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Skybus To St Aug!... Other Secondary Fla Airports?  
User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5961 posts, RR: 17
Posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3684 times:

In case you hadn’t heard (it was talked about in the other thread),
Skybus will be flying to St. Augustine, Fl., marketed as Jacksonville/Daytona Beach

This brings up interesting speculation:

Are other airports in Florida w/ no airline service under consideration?

Someone brought up LAL for Tampa/Orlando

What about VRB for Melbourne/West Palm Beach

Punta Gorda for Sarasota/Ft. Myers

Or how about Naples (APF)

Lake City?

Ocala marketed as Orlando/Tampa?

Any airports south of MIA? Kendall?


Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
52 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMD90fan From Bahamas, joined Jul 2005, 2931 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3658 times:

Quoting 727LOVER (Thread starter):
Any airports south of MIA? Kendall?

I believe they fly to FLL (yes FLL), which is coincidentally one of their better performing routes (along with BUR), also the fact that there isn't much of a market south of Miami rules out the possibility of them doing such a move.



http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
User currently offlineCitrusCritter From Pitcairn Islands, joined May 2007, 1081 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3655 times:

If they go to Palm Beach, I'm sure it will be at PBI. I doubt they will however, since they are already at FLL. I'd expect FLL to stand in for Palm Beach, Fort Lauderdale, and Miami. MTH and EYW are not capable of handling an A319, and FLL is a good choice given its central location.

No reason to not use SRQ or RSW...they aren't exactly MIA, TPA, or MCO.

Lake City would be marketed as what? There's not a significant population or a tourist draw in that area. I think LAL or SFB will be more likely for Orlando versus OCF. OCF is just a little too far away from Orlando's main tourist attractions, and OCF residents have their choice of MCO or GNV for flights. Not to mention that Ocala in itself is not much of a draw...rich horse-business folks aren't Skybus clientele. LAL has the unique ability of being marketed as Orlando/Tampa. I think the slightly more conventional approach of SFB and PIE makes more sense on that front, however.

Naples has runway length issues, and I do not believe it can handle an A319. Skybus as well as NK and perhaps FL should look at VPS and PFN service however.

[Edited 2007-06-26 00:22:10]


TLH
User currently offlineSkyyMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3655 times:

Dunno about the above listed cities. Some don't have scheduled service - would depend on getting TSA in there.

I was looking at the Skybus website about St. Augustine and the driving distances/times to other Florida cities. Huh? Have any of those people actually driven in Florida in the last 5 years? I drove from Daytona to Jacksonville last summer, midweek, mid day. It took almost 2 hours from Daytona to St. Augustine on I-95 due to construction (a never ending thing according to my son-in-law who lives in JAX). He advised us it would take equally as long to make the drive from St. Augustine to Jacksonville (it took roughly an hour going southbound the previous day), so we opted for A1A, and it was just as slow, taking over an hour. Perhaps Skybus is timing their drives for 03:00, I don't know, but they are dreaming if they think their posted drive times are realistic. Also, aforementioned son-in-law says there is a large amount of opposition from St. Augustine NIMBY's about Skybus arrival, and lawsuits are going to happen. Should be interesting.


User currently offlineBillReid From Netherlands, joined Jun 2006, 968 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3624 times:

SRQ or PIE are the only choices on the west coast.
Punta Gorda lacks originating traffic and won't get any outbound from RSW as that is a inbound market served by WN.
TPA is served by WN.
PIE is only eight miles from TPA and is vulnerable to TPA-WN traffic.

SRQ offers the best west coast opportunity as it is smack-dab in the middle and has no WN traffic.

Additionally Florida handles a great deal of seniors on board which is a huge problem for any airline flying without bridges.
Given the density of seats on board Skybus will need a solution for 8-12 wheelchairs into Florida per flight. Based on a twenty-five minute turn this is impossible to do without bridges. At PIE or Punta Gorda Skybus would have to go to a 70 minute turn to accommodate wheelchair pax.

MLB works with the east coast for all the same reasons. Skybus also can tap into the 900,000-1,000,000 dollars MLB is now offering for regional jet service. They are desperate.

my 2 cents.



Some people don't get it. Business is about making MONEY!
User currently offlineCitrusCritter From Pitcairn Islands, joined May 2007, 1081 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3610 times:

SRQ has FL and B6, so it's not exactly LCC competition clear. I doubt SX will steer clear of PIE simply because WN is at TPA, just as they won't steer clear of SFB/LAL/MLB (perhaps) simply because WN, not to mention FL, B6, USA 3000, and others are at MCO.


TLH
User currently offlineSacamojus From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 228 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3552 times:

Quoting SkyyMaster (Reply 3):
I drove from Daytona to Jacksonville last summer, midweek, mid day. It took almost 2 hours from Daytona to St. Augustine on I-95 due to construction (a never ending thing according to my son-in-law who lives in JAX). He advised us it would take equally as long to make the drive from St. Augustine to Jacksonville (it took roughly an hour going southbound the previous day), so we opted for A1A, and it was just as slow, taking over an hour

It is not that bad now. There is no construction from St. Augustine to Jacksonville anymore, except in downtown. The drive from St. Augustine to Southside Jax only took me 30 minutes, and from St. Augustine to Daytona was only 35-40 minutes.

I think LAL has great potential. They have a very nice terminal with rental cars available. It is only 30 minutes to Disney, same distance from SFB to Disney, but also 25 minutes from Tampa. Except for some construction on I-4 the drive would not be bad if you take to the Polk Parkway to I-4. I always wondered why LAL hasn't recieved service in the past considering the population size, the money in the area, Publix, colleges, and growing population.


User currently offlineBillReid From Netherlands, joined Jun 2006, 968 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3476 times:

Quoting CitrusCritter (Reply 5):
SRQ has FL and B6, so it's not exactly LCC competition clear. I doubt SX will steer clear of PIE simply because WN is at TPA, just as they won't steer clear of SFB/LAL/MLB (perhaps) simply because WN, not to mention FL, B6, USA 3000, and others are at MCO.

The logic is ok if SX were planning to fly to ATL(FL) or JFK(B6), but that is not the case. They would fly to CMH while WN flies to RSW and TPA and can vigorously defend the terf. A flight to PIE is vunerable to WN flights and excess capacity merely on that PIE is TRULY co-termalized with TPA.

The argument is supported by TZ immediately exiting PIE upon WN purchase. WN sees PIE as a TPA terminal.



Some people don't get it. Business is about making MONEY!
User currently offlineFLALEFTY From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 396 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3457 times:

http://www.faa.gov/airports_airtraff...ports/airport_safety/part139_cert/

According to this FAA website, Lakeland, St. Augstine, Ocala and Vero Beach are not currently certified as Part 139 - Class I airports, which would allow them to host scheduled airline service with planes over 31 seats.

St. Augustine is probably in the process of upgrading from Class IV to Class I. Thanks to the Northrop-Grumman airplane modification plant at St. Augustine, the airport already has the ATC, runway maintenance, fire fighting and HAZMAT control services in place. But there is no terminal to speak of and they still have to arrange for TSA coverage (that was a problem that delayed service to Marathon last year).

As for Skybus serving PIE, there is a market there, but I don't think the local airport authority will do anything special for Skybus to get the service.

DAB and MLB are starving for new service. I'm surprised that they didn't offer Skybus the "sun and moon" to serve them.


User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5772 posts, RR: 15
Reply 9, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3433 times:

Quoting FLALEFTY (Reply 8):
But there is no terminal to speak of and they still have to arrange for TSA coverage (that was a problem that delayed service to Marathon last year).

They are building a hanger structure that is nearly complete for Skybus to use as a terminal.
Ed Wuellner, executive director of the St. Augustine Airport Authority, told his board of directors that the hangar should be done by July 16, two days before the first incoming flight touches down from Columbus, Ohio.

And in terms of certification:
There are still two more (slight) hurdles: One, the Federal Aviation Authority will visit the airport July 8 for an inspection before certifying the facility for commercial service. Two, the airport has not yet obtained its Class 1 Commercial Certificate.
http://staugustine.com/stories/061907/news_new0619A.shtml

A very tight schedule and I wonder about the TSA and its equipment.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8626 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3425 times:

Quoting FLALEFTY (Reply 8):
DAB and MLB are starving for new service. I'm surprised that they didn't offer Skybus the "sun and moon" to serve them.

I'm guessing they might if this doesn't work out.

Hunter



Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4630 posts, RR: 12
Reply 11, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3369 times:

I dont think it would take much for LAL to get 139 certified.... directly between Orlando and Tampla i think its like 30 min to TPA and 30 min to Disney (45 to Orlando City)... LAL is just as close to the theme parks as SFB is.... i think it'd be a slam dunk


Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineCMHSRQ From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 989 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3351 times:

There is no shortage or airports in Florida I can tell you that.

On the SW coast from Tampa South to Marco there are at least 10 decent airports that they can choose from, only 5 have commercial service. So they really control the cards. Airports like PGD, and VNC, are all options and can probably allow them to not only fly in for free but share in any concessions and airport revenue that SkyBus might generate. The commercial airports would have a more difficult time doing this. I think what ever airport gives them the best deal regardless of facilities is the SW Florida of choice. So I would think 1 SW Florida airport, 1 central Fl airport, Cancun and Nassau will all be in the next announcement for services starting in the fall.

So SRQ, think about revenue sharing, hotel partners revenue sharing, waived landing and rent fees for a couple of years, advertising, ANYTHING BUCKEYES etc etc. I mean come on Tressel and his wife have a home on Siesta Key. Please give them a nice incentive package to start service. Then finally my screen name will actually become a city pair.



The voice of moderation
User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5961 posts, RR: 17
Reply 13, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 3151 times:

Quoting FLALEFTY (Reply 8):
DAB and MLB are starving for new service. I'm surprised that they didn't offer Skybus the "sun and moon" to serve them.

MLB just got USA3000 to BWI



Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineExFATboy From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2974 posts, RR: 9
Reply 14, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3123 times:

Quoting FLALEFTY (Reply 8):
As for Skybus serving PIE, there is a market there, but I don't think the local airport authority will do anything special for Skybus to get the service.

Have to disagree - PIE may not be as desperate as they were before Allegiant arrived, but they're still pretty hard up for business. According to their website, in 2004 PIE had 1,333,069 passengers, in 2006 it was 389,997. That's pretty sad. There's only 80 flights a week out of PIE between Allegiant and USA 3000, and seasonal Canada service only amounted to another 5 flights a week.

While PIE might not be willing to give away the entire store like they would have been pre-Allegiant, they're more than willing to play "Let's Make A Deal!" with...well, anyone, really.


User currently offlineBeefstew25 From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 675 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3052 times:

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 13):
MLB just got USA3000 to BWI

Whoa....I have searched far and wide for a story on that. Do you have a link?

Talked to the mayor the other day about the German charter. He is frustrated on the Customs Agent situation.



MLB: Where you are always number one for takeoff.....
User currently offlineCMHSRQ From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 989 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3038 times:

Quoting Beefstew25 (Reply 15):
Whoa....I have searched far and wide for a story on that. Do you have a link?

I noticed it last week on the USA3000 website when I found the SRQ stuff. The SRQ press release just came out today, so maybe the same for MLB.



The voice of moderation
User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5961 posts, RR: 17
Reply 17, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3034 times:

Quoting Beefstew25 (Reply 15):
Whoa....I have searched far and wide for a story on that. Do you have a link?

As far as I know, there isn't a press release, but if you look at USA3000airlines.com, you can see their 2 new destinations...MLB & SRQ



Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineBeefstew25 From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 675 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2999 times:

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 17):
As far as I know, there isn't a press release, but if you look at USA3000airlines.com, you can see their 2 new destinations...MLB & SRQ

I checked their timetable. Late afternoon into MLB, and evening back out looks like. Seasonal service for now. I love it.

http://www.trvlink.com/download/u5/schedules.pdf

Now if we can get the Germans in and maybe someone to compete with Delta, I will be happy.



MLB: Where you are always number one for takeoff.....
User currently offlineDeltaGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2970 times:

Quoting SkyyMaster (Reply 3):
Also, aforementioned son-in-law says there is a large amount of opposition from St. Augustine NIMBY's about Skybus arrival, and lawsuits are going to happen. Should be interesting.

The 319 isn't any louder than the F-5's and E-2's that operate out of there....then again, leave it to the NIMBY's to screw it up...

DeltaGuy


User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5961 posts, RR: 17
Reply 20, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2963 times:

Quoting CMHSRQ (Reply 12):
Airports like PGD, and VNC,

WOW!!! Venice....never even thought of that one. How long is that runway?

Tiusville/Cocoa Beach could draw from Orlando & Melbourne.



Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineApodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4133 posts, RR: 6
Reply 21, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2957 times:

If they are going to go to Orlando, I am surprised no one has mentioned SFB for them. SFB is the perfect airport for Skybus.

User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5961 posts, RR: 17
Reply 22, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2909 times:

Quoting Apodino (Reply 21):
If they are going to go to Orlando, I am surprised no one has mentioned SFB for them. SFB is the perfect airport for Skybus.

Keep in mind, the point of the thread:

If they are willing to go into an airport that has no commercial air service (St. Augustine), the would they be willing to do that at other small airports without service/TSA.

Because for me, following the SGJ frame of mind, LAL (which I think has TSA?) makes more sense than SFB



Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineAPFPilot1985 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2892 times:

Quoting 727LOVER (Thread starter):
Or how about Naples (APF)

We have service to ATL on EV and it does very well, however we also have a maximum weight limit of 75,000 pounds and the authority is very firm on this.


User currently offlineTbolt1 From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 189 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (6 years 10 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2847 times:

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 22):
Keep in mind, the point of the thread:

If they are willing to go into an airport that has no commercial air service (St. Augustine), the would they be willing to do that at other small airports without service/TSA.

Because for me, following the SGJ frame of mind, LAL (which I think has TSA?) makes more sense than SFB

I have heard LAL as well because they can market more than 1 city that way.



"You can be my wingman anytime."
25 Post contains links FATFlyer : 2004 was an extreme peak at PIE, 2006 a 15 year low. Typically it has been in the 700,000-800,000 passenger range over the last 10 to 20 years. It wi
26 NASCARAirforce : Come on, some of these are just rediculous. LAL could work - They would need to build some sort of terminal though. Nice strategic location between t
27 DAL767400ER : The NIMBYs only see that an A319 is considerably bigger than those military planes, and in NIMBY logic, bigger=louder, as dumb as that is. A1A goes t
28 Post contains links Beefstew25 : Announced in the Florida Today (after I emailed them USA3000's schedule). Fair use: Currently, Delta Air Lines operates five daily roundtrip flights f
29 Sacamojus : LAL already has a terminal, a very nice one at that. The last time I was there, it was two stories with a restaurant, fairly large seating area, and
30 CMHSRQ : So is Chicopee MA, but they are still flying there. I would think that any airport within a 2 hour drive of a large population center is a option.
31 SkyyMaster : I'm guessing Allegiant would put up a pretty good fight at SFB. They seem well entrenched there and I would guess they'd add CMH if the Bus did come
32 727LOVER : Is LAL closer to Disney than SFB? How long is the runway at LAL?
33 CitrusCritter : I think G4 must be the most misunderstood operation on this forum. G4's sole purpose is to bring tourists from smaller cities throughout the country
34 Beefstew25 : Looks to be about the same distance. MLB is about the same also.
35 Post contains images CitrusCritter : MLB is a good 90 minute drive for tourists to Disney World. It could be shorter by using US Hwy 192, but I doubt most tourists would be directed to 19
36 Beefstew25 : Once 192 is a four lane road, it will be an hour. Plus MLB already has a underutilized terminal and indoor plumbing.
37 Jetlanta : MLB is hidden gem. Someday a brave LCC is going to figure it out. They are a little intimidated by the proximately to MCO and the checkered past. But
38 CitrusCritter : MLB would work fine with tourists once the 192 expansion is done, but I can't see folks from Orlando driving to MLB for flights unless the price is e
39 Post contains images 727LOVER : $10 fare? I'd say that's the best deal.
40 Tjwgrr : APF's runways are 5290' and 5000' Skybus flying weight restricted flights out of APF to CMH would never work either. Skybus needs to fill those cheap
41 Post contains images CitrusCritter : Sure, if you can get one of 'em.
42 Jetlanta : MLB doesn't need the Orlando residents. It needs some of the 80% of its own regional traffic that uses MCO to stay home. More importantly, it needs s
43 NASCARAirforce : What is a large population center within 2 hours of Lake City? Maybe Jacksonville, but Jacksonville isn't even that big of a population center when y
44 DeltaGuy : If you've ever been near an EA-6B Prowler, with those old J52's, you know what loud is....the 319 aint got nothing on it. But of course it'll all be
45 CitrusCritter : Any idea what the breakdown of Brevard County originating traffic is in the use of MLB, MCO, PBI, and perhaps DAB?
46 Beefstew25 : No idea. But the prevailing thought around here: 1) Fly out of MLB for business (company pays for it) 2) Fly out of MCO for pleasure (when out of you
47 Jetlanta : As a matter of fact, I do. Though this also includes Indian River County and northern St. Lucie County: About 83% of the market is leaked to other ai
48 NASCARAirforce : I don't have any numbers, but don't forget some also may use SFB. I really see the use of PBI being low out of Brevard County - that is a good 2-3 ho
49 Post contains images DAL767400ER : Oh believe me, I know just how f'n load those old military jets can be, my ears are still ringing from an airshow at Maxwell AFB, Montogomery back in
50 FLALEFTY : Yep, I agree! MLB is a decent little airport that does not have the 100-yard TSA lines that MCO has on a typical day. Right you are! Maybe Martin Cou
51 NASCARAirforce : I-4 is complete between Lakeland and Orlando, until they find out they will have to add a 4th lane each way the way that this area is growing. There
52 Post contains images DAL767400ER : All the construction in downtown Orlando surrounding the new I-4/FL408 interchange can't be ignored . Not to mention that quite a few other interchan
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