Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Is Paris Airshow Airbuses To Win?  
User currently offlineClrd4t8koff From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 225 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7152 times:

All the threads i'm reading are orders for Airbus. I think I came across one thread that said Boeing had something like 110 orders, while Airbus was up to 359? Is this typical or were there supposed to be more 787, 748I, 777F orders? Looks like the only thing sold so far was a fairly large order for the 739ER and some 787's? Is this an upset for Boeing?

63 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePA110 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2017 posts, RR: 23
Reply 1, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7143 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Clrd4t8koff (Thread starter):
Is Paris Airshow Airbuses To Win?

I didn't realize that the Paris Air Show had been reclassified from an aviation exposition to a sales contest.  Yeah sure



It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
User currently offlineRigo From Australia, joined Sep 2005, 91 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7085 times:

Quoting PA110 (Reply 1):
I didn't realize that the Paris Air Show had been reclassified from an aviation exposition to a sales contest.

 checkmark 

Now as has been discussed in another thread, Airbus usually keeps their orders quiet and announce them massively during airshows, while Boeing announce theirs as they are signed. So if you are asking whether Airbus will announce more orders than Boeing during the show, the answer is probably yes.


User currently offlineReggaebird From Jamaica, joined Nov 1999, 1176 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 7021 times:

Quoting Clrd4t8koff (Thread starter):
Is this an upset for Boeing?

Unless you're new to the world of us aviation enthusiasts, you should know that Airbus always wins airshow order races. I dare not say why because I will get banned for starting an Airbus vs. Boeing battle so suffice it to say that the results you sited are not unusual. At the end of the year, it'll be more interesting to see if slow-and-steady Boeing will lose its two year (  devil  ).....I mean one year.....sales title to quick-spurts Airbus


User currently offlineAirTran737 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3707 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6988 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Reggaebird (Reply 3):
Unless you're new to the world of us aviation enthusiasts, you should know that Airbus always wins airshow order races. I dare not say why because I will get banned for starting an Airbus vs. Boeing battle so suffice it to say that the results you sited are not unusual. At the end of the year, it'll be more interesting to see if slow-and-steady Boeing will lose its two year ( ).....I mean one year.....sales title to quick-spurts Airbus

Spot on. Airbus admits to holding orders for the show, where as Boeing announces orders when the customers tell them to do so.



Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
User currently offline787EWR From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 204 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6944 times:

Quoting Clrd4t8koff (Thread starter):
All the threads i'm reading are orders for Airbus. I think I came across one thread that said Boeing had something like 110 orders, while Airbus was up to 359? Is this typical or were there supposed to be more 787, 748I, 777F orders? Looks like the only thing sold so far was a fairly large order for the 739ER and some 787's? Is this an upset for Boeing?

I think it is critical for Airbus to show some success in sales during this period. Their products are quality, but public image and perception have been suffering due to issues with the A380.

I also think some of the airlines who have placed these large orders knew what they were going to do quite some time ago.

Quoting Reggaebird (Reply 3):
At the end of the year, it'll be more interesting to see if slow-and-steady Boeing will lose its two year ( ).....I mean one year.....sales title to quick-spurts Airbus

Agreed. Once the 787 is in the air and testing, sales should continue to grow. As for the 739, as the 757s continue to age, these birds will become more attractive. I haven't heard about too many A321 sales lately(Had to put the dig in).


User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7564 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6927 times:

Quoting 787EWR (Reply 5):
I haven't heard about too many A321 sales lately(Had to put the dig in).

With less range and week economics its not a wonder.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 7, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6825 times:

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 6):
Quoting 787EWR (Reply 5):
I haven't heard about too many A321 sales lately(Had to put the dig in).

With less range and week economics its not a wonder

LOL Weak Economics? You mean the best trip costs per seat mile than any other narrowbody for the vast majority of missions? The A321 has more range than the 737-900 and more cargo capacity.

Look it up mate.

http://www.airbus.com/en/aircraftfamilies/a320/a321/

[Edited 2007-06-20 23:48:10]


What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineZeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 9229 posts, RR: 76
Reply 8, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6761 times:

Quoting PA110 (Reply 1):

I didn't realize that the Paris Air Show had been reclassified from an aviation exposition to a sales contest.

Correct, it is not, both A & B are doing VERY well at the moment, despite what people on here may think.

I wish I had billions worth of orders in my book.

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 7):
LOL Weak Economics? You mean the best trip costs per seat mile than any other narrowbody for the vast majority of missions? The A321 has more range than the 737-900 and more cargo capacity.

Maybe thinking 900ER to the 321-100, the 900ER is very similar to the 321-200.



We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
User currently offlineKhobar From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2379 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6743 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 7):
Look it up mate.

737-900ER range - 5925km (http://www.boeing.com/commercial/737family/pf/pf_900ERtech.html)
A321 range - 5550km. (http://www.airbus.com/en/aircraftfamilies/a320/a321/performance.html)


User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6743 times:

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 6):
With less range and week economics its not a wonder.

What on earth are you blabbering about.

Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 4):
Boeing announces orders when the customers tell them to do so.

Customers dont tell them to announce UFO's, yet UFO's make up a very considerable chunk of the Boeing.com orders page week in week out.

Quoting 787EWR (Reply 5):
Their products are quality, but public image and perception have been suffering due to issues with the A380.

Spot on.


User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 11, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6712 times:

Quoting Khobar (Reply 9):
Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 7):
Look it up mate.

737-900ER range - 5925km (http://www.boeing.com/commercial/737family/pf/pf_900ERtech.html)
A321 range - 5550km. (http://www.airbus.com/en/aircraftfamilies/a320/a321/performance.html)

Read the post dude. I didnt say ER did i?  Wink



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineJTR From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 113 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6657 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 11):
Read the post dude. I didnt say ER did i?

I was under the impression (not that I can remember where I got it from) that Boeing discontinued selling the -900, and is just selling the -900ER. I don't see why you wouldn't compare the two most alike models.


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7089 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6658 times:

Quoting 787EWR (Reply 5):
I haven't heard about too many A321 sales lately(Had to put the dig in).

That is why because they were usually a part of A32x family orders. US and SU were the latest to place an A321 order.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineCHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 62
Reply 14, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6641 times:

Quoting JTR (Reply 12):
Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 11):
Read the post dude. I didnt say ER did i?

I was under the impression (not that I can remember where I got it from) that Boeing discontinued selling the -900, and is just selling the -900ER. I don't see why you wouldn't compare the two most alike models.

The 737-900ER isnt in full service yet mate. Not wishing to be pedantic.



What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
User currently offlineKhobar From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2379 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6626 times:

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 11):
Read the post dude. I didnt say ER did i? Wink

You also didn't say A321-100 or A321-200 either. And?  Wink

Besides, Boeing doesn't offer anything but the ER now, according to Boeing.


User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6626 times:

Quoting JTR (Reply 12):
Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 11):
Read the post dude. I didnt say ER did i?

I was under the impression (not that I can remember where I got it from) that Boeing discontinued selling the -900, and is just selling the -900ER. I don't see why you wouldn't compare the two most alike models.

In all fairness, the -900ER is more comparable. But at best it has 250 miles extra range with winglets and actually less range without them according to data that I have seen, despite entering the market a full 14 Years later than the A321. Its also arguable that the A320 could match the performance with relative ease (Maybe the A321 Enhanced already will), although Im starting to make excuses here, arn't I!

[Edited 2007-06-21 00:07:09]

User currently offlineCP744 From Canada, joined Jul 2000, 200 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6525 times:

Quoting 787EWR (Reply 5):
Their products are quality, but public image and perception have been suffering due to issues with the A380.

Do you mean public image to the "public"... or public image to aviation enthusiasts?

And why I ask is, IMO the "public" could care less. They tend not to know what type of A/C their flying on, never mind any issues that may have happened during design, production, etc. Hell, I've seen customers that have no idea what airline their flying on..... I really believe that $$ is all that drives "most" passengers. They would fly on DC-3's if it was 10 bucks cheaper. Not that there is anything wrong with a DC-3, just used it to try an illustrate the point.

Cheers


User currently offlineZeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 9229 posts, RR: 76
Reply 18, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6485 times:

Quoting Khobar (Reply 9):

737-900ER range - 5925km (http://www.boeing.com/commercial/737family/pf/pf_900ERtech.html)
A321 range - 5550km. (http://www.airbus.com/en/aircraftfamilies/a320/a321/performance.html)

Khobar,

They are very similar, I prepared the chart below some time back. The 321 is not one aircraft, its has had 20 variations in its life so far, 12 variations (range/payload/weights) in the A321-200 alone.

Majority of missions flown by the type will be of 5 hrs duration or less (less than 2500 nm), where the 321-200 would be able to lift about 5000 kg / 10,000 lb more payload than a 737-900ER with winglets.

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/thezeke/range%20payload/f3a7d034.png



We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12884 posts, RR: 46
Reply 19, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6477 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 6):
With less range and week economics its not a wonder.

Just how did Airbus manage to sell over 650 of them before Paris? scratchchin 

Not to mention more sales to Aeroflot and US during Paris.



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana! #44cHAMpion
User currently offlineTeamAmerica From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 1761 posts, RR: 23
Reply 20, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6452 times:

Quoting PA110 (Reply 1):
I didn't realize that the Paris Air Show had been reclassified from an aviation exposition to a sales contest

It's the SuperBowl of aviation sales. At the end they play We Are The Champions and the winners go to EuroDisney. smile 



Failure is not an option; it's an outcome.
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 21, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6443 times:

Quoting Zeke (Reply 18):

On that A.netter drawn-up table...isnt that 737-900ER and 737-900ER with winglets.....the SAME aircraft??  sarcastic 



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31414 posts, RR: 85
Reply 22, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6418 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting CHRISBA777ER (Reply 14):
The 737-900ER isnt in full service yet mate. Not wishing to be pedantic.

Might want to let Lion Air know they're flying around a phantom plane...  Wink

http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2007/q2/070427b_pr.html


User currently offlineSphealey From United States of America, joined May 2005, 378 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 6387 times:

> It's the SuperBowl of aviation sales. At the end they play We Are The
> Champions and the winners go to EuroDisney.

Then the Americans claim that it isn't a "real" world championship because only the European teams play  Wink

sPh


User currently offlinePA110 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2017 posts, RR: 23
Reply 24, posted (7 years 6 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 6387 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting TeamAmerica (Reply 20):
At the end they play We Are The Champions and the winners go to EuroDisney.

Silly me! You mean to say there's no medal ceremony where the national anthems from every supplier nation are played simultaneously?  Silly



It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
25 CHRISBA777ER : Did they start already? Apologies - my bad. When did this happen? Must have missed it.
26 Post contains links CP744 : http://www.boeing.com/commercial/news/2007/q2/070612b_pr.html Don't think it's in service yet..... just took delivery on 12JUN07.... Although, may be
27 Zeke : Nope have a look at the 737 ACAPS document, you will see the differences as exactly as per my diagram.
28 CHRISBA777ER : Hehehehe got away with that then - knew it had been delivered but hadnt seen the press release about it starting revenue service.
29 Prebennorholm : The 737-900ER and A321-200 are of course very similar planes. But the 321 is the slightly larger one. It has more floor space, more load carrying capa
30 Flying_727 : If I remember correctly, Airbus "won" Farnborough last year and Boeing still ended the year with more orders then airbus. With the delta order on the
31 Klkla : Your credibility suffers when you make comments like this. A UFO is a "FIRM" order. It's not a MOU (which seems to make up a large percentage of Airb
32 JTR : So then, how do you define endless debate between A380, 747-8i, 787 and A350XWB? After all, the 737-900ER has, you know, flown once or twice.
33 Post contains images Stitch : Not quite. Their first 737-900 was delivered on April 27 in Boeing's "house livery". The June 12th delivery was the first in Lion Air's own livery.
34 TISTPAA727 : Didn't we keep hearing from Boeing leading up to the show there would be some surprises? Granted, ILFC and Lion Air were nice size orders but I kept e
35 JRDC930 : You have to admit though 70 orders most not even new compared to 500+ cant but look slightly bad for boeing in the eyes of the general public. I know
36 Post contains images JRDC930 : It would be nice it boeing showed off once and a while...
37 AirframeAS : Show me, please. There is nothing on Boeing's website tells me that its two separate airplanes. Winglets are now standard on every 737NG that is prod
38 Post contains images Stitch : And yet Boeing came into the show with almost 500 orders, which was mentioned at the start of most stories about Airbus' great showing, so I imagine
39 PGNCS : And neither does Airbus.
40 Flying_727 : Apparently they do, since they seem to have to do it year after year.
41 Post contains images Scbriml : There's a difference between "needing to" and "choosing to". Airbus and Boeing do things differently. I don't really understand why so many people ha
42 HAWK21M : Out here Airbus seems to be selling better than Boeing Domestically. regds MEL
43 EI321 : Nice try, but your wrong. And your quoting out of context. The original point that the whold UFO announcements was discussed around was ANNOUNCEMENTS
44 Deaphen : Yup thats for sure MEL, domestically, all you see while spotting are A320's! Its only 9W, SG and IC with some of their 732's flying around with Boein
45 Halls120 : And the fact that one company sells more aircraft in one week than the other is meaningless in the long run. No one has to admit anything of that sor
46 814NAS : There is no denying that Airbus has done well at the current airshow; that is one of their main strategies for announcing orders, and there is nothin
47 Post contains images Manni : It is offcourse waiting now for Airbus' update at the beginning of next month, but based on the various press releases from both Boeing and Airbus I
48 MEA-707 : Still 737-700s and 737-800s roll of the production line without winglets, examples are recent deliveries to AirTran (although they slap on winglets t
49 Post contains images CP744 : So right your are.... just goes to show you.... I need to read MORE than the headline!
50 Post contains images TeamAmerica : It's an issue to those who look at it as a sporting competition. Very much like when the visiting team wins and gets carried away in their celebratio
51 Post contains images JRDC930 : Read my post again, i never said i hate airbus, i simply said to the GENERAL PUBLIC i.e. non aviation enthusiast, it might look bad. Its certainly go
52 Halls120 : Wow, someone forgot to exhale this morning. I said "certain" Anetters. I didn't say you in particular. If I had meant to include you, I would have sa
53 SSTsomeday : Actually, professional analysts and investors watch the orders race very closely, So "who is in the lead" apparently is very important in the busines
54 Stitch : For Paris, as of last night, it was $76 billion on 548 frames for Airbus and $16 billion on 125 frames for Boeing at list. However, Airbus continues
55 TeamAmerica : Not clear to me that the present order tally is actually known. A chunk of the Airbus announcements will turn out to be MOU's rather than bookable or
56 Post contains images HughesAirwest : I look at the Paris Airshow as a stage for Airbus to "come out of the closet" with the orders they have been holding just for this occasion to awe th
57 Typhaerion : I have to say it: Has it occurred to anyone but me that with ~1000 orders for multi million dollar aircraft for both of the manufacturers, the only re
58 AndrewUber : Airbus can have the thunder this week. That is no problem at all. In two weeks, Boeing will have all eyes on them, and will be on track to fulfilling
59 Post contains links and images Scbriml : Airbus Press Releases clearly state if an "order" is an MOU or LOI. All it takes is to read them. My summary for the week includes this information:
60 WingsLAX : Is Paris Airshow Airbuses To Win? Seems to me the question is too narrow. The PAS is one play in a grueling, long running game. As has been quoted man
61 Klkla : Do you always place stupid smileys mocking other peoples posts in your threads because you're very insecure or immature? But back to the topic... thi
62 Post contains images Manni : Are you angree because I've put a smiley in my post or are you angree because I corrected you? BTW. The thread isn't mine and the smiley's are provid
63 Post contains links Manni : Noticed this poll on flight international today. http://www.flightglobal.com/Polls/List.aspx (third one from the top). Who will win the order race at
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Future Vegas Airshow To Rival Paris Airshow?... posted Wed Oct 12 2005 21:27:20 by Ulfinator
Paris Airshow: Evening Transfer To CDG? posted Tue Jun 3 2003 19:07:45 by Setjet
Is The N707JT Flying To Paris? posted Sun Aug 11 2002 18:37:24 by Dennys
Last CHANCE: Give Me Your Paris Airshow Prediction posted Sun Jun 17 2007 20:49:11 by Irishpower
Airbus & Boeing Displays At The Paris Airshow posted Thu Jun 14 2007 14:40:14 by EI321
Paris Airshow Orders? posted Thu Apr 26 2007 17:28:29 by EI321
Is There An Easy To Find LAX Meeting Point? posted Mon Mar 26 2007 23:12:59 by Bakersdozen
What Is The Largest Object To Be Airborn? posted Tue Mar 13 2007 17:02:03 by Airfoilsguy
When Is LAX Runway Scheduled To Re-open? posted Fri Feb 16 2007 00:59:47 by 727LOVER
Is The A380 Coming To JFK And IAD posted Tue Jan 30 2007 19:22:43 by NYC777