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DL To Install Winglets On 737/757/767  
User currently offlineDelta4eva From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 344 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 6723 times:

DL to install winglets on more than 60 aircraft. 38 737NG, 10 757, and 15 767-300ERs.

http://news.delta.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=10746


FLY DELTA JETS
29 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 733 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6648 times:

737's will get the "Song-AVOD"? That's good news, too.

When will the winglets be installed? I guess the ex-AA/TWA 757's will get them first, and will be maybe getting them before entering DL service. Will we maybe see a DL 757 flying to places like HEL (with single "L") by next summer?


User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9555 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6626 times:

now maybe DL can put AVOD on the 763ERs?


yep.
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6521 times:

Guess that means ATL-LOS won't be their longest 763ER for long  Wink . About time DL jumped on the winglet bandwagon.

User currently offlineFlyingcat From United States of America, joined May 2007, 543 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6497 times:

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 2):
now maybe DL can put AVOD on the 763ERs?

My thoughts exactly as the intl 767-300 ERs are pushed to the limit. That is supposedly the reason they don't have the PTVs.


User currently offlineSNATH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3247 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 6431 times:

Quoting Delta4eva (Thread starter):
and 15 767-300ERs.

Has anyone else retrofitted their B767s with winglets? I remember AC talking about it but, in the end, they didn't do it.

Thanks,

Tony



Nikon: we don't want more pixels, we want better pixels.
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9555 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6302 times:

Quoting SNATH (Reply 5):
Has anyone else retrofitted their B767s with winglets? I remember AC talking about it but, in the end, they didn't do it.

AA is putting winglets on all 767s
DL just 15 for now but i would bet they add more.



yep.
User currently offlineWJ From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 347 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6287 times:

DL should call their winglets "Widgelets"...


146,727,732,733,734,735,73G,738,739,742,743,744,752,753,762,763,764,772,300,310,319,320,321,330,343,DC9,D10,MD11,M80,E17
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4694 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6273 times:

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 6):
DL just 15 for now but i would bet they add more.

Isnt there a select sub-fleet that can fly to DKR/JNB.. perhaps its the reason why only 15 will be done first (or only)?

15 767 w/ winglets =
ATL-LOS
ATL-DKR-JNB
JFK-TLV
LAX- Asia ???



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineDeltaL1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9555 posts, RR: 14
Reply 9, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6236 times:

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 8):
Isnt there a select sub-fleet that can fly to DKR/JNB.. perhaps its the reason why only 15 will be done first (or only)?

yes there is i think they have biger(high thrust) GE engines on them


Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 8):
ATL-LOS
ATL-DKR-JNB
JFK-TLV
LAX- Asia ???

add ATL-ATH to that



yep.
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4694 posts, RR: 11
Reply 10, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6207 times:

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 9):
yes there is i think they have biger(high thrust) GE engines on them

is that fleet 15 aircraft? if so, i think we know which ones will be getting the winglets....



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineAcey559 From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 1536 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6197 times:

Beat me to it, I just saw this on DeltaNet. Anyway, this is great news for DL, and will further help with cost savings. I'm definitely looking forward to the introduction of the winglets.

User currently offlineDL021 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 11447 posts, RR: 75
Reply 12, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6161 times:

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 3):
About time DL jumped on the winglet bandwagon.

Well, it was a difficult thing to justify when they were in bankruptcy. There was limited cash to do such things.

It certainly does make good sense.



Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
User currently offlineDAL767400ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6130 times:

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 6):
AA is putting winglets on all 767s

Only the 763ERs, not the 762ERs nor the non-ER 763s.

Quoting DL021 (Reply 12):
Well, it was a difficult thing to justify when they were in bankruptcy. There was limited cash to do such things.

True, but DL could have always argumented with the fuel savings the winglets on the 757s and 738s would give them, not necessarily mention that they want them for more range.


User currently offlineSNATH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3247 posts, RR: 22
Reply 14, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6096 times:

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 6):
AA is putting winglets on all 767s

Ah, I now remember! Thanks!

Tony



Nikon: we don't want more pixels, we want better pixels.
User currently offlineAlitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4753 posts, RR: 45
Reply 15, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6085 times:

Well, I guess it's out...  

The winglet additions will help extend the reach of the 76E subleet being established by DAL. They're also adding a crew-rest, to allow pilots to fly the up-coming 12+ hr missions these birds will be scheduled on.

Hopefully they spell out the other mod soon...  Wink

[Edited 2007-06-19 16:35:07]


Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently offlineTinPusher007 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 977 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6040 times:

I have always wondered why go with blended winglets on the 763ER's and not the raked wing tips like the 764?


"Flying isn't inherently dangerous...but very unforgiving of carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
User currently offlineLawnDart From United States of America, joined May 2005, 970 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5994 times:

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 13):
True, but DL could have always argumented with the fuel savings the winglets on the 757s and 738s would give them,

Argumented?  boggled 

As DL021 stated: DL didn't have cash to buy the winglets; Aviation Partners couldn't care less how much fuel it would save them, they aren't in business to give winglets away for free...

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 15):
They're also adding a crew-rest, to allow pilots to fly the up-coming 12+ hr missions these birds will be scheduled on.

I didn't read that in the press release...of course, I'm a slow reader and am only half-way through it.

Quoting TinPusher007 (Reply 16):
I have always wondered why go with blended winglets on the 763ER's and not the raked wing tips like the 764?

I wondered the same thing myself, but it seems the blended winglets by Aviation Partners reduce fuel burn slightly more than the raked winglets on the -400s. The raked winglets were the available technology at the time the -400 was being designed, and they are less stressful to the wing than the winglet (disclaimer: the previous statement was made by a technologically ignunt individual, and was repeated from conversation heard previously. If you have an issue with the validity of said statement, keep it to yourself).

In announcing the order for the winglets, Jim Whitehurst made the statement that the blended winglets would allow the B767-300ER to fly LAX to NRT non-stop, "not that we're planning to do so...".

Hmm...CYA, Jim?


User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5979 times:

Quoting LawnDart (Reply 17):
In announcing the order for the winglets, Jim Whitehurst made the statement that the blended winglets would allow the B767-300ER to fly LAX to NRT non-stop, "not that we're planning to do so...".

Hmm...CYA, Jim?

Then what would be the point if they are not planning on doing it?? Makes no sense otherwise. A very poor effort at CYA in any case.



One Nation Under God
User currently offlineERAUgrad02 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 1227 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5944 times:

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 13):
Only the 763ERs, not the 762ERs nor the non-ER 763s.

You'd think the non-ER Version would benefit even more. they should make them for all 757s/767's. I dont get it.



Desmond MacRae in ILM
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5932 times:

Quoting TinPusher007 (Reply 16):
I have always wondered why go with blended winglets on the 763ER's and not the raked wing tips like the 764?

Because the rakes are an internal Boeing patent whereas the aftermarket wiinglets are a product of APB, which is inhouse but not internal.

Shame too-- because the rakes would look sooooo much better on the 767, just like blendeds would look sooo much better than rakes on the (already disgusting-looking quadjet) 748i


User currently offlinePanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4927 posts, RR: 25
Reply 21, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5913 times:
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Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 18):
Then what would be the point if they are not planning on doing it?? Makes no sense otherwise. A very poor effort at CYA in any case.

Not saying that DL won't do LAX-NRT, but the previously announced ATL-LOS and JFK-TLV are already both longer than LAX-NRT:

LAX-NRT: 4737 nm
ATL-LOS: 5078 nm
JFK-TLV: 4934 nm

Even without LAX-NRT, the winglets will come in handy for both LOS and TLV...

Quoting LawnDart (Reply 17):
Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 15):
They're also adding a crew-rest, to allow pilots to fly the up-coming 12+ hr missions these birds will be scheduled on.

I didn't read that in the press release

It wasn't in this press release but it has been mentioned before. BTW, if you look at the seatmap for any 763ER flight in the near future, you will notice that not only has seat 6C (the traditional pilot rest seat) been blocked off, but 5C as well now (since the lie-flat seat will take up more space)....


User currently offlineAlbird87 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5878 times:

Quoting Flyingcat (Reply 4):
Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 2):
now maybe DL can put AVOD on the 763ERs?

My thoughts exactly as the intl 767-300 ERs are pushed to the limit. That is supposedly the reason they don't have the PTVs.

Well AA dont have PTV's on there 767s and they just went throught upgrading them with the new biz class and some new overhead bins.

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 13):
Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 6):
AA is putting winglets on all 767s

Only the 763ERs, not the 762ERs nor the non-ER 763s.

I dont think AA has anymore non-ER 300s. They just have some 762ERs for there JFK-LAX/SFO and the 763ERs for some Domestic movements and International flights. I was a bit confused when AA went through upgrading the 763 biz cabin and installing new overhead bins in the biz class and front Y cabin but not the rest. Also not installing some PTV's in the aircraft!!


User currently offlineRB211LTN From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 133 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5798 times:

So, they are installing Flight Crew rest but nothing extra for the Cabin Crew. 12-plus hours on a 767 is bad enough but without proper (horizontal) rest it is positively inhumane. I know there is nowhere to put it without impacting passenger capacity (revenue). Could they have a cargo-bay module like the 777?
Imagine if BA announced plans to go over 12 hours with their 767's. They crew would be out on strike before you can say "trades union representative". Not that the crew would need something as severe as this to cause the threat of strike action, it could be something far more trivial. I can sya this with impunity as no BA crew will be reading this, they will all be at Royal Ascot. And before you all start whingeing, I am a former BA steward so I know the way they all think.



The customer is always right.....unless he is a passenger!
User currently offlinePanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4927 posts, RR: 25
Reply 24, posted (7 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5782 times:
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Quoting RB211LTN (Reply 23):
So, they are installing Flight Crew rest but nothing extra for the Cabin Crew. 12-plus hours on a 767 is bad enough but without proper (horizontal) rest it is positively inhumane. I know there is nowhere to put it without impacting passenger capacity (revenue).

The FAs will get crew rest seats with legrests and better recline, etc. - better than what they get today which are four regular Y seats in the back of the 767.


25 Post contains images Hamlet69 : So far, announced customers are: AA - 763ER's LAN - 763ER's and 763F's Austrian - 763ER's Delta - 763ER's Regards, Hamlet69
26 RB211LTN : What do AZ have for crew rest? They do some awfully long flights on the 767's. As one of the most militant workforces in Europe I can't imagine them s
27 Panamair : The replacements won't start happening until the next decade so the 767s will still be flying for a while....The 767s for international are currently
28 Post contains images DiscoverCSG : You mean HEL as opposed to JFK...
29 Delta4eva : I'm going to speculate that this means one of two things: overhead bins being replaced with new 777 style ones; PTVs in economy. Or maybe both??
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