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Why AA Won't Order Boeing (for Now).  
User currently offlineFXramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7173 posts, RR: 86
Posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 15725 times:
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 no 

 twocents 

So the AALPA got a new union president. 57/67 AA pilot, Lloyd D Hill got the nod, with a confidential ballot. I saw this coming a few weeks ago when I was at my uncle's birthday party and he was discussing the upcoming problems AMR would face. I tried to see past it and listen to other people about a potential "mega order" for AA at the Show.

Boy, was I wrong.  no 

article

Pilots at American Airlines ousted their union leaders and opted for a slate that promised to take a tougher stance with the carrier's management. In statements that seem to bode poorly for future labor-management relations at AA, newly elected union president Lloyd Hill says current union leaders tried too hard to find a middle ground with AA's management. He adds that the union's current proposal for a 30.5% raise for pilots "is not nearly enough."

From airline analyst Mike Boyd, who I don't agree with a lot on, but this is spot on.

Boyd tells AP that AA's "management really has screwed this up. Two years ago they had collaboration (with the union). Today, I don't even think they're going to have cooperation."

So they sabotaged the DFW-PEK route and are gonna cost AA a nice Boeing order anytime soon. Congratulations Arpey!  bigthumbsup   bigthumbsup 

106 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRDUDDJI From Lesotho, joined Jun 2004, 1449 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 15643 times:

Quoting FXramper (Thread starter):
So they sabotaged the DFW-PEK route and are gonna cost AA a nice Boeing order anytime soon. Congratulations Arpey!

Sorry, I just don't see the connection between angry employees and capital investment...

I want a 30% raise too, but my company ain't gonna stop doing business to give it to me...



Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
User currently offlineContrails From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 1831 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 15558 times:

I see some difficult days ahead for AA. Employees have had salaries cut and benefits reduced, and the want that reversed. I can't say that I blame them.
.



Flying Colors Forever!
User currently offlineLumberton From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 4708 posts, RR: 20
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 15483 times:

Quoting RDUDDJI (Reply 1):
Sorry, I just don't see the connection between angry employees and capital investment...

I certainly do. Arpey & company fouled up badly with that last round of executive bonuses. The employees are not happy and the unions seem to be in little mood to compromise.

Quoting Contrails (Reply 2):
I see some difficult days ahead for AA. Employees have had salaries cut and benefits reduced, and the want that reversed. I can't say that I blame them.

 checkmark 
I'm simply astonished at the lack of leadership at AA. The employees gave until it hurt. I wouldn't be surprised to see a strike at some point, or at the very least, a new CEO, one more along the lines of a leader, rather an a "manager".

Flame away.



"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21457 posts, RR: 60
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 15483 times:

AA pilots are greedy, plain (plane) and simple.

Just a clue, guys. It isn't the 1990s anymore. Things have changed. Adapt or perish.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineN276AASTT From US Virgin Islands, joined Jan 2004, 620 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 15413 times:

Quoting Contrails (Reply 2):
Employees have had salaries cut and benefits reduced, and the want that reversed. I can't say that I blame them.

Doesn't help when the top 1000 or so execs in AA management received huge bonus checks from AA stocks back in April.



Dejale Caer tu el Peso! YOMO
User currently offlineJustloveplanes From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 1034 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 15384 times:

Quoting Lumberton (Reply 3):
I'm simply astonished at the lack of leadership at AA. The employees gave until it hurt. I wouldn't be surprised to see a strike at some point, or at the very least, a new CEO, one more along the lines of a leader, rather an a "manager".

I couldn't guess how much it hurt at AA, but at least they kept their pensions. DL, UA, NW, and US all probably lost theirs. CO's lost theirs in the early 90's. AA folks have at least something to be grateful for relative to all the other majors, despite the pain.


User currently offlineAAR90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3462 posts, RR: 47
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 15328 times:

Quoting FXramper (Thread starter):
So the AALPA

Who or what is AALPA?  covereyes 



*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
User currently offlineBigAppleCoder From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 44 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15271 times:

Quoting Contrails (Reply 2):
I see some difficult days ahead for AA. Employees have had salaries cut and benefits reduced, and the want that reversed. I can't say that I blame them.

No, you can't blame the employees for trying to get back what they lost, especially with management appearing to want to bleed the company dry with their bonuses. The pilots union has effectively served notice to management that relations are going into the toilet. Unfortunately, a 30.5% (or more) raise just isn't feasible in light of high fuel prices and softening demand. Management is in an unenviable spot. If they acquiesce to the pilots then the mechanics and flight attendants will be pounding on the door for their share. If they don't then the pilots union will strictly enforce work rules and drive up costs anway. Either way, AA is going to need major help to avoid bankruptcy.


User currently offlineAirTran737 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3702 posts, RR: 12
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15247 times:
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How does AA base their aircraft pay, is it weight or seats? The 787 is going to replace the 767, and being that it is roughly the same size as the 767 there should not be any sort of pay increase for flying it.


Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
User currently offlineShannoninAMA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15215 times:

Quoting AAR90 (Reply 7):
Who or what is AALPA?

Im wondering the same thing...hmm


What about


American
Air
Lines
Pilot
Associaion?



Shannon  half 


User currently offlineBigJKU From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 873 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15127 times:

Quoting Lumberton (Reply 3):
I certainly do. Arpey & company fouled up badly with that last round of executive bonuses. The employees are not happy and the unions seem to be in little mood to compromise.

Didn't the pilots turn down a proposal to be involved in just such a program at various points? They did not want profit sharing or company stock from what I remember. They simply wanted raises.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 4):
AA pilots are greedy, plain (plane) and simple.

Just a clue, guys. It isn't the 1990s anymore. Things have changed. Adapt or perish.

 checkmark 

Honestly, what do they expect? They want to keep their pensions and get huge raises which is just absurd. Defined benefit plans like Pensions are going the way of the Dodo and anyone asking for more than a 30% raise is just nuts. While it is certainly a high skill job the average pilot for American Airlines is doing pretty well all things considered. I would hazard to guess that executive pay, even including bonuses, is a pretty small line item expense compared to a 30% raise for every pilot in the company.

These morons are going to negotiate themselves right out of jobs by killing the company.


User currently offlineFleet Service From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 622 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15103 times:

Do a little research, you'll see the APA 'Cleans House' around contract time on a fairly regular basis.

A new slate is elected, vowing change and promising 'Action' until they actually get into office and promptly get a dousing with the cold water of reality,just like with politicians.

There is also the fact that the isn't a pay rate for the 787 on the books yet, AA doesn't want to end up like Delta did a few years back with a nice shiny new airplane and the lack of a pilot pay rate hindering their usage of it.


Make no mistake, AA will be a large 787 operator in the years to come,but they aren't ordering anything until the contract is hammered out.



Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21457 posts, RR: 60
Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15103 times:

Quoting Justloveplanes (Reply 6):
despite the pain

Can someone quantify the "pain" these AA pilots are in? Other than having pay cut, if you just were to take a snapshot today, and not know how they have been injured, what is their payscale and benefit package?



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineMCIGuy From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1936 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15050 times:

For now, but it's a shame that the union interferes with the company purchasing equipment that it needs to be competitive. Oh well, ALPA won't exist in 20 years anyway, maybe 10, the way it's going.


Airliners.net Moderator Team
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17286 posts, RR: 46
Reply 15, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15050 times:

Quoting FXramper (Thread starter):
Congratulations Arpey!

I don't blame Arpey. The APA would be doing this if Arpey gave them everything they wanted.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineJustPlaneNutz From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 518 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15050 times:

Anybody know how long it would be until a strike if AA accepted there would eventually be one and just rode it out? I know the contract becomes amendable in April 2008, but how long after that could the APA strike? Its never too early to make next summer's travel plans.

User currently offlineBmacleod From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 2231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15023 times:

At this rate, I don't expect an order until 2009 at the earliest.....


The engine is the heart of an airplane, but the pilot is its soul.
User currently offlineBigJKU From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 873 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 15023 times:

Quoting BigAppleCoder (Reply 8):
No, you can't blame the employees for trying to get back what they lost, especially with management appearing to want to bleed the company dry with their bonuses.

The total was estimated at $70 million. American stock rose to almost 3 times its previous value in the last 2 years. This generated billions of dollars in capital for the company. Pilots had a chance to be in on a stock driven bonus plan and have repeatedly said no. I did not see them crying for management when they all took paycuts because the stock prices sucked.

What the pilots want is a promise of higher pay regardless of how the company performs. That is just not realistic in the modern business environment.


User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 14977 times:

Quoting RDUDDJI (Reply 1):
Sorry, I just don't see the connection between angry employees and capital investment...

LOL....that's funny.


User currently offlineMCIGuy From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1936 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 14976 times:

Quoting RDUDDJI (Reply 1):
Sorry, I just don't see the connection between angry employees and capital investment...

It's because they're union and they can cripple the company if the company does something they don't like. Those days are coming to an end however.  Smile



Airliners.net Moderator Team
User currently offlineFloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 14956 times:

Quoting Justloveplanes (Reply 6):
I couldn't guess how much it hurt at AA, but at least they kept their pensions. DL, UA, NW, and US all probably lost theirs. CO's lost theirs in the early 90's. AA folks have at least something to be grateful for relative to all the other majors, despite the pain.

NW did not lose their pension. It's still intact.



Good goes around!
User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 14956 times:

Quoting N276AASTT (Reply 5):
Doesn't help when the top 1000 or so execs in AA management received huge bonus checks from AA stocks back in April.

That's partyl teh unions fault. They wanted mgmt to be paid based on performance, while they themselves dotn want to be paid based on financial performace. AMR shares rose and mgmt got paid...there is no screw up here. I saw on CNBC this morning that AMR shares are down liek 23% year to date. If mgmt gets big bonuses for 2007, then I'll agree with the union.


User currently offlineWAH64D From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 966 posts, RR: 13
Reply 23, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 14928 times:

Quoting BigJKU (Reply 11):
Honestly, what do they expect? They want to keep their pensions and get huge raises which is just absurd. Defined benefit plans like Pensions are going the way of the Dodo and anyone asking for more than a 30% raise is just nuts. While it is certainly a high skill job the average pilot for American Airlines is doing pretty well all things considered. I would hazard to guess that executive pay, even including bonuses, is a pretty small line item expense compared to a 30% raise for every pilot in the company.

These morons are going to negotiate themselves right out of jobs by killing the company.

If the company hadn't well and truly shafted them, they wouldn't be in this position in the first place. The only reason AA is still in existance is due to the Pilots mx and cabin staff taking pay-cuts to keep the company afloat. Some of you talk badly of European unions and Labour Laws, it would appear that its no different on your sunny shores. AA is a bloated, inneficient joke of an operation and it wouldn't last 2 minutes anywhere outside the United States. Big changes need to be made to consolidate a fleet that is too high in aircraft types/manufacturers and completely inneficient.

Pension plans are going the way of the Dodo to keep the shareholders happy, pure and simple. I think AALPA are spot-on in their stance. Too many concessions have been made and its time to draw a line in the sand. AA must be prepared to give something back to its staff in return for the concessions they accepted to keep the company going.



I AM the No-spotalotacus.
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17286 posts, RR: 46
Reply 24, posted (7 years 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 14860 times:

Quoting WAH64D (Reply 23):
If the company hadn't well and truly shafted them,

They didn't! The APA shafted itself.

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 22):
They wanted mgmt to be paid based on performance, while they themselves dotn want to be paid based on financial performace.



Quoting BigJKU (Reply 18):
Pilots had a chance to be in on a stock driven bonus plan and have repeatedly said no.



E pur si muove -Galileo
25 AirTran717 : The argument always stands when you start talking unions and negotiations and pay, etc. Most employees truly do deserve more money than they get. But
26 Fleet Service : It's not just AMR that is down double digits percentage wise, the sector as a whole is down year to date.The cost of fuel is impacting all the airlin
27 SLVRBLT : I've noticed that you, FXramper, usually try to have the negative slant on things to say about AA. Got something against AA, or are you jealous? No..
28 Post contains images FXramper : My apologies...I meant APA, not ALPA. Seeing those ALPA lanyards on the ramp too much.
29 ChrisNH : If an order comes in 2009 for a plane that is already sold out till well into the next decade, when could AA expect their 787s? And do they have enoug
30 N844AA : No, AA in August 2001 was a bloated, inefficient joke of an operation with too many fleet types/manufacturers. Say what you will about their current
31 Post contains images Jacobin777 : .....they were "stock-based" bonuses, which management for almost every company gets..aviation or non-aviation..... Arpey has been with AA for decade
32 AeroWesty : I having a bit of a hard time with this statement. The market capitalization of AMR has certainly risen since the low-low days of the summer of 2003,
33 BigJKU : Somewhat but as much as that the longer lifespans of people simply does not work well with a pension system. Those non-productive people are sticking
34 AeroWesty : I made note of your post because of the way you closed it: What has changed in the landscape of employment that an honest day's work doesn't equal an
35 474218 : And the flying public wants lower airfares, you can lower fares and raise the pay and benefits to your employees only a certain amount, then you star
36 BigJKU : Thats all well and good but there is a risk-reward to profit sharing and stock incentives. If the company does well you stand to earn more and if it
37 DAYflyer : Sounds like they want to pay raise themselves straight to the unemployment line when they bankrupt the carrier.
38 AeroWesty : When I read the link, it said in 2003 the pilots had taken a 23% pay cut, along with benefit reductions, to help the company avoid Chapter 11. I'm no
39 Post contains images WAH64D : Very well said.
40 EXAAUADL : I think AA, DL and UA might have to end up leasing 787s from IFC
41 Adh214 : Everytime I see these debates, I am reminded of an idea for labor compensation. Instead of talking about pay rates and work rules, the management coul
42 BigJKU : Perhapse the company is on better footing because it is no longer overpaying the pilots...
43 Charlienorth : Under the Railway Labor Act..this could go on for a couple years,it's unpredictable how long it could take for a strike,there is mediation,super medi
44 Ikramerica : Is anyone who is crying for the pilots going to actually answer my question re: what the pilots are paid now? It's an important question...
45 Post contains images TeamAmerica : If the union is unhappy you automatically assume management is to blame? I don't see it. Without an agreement with the pilots AA cannot commit to the
46 MaverickM11 : They did. The union said no. What if the stock tanked? Management wouldn't be cast as villains, and the hypocritical APA would surely have not been s
47 AeroWesty : That wasn't your original argument. It was the pilots were asking for something someone else got which they didn't. Well the stock had already tanked
48 WAH64D : Reduce shareholder dividend. Let them take the hit for a change.
49 PGNCS : I might think you were right if Arpey's compensation wasn't around $24,000,000 last year. Who is greedy? Oh, yeah, it's those pilots that gave up sev
50 Movingtin : uhh, I think you forgot about 100 million there! they handed themselves $170 Mill in bonuses.
51 Jacobin777 : ....what the pilots want is not possible in 2007..... ...why? They are the ones who purchase the debt and invest and own the company (as well as the
52 SLVRBLT : Quite right, I agree there and no one is more pragmatic or realistic than me, or I try to be.....which is why speculations masqueraded as fact piss m
53 JustPlaneNutz : And that's a very politcal endgame, with a Presidential invervention possible. AA has to appear reasonable to keep political support, so they just ke
54 Bobnwa : AA stock does not pay dividends just like most stock in the US.
55 Reins485 : If they want a raise then they should fly more. I can't find the latest numbers but AA pilots fly around 40 hours a month IIRC. Meanwhile, WN has thei
56 Post contains images Akizidy214 : What a lot of people don't know is that the unions were offered stock options during the last contract negotiation's. But they turned them down becau
57 Lumberton : Shared sacrifice--like GG did at DL. The employees respect the man enormously. The timing of AA's execs was horrible; the performance at the sharehol
58 Post contains links JakeOrion : http://www.willflyforfood.cc/airline...ay/American_Airlines_Pilot_Pay.php Main source: http://www.willflyforfood.cc/airlinepilotpay/ In any case, the
59 WAH64D : I was going to say: I think the wellbeing of the investors, unit funds managers etc come way down the pecking order compared to your employees with f
60 SLVRBLT : Couldn't have said it better; productivity, guys. I've been in part of differenct task forces/boards/etc at AA where I have sat in the same meetings
61 SLVRBLT : Couldn't have said it better; productivity, guys. I've been in part of differenct task forces/boards/etc at AA where I have sat in the same meetings
62 Post contains images Akizidy214 : Could'nt agree with you anymore.....and don't forget the unpaid OT. If anyone should be complaing its the underpaid gate agents!
63 Post contains links and images FXramper : Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 44): what the pilots are paid now? The AA pilots still are lacking 11% of the 23% they gave in 2003, plus other concessions.
64 Charlienorth : Pretty much what happened in 1997,President Clinton owed AA a favor for playing ball during the F.A. strike in 1993,there also was a campaign by othe
65 SLVRBLT : Care to comment on the sum these presumably underpaid folks receive upon retirement.....?
66 Post contains links ThePinnacleKid : www.airlinepilotcentral.com look under legacies and AA... you'll find your answer there to those who are trying to equate the "hourly" wages of pilot
67 Akizidy214 : Sorry not me you meant to quote.
68 Post contains images TeamAmerica : AMR hasn't paid a dividend in recent memory. Your premise is flawed, to say the least. Agreed that GG's gesture was well-timed and well-received...bu
69 Catdaddy63 : This is the same rhetoric that comes out everytime that contracts come due for negotiation. One side says "gimme more, gimme more!" and the other clai
70 Post contains images FXramper : No. I hope your right.
71 HZ747300 : Seriously? The cash has to come from somewhere.
72 Post contains images Ikramerica : Support your argument. The billions you quote have been shown in other threads to be a manufactured fallacy. And I notice how you ignored my question
73 Post contains images Jacobin777 : GG doesn't need the money anymore as he's had a distinguished carrier and has earned his fair share of money over the decades....he wants put his nam
74 Atmx2000 : And the armed forces also has different pay grades tied to rank. Promotions are merit based as opposed to seniority based. And as an officer if you g
75 Aaway : In addition, the aspersions that have been cast at Arpey on this forum, and others, is misplaced. AMR's BoD was responsible for crafting, and approvi
76 BoeingPride800 : I think its the managment that is greedy. When top execs take a raise in paycheck when the companie's pilots and FA's feel the pain for it.
77 AAR90 : I Captain a 150 pax jet flying domestic (North America) flights. I earn the same as a Captain flying 150 pax jets flying domestic flights did 20 YEAR
78 Akizidy214 : Once again. Everything that executive management got was previously agreed to by the unions. The unions thought stock prices would never meet the goa
79 777STL : Freaking thank you! And who elects the BoD? The stockholders!
80 Davidlc3 : I know I'm going to get pelted for these comments but here it goes... I've carried a union card for many years and worked in management for the remain
81 Aaway : Sir, no flaming forthcoming from me. The point is that at a time when AMR desperately needed stability in the executive and operational ranks, the Bo
82 Davidlc3 : I would agree...albeit they may have overarched in their committment as people are prone to do in the face of destruction but they did what they had
83 Post contains images FXramper : I usually agree with most of what you say, but I gotta raise the here. Arpey has been with AMR for ages. He was a VP and head of DFW and Flight Ops b
84 Post contains images UAL777 : Not anytime soon at the airlines. Wrong. They killed the pilot supply. Just wait 10 years. Pilot salaries will skyrocket because there won't be any.
85 Post contains images Davidlc3 : Yes but AA always seems to ride in at the last minute on placing orders and still get pretty good placement on deliveries (sorry I don't have the ment
86 AA787823 : Not gonna happen. Arpey still predicts more turmoil in the industry in the future. AA still has a lot of debt to pay down. AA still has the highest l
87 Post contains links and images Jacobin777 : UAL777...while I feel bad for your dad, however wages still depend on "supply and demand"...unfortunately the market dictates that very highly skilled
88 Reins485 : I can basically thank being born to AA, because the chief pilot when my mom was right out of FA school introduced my parents to each other. My dad wa
89 Ckfred : The Wall Street Journal had an article about this some time ago and took the unions to task. Basically, AA's unions should not compare their wages to
90 Mach3 : ASLPA are the PrimaDonnas of the Airline business. They were to good and high and mighty to be part of the larger ALPA. Being a PIC or FO is a darn aw
91 Davescj : Airline can't plead that they are in dire straights for $$ if they can buy new planes. I agree -- AA won't htink about new planes until labor contrac
92 UAL777 : Its not the wages so much. Its when people say oh their OVERPAID or "being a pilot is easy". Pilot wages are coming back up. You heard it here first.
93 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ..unfortunately, according to the market, it seems as if they are for now...maybe that will change soon as the "pendulum" does eventually shift as th
94 Jetdeltamsy : Then you don't understand much about the airline business. Angry employees tend to run off customers, which causes the company to lose revenue. If th
95 AA767400 : Problem is the Pilots were living the "good life" for years and then they had to take a pay cut. There goes that second home on the beach. Question is
96 AirTran717 : Agreed. But, we have all seen the posts that cry this stuff from people who haven't even ever stepped one inch inside a plane in their lives. Flight
97 BigJKU : Perhapse, and this is just a thought, AA has some realtivly smart people who can see that the cost savings with new aircraft it terms of fuel and MX
98 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ..that's the whole point of my comment..I am giving them respect... ....but "respect" and getting "fair market value" are two different things...
99 Post contains images JakeOrion : Fair enough. I know pilots/flight attendants are gone for days (and in some cases weeks) at a time, and this can be difficult if you have a family. N
100 RDUDDJI : Yes it does and it comes from their capital plan, not from cutting employee wages as some armchair CFOs on here would have you believe. AA has smart
101 777STL : No offense, but that's a rather simplistic viewpoint. In this, you're only taking *one* cost into account and you're totally ignoring the revenue sid
102 BigJKU : Agreed but, and most reports show this to be true, American has some if not the highest labor cost in the industry. We have their unions demanding a
103 UAL777 : That is your problem as well as anyone who has never flown a plane. Sure, perhaps the average joe could do a turn in a 777 and only lose 500-1000 fee
104 AA757200 : You have hit the nail on the head! I am affraid hubris will lead to the latter of the two options. Thanks pilots.
105 474218 : I was a tech rep for a airframe manufacture for over 20 years, many times I went to work in the morning only to be told to go home pack a bag and I w
106 LMP737 : What about AA's costs on leases, facilities or suppliersd compared to other airlines. Don't forget there are other factors invilved, not just your la
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