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AirTran Extends YX Offer To 10AUG  
User currently offlineTravatl From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 2173 posts, RR: 7
Posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8740 times:

Says 59.5 of shares tendered.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/070611/nym045.html?.v=96

264 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSkyexRamper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 8712 times:

Great more Tendered! Now the people actually have to fork those shares over, come on Joe!  Wink 8/10 huh? I bet the next extension will be early October.

User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6771 posts, RR: 17
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 8705 times:

Why don't they just make it an indefinite extension? This is really getting stupid. Midwest doesn't want to sell. AirTran should just let it go and move on.. How long has this been going on? Almost a year? This can't be making the AirTran name very favorable in the eyes of the beholders.. For me personally, it's making me more and more distrusting and put off by the airline..


Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8680 times:

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 2):
For me personally, it's making me more and more distrusting and put off by the airline..

I'm sure Joe Leonard and the rest of Airtran find that disturbing.  Wink

Airtran is not about to give up with that many shares alreadt tendered. Its simply a matter of time and how much it is going to cost FL to aquire Midwest.



One Nation Under God
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6771 posts, RR: 17
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8658 times:

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 3):
I'm sure Joe Leonard and the rest of Airtran find that disturbing.

Sarcasm received..  Smile But perhaps he should because I'm sure I'm not the only one.. just like this war.. I am disturbed by that. Am I the only one? nope.. and on average, my one opinion represent how many people? Probably my one opinion represent 1000 people.. 100 people? well, however many it represents, the actual number of people disturbed should be significant enough to grab someone's attention.



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineGr8SlvrFlt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 1606 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 8649 times:

The additional publicity has helped AirTran in the Milwaukee market immensely. Loads on MKE flights are among the highest in the system. "Midwest doesn't want to sell." Really? Sixty percent of their shareholders do.

User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 8542 times:

Quoting Gr8SlvrFlt (Reply 5):
The additional publicity has helped AirTran in the Milwaukee market immensely. Loads on MKE flights are among the highest in the system. "Midwest doesn't want to sell." Really? Sixty percent of their shareholders do.

And you have proof of this I'm sure.


User currently offlineN917ME From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 730 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 8512 times:

Quoting Gr8SlvrFlt (Reply 5):
The additional publicity has helped AirTran in the Milwaukee market immensely. Loads on MKE flights are among the highest in the system. "Midwest doesn't want to sell." Really? Sixty percent of their shareholders do.

No the large investement firms that have 60pct of the shares want to make a quick buck.. they don't know of care if the "new larger" AirTran is sucessful after a "merger" as they will have sold all those shares off.

So to say 60pct of the shareholders is in favor of the sale.... WRONG, just sixty percent of the shares... which are held by 4-5 large institutions,,,


User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6570 posts, RR: 51
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 8486 times:

60% is still 60% any way you slice it. As in more than half. As in the majority.

I think if FL continues to push this, YX will be their's. They obviously will have no problem extending this as long as it takes...what is this, the third or fourth extension already?

If FL upper management was concered about what some people think of the airline for continuing this push, they would have stopped it maybe six months ago. Obviously, they see the benefits of this far outweighing the potentially negative perception of the airline, especially from die hard YX fans.


User currently offlineFLYGUY767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 8472 times:

It will be a sad day when and if FL takesover YX. Air Tran is not regarded by many, the service and reputation of YX is hallmarked. So sad to see if FL gets their hands on YX. So very sad.

-JD


User currently offlineN917ME From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 730 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 8409 times:

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 8):
60% is still 60% any way you slice it.

well 60% of the shares is different from 60% of the shareholders..vastly different. Anyway, FL has not purchased any of these shares, so whats stopping them?? What are they afraid of.. something if they have not already purchased them.


User currently offlineMainland From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 309 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 8361 times:

Quoting N917ME (Reply 10):
Anyway, FL has not purchased any of these shares, so whats stopping them?? What are they afraid of.. something if they have not already purchased them.

Why not? Because all conditions for the merger to go forward have not been met -- mainly the poison pill provision has not been redeemed. Why would AirTran want to purchase 59.5% of the shares if, with the poison pill looming, the remaining could cost them even more?



You don't need a passport to know what state you're in...
User currently offlineAirTran717 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 746 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 8322 times:

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 6):
And you have proof of this I'm sure.



Quoting Travatl (Thread starter):
Says 59.5 of shares tendered.

That proof enough for ya? Last time I checked anything over 50% was a majority. But that's just my math. I agree with another poster... They won't just let go of their 60% tendered shares they spent the last year obtaining. It's just a matter of time. I can speak for the MKE loads too... as of 2005, when I was still flying for them. They were almost always full then.

717


User currently offlineAirTran717 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 746 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 8322 times:

Quoting N917ME (Reply 7):
So to say 60pct of the shareholders is in favor of the sale.... WRONG, just sixty percent of the shares... which are held by 4-5 large institutions,,,

60% is 60% any way you care to slice it. It's still a majority in favor.

717


User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 8312 times:

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 9):
It will be a sad day when and if FL takesover YX. Air Tran is not regarded by many, the service and reputation of YX is hallmarked. So sad to see if FL gets their hands on YX. So very sad.

Joe just may surprise all of you YX fans and implement some of the customer service hallmarks across FL. You never know........ cookies, better seat pitch and leather seats may be awaiting us all in the future (one can only hope).



One Nation Under God
User currently offlineBlsbls99 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 345 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 8296 times:

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 2):
This is really getting stupid. Midwest doesn't want to sell. AirTran should just let it go and move on.. How long has this been going on? Almost a year? This can't be making the AirTran name very favorable in the eyes of the beholders.. For me personally, it's making me more and more distrusting and put off by the airline..

Hmmmm...new spin...

This is really getting stupid. Air Tran wants to buy. Midwest should just let it go and be bought. How long do they need to hold out? A year? This can't be making the Midwest name very favorable in the eyes of the beholders. For me personally, it's making me more and more distrusting and put off by the airline...



319 320 313 722 732 733 735 73G 738 739 742 752 763 772 CRJ D9S ERJ EMB L10 M88 M90 SF3 AT4
User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 8286 times:

Quoting N917ME (Reply 10):
well 60% of the shares is different from 60% of the shareholders

You know what? It's their money! They own the stock. They put up the money to buy it . They can choose when they want to sell it.

Quoting N917ME (Reply 7):
No the large investement firms that have 60pct of the shares want to make a quick buck..

If they are in it for a quick buck, then more power to them. It's their profits, not yours, not the board of directors, not the government bureaucrats and certainly not some cookie eating passenger who flys once a year and thinks he owns the airline.
You are, of course, welcome to buy their shares for more than the current offer. I'm sure they would be glad to sell. Capitalism is a wonderful thing.


User currently offlineN917ME From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 730 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 8247 times:

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 16):
they are in it for a quick buck, then more power to them. It's their profits, not yours, not the board of directors, not the government bureaucrats and certainly not some cookie eating passenger who flys once a year and thinks he owns the airline.

You are correct. However, Like I said before, if Joe has the majority of the shares, why not buy them now instead of extending the tender over and over..

AirTran just needs to step up, complete the purchase of what shares have been tendered or just turn and go away,


User currently offlineCitrusCritter From Pitcairn Islands, joined May 2007, 1105 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 8228 times:

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 14):
Joe just may surprise all of you YX fans and implement some of the customer service hallmarks across FL. You never know........ cookies, better seat pitch and leather seats may be awaiting us all in the future (one can only hope).

I sure hope so...I am as loyal an AirTran flyer as there is, and they could do a lot to build a loyal following including learning from YX as well as B6. J7 had a unique personality, much like B6 and WN...the F/As were fun etc...FL is a lot more stiff...almost a legacy type personality when that's counter to their main market.



TLH
User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32799 posts, RR: 71
Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 8193 times:

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 2):
Why don't they just make it an indefinite extension? This is really getting stupid. Midwest doesn't want to sell. AirTran should just let it go and move on.. How long has this been going on? Almost a year? This can't be making the AirTran name very favorable in the eyes of the beholders.. For me personally, it's making me more and more distrusting and put off by the airline..

The disturbing thing here is Midwest not selling when it is obvious that it is best they sell.



a.
User currently offlineBOS2LAF From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 374 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 8177 times:

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 14):
Joe just may surprise all of you YX fans and implement some of the customer service hallmarks across FL. You never know........ cookies, better seat pitch and leather seats may be awaiting us all in the future (one can only hope).

 rotfl 

Keep wishing. The day Leonard implements characteristics of YX is the day he rebrands AirTran as Midwest.

What next? AirTran actually vacuuming their planes more than just once at the end of the day??


User currently offlineBlsbls99 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 345 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 8154 times:

Quoting BOS2LAF (Reply 20):
Keep wishing. The day Leonard implements characteristics of YX is the day he rebrands AirTran as Midwest.

Yes, that's right, no other airline implements new, innovative things like Midwest...codesharing with Northwest Airlines, or combing Signature and Saver into the same cabin (wow, first and economy on one aircraft??).
What makes you so sure, other than your own opinion, that AirTran wouldn't implement or keep some YX characteristics?



319 320 313 722 732 733 735 73G 738 739 742 752 763 772 CRJ D9S ERJ EMB L10 M88 M90 SF3 AT4
User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 8134 times:

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 12):
I can speak for the MKE loads too... as of 2005, when I was still flying for them. They were almost always full then.

The industry has the highest load factors in history. Everyone is full.


User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 8092 times:

Some additional coverage:
http://www.ajc.com/business/content/...ies/2007/06/11/0611bizairtran.html

I think this definitely will make the upcoming MEH shareholder's meeting even more interesting. With nearly 60% of the company's stock being tendered and (excluding managers) 64.1% of the company's stockholders having voted for an AirTran buyout, Tim and Company may be facing a hostile crowd at this meeting in addition to the hostile takeover bid. While there has been investment groups that have come in and swooped on shares in the hopes of making a quick buck (That's how investing works folks.), at least one institutional (Heartland) has refused to tender their shares and have instead sold a significant part of their holdings on the open market (shares that were probably picked up by one of the institutional groups trying to make some money off of the deal).



Quoting N917ME (Reply 10):

well 60% of the shares is different from 60% of the shareholders..vastly different. Anyway, FL has not purchased any of these shares, so whats stopping them?? What are they afraid of.. something if they have not already purchased them.



Quoting N917ME (Reply 17):

You are correct. However, Like I said before, if Joe has the majority of the shares, why not buy them now instead of extending the tender over and over... AirTran just needs to step up, complete the purchase of what shares have been tendered or just turn and go away,

I'm guessing that Galena Acquisition Corp. (The wholly-owned subsidiary of AirTran Holdings that the bid and tender offer is being handled through.) will wait until after the Midwest Air Group Inc. shareholders' meeting to start taking the steps to actually start purchasing those tendered shares. I'm also guessing that they're also in the process of finalizing the financing for the deal as well. Galena does hold a small number of shares in MEH already.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 19):

The disturbing thing here is Midwest not selling when it is obvious that it is best they sell.

And the stubbornness of Midwest's management could potentially led to shareholder lawsuits if the deal is tabled and the shares of MEH plummet as a result. The price that shares of MEH has been trading at since the buyout offer was made are tied into the buyout offer itself.

If Midwest truly wants to repel the barbarians at the gates (This deal is reminding me of some of the corporate takeovers of the 1980s, hence the Tom Wolfe reference) of the Cookie Palace, they need to either a.) Hook up with an investment group to take the company private or b.) find another airline to come in and make a higher offer. Option A is more likely than B, as B in a way is almost like the bidding war between Texas Air Corp. and Carl Icahn for TWA back in the Mid-80s, in a sense, going for the lesser of two evils as it were.

Even if AirTran is successful in acquiring Midwest, things will definitely be acrimonious when it comes time to integrate the two companies together.


User currently offlineHeavyMx1 From United States of America, joined Jun 2003, 305 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (7 years 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 8089 times:

Quoting BOS2LAF (Reply 20):
Keep wishing. The day Leonard implements characteristics of YX is the day he rebrands AirTran as Midwest

Instead of wishing lets look at reality in the way that YX is implementing the characteristics of FL and every other airline out their with more seats. Apparently they cant sustain a profit with their current business model.

Quoting N917ME (Reply 17):
AirTran just needs to step up, complete the purchase of what shares have been tendered or just turn and go away

Well basically because the poison pill is still a factor. If you read the recent articles the deadline was extended till Aug. so after YX's annual meeting when new directors are elected (presumably FL's) they can be ratified, this is said to take until August. Once they are in FL will have a little more control and be able to shake things up more.



I am better than you because I live on an Island
25 Mainland : Why should AirTran spend one penny or dilute its share base when there's no assurance the deal will close?
26 Mke717spotter : Well the only way they are going to have an imediate impact on the board is if they can convince some of the other members of the board to let this d
27 N917ME : Well, at least one analyst is now reducing earning estimates for AirTran.... In a report Monday, Calyon Securities analyst Ray Neidl reduced his secon
28 We're Nuts : Not really. Most of the financial institutions in question are legally obligated to sell (because there is a profit involved), regardless of what the
29 SkyyMaster : Does anybody give a flip about YX's employees? Obviously not. They don't want this. A forced takeover is not exactly going to be a morale builder, es
30 Quickmover : Why else would they want it? Certainly not just the planes. Those 13 md80s would be the first to go and replaced by the 75 73Gs on order. Even Carol
31 JBo : At least Wisconsin State law requires that they consider the effect of the merger on employees (and all other stakeholders as well). It's not the YX
32 Deltadude8 : People here in Kansas City know that if YX is indeed bought out by Air Tran that all of the non-stops we have come to know and love from YX will be ou
33 CitrusCritter : Oh give me a break...it has been demonstrated that WN is losing money on most of their new stations, so to think they can come in to MCI and just blee
34 Post contains links Mainland : And now Midwest has issued it's own warning: Midwest Air Sees Lower Second Quarter: http://www.marketwatch.com/News/Stor...55875CA9B%7d&siteid=yhoo&d
35 Vivavegas : I have been paying the HIGHEST fares since I began traveling heavily 10 years ago, this combined with some of the most jam packed planes I have ever
36 N917ME : I Have been asking this question all along. Joe was real big on YX employees will retain their jobs and have more room for advancement (well duh, you
37 AirTran737 : Understand that FL is under headcount in many stations, and the YX additions will help get them up to headcount. It won't be as bad as the YX loyalis
38 N917ME : I see that they have many postings for openings, however I believe on the East Coast, YX starting pay is more than FL starting pay. Without knowing s
39 AirTran737 : In some East Coast cities FL does offer a cost of living increase on all wages, however you cannot live on starting wage at any airline on the East C
40 RJNUT : Why dont they just do like the US/DL proposal. We will buy you but turn it into your product...US knew that the DL product was much better appreciated
41 SkyyMaster : As I said, to get rid of a competitor, even if they do not match up head-to-head. Do you expect FL will keep the YX Conect services? They already did
42 AirTran737 : A big reason that FL didn't like it was due to AWAC sucking major ass. AWAC couldn't get us a maintenance ready airplane if their lives depended on i
43 SkyexRamper : If we count Skyway pilots as YX crews, we have already seen about 6 of them leave for AirTran in the last 3-4 months. Also back at the start of the y
44 SkyyMaster : So I guess the company line that the RJ's simply were not efficient or practical for them when compared to the 717's was a media cover. Funny I never
45 AirTran737 : Joe and Bob always said that the 717 was more efficient than the CRJ, and I don't doubt it. I am telling you that AWAC caused a lot of embarrassment
46 Quickmover : The beauty of this whole deal is that there is very little overlap on their routes. Are you saying that Airtran would pay $389 mil to get rid of nons
47 JBo : Doesn't surprise me, they probably all bought hook, line, and sinker, the lines fed by FL about flying 70-seaters. I somehow doubt that will come to
48 Post contains links CitrusCritter : RE: Interesting Take On WN (by TxAgKuwait May 30 2007 in Civil Aviation) YX is not well known outside of the midwest. AirTran definitely has a much s
49 SkyexRamper : Nah, JBo, our pilots didn't buy into any of the AirTran's "lines"...it's just that they don't give a rats a$$ anymore and don't care who is in charge
50 JBo : That may also be, but given FL's lack of success with regionals, one would think they'd rather be employed than potentially unemployed. 'Course, that
51 N917ME : I disagree. Midwest Airlines is known all across the US, more may know it by Midwest Express. Just ask the readers of Conde Nast Traveler, Travel + L
52 AirTran737 : Very true, Timmy even called it Midwest Express on the conference call the other day. Way to know your own airlines name!
53 N917ME : Well for over 20 years he has called it Midwest Express, kind of hard to break a habit..kind of like when I worked in Corporate Travel, called AirTran
54 RJNUT : I still call it US AIR and still call the airport they serve "National" the merged carried could be called Tranny Express!
55 Cloudboy : name recognition is not the same as brand respect. More people recognize the Taco Bell brand over Qudoba. But you can't tell me most people would rath
56 Blsbls99 : Well if most people don't recognize the Qudoba name/brand (myself included), then I guess most would chose what they know, Taco Bell. AirTran has eno
57 Quickmover : Those jets are leased from Boeing capital, so why pay $389 mil just to take over paying somebody elses lease payments? Also, Airtran has 75 more 737s
58 Mikey711MN : Actually, contacting the manufacturer to place an order or a leasing company to enter into a lease agreement are two ways that are by far easier than
59 Post contains links Travatl : Huh? I've read, heard, seen nothing of 70 seat RJs. They support the merger 'cause certainly a faster road to flying 717s than where they are now. SO
60 CitrusCritter : So in other words, experienced travelers know Midwest Express...maybe. Midwest's destinations are extremely limited and they essentially offer folks
61 JBo : It was more or less mentioned as an aside in the early going when asked of what would become of Skyway, or something like that. Someone like Knope200
62 Travatl : Well, there's certainly no discussion of it on AirTran property. I've followed this as closely as anyone else (and tried to refrain from the biased, s
63 Wjcandee : It wasn't so much "lack of success" with regional jets as that FL realized that they could put a 717 in there for less $$ than they were paying Air W
64 Srbmod : FL has had a pretty cozy relationship with Boeing Capital over the last few years. Boeing Capital helped to finance the huge debt repayment they had
65 N917ME : No, Midwest flies to 52 cities, Airtran flies to 56 cities,,, Yes, AirTran floods those markets with frequency. Brand recognition has nothing to do w
66 CitrusCritter : How many of those 52 cities are mainline and outside of the "midwest?" Of course it does, because if the brand recognition was as high as claimed on
67 Cloudboy : Just because Air Tran is ordering 737s doesn't mean that is their optimal choice. Boeing is making the 717 anymore, so they can't order those. They ha
68 Travatl : And the beat goes on. What ever happened to mature discussion? It seems 80% of the threads on this site (90% that involve AirTran - 99% if they includ
69 Travatl : He was already calling the ValuJet card before all that. It's the standard goto "gotcha" when people run out of items to use on the industry's favorit
70 Post contains links TedEx : Most of the folks on AirTran property probably haven't read AirTran's 8K filing from Feb. 27: http://businessweek.brand.edgar-onli...ssionID=1mZyjNVj
71 JBo : Interesting point indeed, and one wonders what difference it would make being a third-party contractor or an in-house regional. Thinking on the other
72 Post contains images Travatl : This new T.A. (which I have not had the opportunity to see) has new scope provisions in it that have many pilots on the line losing their mind. From w
73 SkyexRamper : Yet another top notch Skyway 328 Captain is going to AirTran. That is about 6 captains that have left for AirTran since the first of the year.
74 AirTran737 : Who all has left this year? I can think of about ten guys from before 2007
75 JBo : LOL ... I don't recall every saying anything about the 1900s ... in my mind they'd be gone unless Great Lakes were to pick up some of the current non
76 JpetekYXMD80 : I fail to see why this is always so perplexing/damning to you. They get to fly mainline aircraft and get paid better for doing so. It's called career
77 AirTran737 : I think his point is that the good pilots who in the past had made Skyway a good place to work are leaving in droves and are being replaced with peop
78 Post contains images SkyexRamper : My point was just that, hey look another pilots is leaving to the company that wants us bad. Also if you look over the last 5 years at Skyway, the la
79 DAYflyer : The are a lot of positive synergies involved in this merger for both sides. Airtran gets the benefit of immediate growth into new markets, aircraft ty
80 Cloudboy : They are not really going to gain additional markets, because the typical Midwest passenger isn't he type of passenger to normally travel on Air Tran.
81 Quickmover : I don't buy that at all. If you are flying to/from MKE or MCI and you have a choice of a nonstop or connection for the same money, people will fly th
82 CitrusCritter : So what I want to know is whether YX will attempt to gain business outside of MKE and MCI and flying persons from those places elsewhere? When will th
83 JBo : For some reason I wouldn't think of SkyWest as the lowest bidder, since I'm fairly certain Mesa put in a bid, too. What does SkyWest being non-union
84 SkyexRamper : Timmy publicly admitted that he is looking at another city to do what he did to MCI. We might find out sometime this year if we're lucky. But I have
85 Mke717spotter : I'm not sure I understand what your saying here, since YX flies all the routes (except MIA) and more that FL flies to/from MKE/MCI. So I don't really
86 Quickmover : Poorly worded. Sorry. I'm talking about post merger Airtran with a couple hundred MKE nonstops. Customers who may say they are staying away from Airt
87 Deltadude8 : So please tell me becuse I'm really interested to know where I can buy a plane ticket on AirTran from MCI-MIA or RSW non-stop...and when it flies and
88 Deltadude8 : oh yes...and since SW has been in MCI for well i don't know something like over 10 years......I don't think its proper to refer to MCI as a "NEW STAT
89 Post contains links AirTran737 : Boy you sure do run your mouth a lot when you don;t know what you're talking about. Ask and you shall receive. http://pressroom.airtran.com/phoenix..
90 Deltadude8 : Okay...so they are gonig to start? But haven't yet... becuase your post said: In context...your saying YX is getting beat in those markets when AirTr
91 N917ME : How many of these will be seasonal?
92 CitrusCritter : Frothing at the mouth a little aren't you? FL would not be starting these routes if they felt YX could keep them out. YX clearly can not. And WN and
93 Knope2001 : Wow…quite a lot going on here in this thread while I was away. Amazing a name-brand chain hotel for $159/night in far suburban Chicago can get away
94 Post contains links TedEx : Excellent post. Your comments about the best of both worlds reminded me of these ads from the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. Unfortunatley, I can't get t
95 Knope2001 : I'll try my hand at these... The 717 isn't flexible enough for AirTran due to range, and the 737 gives them a lot more options. The 737's which were s
96 Knope2001 : Typo on my part...that should say 2006, not 2007. Of course we don't know how 2007 will ultimately turn out for either airline in profits. But in 200
97 CitrusCritter : I think it is clear that FL will not attempt to discount the RJ flights. The RJ flights will continue to cost what they cost YX, with perhaps some sa
98 Post contains links Deltadude8 : The Kansas City Star put an interesting view on the Midwest side of the hostile takeover: and further comes out looking like the "good guy" for KC as
99 AirTran737 : I guarantee that AirTran spends even more money on community involvement than YX does. This is the typical media whining that we have all come to be
100 Post contains images Flyingchoirboy : Let it go and move on? Are you kidding? YX=Loses money, FL=Makes money. FL + YX = YX employees keep their jobs and FL becomes more competitive. And w
101 Deltadude8 : geez...you AirTran people can't take a joke...grrr...so angry all the time... CitrisCritter jumps off the page because he "read" that I had a nasty t
102 AirTran737 : I have been a member for three years and seventy days, I think I have been around long enough. Some of us get a bit testy when it comes to the ScareT
103 Knope2001 : No, reality is that they will need to slash fares to stimulate traffic. That's because AirTran's RJ plans put a lot of seats in new markets with litt
104 Skyexramper : AirTran lands their 3 board members on the Midwest BOD!! Also all MKE-EWR flights will be operated by SkyWest CRJs. A sad day for our real travelers,
105 AirTran717 : As usual, someone taking a cheap shot about a subject in which they know nothing about. Shows the lack of research, education, and common sense in th
106 Cloudboy : How exactly do you think the YX employees are going to keep their jobs and not be lost in the cost savings? How does this really make FL more competa
107 AirTran717 : There is a lot of griping and moaning and one guy trying to one-up the next with wise crack remarks and almost true facts. I feel like I have ring-sid
108 Knope2001 : Even though we sometimes disagree, AirTran717, I really know what you mean about the "ringside seat" aspect of this board. When I posted my ramble thi
109 Flyingchoirboy : FL has said that if the merger is successful, most employees will keep their jobs. I believe them when they say that. Also, I think they will pick up
110 AirTran717 : Now THAT would be innovative for FL. Awesome idea.
111 Post contains links Heavymx1 : http://www.kansascity.com/132/story/150090.html As said FL 3 were elected, and now YX says they will listen
112 AirTran717 : To talk about the pot calling the kettle black. This whole thread, with a few exceptions has been nothing but trash talk.
113 SkyexRamper : If anyone in the MKE area saw the post meeting press conference? How many dang times did Timmy keep saying whats best for the shareholders. I just wan
114 Mke717spotter : YX had a poll a while ago for its frequent fliers, and I believe more than half of them stated they would avoid doing business with FL. Like its been
115 DAYflyer : Dont be too surprised if it happens. FL needs a competitive edge and this could prove to be one of them. Airtran will take over Midwest. There are no
116 AirTran717 : You know... they way these FL/YX threads carry on, you'd think the state of Georgia was trying to BUY the state of Wisconsin or something. It's just a
117 Knope2001 : I think this is kind of a two-edged sword.... When people are asked this type of question, I think there's something of a knee-jerk reaction. A lot o
118 JBo : Midwest is far more than a cookie and a leather seat. You can downplay the customer service aspect all you want, but it doesn't chance the fact that
119 Knope2001 : If indeed AirTran succeeds in acquring Midwest, I suspect Midwest Executive FF members like me will be comped NW Silver Elite status without asking.
120 AirTran717 : I don't see how. You have to enroll yourself. Online. It's not something they "just do" automatically. How do you suppose they got your information t
121 AirTran717 : A small airline can afford to do that I suppose. In the real world, that practice isn't practical or economical.
122 AirTran717 : And in what world is a monopoly a good idea. It's survival of the fittest, especially in the airline world.
123 AirTran717 : And if that's all you base customer service on... Hmm. I know. It's just one example. If YX was such a wonderful, exemplary airline, why are they not
124 JBo : I have a feeling that will be very much the case. I also wonder if the suit would be followed by offering other Midwest Miles members a WorldPerks me
125 JpetekYXMD80 : Are you insinuating Midwest has a monopoly at MKE? Ha! Just what was stopping anyone from taking on YX? Ask NW about that one. Haha, thats just funny
126 JBo : They're not a major carrier because they never wanted to be. Midwest has always been happy being a small niche carrier in MKE. Midwest may not be #1
127 JpetekYXMD80 : ??? Theres been a pretty steady growth throughout the last 20 years, just what did you expect? Look at any domestic airline quality rankings in the l
128 AirTran717 : You missed my point. But that's ok. I'm off to make my daily commute. I'll check back in tomorrow to see what other cat fighting has gone on.
129 Knope2001 : They got my name and address somewhere, and I can assure you I most certainly did not submit any type of information to AirTran in any manner. I had
130 Knope2001 : No, it is an operational decision. In the part of the world most seasoned travelers have horror stories from Northwest's policies, especially in DTW
131 Knope2001 : The world where business is about making moeny. A monopoly is a wonderful thing *for the business* and it is monopoly markets where most airlines fin
132 Knope2001 : Overexpansion has killed countless airilnes, and fighting it is one of the things that has kept Midwest in business. Of the dozens of start-up airlin
133 Cloudboy : If cheaper fares would entice customers to stay with Aritran, then they would have already switched to the lower cost competitors. And while Airtran i
134 Travatl : I guess it's time for us AirTran flight attendants to go oven mitt shopping.
135 MPDPilot : Just reading this suggests that you don't really understand what Midwest is and how the people of Wisconsin see it, which is exactly the thing I don'
136 N917ME : Except when you have to swap A/C for IROPS/MX Actually, He did recognize the employees several times at the meeting. Of course the press will have th
137 N917ME : It was also nice to hear the "individual" shareholders comment on the fact that FL is using YX cash on hand to fund the deal. He also stated to the FL
138 Jmc1975 : What's American West? You can't say they survived if they never existed.
139 Jmc1975 : Ease up on the condescention please. He was only stating what you so arrogantly reiterated about a commuter pilot moving to AirTran as a logical step
140 Knope2001 : It's called a typo. There are several others in my post. But thank you for this cunning contribution anyway.
141 AirTran717 : True. But it's still going to cost money to hold that equipment on the ground. If there are 15 or more that you are holding on for a given flight, th
142 AirTran717 : There is a certain criteria which must be met to be labeled a "major", based on profit. Admittedly, YX is not interested in that status. They are a n
143 AirTran717 : And your post still suggests an emotional decision rather than a logical business decision.
144 AirTran737 : To be a major carrier you must have either one billion dollars in annual revenue, or 1% of the flying market. If it was about profit then NW, DL, and
145 AirTran717 : Thanks for the info. I couldn't remember the actual criteria. I tend to not spout off facts that I am unsure of. I thought it was the $ 1bill. But i
146 AirTran717 : But I mean, seriously... I know this topic is an emotionally charged one. But we should be able to discuss it without the "my airline is better than y
147 Mijoatlanta : The civic pride crap has got to stop! Most airline analysts see this as a no brainer. And these accuations that AirTran wont keep it's promises to Mil
148 AirTran717 : [quote=Mijoatlanta,reply=147][/quote You just found your way onto my Respected Users list. Very well stated post. 717
149 SkyexRamper : At the meeting is one thing but for those people who didn't go or want to put up with the BS only had the LIVE press conference to watch, nothing abo
150 Knope2001 : Um, good luck with that. Perhaps in places where more people are new-arrivals from all over there isn't the same sense of civic pride. But in places
151 Mijoatlanta : Knope2001, I respect your perspective about Milwaukee's civic sensitivity. But it's surprising that the "outsider" has more faith in Mailwaukee than t
152 AirTran717 : Again, Mijo, very well put. I certainly understand the situation from BOTH sides or the argument folks. But I agree with the economics of this deal.
153 JpetekYXMD80 : Ironic. No, he wasn't. You've completely missed the point. Go back and do a search if you want. Gosh...stow it, sailor- what on earth are you talking
154 AirTran717 : That's what I'm talking about. Chill folks. If YX gets bought by FL or any other airline... is your world going to come crashing down? Apocolypse? Ar
155 Mijoatlanta : AirTran717 Well said!!
156 JpetekYXMD80 : The argument that Wisconsin and Milwaukee need to rely on Midwest for a sense of pride is ridiculous. Yes, Midwest holds a special place in our hearts
157 AirTran717 : My last thought on this is that it seems to be the general concensus that if YX is bought out, that event will devestate the economy or water down cus
158 AirTran717 : Without sounding like a tourism ad, I think I answered that already.
159 JpetekYXMD80 : To clarify, the state of WI, city of Milwaukee..
160 AirTran717 : And, being that I have lived in GA for 25 years, I think I'm qualified to make such "ridiculous" statements.
161 DAYflyer : This is my point as well. And if YX were making so much money, why dont they buy airplanes and expand their network then? Or why dont they buy AirTra
162 Mijoatlanta : JpetekYXMD80 You rock!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
163 AirTran717 : What part of my post are you not picking up on here? I was very obviously in reference to my own home state, not Wisconsin. I've only laid over there
164 JpetekYXMD80 : No offense, but have you been living under a rock the last 6 months? Midwest certainly has recovered financially, especially relative to some other c
165 JpetekYXMD80 : Well obviously, but what makes you think the backbone of the save-Midwest sentiment is this sense of 'civic pride' and that this airline is thought t
166 DAYflyer : Nope. They said in the last release they were experiencing a soft market. I also know about the code share situation with NW. But again, where is the
167 Mijoatlanta : There is no superior customer service. Although that is what Midwest is boasting will be their saving grace. P.S. I want a warm cookie
168 AirTran717 : Point taken. I understand that point of view too. But there's more to this than just logistics. If the shareholders can make a buck, they will. That'
169 Gr8SlvrFlt : AirTran Airways is in business to make money. And you know what? So is Midwest. Being a good corporate citizen makes good business sense (publicity an
170 MUWarriors : I hope I don't sound like I am condescending, as that is not my point, I would like to add to the discussion in an adultish way. So here goes. Actuall
171 N917ME : Not that YX has always flourished, however before you toot your horn about Air Tran flourishing in most of their markets, look at a clip from an arti
172 AirTran717 : I have to say that this post has to be the best post on the entire thread. It's a logical deduction on all points. There are upsides and downsides to
173 JBo : Because they don't want to "grow like mad." What part of that do you not understand?
174 Travatl : Oh brother - are you gonna quote market performance daily? If so, here's one from today.. From MarketWatch: Most other shares climbed 1% or less, wit
175 AirTran717 : I actually did read that same article. But I was there still, when all of that was being talked about in DFW. The media puts their own spin on things
176 Post contains images DAYflyer : An excellent post and frank evaluation of the situation.
177 Knope2001 : Actually, AirTran's track record is quite the opposite when they try to expanded outside of their Atlanta hub and Florida snowbird flying. AirTran an
178 AirTran717 : Oh, ok. That must be why they are trying to aquire another airline rather than file bankruptcy? Because they can't flourish? Ok.
179 AirTran717 : But I will say this... At least AirTran is willing to try. Better to have tried and failed, than to settle with status quo.... like YX for example? 71
180 Post contains links Daus : Midwest: Only 40 percent of total shares voted AirTran's way The Business Journal of Milwaukee - 5:56 PM CDT Thursday, June 14, 2007by Rich Rovito Pri
181 AirTran717 : I beg to differ. I flew that route quite a bit and it was availaible for much, much longer than two months. We did BWI-ROC-BOS for several months...
182 Travatl : Lol - why are they so proud of this? What it means is that only 20% voted in favor of Midwest's nominees. Not exactly a ringing endorsement either...
183 AirTran717 : Way to go YX... don't vote at all. Shows indifference to that home team advantage.
184 AirTran717 : Can't even get their own to vote for themselves. Descension in the ranks?
185 N917ME : How do you feel that this would be different from TWA/AA? Do you think PHL staion needs 10 more FTE's to their staff? Do you think DCA needs 40plus F
186 Knope2001 : I, too, appreciate the logic and tone of your post, Gr8SlvrFlt. I do have a few comments I’d like to interject: AirTran has a good reputation in Atl
187 Knope2001 : You're right -- two months is NOT correct. I should be more careful in reading my handwriting. ROC-BOS began 7/6/06 and ended 1/3/07. Just under six
188 Srbmod : There's one thing about this deal that just hit me. Midwest does quite a bit of sports teams charters (including the Atlanta Hawks and Thrashers [Iron
189 Knope2001 : You said that with tongue in cheek. I say that with full seriousness. If AirTran is "flourishing" and Midwest is "failing", then why was AirTran's fu
190 Gr8SlvrFlt : Is AirTran willing to convert part of the fleet (you know the Mad Dogs will be out of the fleet ASAP) to the charter layout YX has on some of their MD
191 Post contains links Pilotfox : On a side note does anyone have any more details on those MSN flights? Someone on here had said one MCI flight had already been cut. From what I hear
192 Knope2001 : Here's some info... MSN-MKE has traditionally been 6x/day, a mix of RJ's and BE1. As of 5/31, it dropped to 5x/day, with the 10am BE1 flight removed.
193 Mke717spotter : Does this mean that YX is changing their minds about letting FL give a presentation to the board or not?
194 Sllevin : I thought this was hysterical spin by YX management. It overlooks the fact that out of those who DID vote, twice as many voted FL's way than YX manag
195 Knope2001 : This is a direct quore from an employee communication on the topic: "Sometime in the next few weeks, our board of directors will meet with AirTran le
196 Deltadude8 : I would like to ask a question to all of the AirTran supporters on this thread (ie Critter, AirTran737, mojitoatl) Have you ever flown YX? And if so w
197 SkyexRamper : " target=_blank>http://flightaware.com/live/flight/S...X7001 Our pilots have left in high numbers over the last year, especially the last 6 months.
198 Gr8SlvrFlt : ATL-MKE-ATW and ATL-MKE-SAT in the mid-90s. That was when they still had linens and china. I remember the food was good but I was not at all impresse
199 SkyexRamper : If you've got to ask this guy, then you haven't been paying attention around these forums. Ah....Midwest Express, good ole' ME! What was the highligh
200 Gr8SlvrFlt : According to seatguru.com (which might very well be wrong) AirTran 717 and 737 Business Class seats are 22" wide with a 37" pitch (I could swear the
201 CitrusCritter : Nope. And you'll also notice that I've never once criticized their service or anything that I could not have experienced firsthand. My criticisms of
202 Travatl : I also flew YX in the 90s between MKE and ATL. Overall, a nice service, and I was impressed. However, I don't understand how this is relevant. Are yo
203 Travatl : Oh, and I flew MAXjet last summer.
204 CitrusCritter : I believe FL has two 717s they use commonly on charters that have complete galleys. I remember reading they were chartered for a flight to HAV and ha
205 CitrusCritter : Someone in this thread had mentioned that Tim wants to announce a "new MCI" for YX, as in adding a new city on the scale of MCI. Any thoughts as to wh
206 Mke717spotter : Well Iif its in the near future I'd have to say OMA is probably the best bet. They already have flights to DCA, LAX and I could see them adding a Flo
207 Mijoatlanta : Last year, MKE-ATL-MKE. And I am not an AirTran supporter, per se. I was just trying to make the point that civic pride is blinding people from reali
208 Knope2001 : It's in their long-term plans, but I doubt (assuming Midwest is not purchased) that it would be any sooner than about 2010. Before they can really do
209 Knope2001 : Yes, it is absoutely possible that Milwaukee will be better off. If AirTran's plans work out, the increased service and lower fares may well be a gre
210 Mijoatlanta : I will give you that....that this is a gamble for Milwaukee. But I am not as convinced as you that it will necesarily fail. And I think in a worst ca
211 Rumorboy : Knope2001 there are some things that Airtran has yet to release about RJ's. The company and union have a tentative agreement with a new pilot contrac
212 Cloudboy : How is Midwest only a nighe player and Airtran a national carrier? And why is ambition and rampant growth any better than solid, well planned growth?
213 TedEx : Wow - I didn't realize Y in FL was that tight. I've only ever flown their "business" product.
214 CitrusCritter : If you've never flown AirTran Business Class then how come you are citing it as "business" as if it is something less?
215 Mijoatlanta : Whoa cowboy! First, cabbage gives me gas. Second, AirTran going to extreams is debatable. Midwest says AirTran is being oportunisitic. Which means Ai
216 Mijoatlanta : Another thing about the loss of a "hometown" airline BS we keep hearing about. AirTran is not even headquartered in ATL but who was it that stepped up
217 Mke717spotter : No, because if YX is gone then NW will come back to MKE with their P2P routes (most likely likes its been talked about here) and gobbles up most of t
218 Mijoatlanta : NW coming back in full force is speculation. AirTran wanting to hub there is fact. Sure, NW may come back but to say for certain they are willing to c
219 Knope2001 : If only that were true. If the MKE hub does not live up to expectations, Milwaukee will likely be left with fewer nonstop destinations and a much mor
220 Knope2001 : I missed BWI...probably 2x in summer and none in winter.
221 CitrusCritter : I'm looking just now to book a flight to DEN...thought I'd give YX a try, but it seems that MKE-DEN is Saver Service, not Signature as indicated on th
222 TedEx : Please re-read my original post.
223 CitrusCritter : My apologies, was reading quickly. But I haven't the slightest idea how you can mock it as a Business Class product. It's not supposed to be Intl Busi
224 N917ME : Great Post Knope2001!! Either YX or FL should hire you as a consultant. One thing FL has failed to do is to convince me how they will be able to susta
225 Cloudboy : Why does everyone think all the YX people care about is civic pride? Where did that even come up? Why are people trying to make this into a civic prid
226 N917ME : US Airways ( a low cost carrier now) offers the F/J class product for a nominal charge at the gate day of departure. The cost is based on the distanc
227 SkyexRamper : This is Timmy and all of YX management's M.O. They are very quick to pull the Midwest + MKE = City can't live without (card) when they feel that the
228 Mariner : It might be closer to the truth. There is a world of difference between Domestic First Class and International First Class. Why not call it what it i
229 CitrusCritter : I was not referencing upgrade costs, though FL cost is $40-60 in my experience. FL-J booking cost is normally in the $350 area depending on the dista
230 N917ME : Actually, unlike FL and to some extent NW, you will NEVER have to pay or book J to receive a pre reserved seat for your flight. I can't say it it eno
231 Travatl : I don't think there are many FL field station employees here. I can give you my observations from an Inflight perspective - but I don't think that's
232 SkyexRamper : I think AirTran737 could easily answer that question.
233 Post contains links TedEx : No problem. I don't find every carrier's Y to be terrible. I fly Southwest quite often and enjoy my flights with them. I also have had good Y-class f
234 Post contains links Travatl : They're not, this is obviously against our policy. If you were on a 717, A/C 780-799, it was a former TWA aircraft, with the original TW F seats - an
235 Mke717spotter : Hey I know that this is pretty off topic, but around what time are YX & FL going to release their 2nd quarter results? Thanks!
236 Travatl : Mid to Late July.....
237 Post contains images Sllevin : Because it's not really business class, either, when compared to international service. There's never going to be one standardized set of names for a
238 Mariner : The comparison made bt N917ME (post #226) was to other US airlines standard premium domestic cabin, which is usually called First - not to internatio
239 Gr8SlvrFlt : If its any consolation to the cookie people out there, many Trannies are against this merger as well. Many fear loss of seniority not to mention the i
240 AirTran717 : We were using between 4 and 6 717's when I was still there in 2005. They were doing full service charters, yes. Most were military or press corp flig
241 AirTran717 : There are many good points and bad points about this merger. We have two vehemently opposed sides on this thread alone. Bottom line is that it's eithe
242 SkyexRamper : I'm sure FL'ers would rather not be called Trannies.
243 AirTran717 : I believe this is what I have already stated. I don't think I have heard or read anywhere that FL intends to make another ATL out of any station they
244 Post contains links Knope2001 : Some of my more recent posts have expressed the worry that AirTran leadership will say anything to get what they want....namely, Midwest. Here's yet a
245 Knope2001 : Perhaps there is an issue of semantics here on what a "hub" is, but there is no way on God's green earth they can support anywhere near the capacity
246 AirTran717 : It's an interesting argument. But my previous statement holds true. It remains to be seen.
247 DAYflyer : And so how many has Midwest dropped for various reasons throughout the last two years or so?
248 MSYtristar : Travatl is correct on most accounts. I was a supervisor for FL in New Orleans, and let me just say that I do not miss the work environment there to s
249 Knope2001 : I don't think Midwest or Midwest Connect has dropped any city pairs in 2006 or 2007.
250 Knope2001 : MKE-HOU is the most recent YX market to be pulled -- it lasted only about 6 months in the second half of 2005. Also, MCI-MSY has not yet been restored
251 Gr8SlvrFlt : Didn't OMA used to be much more of a focus city than it is now? Also, I think ATL-MCI and maybe ATL-OMA were dropped in recent years. My first corpora
252 AirTran717 : It's funny to see so many people quoting percentages and facts here and there, like they are analysts or CFO's, CEO's or any other "in the know" posit
253 Mainland : Shareholders can be pretty apathetic sometimes. Many assume their 100-odd shares won't matter and don't vote, or assume their broker will do so in th
254 Knope2001 : Midwest didn't do ATL-OMA, but for a time they did do ATL-MCI-OMA through flights. At Omaha, the only sgnificant market missing today is OMA-EWR, whi
255 AirTran717 : Agreed. It's a corporate problem across the board, in whatever business you'd care to quote. But the lack of interest by the company's own shareholde
256 MSYtristar : And I wouldn't expect that one to come back anytime soon with XE flying the route now.
257 CitrusCritter : Indeed, though I believe Alaska MVPs get upgrade before they can be purchased...that is not the case on FL. FL-J upgrades are first come, first serve
258 Mainland : I agree -- one would think and hope shareholder interest in this matter would be higher. However, Midwest tried their best to get shareholders off th
259 Knope2001 : If you're talking about the decrease in load factor for April + May, it was down 0.6 points, not .06%. And it represents an estimated decrease in rev
260 AirTran717 : Good math. I'm not disupting that it dipped or that it impacted their sales and revenue. But again, keep things in perspective. As my point clearly e
261 Knope2001 : I do agree that it can be pointless to dig into minute details and fret over small changes from day to day, and the ready availabity of numbers makes
262 Blhp68 : Knope, I noticed in an earlier post you described a possible scenario for MKE in the near future if AirTran does suceed in taking over Midwest. Any id
263 AirTran717 : And what statistic would indicate to you that he admitted demand is weak? My first thought still stands here. We're talking a 3% to 5% differential,
264 AirTran717 : If a plane seats exactly 100 passengers... a 3% to 5% drop in revenue... for the sake of this point, please, indulge me... is 3 to 5 people. Given tha
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