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787 Sold Out Through 2015  
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5802 posts, RR: 47
Posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 12083 times:

I don't have alink but there was a headline on Bloomberg where Mike Bair is quoted as saying that the 787 production slots are sold out through 2015.

Assuming that Boeing delivers 112 787 in 2008 to end of 2009 and then produces 10 x 787 per months in 2010 through 2015, that's 120 per year for 6 years or a total of 832 787s to be delivered by the end of 2015.

Boeing has announced orders for 642 787 meaning they have orders for another 190 787s.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
56 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31420 posts, RR: 85
Reply 1, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 12016 times:
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Quoting NYC777 (Thread starter):
Boeing has announced orders for 642 787 meaning they have orders for another 190 787s.

Or slot reservations for that many...

Still, a nice position to be in.  thumbsup 


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5802 posts, RR: 47
Reply 2, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 11993 times:

I just wish that there would be more announcements made. I'm sure there are going to be a slew of option/purchase right conversions to be made as well.

FYI, in the same press conference, Mike Bair also said that everything is still on track for first flight in late August or early September and first delivery in May, 2008.

[Edited 2007-07-06 19:46:16]


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3602 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 11848 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Thread starter):
Boeing has announced orders for 642 787 meaning they have orders for another 190 787s.

That sounds like about the right amount to cover for their 2 "most favored nation" customers that have not yet ordered (AA and DL) plus some outstanding options from current customers.

Interesting tidbit.


User currently offlinePolymerPlane From United States of America, joined May 2006, 991 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 11833 times:

That's probably including options? IIRC options secure production slots until one or two years before delivery.

Cheers,
PP



One day there will be 100% polymer plane
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5802 posts, RR: 47
Reply 5, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 11799 times:

Here's the full Bloomberg article:

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...=conews&tkr=BA:US&sid=awWmaaY6bwaA



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineAndesSMF From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 11642 times:

The articles seems pretty clear about Boeing claiming:

"A brand-new customer would be looking at delivery in about 2015 assuming we don't do something with additional rate capacity"

That seems to indicate at least negotiations in progress with other airlines regarding the 787.

Appears as if other UFO airlines have reserved the production slots, but not made a full order, yet.


User currently offlineRDUDDJI From Lesotho, joined Jun 2004, 1545 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11591 times:

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 6):
That seems to indicate at least negotiations in progress with other airlines regarding the 787.

True, I was in a meeting with one of UA's senior officers who was asked if UA had waited too long too order the 787 due to the orderbook filling up...He had a great response when he said, "United is one of Boeing's largest and oldest customers, if United decides to order 787's (and cannot wait until 2015), Boeing will find a way to accommodate us."

The order book may be sold out publicly...but if a large customer (DL, AA, most likely) were to order the 787 tomorrow, I'm sure Boeing would get them frames...



Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5802 posts, RR: 47
Reply 8, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11570 times:

I've been hearing that Qatar will announce their 787 order this weekend. Can anyone confirm.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineBoston92 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3390 posts, RR: 7
Reply 9, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11495 times:

Is there any way/chance any carrier such as UA/DL/AA could cut a deal with Boeing to order a large amount of aircraft, but have a delivery date before 2015 (a.k.a cut in line)?


"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5802 posts, RR: 47
Reply 10, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11462 times:

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 9):
Is there any way/chance any carrier such as UA/DL/AA could cut a deal with Boeing to order a large amount of aircraft, but have a delivery date before 2015 (a.k.a cut in line)?

Absolutely, I think it's a near certainty that something like that will happen for AA/DL/UA, BA, and AF/KL. If EK comes in for 100 787 you could count on Boeing to get a few spaces for them around 2013 for the 787-10.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineUnited777 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1657 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11368 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 8):
I've been hearing that Qatar will announce their 787 order this weekend. Can anyone confirm.

It's possible!! I live in area where there are alot of Boeing employees and many of them are managers. I was out in my backyard last night and one of them was doing a BBQ with family and I overheard him talking about Boeing's orders this year and said "yea there are more lined up tomorrow and this weekend" I don't know for sure where the guy gets his information and what he does at Boeing. Oman Air did order two 737-800s today so I guess he was kind of right about an order today. Not too big of an order though.


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7089 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11305 times:

When will the first A350s be available ? If other airlines can not and would not like to wait.
Maybe this is a good chance for Airbus to sell the one or other A350 or A330, too.



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineAminobwana From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11305 times:

Quoting RDUDDJI (Reply 7):
True, I was in a meeting with one of UA's senior officers who was asked if UA had waited too long too order the 787 due to the orderbook filling up...He had a great response when he said, "United is one of Boeing's largest and oldest customers, if United decides to order 787's (and cannot wait until 2015), Boeing will find a way to accommodate us."

The order book may be sold out publicly...but if a large customer (DL, AA, most likely) were to order the 787 tomorrow, I'm sure Boeing would get them frames...



Quoting NYC777 (Reply 10):
Absolutely, I think it's a near certainty that something like that will happen for AA/DL/UA, BA, and AF/KL. If EK comes in for 100 787 you could count on Boeing to get a few spaces for them around 2013 for the 787-10.

Aside of the said in the quotes, the title "B787 is sold out through 2015 !!

More accurately, it should say "if Boeing doesn't increase production, the B787 would be sold out through 2015" !!

regards

aminobwana


User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31420 posts, RR: 85
Reply 14, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11305 times:
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Quoting NYC777 (Reply 8):
I've been hearing that Qatar will announce their 787 order this weekend. Can anyone confirm.

Can't confirm it, but I feel it is likely based on information I have received.


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5802 posts, RR: 47
Reply 15, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11226 times:

Quoting Stitch (Reply 14):
Can't confirm it, but I feel it is likely based on information I have received.

Any idea of when the announcement will be made (today, Saturday or Sunday)?

Ok although I can't confirm I'm hearing that an announcement might be made on Sunday regarding QR's 787 order.

[Edited 2007-07-06 20:54:34]


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineZkojh From China, joined Sep 2004, 1725 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11154 times:

NZ will take another 8 frames in around the 2013 period, which will bring their total to 16 aircraft.


CZ 787 to AKL can't wait.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5802 posts, RR: 47
Reply 17, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 11048 times:

Quoting Zkojh (Reply 16):
NZ will take another 8 frames in around the 2013 period, which will bring their total to 16 aircraft.

Is that a done deal? When will that announcement be made?



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineER757 From Cayman Islands, joined May 2005, 2607 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 10955 times:

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 6):
"A brand-new customer would be looking at delivery in about 2015 assuming we don't do something with additional rate capacity

Sounds to me as if they are still considering opening a 2nd line. If they get large orders from the likes of AA, UA, DL etc, the demand would certainly be there. I think the question would be whether suppliers would be able to furnish the components in sufficient quantity to keep two lines going.


User currently offlineBrendows From Norway, joined Apr 2006, 1020 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10917 times:

Quoting ER757 (Reply 18):
Sounds to me as if they are still considering opening a 2nd line.

I highly doubt that. They don't need a second production, not unless they are going to produce 180-200+ 787s per year. The limitation will be the subcontractors, not the final assembly line.


User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 37
Reply 20, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10890 times:

Quoting Columba (Reply 12):
When will the first A350s be available ? If other airlines can not and would not like to wait.
Maybe this is a good chance for Airbus to sell the one or other A350 or A330, too.

The A330 would be too outdated by 2012-15 for many airlines to consider major purchases. And there will likely be plenty of used frames on the market.

Anyway I fully expect Boeing to increase capacity if the demand remains strong. I think they have to if they want to make a -10, as their capacity is strained already with just two principal models.



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User currently offlineMCIGuy From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1936 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10868 times:

I think they're just waiting for the suppliers to get their ducks in a row. It might take a couple of years for them to hit their stride and time is on theirs and Boeing's side. Obviously any increase is in the hands of the suppliers and I think you will see it but not till around 2010 or so. For what it's worth.... Smile


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User currently offlineCaetravlr From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 910 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10838 times:

Quoting Brendows (Reply 19):
highly doubt that. They don't need a second production, not unless they are going to produce 180-200+ 787s per year. The limitation will be the subcontractors, not the final assembly line.

I was thinking the same thing. Even if the subcontractors can crank out all of the major components fast enough to ramp up production, it still won't matter unless those little fasteners are available to piece it all together. Didn't I read somewhere that even the one that is being rolled out this weekend only had temporary fasteners while waiting on the real ones to get there to replace them?



A woman drove me to drink and I didn't have the decency to thank her. - W.C. Fields
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5802 posts, RR: 47
Reply 23, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10779 times:

Quoting Caetravlr (Reply 22):
I was thinking the same thing. Even if the subcontractors can crank out all of the major components fast enough to ramp up production, it still won't matter unless those little fasteners are available to piece it all together. Didn't I read somewhere that even the one that is being rolled out this weekend only had temporary fasteners while waiting on the real ones to get there to replace them?

Currently ZA001 has to have 1000 temporary fasteners which will probably be replaced in the coming one week.

Boeing won't do a rate increase until 2011 at the earliest.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineBoeingFever777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 409 posts, RR: 53
Reply 24, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 10499 times:

Must be all those holds for DL, AA, and EK.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aHXhwGNZKWD8
More good 787 news!



Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre.
25 AndesSMF : I would not doubt that Boeing has reserved slots for the big US airlines and other customers. It is easy to reserve them now and jiggle the schedule a
26 B777ER : " target=_blank>http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...ZKWD8 It mentions an order from DL for a single 777...is this a new one on top of what they alr
27 Shenzhen : 2015 is a long long long ways away. Boeing has considerable wiggle room in those 8 years. There is little doubt that they will double book quite a few
28 Atmx2000 : While it may be ok to leave something on the table in a given market if you are already participating in it, it may not be a wise idea to abandon a s
29 LH506 : Is this the UFO from March for 8 787s or a new order?
30 NYC777 : Hasn't been announced yet so we'll have to see.
31 Post contains images EA772LR : So is it feasible then that we will see 1000 orders for the 787 before EIS??
32 Post contains images Stitch : Could be. Orders are likely to pick up in Q4-2007 and Q1-2008 as the plane completes it's testing (assuming it all goes well), but unless Boeing is p
33 Keesje : Undeniable good news .. and bad news. Must top 20 Airlines like BA, UA, EK, AA, LH, AF, CX, KLM and DL wait for 8 yrs to start possible introduction?
34 Stitch : They're looking at close to that for the A350, as well, as orders for that family are converted and signed, so I suppose whichever they choose they'r
35 UA76Heavy : Better yet, I'll bet some majors have already put deposits down for slots. These won't show up as orders.
36 United787 : What about United. I bet you are right, I wouldn't be surprised if Boeing is holding slots for them without deposits also.
37 Columba : I think AA, UA and DL are in a much bigger need to replace their 767s with 787s then EK, LH, AF, KLM that have a fairly new fleet of A330, A340s or 7
38 Post contains links and images Lightsaber : The "little fasteners" won't be a problem soon. The issue is Boeing needs 20 of one and 100 of another for prototype #1. Fastener makers like to make
39 Alitalia744 : yes. technically. Keesje, a few of those airlines won't have to.
40 Stitch : Boeing has locked up a number of large and long-term contracts with Russian Ti producers, so they are at least trying to secure that. Yup. The Seattl
41 Flybyguy : From where though? Unless Boeing financially compensated some smaller carriers to give up a delivery or two in favour of a later one. This is an exce
42 Cloudy : I thought that the availability of production slots was a closely guarded secret. The reason being, an airframer is willing to go further to accomodat
43 Stitch : Boeing might be holding some slots for their larger customers, but I imagine they'd have to be "handshake deals" since if any money changed hands, it
44 Atmx2000 : So you think it is even remotely possible they can be early by 2 yrs? That dope you must be smoking must be good stuff? ??? GE never said anything of
45 Post contains links and images Aaron747 : MHI and KHI have been preparing for the regular production schedule and extensive modifications to the LCF loading area and apron extension are under
46 Post contains links Stitch : Indeed I do - http://archives.seattletimes.nwsourc...6&date=20070526&query=boeing+alcoa It's the May 26, 2007 issue.
47 Observer : Boeing will be at 10/mo production by 12/09 when the 112th 787 is delivered. Company has said it is considering boosting production from 2011; past st
48 DLPMMM : Alitalia744 was right about the 6th DL 777-200 LR several months ago, I won't doubt him on this one.
49 2175301 : My feeling is that Boeing will announce an increase in production about the same time as the 787 passes all certifications and starts rolling out the
50 DLPMMM : I do not believe that UA ever signed an exclusive supplier ("most favored nation") agreement with Boeing as AA and DL did..
51 Par13del : One small note I would mention, when the major US Carriers announce their intention to order a/c, they usually do so in good order, unlike some non-US
52 Post contains images Lightsaber : Yep... but never count on the Russians to bring up production on your schedule or budget... Yes. It rarely gets past the local bar. Look... we hire t
53 Srbmod : In the case of DL, they weren't exactly in the position to make an order until just recently. An order from DL is expected by the end of the year at
54 BoeingFever777 : I'm sure Boeing has held slots for AA, DL, BA, AF/KL, and GECAS as they mainly Boeing long-haul customers and big spenders and long standing with Boe
55 Post contains images MCIGuy : Yeah, UA is not a lock, by any means. They'll probably order the 787, but they could easily go A350, or even both. If anyone in the US is a candidate
56 AZGUY : I am sure that they are reserved delivery slots for US Airlines, like AA, DL, and US. Recently on a Delta Flight to BOM and there was DL management pe
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