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The Jetsgo Joke  
User currently offlineBoeingluvr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8640 times:

Alright so I was talking to some co workers the other day. For any of you Canadian guys, you'll remember Jetsgo back a few years now. We were discussing some things and how much of a joke this airline was. Apparantly they used retired Md-83's from AA. They were anything but airworthy. Numorous wing strikes as well as one running off the runway at YYC, as well as an aborted landing where they went around and came extremly close to the YYC tower. And as I was told, near the end when they were selling fares at 2.00 a seat someone told me they were flying at 10000 ft for short routes in order to save fuel. Like YYC-YEG or YYC-YXE. Can anyone confirm or put these rumors to rest? Just some thing I heard that soundsa bit out there. None the less the airline was a joke. Sometimes I laugh when thinking back to the old Jetsgo days.



[Edited 2007-07-27 21:39:00]

49 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCruiser From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1001 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8581 times:

Quoting Boeingluvr (Thread starter):
And as I was told, near the end when they were selling fares at 2.00 a seat someone told me they were flying at 10000 ft for short routes in order to save fuel.

Not quite. Transport Canada issued an injunction against them that they could not fly above a certain altitude in an effort to force them to get their maintenance documentation up to date. This was on all routes...

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/144218


James



Leahy on Per Seat Costs: "Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only 2 seats!"
User currently offline808TWA From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 701 posts, RR: 20
Reply 2, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8565 times:

I flew with them a few times not long after they started operating and found that their service was ok and friendly for the price of the ticket.

However, close to their demise most of the scenarios you mention rang true. They did allegedly have an incident at Calgary where they apparently mistook the runway edge lighting for the centreline and landed part on the grass/snow and part on the tarmac. Luck was on their side and they managed to go around and land safely.

They also allegedly had an incident at YYZ where they left debris on departure. Can't remember if it was an engine part or blown tyre but ATC was pissed at them having not reported it and leaving FOD on the active runway.

In the later stages allegedly they lost some form of certification from Transport Canada (someone else could clarify the details) which resulted with them not being allowed to fly their Mad Dogs above FL280. This was at a time when fuel was a major issue and I think this was the ultimate nail in the coffin. The lower altitudes meant they were burning more fuel and allegedly taking more chances by flying on reserves.

Another "rumour" was that on one occasion they actually had to be towed to the gate at YYZ as they had ran out of fuel taxiing from the active.

Anyways, I'm sure some people could clarify or refute these stories, but it was fairly common knowledge that they were running a very shoddy operation in the latter days.



Love is in the air, so practice safe flying
User currently offline808TWA From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 701 posts, RR: 20
Reply 3, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8551 times:

Quoting Cruiser (Reply 1):
Not quite. Transport Canada issued an injunction against them that they could not fly above a certain altitude in an effort to force them to get their maintenance documentation up to date. This was on all routes...

James, you beat me to it....you must be as busy as me!!  Big grin



Love is in the air, so practice safe flying
User currently offlineDrgmobile From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 658 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8551 times:

While I hardly think Jetsgo got things right (errr, they're gone right), everybody focused on those $2 fares. I don't think that's right. They were promotional gimics of which there was an extremely limited inventory. If 10 more folks bought regular fare seats because of 2 $2 seats offered on a particular flight, then it all evens out. Plus, it is my understanding from someone who works in rev management at a rival that the return fares on many of those routes with $2 fares were sometimes higher as a result -- also evening things.

Much has been made of the airline's fleet choice as well. Obviously the MD-83 wasn't suited to the trans-con routes the airline was running. But to me the airline's biggest mistake was to expand too fast, in particular taking on the country's other two main carriers in their respectively important triangle markets (Ottawa, Montreal, Toronto, and out west Calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver) AT THE SAME TIME, and without being adequately capitalized.


User currently offlineBoeingluvr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8545 times:

I was living in Europe at the time, but some pilot buddies of mine relayed these rumors to me as they unfolded. I couldn't believe what I was hearing. Looks like from that article liknk that both Jetsgo and Transport Canada were a little slow on enforcing maintenance. Transport Canada needs to wake up a bit!

[Edited 2007-07-27 22:00:52]

User currently offlineFly2YYZ From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 1046 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8531 times:

What

Quoting Boeingluvr (Thread starter):
Numorous wing strikes as well as one running off the runway at YYC, as well as an aborted landing where they went around and came extremly close to the YYC tower.

Hey wow... I never knew about this... do you know of any other incident other than the one that took place in YYC? Or are you hearing from a friend of a friend of yours? And if you do... I don't mean Wikipedia.. i mean actual events.


User currently offlineBoeingluvr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8509 times:

I was told this from a friend who worked in YYC for Jetsgo. Apparantly the ATC's in the tower ducked as it looked initially like the MD82 was going to nick the tower on the go around... Once again it's hearsay but from someone who worked for Jetsgo. But if pilots are mistaking the landing lights on the runway for the centerline... It really doesn't surprise me.

[Edited 2007-07-27 22:03:32]

User currently offline808TWA From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 701 posts, RR: 20
Reply 8, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 8500 times:

Quoting Fly2YYZ (Reply 6):
Hey wow... I never knew about this... do you know of any other incident other than the one that took place in YYC? Or are you hearing from a friend of a friend of yours? And if you do... I don't mean Wikipedia.. i mean actual events.

There are many incidents mentioned within the Toronto Star link which Cruiser responded with in reply #1 which re-iterates those I mentioned in my response (reply #2).

None of this was fictional.



Love is in the air, so practice safe flying
User currently offlineCruiser From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1001 posts, RR: 7
Reply 9, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 8464 times:

Quoting 808TWA (Reply 3):
James, you beat me to it....you must be as busy as me!!

 Wink

Quoting Fly2YYZ (Reply 6):
Hey wow... I never knew about this... do you know of any other incident other than the one that took place in YYC? Or are you hearing from a friend of a friend of yours? And if you do... I don't mean Wikipedia.. i mean actual events

http://www.airlinecrew.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=178766



Leahy on Per Seat Costs: "Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only 2 seats!"
User currently offlineOceansWorld From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 8370 times:

Quoting Boeingluvr (Thread starter):
Apparantly they used retired Md-83's from AA.

I don't know who gave you that information, but it is wrong. SG has indeed operated a fleet of MD-83s as well as a few MD-82s, but none came from AA. What was previously operated by AA was the F100s they added during 2004. Go get a look at Jetsgo fleet for more detailed informations such as the previous operators of each aircraft by clicking on their respectivce construction number c/n.

Jetsgo fleet

Regards.


User currently offlineMattRB From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1624 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 8206 times:

Jetsgo is more proof that Michel Leblanc shouldn't be allowed to have anything to do with the Canadian aviation industry.


Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible.
User currently offlinePnwtraveler From Canada, joined Jun 2007, 2248 posts, RR: 12
Reply 12, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 8137 times:

The range and fuel capacity on some of the planes was not sufficient to fly from YYZ to YVR with a full load and full baggage at the lower flight level. I was on a competitors flight (in their Maple Leaf Lounge Big grin ) when the concierge was chatting with the agent on duty about the gaul they had trying to book a container on their next flight to fly the baggage out to YVR. They were having quite the laugh about it.

Royal Airlines was no better when it was flying either. I know ground personnel who would not fly a number of the airlines (one for the Airline he worked for) because they knew the service records were spotty.


User currently onlineVonRichtofen From Canada, joined Nov 2000, 4629 posts, RR: 36
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 8093 times:

Quoting 808TWA (Reply 2):
They did allegedly have an incident at Calgary where they apparently mistook the runway edge lighting for the centreline and landed part on the grass/snow and part on the tarmac. Luck was on their side and they managed to go around and land safely.

It actually happened, they took out a taxi-way sign and left some nice tire tracks in the grass. I saw the pics

Kris



Word
User currently offlineApodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4287 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 8086 times:

Quoting MattRB (Reply 11):
Jetsgo is more proof that Michel Leblanc shouldn't be allowed to have anything to do with the Canadian aviation industry.

Sounds like the perfect guy to run NW when Steenland is gone  Smile.

Seriously though, the guy seems like the Canadian version of Frank Lorenzo. As far as I am concerned, he should have to pay the $30,000 to every pilot that paid that to work for him. What a slimeball.


User currently offlineBriboy From Canada, joined Jul 2001, 366 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 8052 times:

Quoting OceansWorld (Reply 10):
I don't know who gave you that information, but it is wrong. SG has indeed operated a fleet of MD-83s as well as a few MD-82s, but none came from AA.

Ahem... two of them were actually ex AA...


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User currently offlineBoeingluvr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 7907 times:

Quoting OceansWorld (Reply 10):
I don't know who gave you that information, but it is wrong. SG has indeed operated a fleet of MD-83s as well as a few MD-82s, but none came from AA. What was previously operated by AA was the F100s they added during 2004. Go get a look at Jetsgo fleet for more detailed informations such as the previous operators of each aircraft by clicking on their respectivce construction number c/n.

That site you gave me actually shows many of them belonged to AA and a lot of them ended up being stored by AA. Did you lookat atll of that website, or just browse?

Quoting MattRB (Reply 11):
Jetsgo is more proof that Michel Leblanc shouldn't be allowed to have anything to do with the Canadian aviation industry.

Haha he isn't now. Apparantly he has his hand in Europe trying to start an LCC over there haha! Lol.


User currently offlineEXAAUADL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 7905 times:

Quoting Boeingluvr (Thread starter):
someone told me they were flying at 10000 ft for short routes in order to save fuel.

dont you burn more fuel at lower altitudes?


User currently offlineBoeingluvr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 7869 times:

That's why I was surprised to hear about that. Airs a little thinner at FL400 compared to 10000. I think it was due to Transport Canada not fuel. However I'm surprised that they were allowed to do so. Would that not conflict with a lot of low lever aircraft restrictions at some airports?? I know that in YYC there is a minimum for commercial IFR aircraft over some parts of Calgary due to flight schools around the area and YBW as well.

User currently offlineTeneriffe77 From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 470 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 7801 times:

If this was a baseball game, Michel Leblanc would be out (3 strikes that is, Royal, Canada 3000, and Jetsgo).

User currently offlineBoeingluvr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 7674 times:

If it was baseball he would never have been a player. Investors would never go for a fourth. As if he could ever get the money going. Actuallyhe ran a ssmall airline in Quebec as well did he not? Not sure if it's still operating but I wouldn't think so as I have not even heard of it for ever and I can't remember the name. So how about 4 strikes lol?!

User currently offlineJetsGo From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 3085 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 7349 times:

Hey what do you know. A thread about me.  Smile


Marine Corps Aviation, The Last To Let You Down!
User currently offlineBoeingluvr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 7116 times:

Quoting JetsGo (Reply 21):
Hey what do you know. A thread about me.

hmm... Something to be proud of? Lol.


User currently offlineCYLW From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 438 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 7052 times:

I think what they are referring to is that Jetsgo lost their RVSM certification (or never got it in the first place). Therefore they were forced to stay at FL280 and below. Obviously you'll burn more fuel at 280 flying for 4 hours as opposed to 350-390. I believe they were forced to make tech stops doing cross country flights due to this.

User currently offlineOceansWorld From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 7014 times:

Quoting Briboy (Reply 15):
Ahem... two of them were actually ex AA..

All I can say there is that I clicked on most of the MD-80s to check whether any came from AA, and I didn't noticed the two QQ registration, this is why I said that none were previously operated by AA, when two were. My mistake, and thanks for pointing it out.

Quoting Boeingluvr (Reply 16):
That site you gave me actually shows many of them belonged to AA and a lot of them ended up being stored by AA. Did you lookat atll of that website, or just browse?

I said that none of the MD-80s came from AA, because:

Quoting Boeingluvr (Thread starter):
Apparantly they used retired Md-83's from AA.

but my answer wasn't 100% correct as shown above. Though I don't see two aircraft as "many". And for the rest of the fleet, here's what I said:

Quoting OceansWorld (Reply 10):
What was previously operated by AA was the F100s they added during 2004.

So yes, not only did I remember that those Fokkers were former AA aircraft stored for a while, but I also checked it with the link I provided.

Regards


25 Swissy : Jetsgo problem was ML and if I recall it right he sold Royal to C3....., yes they had issues mostly caused by incompetent management....... believe me
26 OceansWorld : Isn't it in general the greatest and most common mistake made by airlines managements ? In Jetsgo's case this means a fleet of six aircraft in 2002,
27 YZFOO7F : A WestJet pilot was telling me that on a flight to the US one time, he overheard ATC getting furious with a JetsGo flight because he wouldn't answer h
28 Post contains images Swissy : Yep I call it GW (have not found a english word for it).......... Up to 2003 they were doing ok but after 2003 the insanity started........ IIRC they
29 LongHauler : Every airline and just about every pilot has missed an ATC call. Just about every controller has missed a call from an aircraft ... it happens. If it
30 Irobertson : I have to say, I didn't have any troubles with JetsGo while flying with them, but their demise certainly was one that was quite despicable. Michel Leb
31 N710PS : Most of the MD's were ex KAL birds if I am not mistaken., Ironic enough Southeast also flew birds that were ex KAL and from what I understand they wer
32 Post contains images Sanjet : I'm not a defender of Jetsgo, but that just sounds rediculouse. Don't think any pilot would allow that to happen.
33 A332 : It was a joke airline from the start... that stupid green smiley face on the tail said it all, from day one. I was thrilled when they finally shut the
34 CP744 : C-GKLJ C-GKLC C-GKLR C-GKLN C-GKLQ I believe all these frames originally delivered to Korean AL. C-GKLT C-GKLO C-GKLY C-GKLZ C-FRYA C-GRMJ C-FKLO C-F
35 BeechNut : It can, and has, happened before and not just with Jetsgo, but with respectable airlines like Pan Am (747 at JFK) or Qantas (at LHR if I remember cor
36 Tornado82 : While they weren't based in Canada, I believe Independence Air had lost their RVSM rights right before the end. Although in a primarily CRJ fleet tha
37 Post contains images Swissy : Agree 100%, as close as you can get without crashing........ But it gave them a brand identity even in Europe people I spoke to know the smile just l
38 Planenutz : Can someone explain the whole C$30,000 payment that employed pilots had to make to Jetsgo? If I understand correctly, each newly hired pilot had to po
39 Boeingluvr : Yes I've heard different things... From after a year to after 3 months it would be refunded. I was told by a Canjet pilot back in the day that a lot o
40 Swissy : In that way he was "very smart" using F100 & MDs and on top of that pilots had to pay up front for their own certification but because the senior (se
41 Boeingluvr : Like I say... investors would never go for it!
42 Pacifica : I don't think he even required much outside investment for Jetsgo IIRC, since he did take like a $40M payout in Canada 3000 stock when he sold Royal
43 Boeingluvr : Possibly not... Well he must have lots a lot of that with Jetsgo. All the same investor would still never go for it given his track record!.
44 Post contains links and images BR715-A1-30 : This one says it all.
45 Boeingluvr : The look on Leblancs face after his third disaster. Lol.
46 Post contains images Heavy747 : I miss some of those Flight attendants!
47 Accargo : The laid-off employee's and stranded passengers didn't think it was funny. You might want to give some consideration to the staff that did their best
48 Boeingluvr : O god it's you again. I'm thinking in terms of the storys and the way it was run... And obviously I'm not the only one that thinks that way. With al
49 Post contains images Accargo : O god yes it is me again. Your always so clear on what you meant in your posts. I guess you must have a hell of a sense of humour, I'm sure it will s
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