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DL Dropping BGM In September  
User currently offlineBatonOps From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 746 posts, RR: 4
Posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 5017 times:

Not good news for BGM.

http://www.theithacajournal.com/apps...70713/NEWS01/707130381/1002/NEWS01

77 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZone1 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1035 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4964 times:

Ouch... Chuck and Hillary wrote Grinstein about this. I guess DL doesn't need that much political capital since the China route is all but a done deal!  Silly


/// U N I T E D
User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8416 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4923 times:

It's hilarious (pardon the pun) that Hillary Clinton and Chuck Schumer suddenly put on their airline network planning hats and decided to dig into the numbers. Their forecasts are utterly fascinating! Really, senators?

User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3589 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4890 times:

Quoting Hillary from the aritcle:

"This decision to seriously limit access to the region by air travelers will hurt countless small businesses that depend on outside tourist dollars to survive,” she said.

WTF?

I didn't realize that so many people spent their vacations in Binghamton!  boggled 

Politicians are such weasels!


User currently offlineDeltaGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4879 times:

I wouldn't really consider Hilary a politician....just a NY transplant.

As for Chuck, well he isn't any smarter than the rest of us when it comes to network planning....actually I think most users on this site would have more expertise than him.....see if he can spell CSM  Wink

DeltaGuy


User currently onlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16825 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4854 times:

I drive to Binghamton all the time, it's not that far from the city. When the airspace is congested as it is these short hops have to be the first to go, if it's between a DL 757 to Las Vegas or a ERJ to Binghamton take the Vegas route.

NJ Transit is planning on restoring passenger rail service to Scranton Pennsylvania via the Lackawanna Cut-off, the Lackawanna cut off continues to Binghamton. NY State should get in on the project to connect Binghamton with the City.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineDelta787 From United States of America, joined May 2006, 321 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4846 times:

Chuck and Hillary have absolutely no idea what they're talking about.


Fly Delta!
User currently offlineJetlanta From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 3258 posts, RR: 35
Reply 7, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4790 times:

Quoting Delta787 (Reply 6):
Chuck and Hillary have absolutely no idea what they're talking about.

Of course not. They are just representing their constituents. What are they supposed to say? "We think this is great. Binghamton has too much air service today."

I'd honestly say that my experience is that Sen. Schumer is probably one the most actively involved members of Congress in terms air service issues for his state. I may not often agree with him in such matters, but he understands its importance and probably has done more to help air service in NY than anyone anywhere.


User currently offlineDALMD88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2535 posts, RR: 14
Reply 8, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4748 times:

All Chuck understands is where the camera is. Rumor in DC is the most dangerous place to stand is between Chuck and a TV camera.

User currently offlineJetlanta From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 3258 posts, RR: 35
Reply 9, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 4703 times:

Quoting DALMD88 (Reply 8):
All Chuck understands is where the camera is. Rumor in DC is the most dangerous place to stand is between Chuck and a TV camera.

So true. But at least he fights for his state. I can't tell you how many good things have happened to air service in outstate NY just so Chuck wouldn't get pissed off. I was in on several things myself, back in the day.

Trent Lott is the same way in MS.

They both seem to care more about air service issues than the standard Senator.


User currently offlineSTLGph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9304 posts, RR: 25
Reply 10, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4687 times:

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 9):

Agreed. If it was most Senators, they wouldn't care at all. After all, hasn't Chuckie been around for jetBlue, and the expansion of services into Newburgh & White Plains?

But really, go ahead and complain about him.

Also, as far as air-savvy Senators, you can add Kit Bond from Missouri to that list.

Quoting Delta787 (Reply 6):

I bet you they're more in touch with the needs of the people of their state than you are.

Just a guess, of course.



Eternal darkness we all should dread. It's hard to party when you're dead.
User currently offlineKcrwFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3795 posts, RR: 7
Reply 11, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4659 times:

Why is BGM still in the online schedule?

User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4028 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4624 times:

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 3):
Politicians are such weasels!

 rotfl  Couldn't be better said! Doesn't matter which partisan side of the isle they are on either.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 2):
It's hilarious (pardon the pun) that Hillary Clinton and Chuck Schumer suddenly put on their airline network planning hats and decided to dig into the numbers.

 rotfl  Considering such politicians would give us such winners as Amtrack and stick it to the taxpayer, no wonder they are in polotics rather than business.

Quoting DALMD88 (Reply 8):
All Chuck understands is where the camera is. Rumor in DC is the most dangerous place to stand is between Chuck and a TV camera.

Now if Hillary weren't running for the White House, I wouldn't put it past this grand-stander to have his hat in that ring.

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 9):
I can't tell you how many good things have happened to air service in outstate NY just so Chuck wouldn't get pissed off.

For once we agree!  smile  Sometimes political clout can come in handy for an area that is more or less in the economic and population growth doldrums (Look how many Congressional House Rep's New York has lost in the past 3-4 census re-districts. I think it is something like 8 or even 10!).

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 9):
Trent Lott is the same way in MS.

I just love what he told Doug Parker about the proposed shot-gun marriage between DL and HP/US! You could say Grinstien had him in his hip pocket.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 5):
I drive to Binghamton all the time, it's not that far from the city. When the airspace is congested as it is these short hops have to be the first to go, if it's between a DL 757 to Las Vegas or a ERJ to Binghamton take the Vegas route.

I think I'll shock Jetlanta with this one, but even a second 752 frequency from JFK-SLC is more economically viable than a CRJ to BGM!  eyepopping 

Quoting STT757 (Reply 5):
NJ Transit is planning on restoring passenger rail service to Scranton Pennsylvania via the Lackawanna Cut-off, the Lackawanna cut off continues to Binghamton. NY State should get in on the project to connect Binghamton with the City.

This is why Amtrack is so lame and perhaps should be busted up into regional authorities, rather than be run like a super-Greyhound on rails.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineFlyinryan99 From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 2000 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4597 times:

Quoting KcrwFlyer (Reply 11):
Why is BGM still in the online schedule?

My guess is the schedules will be updated on Saturday Night/Sunday Morning. Look sometime Sunday and it probably won't be there.


User currently offlineSTLGph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9304 posts, RR: 25
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4580 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 12):
This is why Amtrack is so lame and perhaps should be busted up into regional authorities, rather than be run like a super-Greyhound on rails.

Not necessarily. If the state wanted Amtrak service there, the state could get Amtrak service.



Eternal darkness we all should dread. It's hard to party when you're dead.
User currently offlineJetlanta From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 3258 posts, RR: 35
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4572 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 12):

I think I'll shock Jetlanta with this one, but even a second 752 frequency from JFK-SLC is more economically viable than a CRJ to BGM! eyepopping

And a third! BGM didn't make one dime for Delta. Ever.

They stuck around longer than anyone had a right to expect. And changed the routes three times, looking for something that would work. I don't think you can ask for more.


User currently offlineSpencerII From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 4543 times:

From someone who works in market planning, I have watched this with Delta for sometime, and they have given BGM every opportunity to prove itself. If BGM was as lucrative as the airport officials are claiming, then you would see other airlines going a$$ over tea kettle to increase of start service. That won't happen.

User currently offlineSLCUT2777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 4028 posts, RR: 11
Reply 17, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 4440 times:

Quoting STLGph (Reply 14):
Not necessarily. If the state wanted Amtrak service there, the state could get Amtrak service.

Which is what Chuck and Hillary should be trying to do rather than strong-arm airline CEO's into $$$ losing service.

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 15):
They stuck around longer than anyone had a right to expect. And changed the routes three times, looking for something that would work. I don't think you can ask for more.

 checkmark  Give DL credit for trying BGM as you said. BUF, ROC, SYR and ALB are all better suited for DL or DL/Connection service to ATL, CVG or the short-hop into JFK.



DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8894 posts, RR: 12
Reply 18, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 4356 times:

I know one Delta Platinum Medallion over on FlyerTalk that is not going to like this news one bit.

User currently offlineDelta787 From United States of America, joined May 2006, 321 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 4174 times:

Quoting STLGph (Reply 10):
I bet you they're more in touch with the needs of the people of their state than you are.

Thats up in the air considering they are politicians after all.

[Edited 2007-07-14 04:53:02]


Fly Delta!
User currently offlineAJMIA From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 731 posts, RR: 15
Reply 20, posted (7 years 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4156 times:

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 3):
I didn't realize that so many people spent their vacations in Binghamton!

I went to Binghamton to see an REM concert when I was in college (1985). There really was not much there and the energy of the place made me feel sad. Not sure what the home style is called where the big wood shingles serve as siding, but it sure dont look nice.

Does USAir still fly there??

AJMIA



Lady it's a jet... not a kite.
User currently offlineCitrusCritter From Pitcairn Islands, joined May 2007, 1093 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (7 years 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4143 times:

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 12):
I just love what he told Doug Parker about the proposed shot-gun marriage between DL and HP/US! You could say Grinstien had him in his hip pocket.


Nevermind...went and found it for myself.  Smile

[Edited 2007-07-14 05:16:14]


TLH
User currently offlineBatonOps From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 746 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (7 years 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 3861 times:

Quoting AJMIA (Reply 20):
Does USAir still fly there??

Yes...but express service only to PHL with Dash 8's or CRJ's. They also get NW to DTW on CRJ's and UA to IAD on Saab 340's.


User currently offlineKITH From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 378 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (7 years 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 3821 times:

One word for BGM...haha. It always is sad to see a neighboring community lose air service but airlines are a business, if the flight isn't making money then pull out
Senator Schumer has been instrumental in fighting for upstate NY's air service be it with getting NW to ITH (which is slightly profitable), B6 to upstate and now DL. Schumer did not make a press conference about this, some low level aid wrote this piwce because Schumer had to say something as it is his constituency. As for Senator Clinton, she has brought a lot of $$ to NY, even if the Marine One contract is f***** (thought that was an ELM thing anyways!), -Matt in KITH


User currently offlineBatonOps From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 746 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (7 years 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 3756 times:

Quoting KITH (Reply 23):
NW to ITH (which is slightly profitable

The last article I read about NW to ITH was that the route is doing very well. I was home in ITH a few weeks ago and there was an article in the Ithaca Journal saying that traffic was up around 12% for 2007 compared to 2006. Good news for ITH.  Smile  Smile


25 JetBluefan1 : According to faremeasure, the average one-way flight between BGM and ATL was $263.10. With fares that high, did DL ever consider lowering them in orde
26 KcrwFlyer : That wouldnt work. BGM is too small for B6.
27 BatonOps : I agree. You'll never see B6 at ITH, ELM or BGM. With DL leaving BGM that leaves ITH with the only nonstop service to the New York area.
28 MCOflyer : Very true but maybe ITH could work. Hunter
29 Post contains images BatonOps : I'd love to see ITH with B6 but I won't hold my breath. At this point I think ITH is lucky to have NW and US serving the airport.
30 RocANDtpa : If the route is doing well then NW should be upgrading these routes to CRJ jets.
31 KcrwFlyer : Hahaha. You and I should have a private conversation about routes that NW needs to upgrade to jets. Whats the O&D to the New york area from these pla
32 Alitalia744 : You're right, he's not happy at all....
33 Flyingcat : That is for local traffic not connecting where the majority of the plane was going elsewhere.
34 BatonOps : That would be a nice upgrade for ITH. Right now both flights are on Saab 340's.
35 Belizexp : DL should of maybe using Big Sky via BOS all the other upstate flts via BOS look like it working out so far....
36 KcrwFlyer : I think you should have to support another frequency before you start talking about jets.
37 BatonOps : ITH several years ago had service to BOS on USX. I think all three cities (ITH,ELM,BGM) would do well with service to BOS.
38 KITH : ITH's problem is it is very seasonal traffic and the fare to LGA (try this its fun) try to find a roundtrip ITH-LGA that is under $500 anytime in adva
39 KcrwFlyer : Thats the Colgan way. They love to price gouge on their at-risk flying. They want 430+R/T from here to either D.C. airport.
40 BatonOps : I flew that route many times growing up in ITH. Who knows...when Colgan starts flying the Q400 maybe ITH will get the service back.
41 LV : I realize this is an airline board, and this is off subject, but these two statements just have to be addressed. Amtrak is only as screwed up as it i
42 Post contains images SLCUT2777 : Which is my point entirely if you read between the lines. Being government owned at the Federal level makes it highly vulnerable to political meddlin
43 TIA : BGM should be happy it even has the remaining service. Every time I drove through that sad town, it made me wonder what's there for people to do. Unfo
44 Dford757 : Last I heard too...ELM was going to get a new airline some time in the next few months. Any word on that. Also any word on how Pan Am is doing there.
45 KITH : Cornell's campus to campus service is really nice, at $125 R/T. 2x1 seating, leather seats, snacks in the back and free wifi on board. Not to mention
46 BatonOps : I remember reading that online a few months ago. I wonder who it could be? UA to IAD? Pan Am is down to 2 JS31's to BED Monday - Friday. Not sure how
47 Teneriffe77 : One of the differences between ITH and BGM is that BGM has better road access than ITH (81 and route 17 run right through it) so some in BGM is more l
48 Post contains links RobertS975 : The folks in upstate NY must be longing for the days of Mohawk Airlines! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohawk_Airlines#Former_destinations
49 Positiverate : Schumer called Jim Whitehurst when FL announced their SWF service, and asked Delta to NOT lower fares to match FL's fares, so that FL could have a ch
50 TIA : That was in 2002. Right now I'm only seeing the $500 fares from LGA. Yup. I loved the convenience when I flew out of ITH. I really think it has to do
51 Flybyguy : That wouldn't work unless there are some very lofty incentives to B6... I mean discounts on space rental at ITH "terminal", etc. Furthermore, I can o
52 PSU.DTW.SCE : Not going to happen anytime soon. The bar is much higher for jet service than Saabs. Somedays DTW-ITH is completely full, other days is well below 50
53 DALMD88 : To me it sounds pretty fair. That is very comparable to BOS-ATL one way with only a seven day advance purchase. And it is half of the SYR-ATL one way
54 BatonOps : I'm sure ITH is happy to have the Saab's and service by NW. You really think they have leakage to AVP? AVP doesn't offer much more service than BGM.
55 FlyPNS1 : Except for the fact that DL didn't serve SWF at the time FL announced service there.
56 PSU.DTW.SCE : Yes, there is as AVP as significantly more options (both destinations & airlines) and in some instances more competitively prices fares. Partcularly
57 Post contains images SLCUT2777 : Which is why he might as well share an office with Bernard Sanders of Vermont!
58 Positiverate : Good point. I was wrong. He asked them to not start service in competition. Thanks for the clarification.
59 BatonOps : PIT ended last year I believe. The only US route from BGM is to PHL. You are right on the ORD and CLT service from AVP. WN does the ocassional charte
60 Badge : I for one hate to read this, I am a regular Delta ATL-BGM flier making the flight at least once every other month. The flight were worth every penny w
61 BatonOps : What kind of loads did you have on your flights? I think you are the first A.netter to say you have flown this route. I guess you'll be making the dr
62 Badge : My flights were generally 75% to 99% full, I had talked to many people sitting beside me on a number of occasions on how well this route must be doing
63 BatonOps : That's interesting. I guess DL feels the aircraft could make more money on other routes. Again, a big blow for BGM.
64 Positiverate : We all know though that loads don't mean a thing if the yields aren't there. I can fill up an airplane with $79 fares, have a 100% load factor, but l
65 WesternA318 : Don't forget John McCain....and on a more local level, how about Rocky Anderson, the mayor of SLC?
66 BatonOps : Good point. Maybe US will step up and add service to CLT.
67 RocANDtpa : I didn't think of CRW, I was considering the fact that ELM has 4 or 5 jets a day. I think CRW will get its upgrade once the new 72 seat jets start co
68 PSU.DTW.SCE : Highly doubtful, as its a rather long RJ flight into a small market where the vast majority of connections can be reached through PHL, or driving dow
69 BatonOps : ELM has 4 jets to DTW, BGM has 2 jets to DTW, and ITH has 2 Saabs to DTW. I do believe NW has the central NY area covered.
70 Badge : $79 I wish my tickets over the last year have been $450 and up for round trip.
71 KcrwFlyer : I dont get how ELM supports that. Isnt there some corporate tie to detroit or NW itself? I guess BGM has jets because its only two flights.
72 SCXmechanic : I say good job... More and more of these small cities should have their service reduced. Especially to the much larger cities such as JFK, LGA, EWR, A
73 BatonOps : Maybe Corning Glass has something to do with it. Although Corning has its own flight department and if you check FlightAware on any given weekday the
74 Dford757 : Corning has a lot of things going on in Asia right now...and at any given time...you can see a lot of their people on board those NW DTW flights then
75 PSU.DTW.SCE : ELM has: Corning (as mentioned, generates traffic to Asia) BGM has: Lockheed-Martin, Depends, but don't hold your breath. The new 72-seaters may free
76 BatonOps : They do a lot of it. I see what appears to be a lot of shuttle flights back and forth to EWR.
77 KcrwFlyer : Just about everything I can think of to respond to what PSU just said will result in a disagreement, so I'm going to keep it to myself. Also, didn't m
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