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Plane Crashes Into Building Near BSL  
User currently offlinePilatusguy From Switzerland, joined Jan 2004, 315 posts, RR: 0
Posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 17987 times:

I'm surprised this didn't show up yet.

Today an experimental plane (this one: http://www.experimental.ch/content/view/22/2/) crashed into a building near BSL.

The plane was supposed to fly non-stop to Oshkosh, therefore having 1'700 litres of fuel on board. The pilot did not survive this accident.

Link only in german:
http://www.tagi.ch/dyn/news/schweiz/774448.html

64 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRJ100 From Switzerland, joined Nov 2000, 4118 posts, RR: 29
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 17895 times:

Another picture is here, it really looks quite scary as it was in the middle of a living area.

http://www.baz.ch/_images/news/KvRauch.jpg

The pilot started with a special permission of the BAZL authorities with the obligation not to bank to the left/right after takeoff. Obviously his plane was really heavy...

The plane crashed into a living area and missed a kindergarden (with many kids at this time in a summer camp) only by meters. Nearby is also a hospital, old people's residence and a large public swim bath.

I think today everyone was lucky that it took only 1 live and not 10 or 100.



none
User currently offlineAllegiantAir From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 1733 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 17861 times:

Quoting Pilatusguy (Thread starter):
this one: http://www.experimental.ch/content/view/22/2/) crashed into a building near BSL.

You are not authorised to view this resource.
You need to login

It won't let me see the pic, so what's the plane like? How many engines/propellers?



Live to Fly.
User currently offlineRJ100 From Switzerland, joined Nov 2000, 4118 posts, RR: 29
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 17819 times:

You can see some pictures here:

http://www.eapforum.ch/showthread.php?t=2337



none
User currently offlineAllegiantAir From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 1733 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 17740 times:

Quoting RJ100 (Reply 3):

Thanks!

Wow, as much as I love planes, I'd be afraid to fly in that thing all the way across the Atlantic Ocean. Claustrophobia!
 scared 



Live to Fly.
User currently offlineKPDX From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2741 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 17703 times:

Here's the story in English: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/07/23/world/main3087865.shtml

http://www.aeroexplorer.biz/aboutus/index.php3

Wow, a pretty well known pilot! So sad to see that his long awaited trip was ended so quickly.  

RIP

KPDX

[Edited 2007-07-23 21:17:54]


View my aviation videos on Youtube by searching for zildjiandrummr12
User currently offlineIcna05e From France, joined Feb 2006, 296 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 17594 times:

Impressive. So that's the result of 1700 liters of fuel hitting the ground. Poor guy he did not have any chance of getting out of that.
He had set an impressive series of records nonetheless. I would like to hear what was the cause for the crash.


User currently offlineSandroZRH From Switzerland, joined Feb 2007, 3428 posts, RR: 50
Reply 7, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 17545 times:

Quoting Icna05e (Reply 6):
I would like to hear what was the cause for the crash.

Apparently, eyewittnesses reported that there was debris falling off the aircraft shortly after departure, and that the aircraft seemed to have difficulties to gain altitude.

Also, the departure was originally scheduled for saturday, but due to technical problems it was moved to today.


User currently offlineSEPilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 6897 posts, RR: 46
Reply 8, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 17442 times:

Quoting KPDX (Reply 5):
Here's the story in English: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/...shtml

This article states that the plane had 450 gallons of kerosene, and yet identifies the engine maker as Lycoming. To the best of my knowledge Lycoming does not yet build an engine that runs on kerosene; the pictures on the site posted earlier look like it has a piston engine. It could be a Thielert, but that is not made by Lycoming. Anyone know what engine it actually had?



The problem with making things foolproof is that fools are so doggone ingenious...Dan Keebler
User currently offlineSRMD11 From Switzerland, joined Jan 2007, 58 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 17301 times:

Hello Friends

My pager alarmed me because I'm member in a emergency organisation in the city of Basel. I arrived around 1h after the crash at the location. I can tell you: It is a miracle that not more people have been killed or injured. The plane damaged a long building. Parts incl. the pilots body hit a children's playground. Only a few meters away, 19 Kids where playing... Nobody of them have been injured. Thank's god! The heavy engine block was laying on the roofs top. Most of the wreck parts are collected and will be brought into a hangar of the Airport Basle-Mulhouse.

The Plane lost parts all ready during take off. It seems that the pilot was guided by megalomania - obsessive driven to get into the books of records... for me (and for many other also), such pilots only want to satisfy their ego and risk the life's of others. I don't feel sorry for him. Remember: There are no "good" pilots because the "good" pilots are all 6ft down.. But I feel sorry for those who lost there homes - they have to stay the next night in a shelter of the civil service organisation - maybe some are more lucky and the can stay with friends.

All in all - aviation is fantastic. But it has a dark side too - The crazy hunt for stupid records...

Some info about the flight:

http://www.aeroexplorer.biz/The_Pola...cumentation_The_Polar_Frontier.pdf


User currently offlineRJ100 From Switzerland, joined Nov 2000, 4118 posts, RR: 29
Reply 10, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 17185 times:

Good post SRMD11

Today around noon it was quite hot in Basel, does anyone know how much runway this aircraft needed? As the runway in BSL is longer than in ZRH could this be a reason why he took off from BSL? If yes, he must have known that take-off will be tough but still took the risk.

Anyway, now we have the problem. Tomorrow and in the coming weeks the newspapers will be full with the anti-airport gang that already screams up now when a MasKargo or Korean Air 747 departs low but safe.



none
User currently offlineLonghaulheavy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 402 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 16805 times:

I am a Wisconsin native, but am not living there right now. I had completely forgotten about the EAA starting this week, but then I got this reminder. It seems there are at least a couple like this every year.

User currently offlineAsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 16746 times:

Quoting Longhaulheavy (Reply 11):
I am a Wisconsin native

Being 30 miles east of St. Paul, Minnesota, I see hundreds of aircraft flying over town en route to Oshkosh every year. Yesterday, a Lockheeds 12A flew over at 2000 ft. AGL:



User currently offlineJerald01 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 161 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 14780 times:

Quoting SRMD11 (Reply 9):
All in all - aviation is fantastic. But it has a dark side too - The crazy hunt for stupid records...

"Stupid records"... what a strange way to put it. If it were not for people who quest for "stupid records", as some people call them, very little advancement would be made in any field of endeavor, be it athletics, business, aviation, education, or whatever. Mankind reaches for the better, the higher, the faster, the bigger, not because of an inate desire to set records, but because of an inate desire to excel. Take that away from humanity and we become nothing more than animals. Few among us would want that.



"There may be old pilots, and there may be bold pilots, but there are darn few green cows"
User currently offlineAlessandro From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 14463 times:

I read that this was the 2nd flight with this aircraft, first with it fully tanked, is this true?

User currently offlineArffguy From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 157 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 14187 times:

Quoting SEPilot (Reply 8):
This article states that the plane had 450 gallons of kerosene, and yet identifies the engine maker as Lycoming. To the best of my knowledge Lycoming does not yet build an engine that runs on kerosene

Actually Avco -Lycoming (Textron) makes several (turboshaft) helicopter engines that run on Kerosene (Jet fuel) such as the Huey's, Chinooks and BK117's.



Time to spare, go by air.
User currently offlineDeC From Greece, joined Aug 2005, 616 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 12337 times:

So, anyone have a clear photo of the aircraft? Some of the links above show 2 aircrafts, others are missing and can't be found etc etc.

Thanks



DEC
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13088 posts, RR: 12
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 11881 times:

It is too bad that the airport he was taking off from has so much development near it with it's risks. Fortuntally, only the pilot died. I would assume the pilot knew the risks, he was extremely experienced in flying in general and in expirmental flights. We assume that he and his associates prepared for these flights as throughly as possible. I do hope an investigation determines what went wrong here. RIP to the pilot.

User currently offlineBritannia191a From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2004, 262 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 11810 times:

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 17):
Fortuntally, only the pilot died

I think that could have been phrased better. Think before you type



http://old.experimental.ch/SwissMade/HG_Schmid/welcome.htm

This i think could be the plane

[Edited 2007-07-24 13:11:30]

User currently offlineInfodesk From Switzerland, joined May 2006, 1454 posts, RR: 33
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 11769 times:

Tragic accident yet incredible that more people weren't killed.

I remember watching an interview on Tele M1 with the pilot a few months back and he was obviously so excited about all that lay ahead. RIP and strength to his family.  pray 



"Do nothing in haste, look well to each step and from the beginning think what may be the end" - Edward Whymper
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7702 posts, RR: 21
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 11687 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting SRMD11 (Reply 9):
I don't feel sorry for him.



Quoting SRMD11 (Reply 9):
The crazy hunt for stupid records...

That's pretty harsh when we don't know exactly what happened.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineBritannia191A From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2004, 262 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 11635 times:

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 20):
don't feel sorry for him.



Quoting SRMD11 (Reply 9):
The crazy hunt for stupid records...

I think you should be banned for saying such a thing. How disgraceful and disrespectful. May he rest in peace. He did what he loved doing and thats all that matters. It could have been worse and it could have been any aircraft any time. Just because it was an experimental plane doesnt exempt other aircraft crashing.

He probably achieved more in his life and got more out of life then you, so keep stupid comments like that to yourself.

RIP - God rest his soul

[Edited 2007-07-24 13:26:08]

User currently offlineSEPilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 6897 posts, RR: 46
Reply 22, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 11563 times:

Quoting Arffguy (Reply 15):

Actually Avco -Lycoming (Textron) makes several (turboshaft) helicopter engines that run on Kerosene (Jet fuel) such as the Huey's, Chinooks and BK117's.

I did not know that; but I will assume that one of them was not powering this plane. Which leaves my original question unanswered; the cowling certainly looks like it was for a piston engine, not a turbine.



The problem with making things foolproof is that fools are so doggone ingenious...Dan Keebler
User currently offlineSandroZRH From Switzerland, joined Feb 2007, 3428 posts, RR: 50
Reply 23, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 11546 times:

Quoting Britannia191A (Reply 21):
He probably achieved more in his life and got more out of life then you

What a mature thing to say, i think you should be banned for saying that  Yeah sure


User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7702 posts, RR: 21
Reply 24, posted (7 years 1 month 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 11512 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Britannia191A (Reply 21):
Quoting RussianJet (Reply 20):
don't feel sorry for him.

Those are not my words - please be careful who and how you quote.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
25 RJ100 : The pilot indeed had a big career, flying Swissair planes for his entire life, even the MD-11. But if I read media reports today and also first reacti
26 SRMD11 : Hey Guys - just flame me for what I said - I don't care! I was over several hours at the place where the disaster happened. I saw the people who had t
27 Post contains images RussianJet : Mate, I for one am not going to 'flame' you, I merely said it was a bit harsh to say that about the dead guy. I understand you were there and can ima
28 SRMD11 : For those who are interested in a update: The damaged building, a long four block Apartment house is for half a year uninhabitable. It can't be exclud
29 Post contains links and images KPDX : Here is the plane. (Not the Connie of course). RJ100 posted already earlier: More pictures here: http://www.eapforum.ch/showthread.php?t=2337 Also, ev
30 AllegiantAir : Lucky!!! Every year during Airventure, my home airport AXN gets about 2-3 IFR planes headed to OSH.
31 Post contains links RJ100 : A video of the departure can be seen here. In my opinion you can see the problems already...this thing looks completely overloaded during takeoff. Tod
32 Post contains images KPDX : Holy crap! Lmao just slightly overloaded. Its not very funny, but jeez, that thing didnt even get like 5 feet off the ground, poor guy. If I were him
33 GBan : True, but sometimes that is not enough - especially when flying an aircraft that potentially can do a lot of harm; the guy who killed my brother when
34 RussianJet : So can I to an extent, and I do not excuse his mistakes - but I do still feel sorry for him. Also, I'm sorry you have been affected directly by the a
35 ChrisNH : What the H does THAT mean?
36 Post contains images RJ100 : I don't know either but all I can say is that I did not write this although it says "QUOTE: RJ100".
37 David L : If it had been the aircraft shown here: " target=_blank>http://www.eapforum.ch/showthread.ph...=2337 ... then it would have been rather ironic, given
38 Motopolitico : I am frankly more sympathetic to the first responder community in this case than I am to the man who endangered the lives of many who never heard of
39 Peterinlisbon : From the video it looks like that's what he did. The angle of attack increases but the plane doesn't get any higher and starts to lose speed so you c
40 Post contains images KPDX : Agreed, even though it looks obvious about what went on, doesnt mean we know what happened exactly. What if a passenger jet crashes over a neighboorh
41 RJ100 : Newspapers today report that investigations indeed are running about the overweight... One newspaper reports that after fuel he had 92 kgs of weight l
42 SRMD11 : I agree 100% ! and let me extend: It's not good that the office for Flight accidents (BFU) is part of this organisation too. How can be a propper, ne
43 Swissy : I hardly call his "records" achievement...... perhaps satisfying his ego, yes SRMD11, could not agree more and I am sure "our" BAZL will have to expl
44 Post contains images SRMD11 : You are right! Britannia191A !!! He achieved to bring innocent lifes of 19 Kids in danger, damaged a 40 Appartment Block, made 89 Poeple homeless and
45 Post contains images SRMD11 : Police, Fire brigade, Civil Protection Service, Rescue Teams, Air Ambulance, Special Investigation Service and many others worked hand in hand - they
46 Post contains images Swissy : That is my point.............. That is the dilemma now, I know living around airports can be dangerous and accidents happen but stuff like that??? I
47 Prebennorholm : It was a homebuilt experimental aircraft made for breaking records by a man with 160 records already in the book. I think that Lycoming would be more
48 StealthZ : You might just lose that bet, according to Lycoming, the engine in the plane that Schmid had planned to fly on his Trans Polar circumnavigation (and
49 RJ100 : It's now also confirmed that the pilot had the wind in the back during take-off while the tower proposed him to take off on rwy34 against the wind (wh
50 StealthZ : That makes even less sense than other parts of this sorry tale.
51 SRMD11 : Tailwind, thats what I heard also. By the way, RWY 16 is upward 4.3m in the whole distance. This fact is minor, but if a pilot goes to the ultimate l
52 Viscount724 : Local news report today said that the aircraft used 3300 m. of the 3900 m. (12795 ft.) runway before it lifted off. BSL airport is actually entirely
53 Prebennorholm : Thanks for the info, Chris. Next time you pass through CPH, please give me a hint so I have a chance to get my debt settled, wasn't it 1 dollar? You
54 F9Animal : While we all can have a little dare devil in ourselves, I have to tip my hat to this pilot. I don't think they do it for the recognition so to speak,
55 Post contains images Swissy : Absolutely, if we did not have brave people (past/present) we would not be where we are today........ but in a case like BSL no and I would not be su
56 GBan : Couldn't disagree more. We have seen heroes risking their lives to save the live of others. This pilot risked the live of others to fulfill his own d
57 Post contains links AntonovA330 : There's been an article in a newspaper yesterday. No hot news, but I'll link it nonetheless: http://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/dyn/news/schweiz/775794.html
58 RJ100 : It is an interesting interview indeed and I think most of the newspapers today publish about the same. My impression is that the Swiss government once
59 F9Animal : He died doing it though. If anything, there was progress in aviation from his death. A valuable lesson can be learned from it, and that is what is im
60 Post contains links AntonovA330 : Some more news (again, German only - sorry): http://www.nzz.ch/nachrichten/startseite/der_absturz_1.534255.html It is said among other things, that 4
61 SLCPilot : I think flying the plane at an untested weight/configuration over a densly populated area is poor judgement. For those that criticize even the effort
62 Prebennorholm : Dear SLCPilot, about your reply #61, I can't agree more. Unfortunately the tragic outcome of Mr. Hans Georg Schmid's "poor judgement" may be that it w
63 RJ100 : In my opinion it is the BAZL's task to check the airworthyness of an aircraft. It's not the airport's task to check if a plane is able to fly or not.
64 Prebennorholm : Dear RJ100, please remember that this was an aircraft belonging to the "Experimental" category, not a certified aircraft. An experimental aircraft is
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