Boston92 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3390 posts, RR: 6 Posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 8642 times:
I think that UA without a doubt nailed it when choosing their five hubs.
1. I think all of them have very different tasks, and when combined, it is perfect.
SFO covers all intl travel from DEN west and connects flights that are wholly on the west
LAX has the regional/express flights covered for the west coast
DEN connects both the coasts for travelers terminating in central US
ORD connects, well, everything
IAD connects flights that originate and terminate on the east coast
2. The location of the hubs is also ingenius... there are few routes that United could not do because of hub location (i.e. If IAD was not a hub, who would fly to ORD from BOS when they are going to MIA)?
3. All the hubs are at airports that I do not mind going to. All airports are beautiful and are very nice to go and visit.
4. Including regional flights (i.e. Skywest), United "owns" the airport. All their hubs have major ops; no minor hubs.
I just think that UA has a VERY complete hub operation, any comments, positive or negative, are welcome (I wanna hear what you think, regardless).
"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
RSWA330 From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 261 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 8554 times:
I think AA has a pretty decent hub system. On the opposite end of the spectrum, NW definately has the worst hubs (domestically at least). DTW and MSP are so close together. Anyone know why NW chose these two airports especially given NW's operation in East Asia? I would think they would have looked farther West.
DL Widget Head From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2106 posts, RR: 5
Reply 4, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 8555 times:
Quoting Boston92 (Thread starter): 1. I think all of them have very different tasks, and when combined, it is perfect.
They're not bad as a whole and better than most but hardly perfect. I can think of issues with each one and certainly they are lacking a hub in the Southeast and even the Midsouth as stated in one of the posts above. Anyone have the fgures of how many MAINLINE flights they run out of each?
SkyyMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 8366 times:
Quoting ATLAaron (Reply 5): I disagree. It is very hard to live on the east coast and fly to another city on the east coast via AA. I once had a credit on them to use and had to fly PIT-DFW-MCO.
Although I live in Nashville, one of AA's failures - I think RDU could have worked as an east coast hub. It, along with BNA were victims of bad timing IMO. Had RJ's been around, they could have supplemented mainline services. I know AA has quite a few RJ's at RDU now, but I wouldn't consider it a connecting hub by any means. I'm trying to book some AAdvantage miles from BNA to JAX, and my choices are obviously quite limited and out of the way no matter which direction I go.
I'm not all that impressed with UA's hub placement. SFO and IAD are basically there just for international flights. Many SFO destinations are once a day and IAD is still largely RJ. ORD has a nice terminal, but it's still ORD and that doesn't make it the most attractive option. As for DEN, UA has F9 to worry about, and now WN is looking to make serious inroads there indicated by yesterdays announcement of service realignment. If UA really needs a merger partner to cover the south, everyone says it's CO. I don't really consider IAH in the south so much as midwest. Who knows, maybe they will court US again, and get turned down by DOJ again.
Halls120 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 8330 times:
Quoting AirCop (Reply 6): Quoting Boston92 (Thread starter):IAD connects flights that originate and terminate on the east coast
This hub was rumored to be closed when UA went into bankruptcy. Aside from the European flights there is no other reason to have IAD as a hub.
Yes, it was. Fortunately, someone saw the idiocy of that approach, and instead of being cut back, UA strengthened its IAD ops.
Now if only they would build a proper C/D terminal. When you are sitting in the C17 RCC, you can look out the window and see where they are building a station for the new inter-terminal train. Which, for some time, won't have a terminal attached to it.
DeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 9016 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 8224 times:
I think UA has one of the stronger hub systems in the country; the major gaping hole of course is the Southeast; not a whole lot than can be done there though; ATL has Delta and AirTran, CLT has US Airways and the only other cities that have had hubs (Nashville and Raleigh) have both failed; BNA has a huge WN presence now that would turn off a lot of airlines to hubbing there; RDU has fit it's niche quite nicely as a mix of LCCs and full service airlines with frequent RJs to many business destinations. Florida is too far south for a domestic hub (hence, AA uses MIA for mainly international connections to the Caribbean and South America and some east-west traffic), and cities like BHM, MSY (post-Katrina), JAN, etc. can't really support a full hub operation.
Out of the airlines, here are my thoughts:
AA: Real good for east-west traffic. Real good for north-south in the middle part of the country. On the east coast, it's pretty limited; there is some focal points at BOS, NYC and RDU, but not a whole lot. West coast, AA tends to rely heavily on Alaska it seems.
DL: Northeast is strong with JFK (and focal points at LGA and BOS), Southeast has ATL, midwest has CVG. SLC has gotten stronger, which helps with east-west traffic. West coast is developing; it'll take some time for LAX to get up to full swing. It helps, but it's still lacking when you only have 1-2 options a day in many markets compared to WN, UA and AS having a lot of traffic there.
NW: Has the heartland and the Great Lakes under control. Good for east-west traffic. Pretty poor for any north-south traffic. MEM fills it's role; a little too far west to be an effective southeast hub though, especially compared to CLT and ATL. Probably the worst situation out there.
CO: Northeast is in great shape with EWR, Southwest with IAH gives good east-west traffic, CLE fills it's role. West Coast is lacking. The EWR hubs helps a lot with it, but not the most conducive setup for domestic ops.
US: Midwest is empty, but dominates the East Coast and adding HP adds a lot for east-west traffic and the Southwest.
FlyIGuy From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1310 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 7877 times:
If UA is in need of a hub in the south then I would look to merge with Spirit. they have the same aircraft as UA and same engines so it makes for less parts to keep on hand. they have a hub in FLL which would open up the south, carribean, and latin america for UA. I think Spirit would be the best be...but thtas just me...any suggestions ?
The opinions I post are of mine and mine alone, not of the airline I work for.
COERJ145 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1421 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 7819 times:
Quoting FlyIGuy (Reply 19): If UA is in need of a hub in the south then I would look to merge with Spirit. they have the same aircraft as UA and same engines so it makes for less parts to keep on hand. they have a hub in FLL which would open up the south, carribean, and latin america for UA. I think Spirit would be the best be...but thtas just me...any suggestions ?
Interesting thought, they could also pressure AA at MIA with spirits latin america hub/gateway(FLL). A NW/NK merger would be good on NWs part, as it would elimintate competition at DTW, while giving them latin america access. A NK/B6 merger would be nice as well, giving B6 more international destinations. It would fit well with B6s FLL flights from BOS/JFK and other east coast cities.
AirFrnt From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2844 posts, RR: 40
Reply 23, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 7761 times:
UA is pretty well set hub wise. I do think that they want to push more to the south, and I think they have a huge problem with their DEN hub which is under assault not only by WN and AA, but by the fact that virtually every other carrier in the United States flies there.
DEN gives UA the ability to push passengers east/west and north/south. I think part of the reason you see WN pushing DEN as aggressively as they are is because they are seeing real value to the same trends, breaking up transcons into two shorter hops, and building demand.
ORD provides a huge market. ORD is becoming too congested to be a connection hub for domestic service, but it does well internationally. DEN is picking up the slack with domestic connecting, esp with the new RJ concourse.
SFO does pretty well, but if UA could have all their transcon out of LAX, I suspect that they would do that in a heart beat.
IAD is the week link in the whole system from my point of view.