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British Airways Banned! Tit-for-tat From Angola  
User currently offlineJoKeR From Serbia, joined Nov 2004, 2238 posts, RR: 9
Posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 19154 times:

London - Angola's civil aviation authority has rescinded British Airways' permit to fly into the southwestern African nation, a spokesperson for the airline said on Monday.

"We were informed on Friday by the Angolan CAA that it had rescinded BA's seasonal operating permit with immediate effect," BA spokesperson Richard Goodfellow said.

http://www.fin24.co.za/articles/defa...x?Nav=ns&ArticleID=1518-24_2140111


Kafa, čaj, šraf?
119 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTrekster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 19063 times:

Interesting!!!

UK government ban an airline thats not good on safety, and then they Ban BA in retaliation.

What a nice government they have


User currently offlineContnlEliteCMH From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1459 posts, RR: 44
Reply 2, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 19025 times:

Quoting Trekster (Reply 1):
Interesting!!!

UK government ban an airline thats not good on safety, and then they Ban BA in retaliation.

What a nice government they have

Huh, an African government that doesn't abide by a rule of law, have any semblance of justice, or wishes to grease its plams at the expense of its citizenry? Wow. Maybe Indonesia could give them some lessons in aviation oversight. No, wait...



Christianity. Islam. Hinduism. Anthropogenic Global Warming. All are matters of faith!
User currently offlineSchipholjfk From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 579 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18945 times:

Like BA is going to miss any business revenue! Angola who? No one cares


The fun of flying... love it !!!
User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4435 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18916 times:

Quoting Schipholjfk (Reply 3):
Like BA is going to miss any business revenue! Angola who? No one cares

If BA didn't care, they wouldn't fly there to start with.


User currently offlineB742 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 3768 posts, RR: 19
Reply 5, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18916 times:

Quoting Schipholjfk (Reply 3):
Like BA is going to miss any business revenue! Angola who? No one cares

Actualy BA's LHR-LAD-LHR route is extremely proftiable despite the low frequency.

Intresting move from the Angolan CAA.
Reminds me of the Indian-Kuwaiti saga.

Rob!  wave 


User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8376 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18824 times:

Quoting Schipholjfk (Reply 3):
Like BA is going to miss any business revenue! Angola who? No one cares

Why don't you go learn something before you make yourself look silly. This is a very high yield route for BA. The only reason they don't fly it daily is because Angola doesn't allow it. Every major airline in Europe would fly to LAD daily if they were allowed to.


User currently offlineMaersk737 From Denmark, joined Feb 2004, 702 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18798 times:

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 6):



Quoting Airbazar (Reply 6):
Why don't you go learn something before you make yourself look silly. This is a very high yield route for BA. The only reason they don't fly it daily is because Angola doesn't allow it. Every major airline in Europe would fly to LAD daily if they were allowed to.

No very big problem for BA though.

Cheers

Peter

[Edited 2007-07-02 15:56:59]


I'm not proud to be a Viking, just thankfull
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17508 posts, RR: 45
Reply 8, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18710 times:

Of course this hurts Angola more than it hurts BA


E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineENU From Netherlands, joined Nov 2006, 1166 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18663 times:

What about the other European carriers? Aren't Lufthansa and TAP flying to LAD? It's EU measure, so if the Angolan government is consistent, they would ban all EU-carriers... Ending all direct flights between Europe and Angola.

User currently offlineMadhatter From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 242 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18621 times:

Is it just BA that is banned from Angola or the rest of the EU carriers that fly there as well - Air France, TAP etc. as I was under the impression that it was the EU that banned TAAG from flying in EU airspace and not the British government specifically.

User currently offlineG-CIVP From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 1325 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18595 times:

No great loss is it?!!

User currently offlineBuyantUkhaa From Mongolia, joined May 2004, 2899 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18507 times:

Quoting ENU (Reply 9):
Aren't Lufthansa and TAP flying to LAD? It's EU measure, so if the Angolan government is consistent, they would ban all EU-carriers...

TAP flies there most days of the week. Banning them would hurt Angolans too much, there are many Angolans living in Portugal and lots of trade between the countries as well.

Lufthansa... well... you never know.



I scratch my head, therefore I am.
User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8376 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18477 times:

Quoting G-CIVP (Reply 11):
No great loss is it?!!

No, not a huge loss network wise, but a loss nontheless, especially considering the high yields on this route from Oil industry customers.


User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31684 posts, RR: 56
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 18458 times:

Quoting B742 (Reply 5):
Reminds me of the Indian-Kuwaiti saga.

Theres no connection.That was Not safety related.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineDkny From Ethiopia, joined Mar 2004, 714 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18458 times:

Banning some aircrafts from TAAG maybee I can understand, but all aircrafts! TAAG has 2 777-200ER they received less than a year ago. What's up with that?

User currently offlineB742 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 3768 posts, RR: 19
Reply 16, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18457 times:

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 14):
Theres no connection.That was Not safety related.

I wasn't refering to that sense. It was the case of one banning (or possibly banning) the other after another  Smile

Rob!  wave 


User currently offlineWINGS From Portugal, joined May 2005, 2831 posts, RR: 68
Reply 17, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18336 times:

Quoting Schipholjfk (Reply 3):
Like BA is going to miss any business revenue! Angola who? No one cares

You have no idea how dumb you have just portrayed your self to be.  Wow! Angola is currently one of the fastest growing economies in the world. I suggest that you do some research in the future before making such wild and incorrect assumptions.

Quoting B742 (Reply 5):
Actualy BA's LHR-LAD-LHR route is extremely profitable despite the low frequency.

Correct and the only reason that it is low frequency is that BA has not been granted any more rights. In regards to Tap Portugal I believe that they will not take any drastic measures as Portugal have very close ties with Angola.

Regards,
Wings



Aviation Is A Passion.
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17508 posts, RR: 45
Reply 18, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18336 times:

Quoting Dkny (Reply 15):
TAAG has 2 777-200ER they received less than a year ago. What's up with that?

They're operated by TAAG, and a poorly maintained 777 is not much safer than a poorly maintained 743

Quoting BuyantUkhaa (Reply 12):
Lufthansa... well... you never know.

LH doesn't fly there right now; are they planning to? They aren't any time before December 2007.

On a related note, anyone know why ET is flying an AB3 to LAD? Where did the plane come from?



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineMacc From Austria, joined Nov 2004, 1042 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18320 times:

Quoting BuyantUkhaa (Reply 12):
Lufthansa... well... you never know

They dont fly to Angola as far as I know...



I exchanged political frustration with sexual boredom. better spoil a girl than the world
User currently offlineMahan From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 53 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18270 times:

Quoting B742 (Reply 5):
Intresting move from the Angolan CAA.
Reminds me of the Indian-Kuwaiti saga.

Hmm..Not quite the same.. Indian-Kuwaiti saga was due to business disagreements on both sides..



Airlines I have flown - IC, 9W, KF, AI, LH, BA, LX, CO, DL, UA, SQ, MH, AA
User currently offlineDkny From Ethiopia, joined Mar 2004, 714 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18270 times:

ET does not have any AB3's and the LAD flight is operated by a 763 3x a week.

User currently offlineENU From Netherlands, joined Nov 2006, 1166 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18227 times:

Quoting Macc (Reply 19):
Quoting BuyantUkhaa (Reply 12):
Lufthansa... well... you never know

They dont fly to Angola as far as I know...

Correct, but AF and SN do. They could retaliate upon AF, because TAAG is banned from CDG.


User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17508 posts, RR: 45
Reply 23, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18201 times:

Quoting Dkny (Reply 21):
ET does not have any AB3's and the LAD flight is operated by a 763 3x a week.

In OAG it's showing as a 254 seat AB3, only on ADDLAD.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineDkny From Ethiopia, joined Mar 2004, 714 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 18116 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 23):
In OAG it's showing as a 254 seat AB3, only on ADDLAD.

ET's website shows a 767 all week and shows the same for the flight that left this morning.


25 BSBIsland : What is TAAG going to do with its 777s and 743s as they are not going to fly to Europe anymore?
26 BuyantUkhaa : Argh, now I get flamed for not checking someone else's lack of research. When I said LH I assumed ENU had checked that LH does indeed fly there. How
27 Domokun : While there is not enough information for me to know whether this is just a BA-specific action or part of a wider EU retaliation, if it is targeted s
28 Post contains images Samair : have we got any explanation as to why British Airways has been banned from Angola? 'due to safety concerns' or have they denied to comment? Weve pisse
29 Mandala499 : Well, at least I am now proud to say that we're able to hold our tempers longer than the Angolans... LOL Not that it means much... Mandala499
30 YOWza : This ladies and gentleman is Africa in a nutshell. This type of petty action without proper thought is synonymous with the continents many ridiculous
31 Post contains images TR763 : Put them all to GIG!!
32 MaverickM11 : Sad but true. I'll never understand cutting off your nose to spite your face. Even from an economic perspective, BA brings more people and business f
33 MD90fan : Before you make yourself look like an ass again, you may want to take note that Angola had the world's fastest growing economy last year (GDP leapt a
34 PipoA380 : Oh yeah... that's just like the black lists. It's all political, nothing to do with safety. Ban an airline that will never affect your country, or el
35 Tiago701 : I think it's a matter of time for that to happen. As the Angolan government already said that it will reciprocate all eventual banning measures any E
36 Tiago701 : It seems that the decision of including TAAG in the EU "black list" will become official this Wednesday anyway.
37 Tiago701 : ...and by the way, i think Schipholjfk already got the message!
38 KL577 : This generalization is unfair to quite a number of well-governed countries in Africa. What you meant to say is that this is typical for Angola and a
39 N1120A : Hey, it is completely within their right to do so. It is sort of like Brazil requiring similar procedures to the US for people entering the country a
40 Geo772 : The British CAA still insist on some of the highest standards in the world, so it would not suprise me if they are leading the way here.
41 Tiago701 : 6 weekly, to be completely accurate and was to go daily from this month... Lets see what happens then.
42 YOWza : I beg to differ. Without exception every country on the continent has at some point in recent history taken an action as petty as this one in respons
43 LipeGIG : TP will love this... first because of their service LIS-LAD, and second because they can get some connections LAD-GIG-LIS. But it's a big problem whe
44 Tiago701 : Not questioning that, but just think CAA should have waited for the decision to be official. Does TAAG even started their flights to LGW?
45 Anetter123 : Oh for crying out loud, its embarrasing to even read this post!!! Do you know anything about Angola and its recent economic growth which explains why
46 Morvious : It almost happend to HV when Onur Air was banned if I remember correctly, but now, when one sheep crosses, the new will follow?
47 Vega9000 : Interesting... I wonder what will be the response from the Portuguese authorities on this subject, since this is an important route to TP.
48 KL577 : In the last 10-15 years quite a few countries in Africa have been run by well organized and knowledgeable governments, with decreasing rates of corru
49 Lostmoon744 : You've been owned, bro. As an aside, my wife's been to Angola a few times for the World Bank, and she loved it.
50 Tiago701 : Although whe it becomes oficial Portugal is obliged to enforce it anyway, hence i think it's a matter of time.
51 BuyantUkhaa : I'd say that the aviation authorities who deal with TAAG on a regular basis probably were in the best situation, information-wise, to suggest (or sug
52 Post contains images StrangeLESI : True, lets just hope CAA won't ban TAP
53 AA54Heavy : How ridiculous, instead of focusing on what they have to do to fix their airline so that they can fly to the EU, the decide to deny another airline, a
54 Sunilgupta : The 777 that was on the ground in LIS on the day of the ban operated out of LIS to LAD that evening as scheduled despite the ban. Also, the next morn
55 BuyantUkhaa : The ban hasn't come into force yet. I think it'll be on Wednesday. This night 2 TAAG flights are listed to arrive in LIS, whereas only one of them sh
56 Post contains images JM017 : That familiar with all of Africa's 54 countries, are you? Such sweeping generalizations are usually false. I am not saying there is no truth to it. B
57 Vega9000 : If that happens, I guess we will see a lot more flights to South Africa.
58 ENU : Windhoek (served by Air Namibia, SAA, LH, and BA) is even a better option, with good connecting flights to Angola.
59 777law : I guess I missed that TAAG was placed on the EU Blacklist. I thought that TAAG, like the rest of Angola, was starting to get it's act together. Like
60 Post contains images Cragley : It makes it even tougher for the oil companies to get their workers down there They now have the chartered 757 or AF or TP Prices from the UK to LAD w
61 Impacto : British Airways presence at WDH is by Comair. LH doesn't serve Windhoek, but LTU has direct flights to DUS and MUC. Air Namibia will be the best opti
62 Tiago701 : That doesn't do much for TP which is unquestionably the biggest european carrier (bigger than all others togehter) to LAD. At least for TP i think th
63 BuyantUkhaa : Assuming TP flights will actually be banned; I have my doubts about that.
64 Tiago701 : Well, if Angola government is coherent with what its Transport Minister said, TP will be banned of Angola this Wednesday when the EU ban will become
65 Post contains images SW733 : Much like the fact that Cubana is banned from the United States...but, oh, people seem to forget about that. Politics is politics, just because it st
66 Tiago701 : This shouldn't be about who is stronger or better.... It's not about pride either! I don't think Angolans are happy about it either. If for saffety i
67 SW733 : If it's not about pride, then why did Angola do it? My guess is that they did it to get back at the rules that they felt were ridiculous, they did it
68 Post contains links VV701 : The EU has jurisdiction over all Civil Aviation matters theroughout the EU. It is the responsibility of the governments of each EU country to enforce
69 Tiago701 : My point exactly... It was just about pride and nothing else.. There are serious issues at stake and pride shouldn't get into this. And in my opinion
70 Post contains images SW733 : No, no, you make a very good argument...I actually have to agree with you on most of what you said. You're much smarter than your flag gives you cred
71 Tiago701 : The question is not so much about what Portugal will do, as i think it's very much clear that it will comply with the EU. The question is how Angola
72 YOWza : Ghana? My parents used to rent a house from the president's wife. One of many properties she owned. In fact she owned the whole compound. This is the
73 Post contains links and images Iwok : Hey.. Don't foget Botswana View Large View MediumPhoto © Michael Huddleston It happens all the time in Europe, Asia and the Americas. Using Kiga
74 Gemuser : It is ALL about pride and about NOTHING else! The EU is breaking international law, no doubt it. Why? Pride. The EU & member states have no juristric
75 Mah584jr : It seems odd that Portugal couldn't make its own decision on whether it wanted to ban TAAG, and that it would be forced to coincide with the EU's rul
76 KL577 : Noted, the list is even longer; Many countries have made progress in some important areas (Burkina Faso or Mali) , but not all. The point is that mos
77 Raffik : To be quite honest, BA doesn't survive by flying to Angola. It might be profitable for the airline, but it's not the only profitable destination in th
78 757ops : I dont know what that is all about but I do know for sure that ET operates the B767-300 on this route, maybe a confusion from last summer when ET ope
79 Imag : Having worked in Angola, there is a huge potential to rebuild the infrastructure and although the Angolan gov's response ain't the most contstructive,
80 BuyantUkhaa : Hmmm... And what law would that be? The Chicago convention? Article 6 of the Chicago convention (2006 version) says: No scheduled international air s
81 Post contains links BuyantUkhaa : http://dn.sapo.pt/2007/07/03/economi...jeita_hipotese_interdicao_seu.html (in Portuguese only) Says that in a press statement, TAAG states that "the p
82 SwissA330 : So basically the passengers would not benefit from the new rule as suggested by the EU, but rather they have to transfer at SAL instead of Flying dire
83 Ptknight : I've just read in a Portuguese newspaper that TAP was verbally informed that if Brussels follows the Air Safety Comity recommendation and bans TAAG fl
84 SW733 : I was born in Namibia, I was raised in Namibia, and I have been to many, many countries in Africa from the rich (South Africa) to the poor (Central A
85 Hardiwv : This will seriously affect pax flying from Angola to Europe and the world, and undermine business and development in Angola. TP could easily use free
86 Post contains images LHR777 : The really interesting part is that TAAG Angola Airlines codeshares on the weekly BA077/DT6077. So, not only does Angola lose it's lucrative link to t
87 Airbazar : Angola has already said that all EU airlines will be banned from operating in Angola, starting Friday, if TAAG remains on the black list. So yes, eve
88 Bwest : Reminds me of what happened to an SN plane last year in Rwanda. When Silverback got put on the EU blacklist, they "held hostage" as the Belgian govern
89 Post contains images BuyantUkhaa : Well 24 replies later things have developed further, obviously How do do the Americans call that? "Developing story" or something along those lines.
90 YOWza : I'm not saying it doesn't I was just trying to say that these types of issues are more prevalent in Africa. That was just one story to try and make a
91 Bestwestern : EU bans TAAG because of safety concerns TAAG 732 crashes the same day. Correct decision
92 SwissA330 : Well, that was mentioned in DN Online (linked above, in portuguese below), that TAAG apparently was entering negotiations with TACV to do the LIS Fli
93 SW733 : Excellent, my apologies.
94 ENU : I stand corrected, but when did they cease operating to Windhoek? I'm almost sure they operated flights on the München-Windhoek route last year. Bas
95 Abrelosojos : = Besides the mentioned Namibia and Botswana, how about Seychells, Mauritius, Mali, abd Tunisia to name a few? Every country has skeletons and every
96 BuyantUkhaa : Busy TAAG traffic at LIS today, a third flight just came in (777).
97 StrangeLESI : For what i knwo frequencies are gone betwen Angola and South Africa. And the flight are always full. I've read somewere that the best was
98 Post contains images Flying Belgian : Firstly everyone should be aware that Angola is one of the most corrupt country in the world and champion of its class in Africa. Nothing is done ther
99 Post contains links BuyantUkhaa : Not true, have a look here: EU Blacklist Update Published (by BuyantUkhaa Jul 4 2007 in Civil Aviation)
100 Abrelosojos : = All true. But you forget one simple thing ... it takes two to tango. The Oil companies are equally corrupt and guilty for dealing with corruption a
101 Hjulicher : Actually, Aeroflot also serves Luanda, so even with the EU ban, passengers can always still get to Europe via Moscow. Luanda is the only destination
102 BCAL : It’s all to do with Politics in the Air and similar tit-for-tats have happened in the past, even from developed countries. When Bermuda 2 was being
103 Vega9000 : Perhaps, but personal safety is not the only concern. The fact is that it's difficult to justify allowing airlines that don't abide by the rules to f
104 TAP1972 : About TAAG's new B777, what I heard is that TAAG's pilots failed the tests in Seattle. Therefore, Boeing, to avoid any accident with one of their new
105 Post contains links Vega9000 : According to a Portuguese newspaper, the Angolan Government should ban all european carriers with the exception of TP, which will enter a "code-share"
106 TAP1972 : It would make more sense TAAG to reach a cooperation agreement with TP rather than having the government banning TAP flights. But I still don't agree
107 BuyantUkhaa : Well... it seems TP may be spared after all.
108 Post contains images BA777ER236 : This has absolutely nothing to do with safety. BA 777s are maintained to the highest standards and are mostly under 10 years old and well within thei
109 KL577 : I forgot about SU indeed. Do they still operate once every two weeks? Let me correct myself, apparently not a countrywide ban like Swaziland or DRC,
110 Flying Belgian : TAAG's pilot english skills were far below level if I remember well...
111 Post contains links EBGflyer : No wonder why Angolan jets are banned in the UK: http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/d2-tbp/2.shtml Perhaps Angolan aviation authorities should look upo
112 KL577 : So is TP operating to LAD today? Anything official on banning AF, TP or SN by the Angolan authorities?
113 Evan767 : Getting a little off-topic, but don't want to start another thread to ask this: Does anyone know why for the first few months of Delta's DKR-JNB-DKR,
114 BuyantUkhaa : Yes they are.
115 Omoo : they fear Anti Aircraft batteries operated by the Angolan Rebels, lol just kidding ! I would assume ATC issues ? by the way where is SAA and ET in al
116 MD90fan : Apparently, TAAG has reached an agreement with Cape Verdean airline TACV for cooperation of the Lisbon route, TACV will run 4x weekly Luanda-Sal route
117 BestWestern : Remember that when an aircraft ploughs into an apartment block in Hounslow. The EU banned TAAG, and that very afternoon a TAAG aircraft crashed.
118 Post contains links BuyantUkhaa : Check out Regulation 787/2007 http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/...uri=OJ:L:2007:175:0010:0025:EN:PDF
119 Post contains links ENU : The ban makes even more sense if you see what aircraft they currently operate on the domestic routes...: http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/viewphoto.mai
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