Asuflyer05 : $30k for a first year f/o is about right. CO pays $30 an hour x 76 hours for a "B" reserve is $27,360. Factor in your per diem and it will push you b
39 SansVGs : First it was Monday Morning Airline CEO's here...now it is "Economist Time." A couple of 100 level courses does not an economist make, even with Adam
40 Luvfa : You hit the nail right on the head! FA's are responsible for the safety of all paxs. This commision based pay causes one to sell-sell-sell, reguardle
41 Superfreak : I did the math on that again, and... Assuming 50 flights per month with 100 passengers per flight: $18 per passenger = $36,000 per year just on commi
42 Superfreak : This is an amusing assumption people are making about safety. I don't disagree that there may be a finer line here. But unless Skybus has an accident
43 Logos : Skybus is taking a page out of the PeopleExpress book by generally hiring outside the industry for everything but pilots. Their target for the $9/hour
44 Zenarcade : Who is this guy? How can you possibly suggest that pilots who fly for Skybus should be blacklisted by other employers? Accepting low pay does not hur
45 Poitin : SX's basic premise that there is a market for low cost air travel in the US is correct. FR proved that in Europe. However, their approach to implemen
46 Itsnotfinals : Only 8 of the 65 planes are going to be based in CMH as has been pointed out several times. Their will be several other focus cities for the remaining
47 Post contains links and images Gilesdavies : Nine dollars an hour is criminal!!! I think you need to speak to your dear president about new labour laws and introducing a minimum wage! In the UK w
48 Poitin : Heck, even EI made 65 million Euros selling stuff to their passengers, and a good thing because they turned in only a E 72 million profit last year.
49 CasInterest : Let's make some assumptions. People will want a Soda/Food/Beer. We''ll assume that some will pay, and some won't on a flight. However with everything
50 Post contains images JasperEMA : I know its just like an apprenticeship of old, 3 or 4 years of crap money until you learn the ropes but these figures seem so low , people have still
51 Asuflyer05 : Some flight attendants give customers too much alcohol now and they do it in the name of customer service. My point is can you imagine the issue when
52 Azstagecoach : I think the $9.00 per passenger is quite feasible. Consider the Midwest Express model of $10 Best Care Cuisine entrees that people actually want to b
53 0NEWAIR0 : Raising minimum wage is a dumb idea. Increasing the cost of living (for everyone) is the only thing it accomplishes.
54 Logos : We have a minimum wage, thank you very much, and it was just increased (not that I regard that in any way as positive). What is generally not underst
55 Luvfa : Except in the airline industry where the rules are established by the antiquated RLA. In fact, prior to 1996 there were no rules on duty/rest for FA'
56 Superfreak : Since I was not referring to you as an idiot, but that your opinion reminded me of said idiots train of thought, then I hardly understand why you wou
57 Azstagecoach : I might try it, just to know what the experience is like. If the buy-on-board consumables are of good quality, and the seats are well-designed and su
58 Tbolt1 : it's been said I dunno how many times that they can't force you to not bring food on board. I think even the CEO was quoted saying that they weren't
59 Logos : Or, if enough of you feel that way, you can go do something else with your life. Eventually, the pendulum will swing the other way. I'm sorry, but no
60 UAL777 : Easy for you to say. I have invested too much into my career to simply go do something else. Airline management are the most ruthless guys ever. If t
61 Itsnotfinals : Why, because people will take jobs for that rate? it is a market economy, if people will take the jobs, they would be doing a disservice to their sha
62 Logos : Well said (the entire post was, actually). It was tough to be in the buggy whip manufacturing business when the horseless carriage came along, too. I
63 AirOne : Guys- To clear up a few rumors, first off many of the flight attendants are new to aviation, but many are not. I have met countless ones from JetBlue,
64 UAL777 : Im not bitter. Yes people would go be pilots for less IF THEY DIDNT HAVE TO PAY FOR IT. As of right now, there is a huge shortage due to the years of
65 Itsnotfinals : You still have the economics backwards. The supply is still plentiful for now or else the wages would be higher. The barrier to entering the market ha
66 Logos : And you may be seeing the beginnings of that now as regionals have had to lower their total time to almost nothing to find applicants. I would think
67 Mandala499 : Oh My God! That is dismal! One LCC here (yes a third world country) pays F/As $8 an hour if you recalculate on a per hour basis... Though some tries
68 Itsnotfinals : It is beginning that is for sure. I say 24-36 months from now salaries will be going up (unless some economic thing happens that drives traffic down
69 QXRamperMEII : OK I'm one of those FNGs going early into the jets...hate me at will. Here's a bit of my history: My first flight, ever, as a student was 3 years ago
70 Logos : And that is the bottom line. You looked today's reality square in the face and chose the best alternative among the choices you had. But you're on yo
71 Asuflyer05 : The supply is not plentiful that's why you see certain regionals lowering their minimum times. Some are offering hiring bonuses. There are a number o
72 Itsnotfinals : There is for now, but it is drying up quickly. that is econ 101. Already there are several regionals with no time requirments, so they are getting to
73 GMUAirbusA320 : We got a new minimum wage...courtesy of the spineless Democrats that gave the President a blank check for the war! They did it at the cost of thousan
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